Many Say ‘Just Believe’… But What Did Jesus Actually Teach?

[LoveYeshua]

I find that Jesus teaches the commandments differently than Moses.

Moses teaches a nation to enforce the commandments upon each other. There's an idea of holding others accountable that may involve a judge, or stoning a particularly pernicious sinner to death.

Jesus specifically repudiates that idea, saying "Judge not, lest you be judged" and acting as an exemplar in refusing to stone the adulterous woman.

Jesus instead teaches individuals to follow the commandments in ordering their actions. This is "the law written on their hearts" spoken of by the prophet Jeremiah (who also called for the abolition of Moses covenant).

Yes very differently! from the commandments written on the tables of stone to the commandments written in our hearts and minds. (Jer 31:31-34) Jesus explained how to keep them the proper way, by loving God and Loving one another, this kind of love fulfills the commandments.

 

[LoveYeshua]

Thank you, and Good Morning to you.

Obedience is to do what Jesus asks us to do.


Yes.
Number #1
BELIEVE (in YOUR Heart ie YOUR natural spirit ie YOUR Truth)….He is WHO He IS.

Number #2
Be Very Very Sure…of YOUR Belief…
IF… YOU ARE Very, Very Sure…
THEN…YOU ARE “prepared”…
* TO Accept His Offering, of His Gift Of Salvation…
* BY Calling on the Lord, By His Name,
* And Confessing To Him, Your Very, Very Sure Heartful / Natural spirits BELIEF…
THAT…
* He IS God incarnate, He IS The Christ, Truth, Word, Seed, Power, Salvation of God.

IF a man does So, According to Gods Order and Way…ASK, ACCEPT, TAKE, RECEIVE, HAVE, POSESS, Gods Gift of Salvation…

Then What?
* A man MUST “Keep Asking” for what he already HAS? No
* A man MUST do “anything” to Keep His Received Gift? No.

1) ** A man CAN “DO” his “OWN” works…
Take care of his family, provide their needs, care for his Possessions, Home, Tools, Garden, Animals, etc.
** AND…. Glorify God By Thanking Him for blessing such man with All that he Possesses.

2) ** A man CAN “DO” Unpaid Charity Work, Give his OWN Time, His Own possessions, His OWN Money, His OWN Helping Hand…
To Any other…
** while Telling the “other” who Thanks him…
That the THANKS should be Directed to God, Who MADE the hand-Out Possible!!

THOSE things … neither Give a man Salvation…or Keeps a mans Salvation!

Doing THOSE Two things…Glorifies God.

For Any man “Who Glorifies God”…God “Repays His Debt unto that man…”
With Rewards…. And has Nothing to do with…the man’s condition of being saved or unsaved.

A “Saved man” Does not “by his own Power, Keep His Given Gift of Salvation”…God Does!

And a man, who thinks Receiving Gods Gift of Salvation… that the man has the Power to ( as one Catholic ON this Forum said…. “A man Can throw their Salvation back in Gods face, and Must Do Works to Keep their Gift)…
IS a Lie.

No. Once Salvation IS Given a man…
It’s Permanent…. And thus the Warning to BE VERY sure, before Confessing and taking Gods Gift.



^ That falls under Part of the ORDER and WAY for a man… TO RECEIVE Salvation…
A man ASKING for Gods Forgiveness.



* Men Forgive men …OF WHAT?
TRESPASSES!

I am NOT UNDER any Law, That Declares men can SIN Against me, or I can Sin Against Men…
Or that Men can Forgive Sin, Or that I can Forgive Sin.
But Trespasses? Yes, all day long men can trespass Against men, intentionally or unintentionally…
And Yes, Ask, or give a pardon…
OR NOT

If they do, good, if they do not…bummer.
Zero Effect on a mans Salvation!

Don’t do well toward and Enemy…lose Reward's, not Salvation.



That ^ is Part of the ORDER and WAY to accomplish BEFORE receiving Salvation.




Doing… Particular things… reaps…
A gift
Or
Blessings
Or
Rewards

All different things for a man “particular works”



Is Simply The “Result” of a mans efforts/works…
And Gods Gifts, which are permanent.’
And Gods Rewards, which are Given when Christ Returns.
And Gods Blessings, which is Given Repeatedly to men who HAVE a Relationship with God, and Actually KEEP their Relationship a Daily / Current Relationship.

Pray without ceasing, is notice… to maintain your relationship with God…
(Not like your relation you have not talked to in 3 years).

Yes. Action is What God Observes, rather than, words that mean nothing.


Glory to God,
Taken

Hi Taken, I agree with you on several important points. Obedience does mean doing what Jesus asks. Believing in Him, calling on Him, and giving glory to God are all true and good. Also, it is right that our works do not earn salvation like a payment. On these things, we are in agreement.

But there are some parts that do not fully line up with the words of Jesus, and this is where we need to be careful and stay close to what He actually said.

The first issue is the idea that once a person receives salvation, nothing they do afterward can affect it, and that they do not need to continue in obedience.

Jesus does not speak that way.

He says in Luke 9:23 (ASV):
“If any man would come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me.”

This is not something done once before salvation. Jesus says “daily.” It is a continuing walk, not a one-time step.

He also says in John 15:10 (ASV):
“If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love.”

Abiding in Him is connected to continuing in His commandments. It is not presented as something automatic that cannot be affected.

And even more clearly, Jesus warns in John 15:6 (ASV):
“If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered.”

This shows that remaining in Him matters. It is not described as something permanently secured no matter what a person does.

The second issue is the idea that things like forgiving others, loving enemies, or doing good have “zero effect” on salvation.

Jesus says the opposite.

In Matthew 6:14–15 (ASV):
“For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.”

This is very direct. Our forgiveness is tied to whether we forgive others. That is not “zero effect.”

Also in Luke 6:37 (ASV):
“Forgive, and ye shall be forgiven.”

And about loving enemies, He does not present it as optional reward-only behavior. It is part of being children of God (Luke 6:35).

The third issue is saying that following Jesus, denying yourself, and repentance only happen before receiving salvation.

Jesus speaks of these as ongoing.

In Luke 13:3 (ASV):
“Except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.”

Repentance is not just a one-time entrance step. It is a turning of the heart that must remain.

And again, “take up his cross daily” shows this is a continued life, not a completed requirement.

The fourth issue is reducing fruit to simply personal effort or rewards, without connection to salvation.

Jesus ties fruit directly to whether a person truly belongs to Him.

In John 15:2 (ASV):
“Every branch in me that beareth not fruit, he taketh it away.”

And in Matthew 7:19–21 (ASV):
“Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down… Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father.”

So fruit is not just about rewards. It is evidence of a real and living relationship with Him.

So in a simple way:

Yes, we believe in Jesus and receive from Him.
Yes, we cannot earn salvation by our own works.

But Jesus also teaches that we must continue in Him, continue in obedience, continue in forgiveness, and continue to bear fruit.

Faith is not just something we start with. It is something we live in.

And the safest place is to stay with His own words:

“He that endureth to the end, the same shall be saved.” (Matthew 24:13 ASV)

“Here is the patience of the saints, they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.” Revelation 14:12 (ASV)

This shows it is not only about beginning, but about continuing with Him until the end.

