What does it mean?

[faithhopecharity]

The reference to "patience" is that of waiting--perhaps for a lifetime--which is allotted to us all for our salvation. Because this life of suffering is unto our death, appointed to us for having been born of the lineage of sin since Adam. Which indeed takes patience to endure.


The promise of salvation and eternal life comes to those who believe and consequently are born again of the spirit of God. Which may come at any time in this life where we see God in part. But when this is all over, then we shall see Him face to face, as a child truely seeing the face of their father for the first time.


It means Jesus has come to save us from the burdens we experience of sin and death. If we join with Him, believing that God our Father sent Him, He will walk with us through the rest of this life and escort us out from under the curse that came upon humanity because of the original sin from which we became children. The rest refers to the rest of God, which is life without any burden such as we now know and experience in this life.


Before John the Baptist God carried all people along in their approach of what He promised them along the way since Adam. When John came preaching the forgiveness of sins, it was he who noted the time of our deliverance by identifying Christ. Which was an act of war in the heavens, which Christ eventually won--which was by the "violence" He endured when He was "taken" and crucified.

are you saying patience

The reference to "patience" is that of waiting--perhaps for a lifetime--which is allotted to us all for our salvation. Because this life of suffering is unto our death, appointed to us for having been born of the lineage of sin since Adam. Which indeed takes patience to endure.


The promise of salvation and eternal life comes to those who believe and consequently are born again of the spirit of God. Which may come at any time in this life where we see God in part. But when this is all over, then we shall see Him face to face, as a child truely seeing the face of their father for the first time.


It means Jesus has come to save us from the burdens we experience of sin and death. If we join with Him, believing that God our Father sent Him, He will walk with us through the rest of this life and escort us out from under the curse that came upon humanity because of the original sin from which we became children. The rest refers to the rest of God, which is life without any burden such as we now know and experience in this life.


Before John the Baptist God carried all people along in their approach of what He promised them along the way since Adam. When John came preaching the forgiveness of sins, it was he who noted the time of our deliverance by identifying Christ. Which was an act of war in the heavens, which Christ eventually won--which was by the "violence" He endured when He was "taken" and crucified.

are you saying that we earn salvation by patience?

thks

 

[faithhopecharity]

The reference to "patience" is that of waiting--perhaps for a lifetime--which is allotted to us all for our salvation. Because this life of suffering is unto our death, appointed to us for having been born of the lineage of sin since Adam. Which indeed takes patience to endure.


The promise of salvation and eternal life comes to those who believe and consequently are born again of the spirit of God. Which may come at any time in this life where we see God in part. But when this is all over, then we shall see Him face to face, as a child truely seeing the face of their father for the first time.


It means Jesus has come to save us from the burdens we experience of sin and death. If we join with Him, believing that God our Father sent Him, He will walk with us through the rest of this life and escort us out from under the curse that came upon humanity because of the original sin from which we became children. The rest refers to the rest of God, which is life without any burden such as we now know and experience in this life.


Before John the Baptist God carried all people along in their approach of what He promised them along the way since Adam. When John came preaching the forgiveness of sins, it was he who noted the time of our deliverance by identifying Christ. Which was an act of war in the heavens, which Christ eventually won--which was by the "violence" He endured when He was "taken" and crucified.

it does not say "rest to your bodies" but "rest to your souls"

try again

thks

 

[faithhopecharity]

The reference to "patience" is that of waiting--perhaps for a lifetime--which is allotted to us all for our salvation. Because this life of suffering is unto our death, appointed to us for having been born of the lineage of sin since Adam. Which indeed takes patience to endure.


The promise of salvation and eternal life comes to those who believe and consequently are born again of the spirit of God. Which may come at any time in this life where we see God in part. But when this is all over, then we shall see Him face to face, as a child truely seeing the face of their father for the first time.


It means Jesus has come to save us from the burdens we experience of sin and death. If we join with Him, believing that God our Father sent Him, He will walk with us through the rest of this life and escort us out from under the curse that came upon humanity because of the original sin from which we became children. The rest refers to the rest of God, which is life without any burden such as we now know and experience in this life.


