Reviving Biblical Christianity (The Way) Part 2

[Episkopos]

If you can’t impute righteousness where there isn’t righteousness, then you can’t NOT impute sin where there is sin. Yet the scriptures do just that.

Only in your mind. God is a righteous judge. You would have Him be an UN-righteous judge....toward those who flatter Him or have a correct sounding belief.

But nothing is further from the truth than what you have been indoctrinated into.

You are confusing mercy with truth, mixing the 2 to produce neither. God will forgive sin as we also forgive others who use and abuse us the way He is abused by us. But He is not blind to what we do. The more we name and claim things that are not true, the more condemnation we are storing up for that day.

 

[MostlyConfused]

It is righteousness UNTO holiness sister, so not sharply divided.

You must distinguish between the holy and the common, between the clean and the unclean,

This is EXACTLY what episkopos does.

 

[Episkopos]

You must distinguish between the holy and the common, between the clean and the unclean,

This is EXACTLY what episkopos does.

I learned it from the scriptures. You know, the ones the self-righteous don't read...


Her priests have violated my law, and have profaned mine holy things: they have put no difference between the holy and profane, neither have they shewed difference between the unclean and the clean, and have hid their eyes from my sabbaths, and I am profaned among them. Ez. 22:26

 

[Episkopos]

I call it one of the most beautiful verses in the bible. And some folks here want to pick it to pieces til it is unrecognizable. Nobody need be offended that the sinless Christ was made sin for us or that we unworthies might become the righteousness of God in Him. It is not literal, it is a manner of speaking...how it is being reckoned. The verse is indicating in a beautiful way God accepting Christ's atonement for us by proxy...it speaks of a divine exchange, His life for ours. AKA the Gospel.

2Co 5:19-21

To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.

For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.


Isa 53:4-6

Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted.

But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.

All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.

Isa 53:12

Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his soul unto death: and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.

Lev 16:10

But the goat, on which the lot fell to be the scapegoat, shall be presented alive before the LORD, to make an atonement with him, and to let him go for a scapegoat into the wilderness.

Lev 16:21-22

And Aaron shall lay both his hands upon the head of the live goat, and confess over him all the iniquities of the children of Israel, and all their transgressions in all their sins, putting them upon the head of the goat, and shall send him away by the hand of a fit man into the wilderness:

And the goat shall bear upon him all their iniquities unto a land not inhabited: and he shall let go the goat in the wilderness.

One person's corrupt translation is another person's favourite verse. The corruption then is in the reader's mind who is looking for a way out of their sin predicament. Nevermind what the bible ACTUALLY says...trust the human tradition.

 

[MostlyConfused]

I learned it from the scriptures. You know, the ones the self-righteous don't read...


Her priests have violated my law, and have profaned mine holy things: they have put no difference between the holy and profane, neither have they shewed difference between the unclean and the clean, and have hid their eyes from my sabbaths, and I am profaned among them. Ez. 22:26

It seems like some of them DO read them. But they do it from self-interest and so they cannot understand? We all begin with some self-interest. Even the very question “what must I do to inherit eternal life” is asked with self-interest.

 

[Episkopos]

It seems like some of them DO read them. But they do it from self-interest and so they cannot understand? We all begin with some self-interest. Even the very question “what must I do to inherit eternal life” is asked with self-interest.

You are right, of course. God is leading us out of selfishness and into selflessness. Of course this is all subverted when the message that is to lead us into selfLESSness is altered to support a walk in selfishness.

 

[Lizbeth]

So, in your scheme... When we do something wrong it's... AS IF...Jesus did it, not us. And everything that Jesus does perfectly....it's AS IF we did it, not Jesus.

It's a con game called bait and switch....and you fell for it as many others also did.

And if you are looking to justify sin... What's not to like???

No that is not my scheme and I do not try to justify sin.

 

[Lizbeth]

Only in your mind. God is a righteous judge. You would have Him be an UN-righteous judge....toward those who flatter Him or have a correct sounding belief.

But nothing is further from the truth than what you have been indoctrinated into.

You are confusing mercy with truth, mixing the 2 to produce neither. God will forgive sin as we also forgive others who use and abuse us the way He is abused by us. But He is not blind to what we do. The more we name and claim things that are not true, the more condemnation we are storing up for that day.

You appear to be blind to the point I made.

 

[Lizbeth]

It seems like some of them DO read them. But they do it from self-interest and so they cannot understand? We all begin with some self-interest. Even the very question “what must I do to inherit eternal life” is asked with self-interest.