Blessings

 

[PS95]

And what is the "will of the father"?
Its that you "believe on Jesus whom God sent".
= Our "Faith is counted by God, as (Christ's) righteousness"...
"Abraham BELIEVED God, and his FAITH was counted unto Him as Righteousness".
We give God our FAITH, .. as that is how you "do the will of my Father"....... and God accepts our faith to give us "The Gift of Salvation".
And who is Salvation?
WHO, is Salvation?
A.) Jesus is Salvation.
So, when you Trust in Christ by "faith".......God then imputes (eternally gives) unto the Believer what Jesus has finished on The Cross 2000 yrs ago.
1.) Welcome to : Salvation.............its not something you do..............Its JESUS Himself.
Now, Heretics and religious fakirs who waste your time on Forums.... can't understand any of this, because there is no Holy Spirit in them that can receive this Truth, and that is why they can only keep talking and talking and talking about......."you must do this, and you must do that and you must keep this command and this law....""""'... 'you must work work work you way to heaven"........and that is impossible, reader.
The Reality of SALVATION, is that its not something you DO........
A.) JESUS is Salvation.
So, reader, when you keep reading these continual self righteous garbage posts that keep directing you to "keep this law and do this commandment" to be saved...... you are not dealing with someone who understands God's Salvation.
You are dealing with a religious pretender, or you are dealing with a dark light.
Paul defines them here...
2 Corin 11:14-15.
Read it. !
Learn to recognize them on Forums and in Pulpits and on TV and in UTUBE VIDEOS...., as they will always talk about what YOU DO, and what YOU must do and what YOU must Do, so that God will have you, they falsely teach, over and over and over.
These are HERETICS....they are religious but lost, in most cases.
Often they are Water baptized, and always obsessed with their own self effort to try to go to heaven and they will never make it, as God does not accept our works to accept us.
if He did, then Jesus was wasting His BLOOD on THE Cross.
Do you Understand?
Heretics/Religous Fakirs do not understand and in fact will argue against FAITH, while pretending they are not.
Repenting from Sin, means that you try to stop sinning, and maybe a sinner can stop for a few mins or even a day or 2.
Whereas the Repentance that God accepts, is not to try to stop sinning as the religious fakirs explain........
Not at all..
2.) Reader....The ONLY Repentance that God accepts is that you TURN FROM UNBELIEF.......YOU REPENT FROM UNBELIEF...... as that means you have now turned to FAITH, in Christ, and God will take you and save you and keep you if you do that.., because you are doing God's "will".
But if all you can do is try to repent from sin, and keep commandments, then you are just as lost as the next religious person who is trying to be good enough for God to have them until they died and went to Hell.
You might as well be a Buddhist or a Scientologist or an Atheist...as GOD will never will have you, if that is what you keep bringing to Him, as God is not interested in your works/self effort.
He's only looking for "FAITH in Christ"........as that is exactly where Salvation begins.
This is why the NT teaches that "without FAITH it is impossible to please God"........so, keep that in mind if you have been wrongly taught that "its all about you trying to keep commandments and be good".

Behold- I'm confused by you today. So, I went back to your thread from the other day, where we agreed- that we are saved by grace through faith in Jesus- and then since we now love Him, we will obey Him including His commands by the leading and guiding of the Holy Spirit who fills us with God's love./ God working in us..
I just saw that you EDITED your post after we agreed? WHY?
I'm going to take that as a good thing- because deep down you do know that LOVE from God in us- recognizes that His commands are LOVE- a person will not steal or lie or murder etc- because LOVE fulfills the law.
God's moral law is not of no value- it is good and holy when we understand it properly. Obeying the law can't save us- no one of us have obeyed God's law perfectly- only Jesus saves us- but He does not save us so that we may continue in sins. Never!
He washes us and gives us His Spirit to guide and help us to walk in His love which does not steal, murder, lie, etc. nor does he want to-- because we are given a new heart!!! The circumcism of our hearts! We are to be holy and walk in His righteousness- which DOES LIVE and WALK righteously. It is not a self righteousness!-- We are not earning our salvation by works under the law- we are walking in LOVE. It is Christ in us. We don't want to grieve the Holy Spirit.--We have been made new and now we walk in that newness of life-

It should not be hard for you to say once we receive Christ- that we are to walk in the Spirit (of LOVE) which fulfills the law. ---Paul did!
Love doesn't want to break God's commands- His commands are of love.

Romans 13:8-10
8Owe nothing to anyone except to love one another; for he who loves his neighbor has fulfilled the law. 9For this, “YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, YOU SHALL NOT MURDER, YOU SHALL NOT STEAL, YOU SHALL NOT COVET,” and if there is any other commandment, it is summed up in this saying, “YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.”
10Love does no wrong to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.

Galations 5:16-
13For you were called to freedom, brethren; only do not turn your freedom into an opportunity for the flesh, but through love serve one another. 14For the whole Law is fulfilled in one word, in the statement, “YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.” 15But if you bite and devour one another, take care that you are not consumed by one another.

16But I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not carry out the desire of the flesh. 17For the flesh sets its desire against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; for these are in opposition to one another, so that you may not do the things that you please. 18But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the Law. 19Now the deeds of the flesh are evident, which are: immorality, impurity, sensuality, 20idolatry, sorcery, enmities, strife, jealousy, outbursts of anger, disputes, dissensions, factions, 21envying, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these, of which I forewarn you, just as I have forewarned you, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God. 22But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law. 24Now those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.

25If we live by the Spirit, let us also walk by the Spirit. 26Let us not become boastful, challenging one another, envying one another.

 

[Taken]

@LoveYeshua

Will address all your points within this evening or next day.
Tending animals and supper and Family first.

God bless you.
Taken

 

[PS95]

And what is the "will of the father"?

Its that you "believe on Jesus whom God sent".

= Our "Faith is counted by God, as (Christ's) righteousness"...

"Abraham BELIEVED God, and his FAITH was counted unto Him as Righteousness".

We give God our FAITH, .. as that is how you "do the will of my Father"....... and God accepts our faith to give us "The Gift of Salvation".

And who is Salvation?

WHO, is Salvation?

A.) Jesus is Salvation.

So, when you Trust in Christ by "faith".......God then imputes (eternally gives) unto the Believer what Jesus has finished on The Cross 2000 yrs ago.


1.) Welcome to : Salvation.............its not something you do..............Its JESUS Himself.

Now, Heretics and religious fakirs who waste your time on Forums.... can't understand any of this, because there is no Holy Spirit in them that can receive this Truth, and that is why they can only keep talking and talking and talking about......."you must do this, and you must do that and you must keep this command and this law....""""'... 'you must work work work you way to heaven"........and that is impossible, reader.

The Reality of SALVATION, is that its not something you DO........

A.) JESUS is Salvation.

So, reader, when you keep reading these continual self righteous garbage posts that keep directing you to "keep this law and do this commandment" to be saved...... you are not dealing with someone who understands God's Salvation.
You are dealing with a religious pretender, or you are dealing with a dark light.
Paul defines them here...

2 Corin 11:14-15.

Read it. !

Learn to recognize them on Forums and in Pulpits and on TV and in UTUBE VIDEOS...., as they will always talk about what YOU DO, and what YOU must do and what YOU must Do, so that God will have you, they falsely teach, over and over and over.

These are HERETICS....they are religious but lost, in most cases.
Often they are Water baptized, and always obsessed with their own self effort to try to go to heaven and they will never make it, as God does not accept our works to accept us.
if He did, then Jesus was wasting His BLOOD on THE Cross.