Before John the Baptist God carried all people along in their approach of what He promised them along the way since Adam. When John came preaching the forgiveness of sins, it was he who noted the time of our deliverance by identifying Christ. Which was an act of war in the heavens, which Christ eventually won--which was by the "violence" He endured when He was "taken" and crucified.

this is good and I agree it refers to His passion and death but we have union with Christ and so must suffer as well! phil 1:29

thks

 

[faithhopecharity]

The would-be contradiction exists because many believe that our works are required--which is not required. But what is required are Jesus'/God's works--not ours.

If Christ did it all for us and there would s nothing for us to do to obtain eternal salvation why does it say that we MUST DO IT?

thks

Jn 3:16 1 Jn 5:13 Perpetual faith
mt 3:8 2 cor 7:10 fruits of repentance
Jn 15:4 abide in Christ & bear fruit
Lk 3:9 bear fruit
Lk 1:75 acts 10:35 deeds of righteousness
phil 1:11 fruits of righteousness
mt 26:41 watch and pray
mk 24:48 watch and pray
Lk 21:36 Watch and pray, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.
mt 7:7 ask and you shall receive
Lk 9:23 phil 1:29 daily, deny thyself, take up thy cross and follow me.
ps 23:3 leads in paths (deeds) of righteousness acts 10:35
mt 7:14 narrow road that leads to life
2 pet 3:18 grow in grace
heb 6:12 faith & patience
rev 2:19 faith, patience, & works
rev 14:12 commandments, patience, & faith
mt 19:17 Jn 14:21 1 cor 7:19 1Jn 3:24 1 Jn 5:2-3 rev 12:17 keep the commandments
mt 10:22 mk 13:13 mt 24:13 endure to the end in patient suffering
rev 2:10 he who overcomes I shall give the crown of life!

 

[NayborBear]

"works are forbidden"

verses

"works are required"


((works are forbidden))

eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast

((works are required))

eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.


how do you solve this glaring contradiction in scripture?

thks

Like this:
1 Peter 2:5
5 Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, TO OFFER UP "SPIRITUAL SACRIFICES." ACCEPTABLE TO GOD BY Jesus Christ.

Cuz, ya see? the "word" FAITH = "EFFORT!" Where many stop at the "word" BELIEVE? What is actually celebrated and rewarded is?: "BELIEEEEVEINNNNG!"
The meaning of "Spiritual Sacrifices" in the above verse, is indicative of "UNSEEN EFFORT/S"
Hebrews 7:11
If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that ANOTHER PRIEST should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?

This comes after YEARS of "BEELEEEVEEENG!"
Hebrews 6:1
Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection (COMPLETENESS); not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,
(an add on edit)
Believe it or not? Doing this "carries a lot of water" towards "Acts ATTRIBUTABLE towards RIGHTEOUSNESS!"
Or so I've been told!
Hope this helps.

 

[faithhopecharity]

Galatians 5:2, this is one of the most frightening statements in the New Testament, how could doing something religious make Jesus Christ have no value? The Galatians thought they were just adding a little extra obedience to their faith, they believed in Jesus, but they also wanted to be serious about their religion, they thought the equation for salvation was Jesus plus circumcision, but Paul stops them and says the math does not work that way, it is not Jesus plus something else, it is Jesus or nothing. The moment you decide that you need to do something to finish your salvation, you’re saying that the cross was not enough, you are insulting the sacrifice of Jesus. You are telling God, that the death of his son was only a partial payment and that your human effort will pay the rest of the bill.

we don't have eternal salvation so were not finishing salvation

we have the grace of justification and we must participate in sanctification and perseverance

thks

 

[faithhopecharity]

Galatians 5:2, you insist on giving God your pocket change to help pay for it, that might seem like a nice gesture, but it is actually a deep insult. By trying to pay, you are turning a loving gift into a business transaction, you are saying his gift was not sufficient, you are degrading his generosity, that is exactly what you do, when you try to add your own works to Jesus’ sacrifice, you are trying to pay for a house you could never afford with pocket change that is worthless. Hebrews 9:18-28, the blood the High Priest brought into the Holy of Holies was always the blood of an animal, never his own, every one of these limitations points to a system that was never designed to be the final answer.

Jn 15:5 apart from Christ? nothing!

