Both Pretribbers and Preterists are clearly wrong that great tribulation begins with the DOTL.

[ewq1938]

Which does not prove the first 3.5 years is the time during which the antichrist first comes to power and when he spends time deceiving the entire world to follow him.

The entire length is 42 months. There is no "first half" or anything of the sort. The trib being shortened does not mean staying the same length. I shouldn't have to explain why that is.

 

[Dan Clarkston]

The entire length is 42 months. There is no "first half" or anything of the sort. The trib being shortened does not mean staying the same length. I shouldn't have to explain why that is.

The length of the tribulation is seven years. This is determined by an understanding of the seventy weeks of Daniel (Daniel 9:24–27). The Great Tribulation is the last half of the tribulation period

You are confusing the last half with the entire 7 year tribulation period.

The last half is a moot point for me as I won't be here after the catching away of the Lord's faithful.

If you'd like to refuse the rescue and stay here, feel free.

 

[ewq1938]

The length of the tribulation is seven years. This is determined by an understanding of the seventy weeks of Daniel (Daniel 9:24–27). The Great Tribulation is the last half of the tribulation period

No, the trib andf GT are two ways the bible speaks of the same period of time and Jesus said it would be shortened so no longer 7 years long.

If you'd like to refuse the rescue and stay here, feel free.

It's better than Apostasy...

 

[Dan Clarkston]

It's better than Apostasy...

So those recused by the Lord and taken off the earth pre-wrath are in apostasy?

I'm going to believe God's promises of deliverance and victory over the forces of darkness because I'm a believer. That's what believers do is they believe God's promises.

Romans 3:3,4
For what if some did not believe? shall their unbelief make the faith of God without effect?
God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.

 

[rebuilder 454]

Which does not prove the first 3.5 years is the time during which the antichrist first comes to power and when he spends time deceiving the entire world to follow him.

The ant-christ does not show up on the scene and immediately all things are bad in the world. If it went down like that then the entire world would be opposed to the anti-christ.

The devil's boy shows up on the world stage as this seemingly great new world leader who appears to have solutions for all the problems of the world so there is a space of time (3.5 years) that the anti-christ is in power doing things most of the world loves and is in agreement with.

The Lord allows this massive world wide deception because they world rejects Him and wants the devil, and so the Lord lets the world have the devil and his boy the anti-christ.

The train goes off the tracks so to speak during the last have and it's the tribulation saints (those not taken in the pre-wrath rapture, or that have gotten born again after the rapture) that the devil is attacking to which the Lord shortens their time of exposure

Nope.
The 4 horsemen unleash hell on this earth.
The first one on a white horse kicks off the 7 yr trib.
The rapture ( every rapture verse) is peacetime, normal life ,everyday life, commerce, and planning for the future, which is exactly opposite of the post trib model ....which is unbiblical.

 

[rebuilder 454]

No, the trib andf GT are two ways the bible speaks of the same period of time and Jesus said it would be shortened so no longer 7 years long.




It's better than Apostasy...

That's like saying a man in prison has his time shortened VIA TAKEN OUT OF PRISON, and you interpret it as the prison was shut down so his sentence is shortened.

Nope, the ELECT ARE TAKEN OUT...(days shortened) in Rev 14:14.

You are not connecting the dots properly.

 

[rebuilder 454]

No, Jesus said the tribulation would be shortened so it had been 7 years long in Daniel, but Rev has it half of that length.

Mat 24:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
Mat 24:22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.



There is no 7 year tribulation anymore. We all know there is a 42 month tribulation in Rev 13. We also know in the gospels Christ spoke of the time of the tribulation being shortened, Matthew 24:22. Since we have a current prophecy of 3.5 years then we know it was originally longer (likely 7 years) and later shortened.


So, we won't have a 7 year trib but will have a 3.5 year long tribulation. This begins with the first beast, continues with the second beast and ends when Christ arrives at the second coming.



To shorten something means it was a certain length of time, then it was shortened to a shorter amount of time.

Mar_13:20 And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved: but for the elect's sake, whom he hath chosen, he hath shortened the days. (the original time will be shorter to benefit the elect)


No one would survive the original length of the trib so for the sake of the elect, God will shorten the trib so they can survive. This is why Paul declares some Christians will be alive and remain unto the coming of Christ.They would not have survived had the trib been it's original length.

Here we see that Jesus says the Great Tribulation was shortened. That means OT prophecy had a longer Great Tribulation than the actual Great Tribulation shall be. That is an example of a change God made to OT prophecy. In Daniel we have a 7 year trib but in Revelation we have a 3.5 year trib. God literally cut the trib in half. Going by OT prophecy alone you would have the wrong length.

Nope.
Daniel 9 :27 declares in the middle of the 7byr trib ( one week) the AOD is performed in the temple.
3,5 yrs...then the next 3.5 yrs.= 7 yr period of trib/wrath.

 

[Dan Clarkston]

The first one on a white horse kicks off the 7 yr trib.

Actually the start of the 7 year tribulation period starts when the anti-christ is revealed to the world which is enabled by the falling away

2 Thessalonians 2:1-3
Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto Him,
That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition

 

[rebuilder 454]

Actually the start of the 7 year tribulation period starts when the anti-christ is revealed to the world which is enabled by the falling away

2 Thessalonians 2:1-3
Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto Him,
That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition

We are in the falling away.
So I don't see your point at all.

 

[Dan Clarkston]

We are in the falling away.
So I don't see your point at all.

OK, so what part of "the 7 year tribulation period starts when the anti-christ is revealed to the world" where you having problems understanding exactly?