WATER BAPTISM CAUSES DIVISIONS

[rwb]

Is 59: 2
But your iniquities have separated you from your God;
And your sins have hidden His face from you,
So that He will not hear.

The only thing we have is reconciliation. outside of grace. God will hide his face from us, and will not hear our prayer

Are the words of Isaiah directed toward faithful saints of Old, or is the warning of God Isaiah was given to speak directed to those who are "separated you from your God"? Believers from both Old and New Covenant "have been reconciled" (past tense) through Christ.

Romans 5:10 (KJV) For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

2Co 5:18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;
2Co 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
2Co 5:20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.
2Co 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Colossians 1:21 (KJV) And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled.

There is no sin those who have been reconciled to God, having been born again through Christ that will cause God to hide His face from us, or keep Him from hearing the prayers of the righteous. We have been saved, are being saved and shall be saved! There is NOW no condemnation to them who are in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Hebrews 8:12 (KJV) For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Are the words of Isaiah directed toward faithful saints of Old, or is the warning of God Isaiah was given to speak directed to those who are "separated you from your God"? Believers from both Old and New Covenant "have been reconciled" (past tense) through Christ.

Romans 5:10 (KJV) For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

2Co 5:18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;
2Co 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
2Co 5:20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.
2Co 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Colossians 1:21 (KJV) And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled.

There is no sin those who have been reconciled to God, having been born again through Christ that will cause God to hide His face from us, or keep Him from hearing the prayers of the righteous. We have been saved, are being saved and shall be saved! There is NOW no condemnation to them who are in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Hebrews 8:12 (KJV) For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

I believe he is talking to anyone who has not been reconciled through salvation. Old or new.

 

[GodsGrace]

If sin committed by a born-again Christian can cast them out of the Kingdom of God, who then can be saved?

So it's OK to sin?

It's good to hear that we can be disobedient and still be saved because Jesus paid the price for our disobedience...all of it.

I'm very relieved to tell you the truth.
I'm considering having an affair with this good looking guy down the block. He's really nice, smart, and he seems to be interested in me and is waiting for me to make my decision.

So, it's OK to begin this affair?
I think it might be disobeying Jesus,,,but it sounds like it'll be OK since disobedience, all our disobedience does not mean we will lose our salvation because Jesus paid for it all. I mean,,,it sounds like Jesus did it all, and I could be disobedient and still be saved.

So it sounds like I'm good to go!

I like this Christian religion.
I can do anything I want to and still get into heaven!
This is great!

 

[rwb]

So it's OK to sin?

It's good to hear that we can be disobedient and still be saved because Jesus paid the price for our disobedience...all of it.

I'm very relieved to tell you the truth.
I'm considering having an affair with this good looking guy down the block. He's really nice, smart, and he seems to be interested in me and is waiting for me to make my decision.

So, it's OK to begin this affair?
I think it might be disobeying Jesus,,,but it sounds like it'll be OK since disobedience, all our disobedience does not mean we will lose our salvation because Jesus paid for it all. I mean,,,it sounds like Jesus did it all, and I could be disobedient and still be saved.

So it sounds like I'm good to go!

I like this Christian religion.
I can do anything I want to and still get into heaven!
This is great!

If you have this desire within your heart to knowingly sin against God, then you need to examine your own heart! The desire of the heart of a born again believer is to NOT sin, for it is our desire to please God.

Having a desire to knowingly commit sin before one is born again is the natural condition of our heart. Once we have been born again the desires of our heart have changed, and our desire to sin has changed from wanting to sin to wanting to please God.

Having a desire to knowingly sin does not come from the heart that has been changed, pray that God will give you a new heart and a new Spirit that no longer desires sin.

 

[GodsGrace]

Having a desire to knowingly commit sin before one is born again is the natural condition of our heart. Once we have been born again the desires of our heart have changed, and our desire to sin has changed from wanting to sin to wanting to please God.

Having a desire to knowingly sin does not come from the heart that has been changed, pray that God will give you a new heart and a new Spirit that no longer desires sin.

Very nice speech rwb.
Exactly what I knew you would say.

BUT
What does it all matter?
Heart, no heart.

I am not perfect and I want to have this affair with this guy.

Now, YOU said it'll be OK .

THIS is what YOU stated in post no. 242

"If sin committed by a born-again Christian can cast them out of the Kingdom of God, who then can be saved?"


See....I agree with you!!!
I am a born again Christian
so
even if I commit sin and have this affair with this guy...

I CANNOT BE CAST OUT OF THE KINGDOM OF GOD!!!

Why?
Because I am a born again Christian and sin committed by a born again Christian will not get them cast out of the Kingdom.

It's what YOU are teaching here on this forum.

I'm just taking YOUR ADVICE.

So are you back tracking now?
Do you think that having this affair with this guy might put my soul in jeapordy??

Do you wish to retract your statement?

Let me know...I'm here to learn what God expects from me.

 

[rwb]

Very nice speech rwb.
Exactly what I knew you would say.

BUT
What does it all matter?
Heart, no heart.

I am not perfect and I want to have this affair with this guy.