Do you Understand?
Heretics/Religous Fakirs do not understand and in fact will argue against FAITH, while pretending they are not.




Repenting from Sin, means that you try to stop sinning, and maybe a sinner can stop for a few mins or even a day or 2.

Whereas the Repentance that God accepts, is not to try to stop sinning as the religious fakirs explain........
Not at all..

2.) Reader....The ONLY Repentance that God accepts is that you TURN FROM UNBELIEF.......YOU REPENT FROM UNBELIEF...... as that means you have now turned to FAITH, in Christ, and God will take you and save you and keep you if you do that.., because you are doing God's "will".
But if all you can do is try to repent from sin, and keep commandments, then you are just as lost as the next religious person who is trying to be good enough for God to have them until they died and went to Hell.
You might as well be a Buddhist or a Scientologist or an Atheist...as GOD will never will have you, if that is what you keep bringing to Him, as God is not interested in your works/self effort.
He's only looking for "FAITH in Christ"........as that is exactly where Salvation begins.
This is why the NT teaches that "without FAITH it is impossible to please God"........so, keep that in mind if you have been wrongly taught that "its all about you trying to keep commandments and be good".

Behold
-https://www.christianityboard.com/threads/the-law-of-moses-cant-define-a-christian.76361/page-2#post-2250553

Here is the thread and your post to me is below- this was prior to the edit. There was nothing wrong with it -
it was right and true. of course, Moral law is still in effect- ceremonial law is not. BUT just obeying the moral law can't save us-- JESUS SAVES US- and then we want to obey His command to love by the aid of the Spirit which He gives to us. We now obey from the heart- not outwardly for self- righteous reasons, but our hearts are changed and we now love.-- Love fulfills the law. --
We are to walk as He walked.
Abraham believed God and was counted as righteous- yes- and years later Abraham's belief also OBEYED God and his FAITH was perfected.
"faith was working with his works, and as a result of the works, faith was perfected"-- James 2 .--- James and Paul do not disagree!
"We are saved by grace.. and then we walk in good works.. Eph. Paul-- NOT TO BE SAVED but BECAUSE WE ARE.
We love because He first loved us!

Behold said:
So, if you decide to do it anyway, then you are going to have to deal with the consequences in life and then inside yourself you are going to feel that sense of having violated something........and that is the Holy Spirit being grieved.
So, there is our GUIDE....He is Inside the Born again...........not Moses Law or 10 Commandments., tho we all need to obey the 10 commandments.....sure., as well as Jesus's Commandments.

 

[PS95]

About Faith

Faith, as Jesus teaches it, is not something passive. It is not only to believe that He exists, or to say His name. True faith moves, obeys, and produces fruit. Without that, it is empty. Jesus Himself makes this clear. In Gospel of Matthew 7:21 (ASV), He says:
“Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father who is in heaven.” Here, simply calling Him “Lord” is not enough. What matters is doing the will of God. Faith must lead to obedience.
He continues in the same teaching: “Every one therefore that heareth these words of mine, and doeth them, shall be likened unto a wise man…” “And every one that heareth these words of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man…” (Matthew 7:24–26, ASV)

Both hear His words. Both could say they believe. But only one acts. That is the one who stands. This shows that faith without action does not hold. Jesus also teaches that a true life of faith must produce visible fruit. In Gospel of Matthew 7:16–20: “By their fruits ye shall know them… Every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but the corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit… Therefore by their fruits ye shall know them.”

Faith is like a tree. If it is real, it will bear fruit. If nothing comes from it, it is not the faith Jesus speaks of.
He gives a strong warning in Gospel of Luke 13:6–9, the parable of the fig tree. A tree that does not bear fruit is in danger of being cut down. This shows that a life without change, even if it seems to have time and chances, cannot remain as it is.
Jesus also speaks directly about keeping His words. In Gospel of John 14:23:
“If a man love me, he will keep my word.”
Love and faith go together, and both lead to obedience. Not by force, but from the heart. And again He says:
“Why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?” (Luke 6:46, ASV)
This question goes straight to the point. Calling Him Lord, believing in Him, is not enough if a person does not follow what He says.
Jesus also connects eternal life with action. In Gospel of Matthew 19:16–17, when asked about life, He answers:
“If thou wouldest enter into life, keep the commandments.”
This shows that faith does not replace obedience, It leads into it.
So when we gather all His words, the message is simple. Faith is the beginning, but it is not meant to stay alone. True faith listens, follows, obeys, and produces fruit. It is alive and active.
A faith that does not change the heart, that does not lead to obedience, is not the faith Jesus taught.

About Repentance

Jesus speaks very plainly about what He expects. He calls people to repent, to turn away from sin, and to receive a new heart that brings a new way of living. First we need to understand what sin is. Jesus shows that sin is not only outward actions, but also what comes from inside a person. He said: “In Gospel of Mark 7:20–23 (ASV), ‘That which proceedeth out of the man, that defileth the man. For from within, out of the heart of men, evil thoughts proceed, fornications, thefts, murders, adulteries… all these evil things proceed from within, and defile the man.’”

So sin is anything that comes from a heart that is not aligned with God. It includes actions, but also thoughts, desires, and intentions.
Jesus also deepens the meaning of sin in Gospel of Matthew 5. He teaches that sin is not only the act, but the root behind it:
“You have heard… ‘Thou shalt not kill’… but I say unto you, that every one who is angry with his brother shall be in danger of the judgment.” (Matthew 5:21–22, ASV) “You have heard… ‘Thou shalt not commit adultery’: but I say unto you, that every one that looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.” (Matthew 5:27–28, ASV)
Here we see that sin begins in the heart. This is why repentance must also begin there.
Jesus calls all people to repent. At the start of His ministry, it is written in Gospel of Matthew 4:17: “Repent ye; for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.” To repent means more than feeling sorry. It means to turn around, to leave the old way, and to walk in a new one. Jesus makes this very clear when He warns: “I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all in like manner perish.” (Luke 13:3, ASV) But Jesus does not only ask people to stop doing wrong. He calls for a true change inside. A new heart that produces good fruit.
In Gospel of Luke 6:43–45 He says:
“For there is no good tree that bringeth forth corrupt fruit… For each tree is known by its own fruit… The good man out of the good treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is good.”

This means the change must be real and inward. A changed heart will naturally bring a changed life.
Jesus also shows this in how He dealt with sinners. When He forgave the woman caught in sin, He told her:
“Go thy way; from henceforth sin no more.” (John 8:11, ASV)
He offers mercy, but He also calls for a new life.
And again, when He healed a man, He said: “Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing befall thee.” (John 5:14, ASV)

So the message is simple and clear. Sin comes from the heart and includes both what we do and what we desire. Repentance means turning away from that sin, not only outwardly but inwardly. And the change Jesus asks for is a true change of heart, one that leads to a new way of living.
In the end, Jesus shows that this is not optional. Those who truly follow Him are those who hear His words and do them. As He said in Gospel of Matthew 7:24:
“Every one therefore that heareth these words of mine, and doeth them, shall be likened unto a wise man, who built his house upon the rock.”

What about the commandments Jesus spoke about?

The commandments are not separate from what Jesus taught about repentance and a changed heart. They are part of it. They show us what sin is, and they show us what a right life looks like. When Jesus spoke about sin, He often pointed back to the commandments, but He went deeper than just the surface. In Gospel of Matthew 5, He takes the commandments and shows their true meaning. Not killing is a commandment, but Jesus shows that anger in the heart is already part of that sin. Not committing adultery is a commandment, but He shows that lust in the heart breaks it already. This means the commandments are not only about actions, but about the heart.