Self interest is what motivates some to enter the holy of holies without the proper garments on and then get turfed out. It is what Buddhists, Hindus and New Age does....pride, ambition, covetousness, etc. God would not lead (and therefore be with them, clothing them) someone to enter before having "learned righteousness". People need to test the spirits, of their own experiences, as well as that of others. Without God the same thing that was meant to be a blessing with Him, becomes death to them.

 

[Lizbeth]

You must distinguish between the holy and the common, between the clean and the unclean,

This is EXACTLY what episkopos does.

Seeking to establish our own righteousness is common/unclean. The righteousness of God is clean.

 

[MostlyConfused]

I don’t think that was a good translation that I quoted from. Others say “what is holy from what is profane.” I think it has to be more accurate.

 

[ProDeo]

You are not hearing me.

I am hearing you since 2008! On the old (gone) forum, it's where we met. Let's go there and reason a couple plies deeper. There you testified you fell from grace after living a life without sin for 2 years. One small moment of recklessness and there you went, in tears, in pain, devastated, one big trauma as a result. And there was another person also preaching sinless perfection who also fell from grace and sinned, that drama was even bigger, seeking penance, even fearing the Lord's rejection. Both of you needed a long period of healing. Remember ?

So, what is it that in a split second your Christian life, your faith can fall into pieces and cause such great stress, a trauma you need to heal from. Have you already figured it out?

Me then, living a holy life, so it felt. Then after a decade the good Lord opened my eyes, pride, I walked in pride, one of the worst sins. And it went as it went with you, tears, in pain, devastated, one big trauma as a result, And needed a long period to overcome.

So why was I so hurt, I repented, was forgiven, but the pain remained, why? And I could not figure it out in that time, that needed another decade or was it 2 decades, could be.

Paul then, Romans 7, Paul experienced the same, Wretched man that I am! Who will deliver me from this body of death?

What have these cases in common, why the disappointment, why the pain ?

Right, I was disappointed in myself, not able to live a holy and sinless life. In other words, the good Lord just opened my eyes I lived a prideful life and then my reaction is another form of pride, disappointed in myself! as if I am able to live a sinless life without Christ! So I can echo Paul wretched man that I am! A selfish ego sinner and great lesson from the Lord to know what I am.

Where you too disappointed in yourself at the time you fell from grace after 2 years of living without sin?

Just curious.

 

[MostlyConfused]

I learned it from the scriptures. You know, the ones the self-righteous don't read...


Her priests have violated my law, and have profaned mine holy things: they have put no difference between the holy and profane, neither have they shewed difference between the unclean and the clean, and have hid their eyes from my sabbaths, and I am profaned among them. Ez. 22:26

“Sabbaths.” Plural.
It’s interesting to me because I have wondered at how He has given me a peaceful rest and yet I am not holy.
Do you think there is a rest at both levels?

 

[Lizbeth]

One person's corrupt translation is another person's favourite verse. The corruption then is in the reader's mind who is looking for a way out of their sin predicament. Nevermind what the bible ACTUALLY says...trust the human tradition.

It is consistent with all scripture Epi. That's how we test it. You are bringing a false gospel I'm afraid.

 

[ProDeo]

To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

Amen.

Luke 23:44 And it was about the sixth hour, and there was a darkness over all the earth until the ninth hour.
Luke 23:45 And the sun was darkened, and the veil of the temple was rent in the midst.
Luke 23:46 And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said thus, he gave up the ghost.

We will never fully know what happened in those 3 hours, between God the Father and God the Son on the cross dying, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation. And nobody was allowed to see it, it was in darkness.

Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.

For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Isa 53:4-6

Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted.

But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.

All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.

Isa 53:12

Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his soul unto death: and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.

Lev 16:10

But the goat, on which the lot fell to be the scapegoat, shall be presented alive before the LORD, to make an atonement with him, and to let him go for a scapegoat into the wilderness.

Lev 16:21-22

And Aaron shall lay both his hands upon the head of the live goat, and confess over him all the iniquities of the children of Israel, and all their transgressions in all their sins, putting them upon the head of the goat, and shall send him away by the hand of a fit man into the wilderness:

And the goat shall bear upon him all their iniquities unto a land not inhabited: and he shall let go the goat in the wilderness.

Another amen.

 

[Episkopos]

I am hearing you since 2008! On the old (gone) forum, it's where we met. Let's go there and reason a couple plies deeper. There you testified you fell from grace after living a life without sin for 2 years. One small moment of recklessness and there you went, in tears, in pain, devastated, one big trauma as a result. And there was another person also preaching sinless perfection who also fell from grace and sinned, that drama was even bigger, seeking penance, even fearing the Lord's rejection. Both of you needed a long period of healing. Remember ?

