God Commands Righteous Violence

[Rockerduck]

God will defend His people. Without a doubt. Sargent York was a Christian who did not want to go to war. He went to France and captured 132 Germans at a machine guns post. Then corporal York didn't get shot, but men with him did. He walked up to the Germans they fired at him point blank, with one officer emptying his pistol straight at him. The Germans surrendered to him. God will battle for His people.

 

[Matthias]

God will defend His people. Without a doubt. Sargent York was a Christian who did not want to go to war. He went to France and captured 132 Germans at a machine guns post. Then corporal York didn't get shot, but men with him did. He walked up to the Germans they fired at him point blank, with one officer emptying his pistol straight at him. The Germans surrendered to him. God will battle for His people.

How many Christians did York kill?

 

[Matthias]

You are ignoring the commands in the Bible to do righteous violence - you and that crazy pacifist.

“I wish that Christian men would insist more and more on the unrighteousness of war, believing that Christianity means no sword, no cannon, no bloodshed, and that, if a nation is driven to fight in its own defense, Christianity stands by to weep and to intervene as soon as possible, and not to join in the cruel shouts which celebrate an enemy’s slaughter.”

C.H. Spurgeon, pacifist. A preacher whom you yourself told me in another thread is one of your favorite Christian authors.

Why is a “crazy pacifist” one of your favorite Christian authors?

C.H. Spurgeon, the “Prince of Preachers,” one your favorite Christian authors, is crazy; Vlad the Impaler, a man whom you have said in this thread is not of your faith, one of the most sadistic rulers in the history of the world - killer and torturer of Muslim and Christian men, women, and children - is a Christian role model.

***



Vlad the Impaler. Christian role model.



C.H. Spurgeon. Crazy pacifist. Ignorer of the commands in the Bible to do righteous violence.

Word of the Day -> Crazy.

 

[Rockerduck]

How many Christians did York kill?

zero

 

[Matthias]

zero

How do you know that?

 

[Matthias]

Did Alvin York suffer from PTSD?

AI Overview had this to say -

“Yes, historians widely recognize that WWI hero Sergeant Alvin York suffered from what was then called ‘shell shock’ or ‘battle fatigue,’ which is known today as PTSD.

His trauma was compounded by the intense moral conflict he faced as a devout pacifist who had to reconcile his religious beliefs with the violence of war. Several aspects of his struggles are well documented:

• Combat Trauma: York experienced severe psychological distress after the Meuse-Argonne Offensive, during which he witnessed several comrades die.

• Extreme Triggers: Decades later, while visiting the set if the 1941 film Sergeant York, he was asked how many enemy soldiers he had killed. The memory reportedly caused an uncontrollable emotional breakdown, including sobbing and vomiting.

• Lasting Legacy: His legacy and struggles with both physical and mental health are honored at the Alvin C. York VA Medical Center in Murfreesboro, TN.”

 

[Matthias]

“As a member of the Church of Christ in Christian Union, York had strong religious convictions. He was opposed to fighting in World War I, but when time came to sign up for the draft, he did. In 1917, York got notice that he had been drafted. Three times he tried to file for an exemption as a conscientious objector, but these were all denied because his church was not recognized as an official sect of Christianity. Under threat of being arrested, York gave in and joined the Army.”

A Century Old Myth: Sergeant Alvin York

Sgt York was awarded the Medal of Honor for single handedly killing two dozen enemies and capturing over 130 during World War I, but is that what really…

evergreenpodcasts.com

 

[Rockerduck]

Did Alvin York suffer from PTSD?

AI Overview had this to say -

“Yes, historians widely recognize that WWI hero Sergeant Alvin York suffered from what was then called ‘shell shock’ or ‘battle fatigue,’ which is known today as PTSD.

His trauma was compounded by the intense moral conflict he faced as a devout pacifist who had to reconcile his religious beliefs with the violence of war. Several aspects of his struggles are well documented:

• Combat Trauma: York experienced severe psychological distress after the Meuse-Argonne Offensive, during which he witnessed several comrades die.

• Extreme Triggers: Decades later, while visiting the set if the 1941 film Sergeant York, he was asked how many enemy soldiers he had killed. The memory reportedly caused an uncontrollable emotional breakdown, including sobbing and vomiting.

• Lasting Legacy: His legacy and struggles with both physical and mental health are honored at the Alvin C. York VA Medical Center in Murfreesboro, TN.”

He killed Germans that were shooting at him. God protected York. I doubt many Germans were Christians that were trying to kill as many US soldier they could.. WW1 and WW2 were actually the same war with about 20 yrs. between them with same goals. Hitler tried a 2nd time and failed, so much so the Nations decided something is wrong with the Germanic people and put restrictions that exist today on them that prevented them from rising to power again.. Soldiers who fought in Vietnam returning home had the same PTSD symptoms.

 

[Rockerduck]

“As a member of the Church of Christ in Christian Union, York had strong religious convictions. He was opposed to fighting in World War I, but when time came to sign up for the draft, he did. In 1917, York got notice that he had been drafted. Three times he tried to file for an exemption as a conscientious objector, but these were all denied because his church was not recognized as an official sect of Christianity. Under threat of being arrested, York gave in and joined the Army.”

A Century Old Myth: Sergeant Alvin York

Sgt York was awarded the Medal of Honor for single handedly killing two dozen enemies and capturing over 130 during World War I, but is that what really…

evergreenpodcasts.com

I saw a documentary on Sargent York. The true story. He began ministry's and used his fame for good. Even with mental issues from war. Its hard to imagine fighting anther country's army when its kill or be killed and you have little choice but to be vicious with little empathy.

 

[Matthias]

He killed Germans that were shooting at him.

Yes. A conscientious objector who didn’t want to be there was being shot at by German soldiers - Lutherans and Catholics.