Now, YOU said it'll be OK .

THIS is what YOU stated in post no. 242

"If sin committed by a born-again Christian can cast them out of the Kingdom of God, who then can be saved?"


See....I agree with you!!!
I am a born again Christian
so
even if I commit sin and have this affair with this guy...

I CANNOT BE CAST OUT OF THE KINGDOM OF GOD!!!

Why?
Because I am a born again Christian and sin committed by a born again Christian will not get them cast out of the Kingdom.

It's what YOU are teaching here on this forum.

I'm just taking YOUR ADVICE.

So are you back tracking now?
Do you think that having this affair with this guy might put my soul in jeapordy??

Do you wish to retract your statement?

Let me know...I'm here to learn what God expects from me.

Where in my replies have I ever said or even given the impression that Christians have a license to knowingly commit sin?

"If sin committed by a born-again Christian can cast them out of the Kingdom of God, who then can be saved?

You haven't answered the question! Instead, you try to re-direct the question as though asking the question means I believe born again Christians can continue in the natural life of sin as though they have no change of heart.

The fact of eternal security in Christ comes from the Bible! Christ tells us the life we receive when we have been born again is to both know and enter the Kingdom of God possessing life through Christ forever. Christ adamantly tells us "Ye must be born again"!

Christ, speaking to Nicodemus says that no man can know (see) or enter the Kingdom of God until they have been born again. To be born again is through the Spirit of Christ in us. Once we have been born again of Christ's Spirit, we are promised that He shall never leave us. If born again believers could be cast out of the Kingdom of God, Christ would not tell us the life we have through Him is eternal life.

It sounds like you don't really believe the assurance of eternal life Christ gives us through His written Word. Repent and believe God!

Ro 8:10 ¶ And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
Ro 8:11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
Ro 8:12 Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh.
Ro 8:13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
Ro 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
Ro 8:15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
Ro 8:16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
Ro 8:17 ¶ And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

Ro 8:26 ¶ Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.
Ro 8:27 And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God.
Ro 8:28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.
Ro 8:29 ¶ For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
Ro 8:30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
Ro 8:31 ¶ What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?
Ro 8:32 He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?
Ro 8:33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.
Ro 8:34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.
Ro 8:35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?
Ro 8:36 As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.
Ro 8:37 Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.
Ro 8:38 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
Ro 8:39 Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

 

[rwb]

I am not perfect and I want to have this affair with this guy.

Now, YOU said it'll be OK .

THIS is what YOU stated in post no. 242

"If sin committed by a born-again Christian can cast them out of the Kingdom of God, who then can be saved?"

Again, I am NOT saying it's okay for born again Christians to willfully commit sin against God.

When we have known and entered the Kingdom of God we are eternally secure through the Spirit of Christ in us. But do not forget the admonition of the Lord, telling us to keep ourselves from sin. Not because willful sin will cast us from the Kingdom of God but because God will chasten whom He loves.

Several passages in Scripture clearly teach that God disciplines and chastens His children when they sin, as part of His loving care and to bring them back to holiness.

Hebrews 12:6 (KJV) For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.

Born again believers are chastened by the Lord because He loves us, His chastening is proof of this fact.

Hebrews 12:7 (KJV) If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?

Enduring discipline affirms God's loving care for His children.

Hebrews 12:11 (KJV) Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby.

The outcome of chastening from the Lord toward born again believers produces spiritual growth and righteousness.

Revelation 3:19 (KJV) As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

Discipline from God is aimed at repentance from those who love the Lord.

These verses teach that God’s chastening is not punishment for sin’s eternal penalty (which was borne by Christ on the cross) but restorative discipline to correct, protect, and refine believers. It may come through circumstances, conviction, loss, or even physical hardship or death, and its goal is to produce “the peaceful fruit of righteousness”.

Born again believers may be chastened/disciplined by the Lord when we sin, but we are not cast away from the Kingdom of God because our life is eternally secure through Christ who has saved us.

 

[GodsGrace]

Where in my replies have I ever said or even given the impression that Christians have a license to knowingly commit sin?

"If sin committed by a born-again Christian can cast them out of the Kingdom of God, who then can be saved?

This is the problem with Christianity in these modern times.
YOU said that a Christian can commit a sin and not be cast out of the Kingdom.
Please read what you said...it's in the English language.

You haven't answered the question! Instead, you try to re-direct the question as though asking the question means I believe born again Christians can continue in the natural life of sin as though they have no change of heart.

YOU said I could commit sin and still be in the Kingdom.
You did not give any warning as is given in the NT.

The NT teaches that we are not to sin and if we do we are to ask forgiveness.
1 John 1:8-9
8If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us. 9If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.


John taught that we are to walk in righteousness and not in darkness:
1 John 1:6-7
6If we say that we have fellowship with Him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth;
7but if we walk in the Light as He Himself is in the Light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin


The statement you made makes one believe that a Christian could sin with no second though.
That a christian could sin and still be saved.
You did not state what kind of sin...
or if could or could not be ongoing....
you made a blanket statement that does not agree with what Jesus taught.