I agree with you here, of course! I also want to make sure that you are not saying that we must clean all up and obey God's commands before we can come to Jesus.. ( there are cults who teach that)
We come to him in faith- filthy in our sins but repenting- and He washes us clean in His blood, give us of His Spirit and only then-- we are able to walk in His commands in love with a changed heart that He gives to us-
We don't obey commands to be saved- but because he saved us, and has given us of His Spirit-- .now we want to obey and have the power to put the deeds of the flesh to death by the Spirit- sin no longer masters over us.
By this we know that we have come to know Him, if we keep His commandments. 1 John 2:3
We love Him since He first loved us- Love doesn't break God's commands. LOVE is HIS Command. How can we love and yet, steal or lie, cheat, etc against another?
How can we love God, yet worship an idol or curse His name? Therefore, love fulfills the law.

James 2-
8If, however, you are fulfilling the royal law according to the Scripture, “YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF,” you are doing well.
9But if you show partiality, you are committing sin and are convicted by the law as transgressors. 10For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles in one point, he has become guilty of all. 11For He who said, “DO NOT COMMIT ADULTERY,” also said, “DO NOT COMMIT MURDER.” Now if you do not commit adultery, but do commit murder, you have become a transgressor of the law. 12So speak and so act as those who are to be judged by the law of liberty. 13For judgment will be merciless to one who has shown no mercy; mercy triumphs over judgment.

Love never fails- faith, hope and love-- greatest of these is love.
Is this what you teach or are you teaching we must obey the 10 commandments including church on Fri- Sat, dietary laws, OT festivals?

 

[LoveYeshua]

I agree with you here, of course! I also want to make sure that you are not saying that we must clean all up and obey God's commands before we can come to Jesus.. ( there are cults who teach that)
We come to him in faith- filthy in our sins but repenting- and He washes us clean in His blood, give us of His Spirit and only then-- we are able to walk in His commands in love with a changed heart that He gives to us-
We don't obey commands to be saved- but because he saved us, and has given us of His Spirit-- .now we want to obey and have the power to put the deeds of the flesh to death by the Spirit- sin no longer masters over us.
By this we know that we have come to know Him, if we keep His commandments. 1 John 2:3
We love Him since He first loved us- Love doesn't break God's commands. LOVE is HIS Command. How can we love and yet, steal or lie, cheat, etc against another?
How can we love God, yet worship an idol or curse His name? Therefore, love fulfills the law.

James 2-
8If, however, you are fulfilling the royal law according to the Scripture, “YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF,” you are doing well.
9But if you show partiality, you are committing sin and are convicted by the law as transgressors. 10For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles in one point, he has become guilty of all. 11For He who said, “DO NOT COMMIT ADULTERY,” also said, “DO NOT COMMIT MURDER.” Now if you do not commit adultery, but do commit murder, you have become a transgressor of the law. 12So speak and so act as those who are to be judged by the law of liberty. 13For judgment will be merciless to one who has shown no mercy; mercy triumphs over judgment.

Love never fails- faith, hope and love-- greatest of these is love.
Is this what you teach or are you teaching we must obey the 10 commandments including church on Fri- Sat, dietary laws, OT festivals?

I am not legalistic I always speak of following Jesus and abiding in him, he is compassionate and merciful and gave us examples this is what I follow. The laws of Moses are the old covenant and were added to the Commandments for many reasons, the main one because the israelites were stiffed necked and would not change or could not and constantly transgressed the law and idolized other Gods, they broke the first commandments constantly. Jesus made all things possible, he died for our sins , shed his own blood on the cross so we could live, all we have to do is as he says and it is not a burden, He came to show us the way either Jews or gentiles. He promised to send his believers the Holy Spirit to teach and Guide. In essence He asks us to love God one another.

For the dietary laws, they are from another time and were part of the identity of the israelites, same for circumcision an identity marker. As for the sabbath for me its Saturday and I keep it simply, NEVER like the Jews of today but very simply as expressed in Isaiah 58:13-14, there is nothing to it really, before people judge me, I am NOT SDA, I am not part of any church at this time, since I cannot find one church that Follows the teaching of Christ but I am still looking, but nonetheless I have the bible, the written word of God and I know Jesus is with his followers always, I am not alone.

 

[Taken]

The first issue is the idea that once a person receives salvation, nothing they do afterward can affect it, and that they do not need to continue in obedience.

Correct.
Salvation is A Gift from God for a mans true Heartful belief IN God… period.

The belief is “guarded, protected, maintained”, by the Power of God that ENTERS IN-to a man, that that remains always true.

And What afterwards?
The man what?
Has good relationships with some men?
Has crappy relationships with some men?
Lies, unintentionally ?
And Hates Some people individually, or by “group” association?

What Obedience IS Required…for a converted man?
Love the Lord God above all? Yes.
Love all men ? Yes?

Same “LOVE”? No.
Love to God, is Utmost Holy perfection.
Love between mankind, is about “treatment’”.

Would you first question a persons beliefs…of stranded motorist, a drowning person, a hungry person, a lost person, a person being attacked, a wounded person, etc.

Before you would Render aid? No.
Because Loving all people does not matter, what their beliefs are… for or against God.

There is Not Opposite of Love.
There IS only Love and Not Love.
God is Love…
They who reject Him, have simply rejected THEIR FREEWILL to Love Him.

Can a person Who Loves God, also Hate God? No.

Can a person who Loves God, Love ALL men…
While Also Hate some of those Same men?
Yes… and so Also does the Same apply to God.

So what IS Hate?
Opposite of Love? No.
Hate is a STRONG dis-LIKE.
Can a man love a person and not LIKE that person? Yes.
And if you strongly do not Like that person… is that Hate? Yes.

Now… Does Any Saved / Quickened man…
Have any “requirements”…commandments beyond Loving God, and all men?

No.

Is such a (saved and quickened man)… Not continuing in Obedience?

If not…How so?


Glory to God,
Taken








Jesus does not speak that way.

He says in Luke 9:23 (ASV):
“If any man would come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me.”

This is not something done once before salvation. Jesus says “daily.” It is a continuing walk, not a one-time step.

He also says in John 15:10 (ASV):
“If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love.”

Abiding in Him is connected to continuing in His commandments. It is not presented as something automatic that cannot be affected.

And even more clearly, Jesus warns in John 15:6 (ASV):
“If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered.”

This shows that remaining in Him matters. It is not described as something permanently secured no matter what a person does.

The second issue is the idea that things like forgiving others, loving enemies, or doing good have “zero effect” on salvation.

Jesus says the opposite.

In Matthew 6:14–15 (ASV):
“For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.”

This is very direct. Our forgiveness is tied to whether we forgive others. That is not “zero effect.”

Also in Luke 6:37 (ASV):
“Forgive, and ye shall be forgiven.”

And about loving enemies, He does not present it as optional reward-only behavior. It is part of being children of God (Luke 6:35).

The third issue is saying that following Jesus, denying yourself, and repentance only happen before receiving salvation.

Jesus speaks of these as ongoing.

In Luke 13:3 (ASV):
“Except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.”

Repentance is not just a one-time entrance step. It is a turning of the heart that must remain.

And again, “take up his cross daily” shows this is a continued life, not a completed requirement.