Phil 4:13 In union with Christ? all things!

thks

what exactly does "it is finished" mean? Jn 19:30

 

[faithhopecharity]

Grace, on the other hand, demands faith in the one who was perfect, Paul is forcing the Galatians to make a choice, do you want to be judged by a system where one mistake destroys you or do you want to be saved by a system where all your mistakes are covered by the blood of Jesus Christ, you cannot have both. Galatians 5:4, when most people hear fallen from grace, they think of a moral failure, a news story about a pastor who had an affair or a leader caught stealing money and people say, he fell from grace. But falling from grace has nothing to do with committing sins like adultery or theft, ironically, falling from grace happens when you try to be too good, it happens when you try to earn your standing with God through your own behavior.

we have union with God by the grace of Christ but that's not eternal salvation

 

[faithhopecharity]

Grace, on the other hand, demands faith in the one who was perfect, Paul is forcing the Galatians to make a choice, do you want to be judged by a system where one mistake destroys you or do you want to be saved by a system where all your mistakes are covered by the blood of Jesus Christ, you cannot have both. Galatians 5:4, when most people hear fallen from grace, they think of a moral failure, a news story about a pastor who had an affair or a leader caught stealing money and people say, he fell from grace. But falling from grace has nothing to do with committing sins like adultery or theft, ironically, falling from grace happens when you try to be too good, it happens when you try to earn your standing with God through your own behavior.

it is a moral failure of a man who has received the grace of justification to sin is to fall from grace and be cut off from the life of God, thats why gal 6 says

7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.

8 For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.

and gal 5 says

19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,

20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,

21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

SHALL NOT INHERIT THE KINGDOM OF GOD!

eternal damnation!

lost forever!

thks

 

[ScottA]

are you saying patience

are you saying that we earn salvation by patience?

thks

Have patience, yes, as God has allotted our whole life to the cause of our salvation. But no, we do not earn salvation, it is a gift from God.

If you are not following or understanding what I am telling you, slow down (patience), read it again. This is like leaning a new language, comprehension takes time and determination to understand fully. Or skip trying to understand and just believe the greatest longest established truth in all of history at face value. Just that, is enough. You don't need to have all the answers. If you would like them however, they are there, to be found...if you have the patience, and allow God to impose His terms, rather than things having to fit into our own terms as many try to do (like a rude tourist). That is not how God works, He'll leave you hanging if you do not come willing and humble. I am not saying you are anything like that...just trying to set you on the right footing to have the best of results.

 

[ScottA]

it does not say "rest to your bodies" but "rest to your souls"

try again

thks

No. I will not try again. This is not a game or a test. You asked questions as if knowing little of nothing. It is only in that context that I answered the way I did.

You, on the other hand, should try taking a different, less deceiving approach.

 

[faithhopecharity]

A related question: What does it mean to "seek God's face?" (Psalm 27:8 and other OT references.)

With Exodus 33:20 lurking in the background: "No man can see my face and live". So why would we seek God's face?

I think it refers to seeing God in the future glory

thks

 

[faithhopecharity]

This is a rest for a weariness that penetrates to the very essence of a person.

I think it means eternal rest (salvation)

thks

 

[faithhopecharity]

Galatians 5:6, real faith is not static, it moves, it acts, but the motivation is different. Under the law, you loved your neighbor, because you were afraid of being punished if you didn’t. Under grace, you love your neighbor, because you are so overwhelmed by God’s love for you, that it overflows. The action might look the same on the outside, but the heart condition is completely different, Paul is baffled by how quickly the Galatians turned away from this truth, Galatians 5:7. The Christian life is a marathon, the Galatians were running well, they were focused on Jesus, but legalism cut in on them.

Bad theology, it stops your spiritual progress, Paul warns the Galatians about how subtle this deception is, Galatians 5:8-9. If you have ever baked bread, you know you do not need much yeast, a tiny pinch will eventually cause the entire bowl of dough to rise. False teaching is the same, you do not need to reject Jesus completely to destroy a church, you just need to add a little bit of legalism, add a few man-made rules. Give lies enough time and they will infect everything, they will turn a joyful community of believers into a judgmental club of rule keepers. Galatians 5:12, Paul feels so strongly about this, that he uses graphic language, he basically says he wishes they would go even further and cut themselves off, that is how serious he is. Paul wants the source of this legalism cut off completely, because it is destroying the souls of his friends.