Of course. It is a devastating thing to fall from grace...to be sent back to walk as any man....in one's own strength again. People who have never entered into the kingdom walk have no idea of how devastating the experience is. So it's easy to ridicule those who have indeed tasted the goodness of the life to come. But I have come to see it as training in righteousness. We go in and out of the Spirit and find pasture. Jesus being the doorway....and the life that is found in the kingdom realm.

So, what is it that in a split second your Christian life, your faith can fall into pieces and cause such great stress, a trauma you need to heal from. Have you already figured it out?

Me then, living a holy life, so it felt. Then after a decade the good Lord opened my eyes, pride, I walked in pride, one of the worst sins. And it went as it went with you, tears, in pain, devastated, one big trauma as a result, And needed a long period to overcome.

So why was I so hurt, I repented, was forgiven, but the pain remained, why? And I could not figure it out in that time, that needed another decade or was it 2 decades, could be.

Paul then, Romans 7, Paul experienced the same, Wretched man that I am! Who will deliver me from this body of death?

What have these cases in common, why the disappointment, why the pain ?

Right, I was disappointed in myself, not able to live a holy and sinless life. In other words, the good Lord just opened my eyes I lived a prideful life and then my reaction is another form of pride, disappointed in myself! as if I am able to live a sinless life without Christ! So I can echo Paul wretched man that I am! A selfish ego sinner and great lesson from the Lord to know what I am.

Where you too disappointed in yourself at the time you fell from grace after 2 years of living without sin?

Just curious.

I don't think you understand the point of Paul's testimony in Romans 7. The solution is not about self-comfort...but entering back INTO the Spirit. Paul speaks of falling out of the Spirit and then realizing that sin had a grip on him again. Who can save us from that? Christ...and entering into Him to walk as He walked in His perfection. And failing that to AT LEAST humble yourself and learn righteousness...become like the meek and lowly...perhaps GOd will have mercy on you.

So the maturing of the saint is to fail God, and then LEARN righteousness as a support for the gift of grace..being saved by grace through faithfulness as well as faith (same word in Hebrew and Greek)

I think you are looking for comfort without fearing God. But read this..

Then had the churches rest throughout all Judaea and Galilee and Samaria, and were edified; and walking in the fear of the Lord, and in the comfort of the Holy Ghost, were multiplied. Acts 9:31

Do you see the balance? Fear on the sinful part of us, the outer man...AND comfort in the inner man.

So then carry your cross....the deadness of your carnal nature...by taking RESPONSIBILITY for every word and deed (unlike the pretenders here who act like they are innocent of evil)

Be weaned gradually from the flesh or all at once be crucified so that it is Christ doing the works. Or both...

When we are not in the Spirit, we should be weaned of the flesh and looking to God for guidance and mercy.

There is a big difference between being led by the Spirit and being IN the Spirit.

The difference in our testimonies is that you didn't fall from the perfection of Christ...you fell from a THINKING that you were already perfect. Do you see the difference? No self involved in a saint's training. It's about understanding the rules of the race of faith.

 

[Episkopos]

“Sabbaths.” Plural.
It’s interesting to me because I have wondered at how He has given me a peaceful rest and yet I am not holy.
Do you think there is a rest at both levels?

Yes. One can be at peace with God in humility without the heavenly walk. One can experience moments...touches...from God as one turns one's heart to Him. One can collect the dew of the morning even in a drought. :)

 

[Episkopos]

I don’t think that was a good translation that I quoted from. Others say “what is holy from what is profane.” I think it has to be more accurate.

The profane is the common. You had an amazingly accurate statement...which is fully supported in the bible. That's how we know that our spirit is aligned with God.

 

[MostlyConfused]

I don't think you understand the point of Paul's testimony in Romans 7. The solution is not about self-comfort...but entering back INTO the Spirit

That has something to do with a righteous man may fall 70 times but getting back up and begin racing again…?

 

[Episkopos]

That has something to do with a righteous man may fall 70 times but getting back up and begin racing again…?

7 times...yes..which just means many times. I have been in and out of the Spirit twice now. I'm working on my 3rd talent. Endeavoring to add in a growing maturity to the purity of holiness I was allowed to experience.

People who don't have that experience think I'm making things up because they are going by their beliefs and ideologies and bad bible reading...without any experience of God....at least no experience that was not a quick moment or two. Thereby drawing the wrong conclusions.

I point these to the bible for context....but they won't hear it.