The fourth issue is reducing fruit to simply personal effort or rewards, without connection to salvation.

Jesus ties fruit directly to whether a person truly belongs to Him.

In John 15:2 (ASV):
“Every branch in me that beareth not fruit, he taketh it away.”

And in Matthew 7:19–21 (ASV):
“Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down… Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father.”

So fruit is not just about rewards. It is evidence of a real and living relationship with Him.

So in a simple way:

Yes, we believe in Jesus and receive from Him.
Yes, we cannot earn salvation by our own works.

But Jesus also teaches that we must continue in Him, continue in obedience, continue in forgiveness, and continue to bear fruit.

Faith is not just something we start with. It is something we live in.

And the safest place is to stay with His own words:

“He that endureth to the end, the same shall be saved.” (Matthew 24:13 ASV)

“Here is the patience of the saints, they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.” Revelation 14:12 (ASV)

This shows it is not only about beginning, but about continuing with Him until the end.

Blessings
[/QUOTE]

 

[Taken]

Jesus does not speak that way.

God approved Scripture…
Acts 16:
[30] And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?
[31] And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

John 6:
[29] Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.

Matt 22:
[36] Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
[37] Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
[38] This is the first and great commandment.
[39] And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
[40] On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

If a man accomplishes these TWO Commandments…He’s “HAS” and “Continues” in God Grace and personal relationship with the Lord God Almighty.

Glory to God,
Taken

He says in Luke 9:23 (ASV):
“If any man would come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me.”

This is not something done once before salvation. Jesus says “daily.” It is a continuing walk, not a one-time step.

He also says in John 15:10 (ASV):
“If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love.”

Abiding in Him is connected to continuing in His commandments. It is not presented as something automatic that cannot be affected.

And even more clearly, Jesus warns in John 15:6 (ASV):
“If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered.”

This shows that remaining in Him matters. It is not described as something permanently secured no matter what a person does.

The second issue is the idea that things like forgiving others, loving enemies, or doing good have “zero effect” on salvation.

Jesus says the opposite.

In Matthew 6:14–15 (ASV):
“For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.”

This is very direct. Our forgiveness is tied to whether we forgive others. That is not “zero effect.”

Also in Luke 6:37 (ASV):
“Forgive, and ye shall be forgiven.”

And about loving enemies, He does not present it as optional reward-only behavior. It is part of being children of God (Luke 6:35).

The third issue is saying that following Jesus, denying yourself, and repentance only happen before receiving salvation.

Jesus speaks of these as ongoing.

In Luke 13:3 (ASV):
“Except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.”

Repentance is not just a one-time entrance step. It is a turning of the heart that must remain.

And again, “take up his cross daily” shows this is a continued life, not a completed requirement.

The fourth issue is reducing fruit to simply personal effort or rewards, without connection to salvation.

Jesus ties fruit directly to whether a person truly belongs to Him.

In John 15:2 (ASV):
“Every branch in me that beareth not fruit, he taketh it away.”

And in Matthew 7:19–21 (ASV):
“Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down… Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father.”

So fruit is not just about rewards. It is evidence of a real and living relationship with Him.

So in a simple way:

Yes, we believe in Jesus and receive from Him.
Yes, we cannot earn salvation by our own works.

But Jesus also teaches that we must continue in Him, continue in obedience, continue in forgiveness, and continue to bear fruit.

Faith is not just something we start with. It is something we live in.

And the safest place is to stay with His own words:

“He that endureth to the end, the same shall be saved.” (Matthew 24:13 ASV)

“Here is the patience of the saints, they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.” Revelation 14:12 (ASV)

This shows it is not only about beginning, but about continuing with Him until the end.

Blessings
[/QUOTE]

 

[Taken]

He says in Luke 9:23 (ASV):
“If any man would come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me.”

This is not something done once before salvation. Jesus says “daily.” It is a continuing walk, not a one-time step.

A man denying himself… is laying down his body unto Crucifixion Death with Jesus’ Body.

A man picking up “his” own Crucifixion cross… walks on, despite naysayers, all around him, day after day, beating him down, spitting, hurling, Lies, Accusations, Disgust, Against him.

The Salvation IS a One Time Gift…

They Following Jesus is the Saved’s continual Path and Direction.

The anti-Christs and Naysayers ARE the continual “Tribulations”… of man Against man… of THIS World…”that the saved are subjected to….”

But not to be dismayed…
They who, have spent their Time, badgering, gaslighting, attacking They with and IN Christ…
Will have Gods Revenge, Tribulations, Wrath… visit them in due time.
Order and Way!

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

He also says in John 15:10 (ASV):
“If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love.”

He is Talking to Whom?

Keep Jewish marriage protocol commands?
Keep Jewish Holy days sacred?
Keep Jewish Feast Days?
Keep Jewish Temple Rituals?
Keep Jewish Death and Burial Rituals?
Keep the Days/ Nights according to Jewish days/ months?
Keep women, bleeding, separated from all others?
Abstain from sexual intercourse a certain number of days… after a birth of a boy, and a different number of days after the birth of a girl?
Abstain from mixing certain fabrics?

Really? Do you do all these Commands?

Do you know WHO Jesus came to … seek, look for, preach to?

Matt 15:
[24] But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

All commands do not apply to all people.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

This is not something done once before salvation. Jesus says “daily.” It is a continuing walk, not a one-time step.

Before given Salvation…
Is a mans Choosing to Commit.
After Given Salvation…Continuing IN Love of God and all men…
Continues….
CAN NOT stop…
Because…
The power of God in Them Maintains their love.

He also says in John 15:10 (ASV):
“If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love.”

IF…implies, the CHOICE still remains with the man.

Abiding in Him is connected to continuing in His commandments. It is not presented as something automatic that cannot be affected.

That is about Gods Love.
Not a man abiding in God.

And even more clearly, Jesus warns in John 15:6 (ASV):
“If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered.”

And WHO are Those?
Not they IN Christ, of which I am.
So, that has no application to me.

This shows that remaining in Him matters.

That says nothing about “Remaining” IN him.
Nothing says they were “IN” Him…

It is not described as something permanently secured no matter what a person does.

Like what?

 

[Taken]

The second issue is the idea that things like forgiving others, loving enemies, or doing good have “zero effect” on salvation.

Jesus says the opposite.

In Matthew 6:14–15 (ASV):
“For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.”

This is very direct. Our forgiveness is tied to whether we forgive others. That is not “zero effect.”

Sin is unbelief in God.
Only God forgives Sin.

Trespasses are Between men.
If You over step your boundaries against men…
Who are you going to apologize to? Say excuse me, sorry, pardon me…?
God?
No! And men can say, I accept, your are excused, you are pardoned…. Which are them forgiving your Trespass against them!
And if they don’t forgive? So what?
God automatically Will.

Also in Luke 6:37 (ASV):
“Forgive, and ye shall be forgiven.”

Correct… forgive men their Trespasses…and God will forgive your trespasses… that men refused to forgive.

And about loving enemies, He does not present it as optional reward-only behavior. It is part of being children of God (Luke 6:35).

And? who said it was optional, regarding the Saved? I didn’t.

Loving my enemies… does not mean I am required to LIKE them or trust them or Buddy around with them.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

The third issue is saying that following Jesus, denying yourself, and repentance only happen before receiving salvation.

Jesus speaks of these as ongoing.

Only?

Yes Receiving Salvation Requires Action Before Salvation is Received.