Sin costs life and the only blood valuable enough to pay for every human soul was Jesus Christ’s blood. Hebrews 9:22, almost, not all things, almost all things. there were exceptions in the law where purification could occur without blood, a person too poor to afford an animal, could offer flour instead. Certain purifications used water or fire, the author of Hebrews knows this and he says, almost on purpose, because God’s word does not exaggerate, it does not round up, it says exactly what it means. The Bible, it is careful with its claims and if scripture is that precise, you can trust it when it makes its larger claims about blood, forgiveness and the cross.

if Christ did it all for us and there is nothing for us to do why does it say: "we must do it"?

Jn 3:16 1 Jn 5:13 Perpetual faith
mt 3:8 2 cor 7:10 fruits of repentance
Jn 15:4 abide in Christ & bear fruit
Lk 3:9 bear fruit
Lk 1:75 acts 10:35 deeds of righteousness
phil 1:11 fruits of righteousness
mt 26:41 watch and pray
mk 24:48 watch and pray
Lk 21:36 Watch and pray, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.
mt 7:7 ask and you shall receive
Lk 9:23 phil 1:29 daily, deny thyself, take up thy cross and follow me.
ps 23:3 leads in paths (deeds) of righteousness acts 10:35
mt 7:14 narrow road that leads to life
2 pet 3:18 grow in grace
heb 6:12 faith & patience
heb 12:4 Ye have not yet resisted unto blood, striving against sin.
James 4:7 Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.
rev 2:19 faith, patience, & works
rev 14:12 commandments, patience, & faith
mt 19:17 Jn 14:21 1 cor 7:19 1Jn 3:24 1 Jn 5:2-3 rev 12:17 keep the commandments
eph 6:11 Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil.
mt 10:22 mk 13:13 mt 24:13 endure to the end in patient suffering
rev 2:10 he who overcomes I shall give the crown of life!

Jude 1:21 Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.

Romans 2:7
To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:

Hebrews 10:36
For ye have need of patience, that, after ye have done the will of God, ye might receive the promise.
(eternal salvation)

thks

 

[newnature]

if Christ did it all for us and there is nothing for us to do why does it say: "we must do it"?

Jn 3:16 1 Jn 5:13 Perpetual faith
mt 3:8 2 cor 7:10 fruits of repentance
Jn 15:4 abide in Christ & bear fruit
Lk 3:9 bear fruit
Lk 1:75 acts 10:35 deeds of righteousness
phil 1:11 fruits of righteousness
mt 26:41 watch and pray
mk 24:48 watch and pray
Lk 21:36 Watch and pray, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.
mt 7:7 ask and you shall receive
Lk 9:23 phil 1:29 daily, deny thyself, take up thy cross and follow me.
ps 23:3 leads in paths (deeds) of righteousness acts 10:35
mt 7:14 narrow road that leads to life
2 pet 3:18 grow in grace
heb 6:12 faith & patience
heb 12:4 Ye have not yet resisted unto blood, striving against sin.
James 4:7 Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.
rev 2:19 faith, patience, & works
rev 14:12 commandments, patience, & faith
mt 19:17 Jn 14:21 1 cor 7:19 1Jn 3:24 1 Jn 5:2-3 rev 12:17 keep the commandments
eph 6:11 Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil.
mt 10:22 mk 13:13 mt 24:13 endure to the end in patient suffering
rev 2:10 he who overcomes I shall give the crown of life!

Jude 1:21 Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.

Romans 2:7
To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:

Hebrews 10:36
For ye have need of patience, that, after ye have done the will of God, ye might receive the promise.
(eternal salvation)

thks

Galatians 5:13, if you are free from the law and you are saved only by grace, why not just sin as much as you want, if God’s job is to forgive and my job is to have fun, let us get to it, this is the most common objection to the message of grace. People are terrified that freedom will lead to chaos, but Paul crushes this idea, freedom is not the right to do whatever you want, that is actually a different kind of slavery. If you do whatever your impulses tell you to do, you are a slave to your impulses, true freedom is the power to do what you ought to do, it is the power to choose love over selfishness.

 

[newnature]

it is a moral failure of a man who has received the grace of justification to sin is to fall from grace and be cut off from the life of God, thats why gal 6 says

7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.

