THE FAKE KJV ONLY ARGUMENT

[Michiah-Imla]

 

[Wrangler]

Yet again, the tired "Older and Better" refrain is beckoning us.

Because it is true. I would not read the Bible at all if all I had to read was the most horrible KJV.

 

[rvmb]

Stick with the King of all translations​

View attachment 82238​

ABSOLUTELY.
Here's more reasons why :)

KJV Code

kjvcode.com

 

[doctrox]

Again, that is merely your opinion [re: W&H] and many scholars, if not most, disagree.

Rather, conclusive primary and secondary documentation has been posted in these forums previously. Shall we do a reprise just for your sake? And it is "many scholars" who have corrupted the covenant and led many astray (Malachi 2).

Because it is true. I would not read the Bible at all if all I had to read was the most horrible KJV.

It's obvious you don't read it much anyway.

Wisdom doesn't come from your opinions (or mine):

If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.

When's the last time you asked him?

 

[Michiah-Imla]

most horrible KJV.

Most wonderful KJV.

But What translation do you read?

How often do you read it?

 

[Wrangler]

Most wonderful KJV.

But What translation do you read?

How often do you read it?

I read several translations and read the Bible every day. No one translation is my favorite depending on the verse.

For instance, the CEV has one verse rendered, DON’T BE STUPID. This has universal applicability even if not the literal words. It’s memorable.

 

[Wrangler]

They make their IDOL an obstacle for us to get closer to God.

@Armour of God, these IDOLATORS make the same error as the Roman Catholic Church in extend the one mediator to God being Jesus with one mediator to him being a translation of a book.

 

[Armour of God]

@Armour of God, these IDOLATORS make the same error as the Roman Catholic Church in extend the one mediator to God being Jesus with one mediator to him being a translation of a book.

I agree that we should be able to read what ever version we like but calling them idolators is going a bit far in my opinion.
If their happy to read the KJV then fine but don't force that medieval English on everyone else. They should just accept that people prefer to read it in modern English. I don't understand why they feel like that.
I wonder if the Greeks are condemning translations made for every other language. I doubt it

 

[Armour of God]

Let's look at a phrase used a lot by Jesus

In KJV it reads
Verily, verily I say unto you

In NIV it reads
Very truly I tell you

To the KJV only people, what's the difference?
Why shouldn't I read a modern English version?
Are there any passages in modern English versions that are mistaken?
If so please show me them

It does my head in trying to read old English. For people just learning English or people that can't read well or people who have another first language it is a burden to them who simply want to read God's word

 

[David Lamb]

Let's look at a phrase used a lot by Jesus

In KJV it reads
Verily, verily I say unto you

In NIV it reads
Very truly I tell you

To the KJV only people, what's the difference?
Why shouldn't I read a modern English version?
Are there any passages in modern English versions that are mistaken?
If so please show me them

It does my head in trying to read old English. For people just learning English or people that can't read well or people who have another first language it is a burden to them who simply want to read God's word

Yes, and the really tricky thing is when the word or phrase is still used in today's English, but with a totally different meaning. Nobody would know that they needed to look the meaning up - they'd just assume the current meaning. Examples are: "prevent" (meant "go before." Now means "stop something happening"). "Carriages" (meant "equipment" or "luggage." Now means "wheeled vehicles.") "Fetched a compass" meant "turned around". Now means, "acquired a direction-finding device." I just cannot see why using a word like "carriages" instead of "luggage" should be considered more correct or more godly.

 

[Michiah-Imla]

these IDOLATORS make the same error as the Roman Catholic Church in extend the one mediator to God being Jesus with one mediator to him being a translation of a book

Why does this anger you so much?

It’s not idolatry to prefer the most faithful, accurate, and reliable translation of the word of God that has stood the test of time.

 

[Michiah-Imla]

In KJV it reads
Verily, verily I say unto you

In NIV it reads
Very truly I tell you

I have no problem with the NIV rendering here.

Are there any passages in modern English versions that are mistaken?
If so please show me them

There are many.

But here’s one where the NIV is saying something different from the KJV.

Mark 1:41

KJV

[41] And Jesus, moved with compassion, put forth his hand, and touched him, and saith unto him, I will; be thou clean.

(NIV)

Jesus was indignant. He reached out his hand and touched the man. “I am willing,” he said. “Be clean!”

But There are many passages that are omitted due to the usage of a different underlying Greek text.

Do a search and you will see.

 

[Wrangler]

calling them idolators is going a bit far in my opinion ... I don't understand why they feel like that.

LOL. For the reason you think it's going a bit far - they're IDOLATORS.

For decades I didn't get idolatry. Now that I do, you can't unsee it. It's everywhere in Christendom.

 

[David Lamb]

I have no problem with the NIV rendering here.



There are many.

But here’s one where the NIV is saying something different from the KJV.

Mark 1:41

KJV

[41] And Jesus, moved with compassion, put forth his hand, and touched him, and saith unto him, I will; be thou clean.

(NIV)

Jesus was indignant. He reached out his hand and touched the man. “I am willing,” he said. “Be clean!”

But There are many passages that are omitted due to the usage of a different underlying Greek text.

Do a search and you will see.

But the NIV is not the only translation more modern than the KJV. Not all such versions translate Mark 1:41 like the NIV does. For example, the NKJV says:

(Mar 1:41) Then Jesus, moved with compassion, stretched out His hand and touched him, and said to him, "I am willing; be cleansed."