Following Jesus…
Of course, learning About something / someone Before A Commitment to that One.

Denying yourself…
Yes…
First it would be good to know what “is yourself”…
Your name? Your what?
Your Life? Yes.
What IS your Life? Blood.
How do you Deny your Life?
Kill it? Sure, that is called suicide.

How about … Willingly GIVE your Life UNTO Death… To express your Giving of (your most precious thing : Life), unto Death…
As “confirmation” your Words of Confession be True?

How do men confirm an OATH / Contract?
1) By their Confessed Word
2) By their Signature

How does God confirm an OATH / Contract?
1) By the mans Confessed Word
2) By the man willingly giving his (blood Life) unto Death.

How?
1)God provided a WAY… crucified with Christ Jesus’ Body.
2) second option WAY… Be killed, murdered, by an anti-Christ/UnGodly…of a man continuing to Stand in Belief….they called
Martyrs.

Repent?
Uh… Confess sorrow, shame, regret for ever having had Not Believed.

Those are actions Before receiving Forgiveness and Salvation.

Of course the following continues…

The crucifying, martyr, repeated over and over… No

The repeated repentance and repeated forgiveness for What?

 

[PS95]

I am not legalistic I always speak of following Jesus and abiding in him, he is compassionate and merciful and gave us examples this is what I follow. The laws of Moses are the old covenant and were added to the Commandments for many reasons, the main one because the israelites were stiffed necked and would not change or could not and constantly transgressed the law and idolized other Gods, they broke the first commandments constantly. Jesus made all things possible, he died for our sins , shed his own blood on the cross so we could live, all we have to do is as he says and it is not a burden, He came to show us the way either Jews or gentiles. He promised to send his believers the Holy Spirit to teach and Guide. In essence He asks us to love God one another.

For the dietary laws, they are from another time and were part of the identity of the israelites, same for circumcision an identity marker. As for the sabbath for me its Saturday and I keep it simply, NEVER like the Jews of today but very simply as expressed in Isaiah 58:13-14, there is nothing to it really, before people judge me, I am NOT SDA, I am not part of any church at this time, since I cannot find one church that Follows the teaching of Christ but I am still looking, but nonetheless I have the bible, the written word of God and I know Jesus is with his followers always, I am not alone.

PY- Far be it for me to judge you. We are never to judge over the keeping of any day or not. If I recall, you reject Paul's writings, so that will always leave us at an impasse on this. I certainly have no problem with you observing the Sabbath day- Do you acknowledge that it is not a condition of salvation? Otherwise, it's a works based salvation- do you agree?
If only you did not ignore Paul- I am not Paul only- I think that is totally ridiculous and is due to cherry picking verses. While Paul's emphasis was on saved by grace through faith- never once did he teach that what they call "performance" would not be the result of that faith. It is not what saves us- but is the outcome of true faith. He agrees with James unless we cherry pick verses. James' emphasis was more on the result of that saving faith vs. an empty dead faith. Both of them understood grace, and the command to love one another that true faith produces fruits.
It's interesting that both Paul & James were unbelievers until they actually encountered the Risen Lord and then believed.
1 Cor 15
3For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures, 5and that He appeared to Cephas, then to the twelve. 6After that He appeared to more than five hundred brethren at one time, most of whom remain until now, but some have fallen asleep; 7then He appeared to James, then to all the apostles; 8and last of all, as to one untimely born, He appeared to me also. 9For I am the least of the apostles, and not fit to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God. 10But by the grace of God I am what I am, and His grace toward me did not prove vain; but I labored even more than all of them, yet not I, but the grace of God with me. 11Whether then it was I or they, so we preach and so you believed.

With all of my heart I wish that you could accept Paul as sent by the Lord. It is only when we misunderstand Paul that we think his gospel is different. It is not. He writes to Gentiles, so it may seem less Jewish as it should. But the gospel is the same! IF Paul wrote Hebrews- no one is certain on that.. but if he did- we see his Jewish roots there.
Hebrews 4 is where I get my understanding of the Sabbath and what it's true meaning is. Jesus taught us that the Sabbath was made for man. He also taught that He and the Father continued working. The rest God spoke of was when we rest from our works trying to earn salvation. When we truly accept His gift- we rest from our works for salvation and are free to walk in His command to love others in full confidence of His love and grace. The Sabbath being a shadow..
Paul speaks of the "old covenant" being obsolete replaced by the "new covenant"-- true- but never once should we believe that he is saying it's fine to live morally wrong! Never does Paul teach that. Love fulfills the law.- and as we walk in love we fulfill the law also.
Now if our salvation was conditional on keeping a certain day- God would not have spoken of another day which is today, if we hear His voice.- we are to enter into that rest. That does not mean you can't keep the day- but please be sure that it is not out of self- righteousness in thinking it can save you, or that those who don't keep a certain day- are being disobedient.

There are many Sabbath keepers that do believe it is imperative to keep a certain day. I say that because of those who keep Saturday or Sundays as some Christians have been wrongly taught that the day of rest was changed to Sunday. Both are wrong. We rest in the Lord from our works based salvation everyday. Jesus gave us rest. he is Lord of the Sabbath- He IS our Sabbath. I'm not going to post Hebrews 4 here for you due to space, and sadly, I am not sure you would read it anyway since you reject Paul. I urge you to reconsider and not allow those who misunderstand Paul's teachings to sway you. It is wrong to belong to only Paul or only Cephas etc.. That mistake is still being made today! All of the apostles are one with Christ and we with them.
The 10 commandments are all reiterated in the NT-and come under love--- with the exception of keeping the Old covenant Sabbath day.-
We have a new Sabbath- rest in Him every day!
Peace to you, PY.

 

[LoveYeshua]

PY- Far be it for me to judge you. We are never to judge over the keeping of any day or not. If I recall, you reject Paul's writings, so that will always leave us at an impasse on this. I certainly have no problem with you observing the Sabbath day- Do you acknowledge that it is not a condition of salvation? Otherwise, it's a works based salvation- do you agree?
If only you did not ignore Paul- I am not Paul only- I think that is totally ridiculous and is due to cherry picking verses. While Paul's emphasis was on saved by grace through faith- never once did he teach that what they call "performance" would not be the result of that faith. It is not what saves us- but is the outcome of true faith. He agrees with James unless we cherry pick verses. James' emphasis was more on the result of that saving faith vs. an empty dead faith. Both of them understood grace, and the command to love one another that true faith produces fruits.
It's interesting that both Paul & James were unbelievers until they actually encountered the Risen Lord and then believed.
1 Cor 15
3For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures, 5and that He appeared to Cephas, then to the twelve. 6After that He appeared to more than five hundred brethren at one time, most of whom remain until now, but some have fallen asleep; 7then He appeared to James, then to all the apostles; 8and last of all, as to one untimely born, He appeared to me also. 9For I am the least of the apostles, and not fit to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God. 10But by the grace of God I am what I am, and His grace toward me did not prove vain; but I labored even more than all of them, yet not I, but the grace of God with me. 11Whether then it was I or they, so we preach and so you believed.