God protected York.

Perhaps he did. God didn’t protect all Christians, on either side.

I doubt many Germans were Christians that were trying to kill as many US soldier they could..

Why do you doubt?

WW1 and WW2 were actually the same war with about 20 yrs. between them with same goals. Hitler tried a 2nd time and failed, so much so the Nations decided something is wrong with the Germanic people and put restrictions that exist today on them that prevented them from rising to power again.. Soldiers who fought in Vietnam returning home had the same PTSD symptoms.

 

[Matthias]

I saw a documentary on Sargent York. The true story. He began ministry's and used his fame for good. Even with mental issues from war. Its hard to imagine fighting anther country's army when its kill or be killed and you have little choice but to be vicious with little empathy.

Christians with “little choice but to be vicious with little empathy”.

Let’s think about that. Is that what Jesus wants for his followers?

***

Just as an aside, during the Ante Nicene period of Church history, a man like York would be prohibited from serving in the ministry.

 

[Rockerduck]

“As a member of the Church of Christ in Christian Union, York had strong religious convictions. He was opposed to fighting in World War I, but when time came to sign up for the draft, he did. In 1917, York got notice that he had been drafted. Three times he tried to file for an exemption as a conscientious objector, but these were all denied because his church was not recognized as an official sect of Christianity. Under threat of being arrested, York gave in and joined the Army.”

A Century Old Myth: Sergeant Alvin York

Sgt York was awarded the Medal of Honor for single handedly killing two dozen enemies and capturing over 130 during World War I, but is that what really…

evergreenpodcasts.com

I read this story. There is more of the cover up of awarding medals to his fellow soldiers than on York. The unfounded accusation of his fabricated story did not hold water and this is a obvious hit piece against York. Sometimes the truth is too unbelievable, so people naturally try to disprove a story. I have stories of what God has done for me, but I know its unbelievable too.

 

[Matthias]

I read this story. There is more of the cover up of awarding medals to his fellow soldiers than on York. The unfounded accusation of his fabricated story did not hold water and this is a obvious hit piece against York. Sometimes the truth is too unbelievable, so people naturally try to disprove a story. I have stories of what God has done for me, but I know its unbelievable too.

That may or may not be the case. I quoted the article only to establish the fact that York was a conscientious objector who attempted multiple times to obtain an exemption and only went because he was threatened with arrest if he didn’t.

 

[Rockerduck]

Christians with “little choice but to be vicious with little empathy”.

Let’s think about that. Is that what Jesus wants for his followers?

***

Just as an aside, during the Ante Nicene period of Church history, a man like York would be prohibited from serving in the ministry.

God has put me is situations that most would not want to. But God was with me. You go where you are called. Yes, there are Christian martyrs. Remember, not one documentary or hit piece has denied York's conversion experience.

 

[Rockerduck]

That may or may not be the case. I quoted the article only to establish the fact that York was a conscientious objector who attempted multiple times to obtain an exemption and only went because he was threatened with arrest if he didn’t.

That's true.

 

[Matthias]

God has put me is situations that most would not want to. But God was with me. You go where you are called. Yes, there are Christian martyrs. Remember, not one documentary or hit piece has denied York's conversion experience.

I’m not denying that York was a Christian. He was a conscientious objector. The author of the OP insists (in other threads) that conscientious objectors, by definition, aren’t Christian and that they are men in form but not in substance. This last provides insight into why he started this thread.

As for Christian martyrs, the early Christian martyrs didn’t kill their enemies.

Does Jesus want conscientious objectors to violate their conscience? Does Jesus reject them as followers? Does Jesus want his followers to have “little choice but to be vicious with little empathy”?

 

[Rockerduck]

I’m not denying that York was a Christian. He was a conscientious objector. The author of the OP insists (in other threads) that conscientious objectors, by definition, aren’t Christian and that they are men in form but not in substance. This last provides insight into why he started this thread.

As for Christian martyrs, the early Christian martyrs didn’t kill their enemies.

Does Jesus want conscientious objectors to violate their conscience? Does Jesus reject them as followers? Does Jesus want his followers to have “little choice but to be vicious with little empathy”?

Joshua and King David both had the Holy Spirit and talked to God and killed. It all has to do with what God is doing in your life to refine by fire all His children. Yes, I've gone through and continue to be refined by fire. Those are all the situations God put's me in to refine and purify me to be His treasure in Heaven.

 

[Matthias]

Joshua and King David both had the Holy Spirit and talked to God and killed.

That’s right.

But we’re talking about Christians, 1st century - present. With the coming of the Messiah, a change has occurred.

It all has to do with what God is doing in your life to refine by fire all His children. Yes, I've gone through and continue to be refined by fire. Those are all the situations God put's me in to refine and purify me to be His treasure in Heaven.

 

[Rockerduck]

That’s right.

But we’re talking about Christians, 1st century - present. With the coming of the Messiah, a change has occurred.

Malachi 3:6 - for I am the LORD, I do not change

 

[Matthias]

Yes. A conscientious objector who didn’t want to be there was being shot at by German soldiers - Lutherans and Catholics.

Were the German soldiers in World War I Christians?

AI Overview replied -

“Yes, the cast majority of German soldiers in World War I were Christians. Demographics at the time indicate about two-thirds of the population were Protestant and one-third were Catholic, with small Jewish and other minirities.,Bith denominations actively supported the war effort, viewing it as a religious and national duty.”

I don’t know if York killed any Christians or not, but the odds are high that he did. He certainly would have been aware of the possibility / probability. It’s not surprising to me that a Christian conscientious objector who killed his enemy suffered both mentally and physically from his action.

Christians killing Christians. Jesus can’t be pleased with his followers killing one another.