8 For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.

and gal 5 says

19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,

20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,

21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

SHALL NOT INHERIT THE KINGDOM OF GOD!

eternal damnation!

lost forever!

thks

Galatians 5:14, Paul explains that the entire law creates a heavy burden, but the intent of the law can be fulfilled in one simple command, love your neighbor as yourself. If you love your neighbor, you will not seal from him. If you love your neighbor, you will not sleep with his wife. If you love your neighbor, you will not lie about him. Love naturally fulfills the moral requirements of the law without needing a checklist. But look at the warning Paul gives to churches that lack this love, Galatians 5:15, this is a wild animal metaphor. When a church focuses on rules instead of love, people become vicious, they judge each other, they gossip, they attack those who do not measure up, they act like wild dogs fighting over scraps of meat, Paul says this is the inevitable result of legalism, it destroys community.

 

[newnature]

we have union with God by the grace of Christ but that's not eternal salvation

Galatians 5:16-17, this is the most psychologically relatable part of the entire Bible, every single believer knows exactly what this feels like, you have two natures living inside one body. You have the flesh, which is your old human nature that wants to please itself, it is selfish, fearful, rebellious and craves instant gratification, then you have the Holy Spirit, the actual presence of God living inside you. These two are not friends, they are not roommates who get along, they are not partners who compromise, they are mortal enemies, they are at war 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. This is a violent, active conflict happening in your mind right now, this explains the deep frustration and exhaustion many Christians feel.

Believers wonder, if I am saved, why do I still want to sin, why is the temptation still so strong? Many believers panic when they feel this battle, they think that having sinful thoughts means they are not really Christians, but the opposite is true, the presence of the battle is proof of your salvation. If you are not a Christian, there would be no battle, you would just follow the flesh without any resistance, a dead fish floats downstream, only a live fish swims against the current. The fact that you feel the resistance means the Holy Spirit is alive in you fighting back.

 

[newnature]

Jn 15:5 apart from Christ? nothing!

Phil 4:13 In union with Christ? all things!

thks

what exactly does "it is finished" mean? Jn 19:30

1 Peter 2:6, Peter is urging believers to live as a spiritual house, built on the foundation of Christ, having laid the foundation of holiness as your response to God’s grace. Turn your gaze to the bedrock of it all, Christ himself, the cornerstone upon which everything stands and of believers as living stones being built into a spiritual house. This metaphor is more than poetic, it’s a rallying cry for Christians to embrace their identity and mission, even in the face of rejection and opposition.

In the ancient world, the cornerstone was the first stone laid in a building’s foundation, determining the structures alignment and strength, if the cornerstone was flawed, the entire building would falter. The cornerstone Peter describes is no ordinary stone, it is chosen by God himself, precious and perfect, capable of bearing the weight of all creation. This cornerstone is Jesus, the foundation of faith and the assurance that you will never be put to shame, but not everyone sees him this way.

 

[newnature]

we don't have eternal salvation so were not finishing salvation

we have the grace of justification and we must participate in sanctification and perseverance

thks

Romans 11:26, in God’s wisdom, the rejection of Jesus by much of Israel, led to the good news being preached to the Gentiles, but Paul says that God’s plan isn’t finished yet, he prophesies that a time will come, when Israel will turn back to God. Not every single person of Israel will automatically be saved, but that God’s promises to Israel will be fulfilled in his way, in his time. Paul’s teaching here, shows you that God is faithful to his promises, even when Israel strayed, God didn’t abandon them, he used their story, their struggles and even their mistakes to further his redemptive plan.

God’s faithfulness to Israel is a reminder that he is faithful to you as well, no matter how far you stray, his love and promises remain. Just as God is working in Israel’s story, he’s working in yours, weaving every part of your journey into his bigger plan. Paul’s discussion of Israel isn’t just historical, it’s relevant to you today, it reminds you that God’s ways are higher than yours, that his timing and purposes often extend far beyond what you can see. God’s commitment to Israel reveals his character, his patience, his mercy and his unbreakable promises.

 

[faithhopecharity]

The would-be contradiction exists because many believe that our works are required--which is not required. But what is required are Jesus'/God's works--not ours.

not required?

how can you be a disciple without works?

Lk 14:26-27
If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple. And whosoever doth not bear his cross, and come after me, cannot be my disciple.

can someone who is not a disciple attain to eternal salvation?

thks