With all of my heart I wish that you could accept Paul as sent by the Lord. It is only when we misunderstand Paul that we think his gospel is different. It is not. He writes to Gentiles, so it may seem less Jewish as it should. But the gospel is the same! IF Paul wrote Hebrews- no one is certain on that.. but if he did- we see his Jewish roots there.
Hebrews 4 is where I get my understanding of the Sabbath and what it's true meaning is. Jesus taught us that the Sabbath was made for man. He also taught that He and the Father continued working. The rest God spoke of was when we rest from our works trying to earn salvation. When we truly accept His gift- we rest from our works for salvation and are free to walk in His command to love others in full confidence of His love and grace. The Sabbath being a shadow..
Paul speaks of the "old covenant" being obsolete replaced by the "new covenant"-- true- but never once should we believe that he is saying it's fine to live morally wrong! Never does Paul teach that. Love fulfills the law.- and as we walk in love we fulfill the law also.
Now if our salvation was conditional on keeping a certain day- God would not have spoken of another day which is today, if we hear His voice.- we are to enter into that rest. That does not mean you can't keep the day- but please be sure that it is not out of self- righteousness in thinking it can save you, or that those who don't keep a certain day- are being disobedient.

There are many Sabbath keepers that do believe it is imperative to keep a certain day. I say that because of those who keep Saturday or Sundays as some Christians have been wrongly taught that the day of rest was changed to Sunday. Both are wrong. We rest in the Lord from our works based salvation everyday. Jesus gave us rest. he is Lord of the Sabbath- He IS our Sabbath. I'm not going to post Hebrews 4 here for you due to space, and sadly, I am not sure you would read it anyway since you reject Paul. I urge you to reconsider and not allow those who misunderstand Paul's teachings to sway you. It is wrong to belong to only Paul or only Cephas etc.. That mistake is still being made today! All of the apostles are one with Christ and we with them.
The 10 commandments are all reiterated in the NT-and come under love--- with the exception of keeping the Old covenant Sabbath day.-
We have a new Sabbath- rest in Him every day!
Peace to you, PY.

you start with "far from me to judge you" then you do exactly that. This thread is NOT about the sabbath its NOT about Paul it is not about me. it is about Jesus and what he teaches. What you wrote here judging me without knowing me is not acceptable. if you have a direct question on the O.P. then i may reply.

 

[LoveYeshua]

Before given Salvation…
Is a mans Choosing to Commit.
After Given Salvation…Continuing IN Love of God and all men…
Continues….
CAN NOT stop…
Because…
The power of God in Them Maintains their love.



IF…implies, the CHOICE still remains with the man.



That is about Gods Love.
Not a man abiding in God.



And WHO are Those?
Not they IN Christ, of which I am.
So, that has no application to me.



That says nothing about “Remaining” IN him.
Nothing says they were “IN” Him…





Like what?

Salvation begins when a person truly believes in Jesus and turns to Him. Jesus said, “He that believeth on him should not perish, but have eternal life” (John 3:16), and “He that heareth my word, and believeth… hath eternal life, and hath passed out of death into life” (John 5:24). So there is a real change that starts now. A person moves from death to life when they believe. But Jesus also shows that this faith must remain living and faithful. He said, “If a man keep my word, he shall never see death” (John 8:51), and again, “He that endureth to the end, the same shall be saved” (Matthew 24:13). This means the beginning is not the end. The one who believes must continue in His word.

Then the last book of the Bible shows the final moment when everything is revealed. In the book of Book of Revelation, it says, “I saw the dead, the great and the small, standing before the throne… and the dead were judged… according to their works” (Revelation 20:12). And it says, “If any was not found written in the book of life, he was cast into the lake of fire” (Revelation 20:15). This shows that there is a real judgment at the end.

But it also speaks of those who overcome and remain faithful. “He that overcometh shall be clothed in white garments; and I will in no wise blot his name out of the book of life” (Revelation 3:5). And again, “Be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee the crown of life” (Revelation 2:10). And at the end, those who are received are described as those who followed and remained clean: “Blessed are they that wash their robes, that they may have the right to come to the tree of life” (Revelation 22:14).

Salvation begins now when a person believes in Jesus and follows Him. But it is not a one moment thing that cannot be lost. It is a life that must continue. At the end, at the judgment, each person stands before God, and those who remained faithful, who kept His word, and whose names are found in the book of life, they are the ones who enter into the kingdom.

 

[LoveYeshua]

God approved Scripture…
Acts 16:
[30] And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?
[31] And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

taken What does believe in someone means to you personally? to me when I believe someone, I believe in what they say and if that person ( Jesus) would ask something of me or ask me to do something I would do it. but realize it is a choice we all have to make. simple belief is not enough.

James 2:19
“Thou believest that God is one; thou doest well: the demons also believe, and shudder.”

This shows something very important.
Belief by itself is not enough. Even demons believe that God is real, yet they do not follow Him.

One must choose to follow him and yes people can change, example Judas, was given the power to heal and cast out demons and did so as the other disciples also, yet he did prefer 30 silver coins to Jesus and and delivered him to his enemies.

Jesus was clear: any branches that does not bare fruit he will cut away. Here I quote these verses in the full context, the words of Christ through John are so exquisite they must keep together.

Jhn 15:1 I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.

Jhn 15:2 Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.

Jhn 15:3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.

Jhn 15:4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.

Jhn 15:5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.

Jhn 15:6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

Jhn 15:7 If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.

Jhn 15:8 Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples.

Jhn 15:9 As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love.

Jhn 15:10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

Jhn 15:11 These things have I spoken unto you, that my joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be full.

Jhn 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.

Jhn 15:13 Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.

Jhn 15:14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.

Jhn 15:15 Henceforth I call you not servants; for the servant knoweth not what his lord doeth: but I have called you friends; for all things that I have heard of my Father I have made known unto you.

Jhn 15:16 Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you.

Jhn 15:17 These things I command you, that ye love one another.

Blessings

 

[Taken]

Salvation begins when a person truly believes in Jesus and turns to Him.

FAITH, begins when a person Hears/ is Learning About God.

TASTING, begins when a person IS Accepting What they Hear.

BLESSINGS, begin when a person IS Hearing AND Tasting.

God IS WITH, a person begins when a person IS Hearing AND Tasting.

A person IS WITH, God begins when a person IS Hearing and Tasting.

ANYTIME…a person can WALK AWAY.
(They called, “Fallen FROM FAITH)

SALVATION, FROM God, is OFFERED, to the person, “who” CONTINUES to Hear and Taste; … To the moment His Body mortally Dies.
… THEN… is THAT person “GIVEN” SALVATION.
Restored Saved soul, (departs dead body) rises to Heaven.
Dead Body, returns to dust.
Dead body Raised in glory, Gods “First” world Wide Resurrection.

SALVATION, FROM Christ Jesus the Lord, is OFFERED to the person;
“who”…
Hears, Tastes, AND EATS what he Hears and Eats.

THAT person…”EATING”….”NOW” HAS the OPTION…

TO: Call on Christ Jesus
TO: ASK for Forgiveness; (for having HAD, not Believed)
TO: Confess his True Heartful Belief.
TO: Willingly Lay Down his own Life, Crucified WITH Jesus’ Body.
TO: Receive His: Forgiveness, Covering, Cleansing, Justification, Sanctification (ie. set Apart from the Unsanctified)
TO: Receive His: Circumcision, New Heart, Baptism, Restored soul, Seed of God, Gods Spirit, the mans new spirit…
TO: Live “IN” Christ Jesus’ Risen Body, until their own glorified body is risen up.
TO: Forever be WITH God.
TO: be risen up “Claimed / Resurrected in glory” BY: Christ Jesus ( Rapture)

A man, Rejecting Christ Jesus Option…
And Mortally Dies in Belief,
Shall Participate In Gods “First” world wide Resurrection.