The MKJV says:

(Mar 1:41) And Jesus, moved with compassion, put out His hand and touched him, and said to him, I will; be clean!

The ESV says:


Moved with pity, he stretched out his hand and touched him and said to him, “I will; be clean.”

The RSV says the same:


Moved with pity, he stretched out his hand and touched him, and said to him, "I will; be clean."

YLT says:

And Jesus having been moved with compassion, having stretched forth the hand, touched him, and saith to him, 'I will; be thou cleansed;'

The implication that all translations since the KJV use a word like "indignant" is just wrong.

 

[Wrangler]

Why does this anger you so much?

It’s not idolatry to prefer the most faithful, accurate, and reliable translation of the word of God that has stood the test of time.

Because IDOLATRY is not merely a preference - putting aside your false claims of it being better! You are not being honest with yourself about the passionate fanaticism KJV-ism has:

1. Not merely a preference
2. Not merely claiming it is the best translation.
3. Saying one is under satanic influence if they read other translations and can't be saved.

I was victimized for decades by this IDOLATRY, told by fanatics that I HAD to read that trash! It kept me from Christ. What does Jesus say about doing such things? Matthew 23:13

“Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You shut the door of the kingdom of heaven in people’s faces. You yourselves do not enter, nor will you let those enter who are trying to.​

 

[KUWN]

Rather, all modern translations use W-H as its basis. Two spiritualists, Westcott and Hort, changed the traditional Greek text in well over eight thousand places using the Vaticanus manuscript and other corrupt texts. In 1881, this 1% minority text type supplanted the Majority Text with its almost two millennia standing. All modern versions are their product.


The reality is far worse.

Westcott and Hort were mystics, spiritualists, and necromancers. They admitted they were heretics.

All new versions (and the ‘new’ church they are producing) owe their occult bend to their underlying Greek text, a novelty produced in the 1880’s by Brooke Foss Westcott, a London Spiritualist, and his cohort, Fenton John Anthony Hort. Secular historians and numerous occult books see Westcott as ‘the Father’ of the current channeling phenomenon, a major source of the ‘doctrines of devils’ driving the New Age movement.

Westcott and Hort wrote the Greek text underlying the new versions.


Indeed.


Happy to say that such attempts to "kitchen sink" the issue will not succeed.


Rather, all modern translations are based on the Westcott-Hort texts. All modern versions, including your NIV, are their product.

It takes much time, research and effort to bring the truth to bear. But I will do it now for this important OP. What you may then do with the truth of the matter will be up to you; but be aware, as you are now accountable.

The body of standard Christian reference works affirm Westcott and Hort’s pivotal and powerful role in this war of words. Scanning the major works will document the singularity and paramountcy of their role.

The following is but a small sampling of the total documentation available on the subject, lest I be here all night.

John Kohlenberger, spokesperson for Zondervan (publisher of the NASB, Living Bible, Amplified Bible, NIV, and RSV), is author of a Hebrew/NIV Interlinear, as well as, Words About the Word: A Guide to Choosing and Using Your Bible. He discloses:

Westcott and Hort...all subsequent versions from the Revised Version (1881) to those of the present...have adopted their basic approach...[and] accepted the Westcott and Hort [Greek] text.1

He goes on to salute Westcott’s, A General Survey of the History of the Canon of the New Testament, saying, “This century old classic remains a standard.”2 Christians may not return the salute, but ask why the work of esoterics are “standards” and “classics” for the body of Christ.

...continued...

You wrote: Westcott and Hort were mystics, spiritualists, and necromancers. They admitted ( where?) they were heretics.

Can you provide original sources for these claims!! Be sure to use the definitions that were attached to these words in the 1880s.

 

[Michiah-Imla]

I was victimized for decades by this IDOLATRY, told by fanatics that I HAD to read that [KJV] trash!

You seem to have KJV derangement syndrome.

 

[Wrangler]

You seem to have KJV derangement syndrome.

Yea, how many other threads are there pushing any other translation? When you look at it objectively, you realize the KJVO crowd deserve their condemnations.

Let me put it this way. IF KJV were merely preference for you, you would not retort than other have this made up derangement syndrome. Do you do that with all things in life or only your fanatical devotion to translation IDOLATRY?

 

[Michiah-Imla]

the KJVO crowd deserve their condemnations.

fanatical devotion to translation IDOLATRY

Apparently, you are not finding peace nor instruction in long-suffering from the translations you are using.

Switch to the KJV and you’ll become a better Christian.

 

[marks]

Further, the "original (or oldest available) manuscripts" comment is a non sequitur. You’re wacked!

It's non-sequitor if you are assuming something that is patently false, that the "older are better". One was pulled from the trash. You remember that, right? The three that people rely so much upon were lost to history for 1000 years and more. Do you suppose God was hiding His real Word all that time?

These mss disagree heavily with each other, and were discarded by those more contemporary with their creation.

Who is whacked??

Your ad hominem doesn't make those mms into any greater agreement. Meanwhile, the Majority Manuscript has thousands of witnesses in extremely close agreement.

Whacked. Why do people have to become uncouth? I guess it's the thing about, "I declare you are whacked, being your judge, which means my point must be right." Not just, non sequitor, but very poor form.

Much love!