The Rapture IS Christ Jesus’ Resurrection…
ARE the Saved, By Christ Jesus

The First world wide Resurrection is Gods Resurrection…ARE the Saved, BY God.

The Last world wide Resurrection is Gods Resurrection of the damned.

Every individual person HAS FREEWILL to Hear, Learn, Choose, Reject, Deny IF, When, How, Why…
According …
TO: The Lord God Almighty;
REGARDING …their FINAL FOREVER Destiny.

Personally…
REGARDING “my FREEWILL Choice/ Election”

I Chose To Know, Take, Possess, Have, Keep…
Christ Jesus’ OFFERING.

John 14:
[20] At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Luther7]

About Faith

Faith, as Jesus teaches it, is not something passive. It is not only to believe that He exists, or to say His name. True faith moves, obeys, and produces fruit. Without that, it is empty. Jesus Himself makes this clear. In Gospel of Matthew 7:21 (ASV), He says:
“Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father who is in heaven.” Here, simply calling Him “Lord” is not enough. What matters is doing the will of God. Faith must lead to obedience.
He continues in the same teaching: “Every one therefore that heareth these words of mine, and doeth them, shall be likened unto a wise man…” “And every one that heareth these words of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man…” (Matthew 7:24–26, ASV)

Both hear His words. Both could say they believe. But only one acts. That is the one who stands. This shows that faith without action does not hold. Jesus also teaches that a true life of faith must produce visible fruit. In Gospel of Matthew 7:16–20: “By their fruits ye shall know them… Every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but the corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit… Therefore by their fruits ye shall know them.”

Faith is like a tree. If it is real, it will bear fruit. If nothing comes from it, it is not the faith Jesus speaks of.
He gives a strong warning in Gospel of Luke 13:6–9, the parable of the fig tree. A tree that does not bear fruit is in danger of being cut down. This shows that a life without change, even if it seems to have time and chances, cannot remain as it is.
Jesus also speaks directly about keeping His words. In Gospel of John 14:23:
“If a man love me, he will keep my word.”
Love and faith go together, and both lead to obedience. Not by force, but from the heart. And again He says:
“Why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?” (Luke 6:46, ASV)
This question goes straight to the point. Calling Him Lord, believing in Him, is not enough if a person does not follow what He says.
Jesus also connects eternal life with action. In Gospel of Matthew 19:16–17, when asked about life, He answers:
“If thou wouldest enter into life, keep the commandments.”
This shows that faith does not replace obedience, It leads into it.
So when we gather all His words, the message is simple. Faith is the beginning, but it is not meant to stay alone. True faith listens, follows, obeys, and produces fruit. It is alive and active.
A faith that does not change the heart, that does not lead to obedience, is not the faith Jesus taught.

About Repentance

Jesus speaks very plainly about what He expects. He calls people to repent, to turn away from sin, and to receive a new heart that brings a new way of living. First we need to understand what sin is. Jesus shows that sin is not only outward actions, but also what comes from inside a person. He said: “In Gospel of Mark 7:20–23 (ASV), ‘That which proceedeth out of the man, that defileth the man. For from within, out of the heart of men, evil thoughts proceed, fornications, thefts, murders, adulteries… all these evil things proceed from within, and defile the man.’”

So sin is anything that comes from a heart that is not aligned with God. It includes actions, but also thoughts, desires, and intentions.
Jesus also deepens the meaning of sin in Gospel of Matthew 5. He teaches that sin is not only the act, but the root behind it:
“You have heard… ‘Thou shalt not kill’… but I say unto you, that every one who is angry with his brother shall be in danger of the judgment.” (Matthew 5:21–22, ASV) “You have heard… ‘Thou shalt not commit adultery’: but I say unto you, that every one that looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.” (Matthew 5:27–28, ASV)
Here we see that sin begins in the heart. This is why repentance must also begin there.
Jesus calls all people to repent. At the start of His ministry, it is written in Gospel of Matthew 4:17: “Repent ye; for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.” To repent means more than feeling sorry. It means to turn around, to leave the old way, and to walk in a new one. Jesus makes this very clear when He warns: “I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all in like manner perish.” (Luke 13:3, ASV) But Jesus does not only ask people to stop doing wrong. He calls for a true change inside. A new heart that produces good fruit.
In Gospel of Luke 6:43–45 He says:
“For there is no good tree that bringeth forth corrupt fruit… For each tree is known by its own fruit… The good man out of the good treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is good.”

This means the change must be real and inward. A changed heart will naturally bring a changed life.
Jesus also shows this in how He dealt with sinners. When He forgave the woman caught in sin, He told her:
“Go thy way; from henceforth sin no more.” (John 8:11, ASV)
He offers mercy, but He also calls for a new life.
And again, when He healed a man, He said: “Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing befall thee.” (John 5:14, ASV)

So the message is simple and clear. Sin comes from the heart and includes both what we do and what we desire. Repentance means turning away from that sin, not only outwardly but inwardly. And the change Jesus asks for is a true change of heart, one that leads to a new way of living.
In the end, Jesus shows that this is not optional. Those who truly follow Him are those who hear His words and do them. As He said in Gospel of Matthew 7:24:
“Every one therefore that heareth these words of mine, and doeth them, shall be likened unto a wise man, who built his house upon the rock.”

What about the commandments Jesus spoke about?

The commandments are not separate from what Jesus taught about repentance and a changed heart. They are part of it. They show us what sin is, and they show us what a right life looks like. When Jesus spoke about sin, He often pointed back to the commandments, but He went deeper than just the surface. In Gospel of Matthew 5, He takes the commandments and shows their true meaning. Not killing is a commandment, but Jesus shows that anger in the heart is already part of that sin. Not committing adultery is a commandment, but He shows that lust in the heart breaks it already. This means the commandments are not only about actions, but about the heart.

When a man asked Him how to have eternal life, Jesus answered by pointing directly to the commandments:
“You know the commandments… Do not kill, Do not commit adultery, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Honor your father and mother.” (from Gospel of Mark 10:19, ASV)
This shows that the commandments still stand as the way of righteousness. But Jesus does not stop there. He then calls the man to follow Him fully, showing that obedience must come from the heart, not just outward behavior.
Jesus also sums up the commandments in a simple way in Gospel of Matthew 22:37–40: “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart… and your neighbor as yourself. On these two commandments hangs all the law and the prophets.”
So the commandments are fulfilled through love. But this is not just words. Real love leads to real obedience.
This is where repentance fits in. To repent means to turn away from breaking these commandments, and to begin to live according to them, from the heart. It is not just stopping sin, but starting to walk in what is right.
Jesus makes this very clear when He says:
“Not every one that says to me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that does the will of my Father.” (Matthew 7:21, ASV)
And again: “If you love me, you will keep my commandments.” (John 14:15, ASV,)
So the commandments show what sin is, repentance is turning away from breaking them, and a changed heart is what allows a person to truly keep them.

The commandments are like a mirror that shows what is wrong. Repentance is turning away from that wrong. And the new heart that Jesus speaks about, transformed by the Holy Spirit whom He gives to His believers, is what makes a person able to live in what is right. Faith is not just belief; it is active and obeys the words of Christ.

Amen. That " changed heart" ( the work of God) is the key. We would forever walk in darkness if not for His mercy on His people.