Jesus taught that we are to act on His word or our house would FALL:
Matthew 7:26-27
26“Everyone who hears these words of Mine and does not act on them, will be like a foolish man who built his house on the sand.
27“The rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and slammed against that house; and it fell—and great was its fall.”

The fact of eternal security in Christ comes from the Bible! Christ tells us the life we receive when we have been born again is to both know and enter the Kingdom of God possessing life through Christ forever. Christ adamantly tells us "Ye must be born again"!

Of course we must be born again.
Does anyone on this thread doubt this?
Do those that do not believe in God have any chance of spending eternity with Him?

But Jesus did not say ONLY Ye must be born again.

He also said this:
Matthew 7:21
21“Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter.

Christ, speaking to Nicodemus says that no man can know (see) or enter the Kingdom of God until they have been born again. To be born again is through the Spirit of Christ in us. Once we have been born again of Christ's Spirit, we are promised that He shall never leave us. If born again believers could be cast out of the Kingdom of God, Christ would not tell us the life we have through Him is eternal life.

Correct.
But we must have that life through Him.

Jesus said that if we do not obey Him we will be cut off:
John 15:1-2
1“I am the true vine, and My Father is the vinedresser. 2“Every branch in Me that does not bear fruit, He takes away;

It sounds like you don't really believe the assurance of eternal life Christ gives us through His written Word. Repent and believe God!

Ro 8:10 ¶ And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
Ro 8:11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
Ro 8:12 Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh.
Ro 8:13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
Ro 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
Ro 8:15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
Ro 8:16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
Ro 8:17 ¶ And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

Ro 8:26 ¶ Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.
Ro 8:27 And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God.
Ro 8:28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.
Ro 8:29 ¶ For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
Ro 8:30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
Ro 8:31 ¶ What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?
Ro 8:32 He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?
Ro 8:33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.
Ro 8:34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.
Ro 8:35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?
Ro 8:36 As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.
Ro 8:37 Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.
Ro 8:38 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
Ro 8:39 Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Very nice carpet bombing.

Do you believe that we are to obey Jesus?

 

[GodsGrace]

Again, I am NOT saying it's okay for born again Christians to willfully commit sin against God.

When we have known and entered the Kingdom of God we are eternally secure through the Spirit of Christ in us. But do not forget the admonition of the Lord, telling us to keep ourselves from sin. Not because willful sin will cast us from the Kingdom of God but because God will chasten whom He loves.

God will only chasten?
I just gave you John 15:2
Jesus said a person IN HIM will be CUT OFF if he does not produce good deeds...IOW, obey Him.

Jesus said to cut down a tree that was not producing fruit..
it was USELESS, it was just taking up ground.

Luke 13:7-9
7“And he said to the vineyard-keeper, ‘Behold, for three years I have come looking for fruit on this fig tree without finding any. Cut it down! Why does it even use up the ground?’
8“And he answered and said to him, ‘Let it alone, sir, for this year too, until I dig around it and put in fertilizer;
9and if it bears fruit next year, fine; but if not, cut it down.’”

Your carpet bombing does not state what you think it does.
But the above are very clear warnings to obey Jesus.

Several passages in Scripture clearly teach that God disciplines and chastens His children when they sin, as part of His loving care and to bring them back to holiness.

Hebrews 12:6 (KJV) For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.

Born again believers are chastened by the Lord because He loves us, His chastening is proof of this fact.

Hebrews 12:7 (KJV) If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?

Enduring discipline affirms God's loving care for His children.

Hebrews 12:11 (KJV) Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby.

The outcome of chastening from the Lord toward born again believers produces spiritual growth and righteousness.

Revelation 3:19 (KJV) As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

Does being cut off sound like chastening to you?
The chastening is done in THIS world...you pay for your sins in many ways.

Paul and the other writers gave many warnings to remain faithful or we would fall from our secure place.

1 Corinthians 10:8-12
8Nor let us act immorally, as some of them did, and twenty-three thousand fell in one day. 9Nor let us try the Lord, as some of them did, and were destroyed by the serpents. 10Nor grumble, as some of them did, and were destroyed by the destroyer. 11Now these things happened to them as an example, and they were written for our instruction, upon whom the ends of the ages have come. 12Therefore let him who thinks he stands take heed that he does not fall.


Is Paul worried about being chastened here:

1 Corinthians 9:27
27but I discipline my body and make it my slave, so that, after I have preached to others, I myself will not be disqualified.

Discipline from God is aimed at repentance from those who love the Lord.

These verses teach that God’s chastening is not punishment for sin’s eternal penalty (which was borne by Christ on the cross) but restorative discipline to correct, protect, and refine believers. It may come through circumstances, conviction, loss, or even physical hardship or death, and its goal is to produce “the peaceful fruit of righteousness”.

Born again believers may be chastened/disciplined by the Lord when we sin, but we are not cast away from the Kingdom of God because our life is eternally secure through Christ who has saved us.

rwb
There are many warnings in the NT.
Warnings are not given where there is no danger.

Warnings are given when danger is present.

 

[rwb]

This is the problem with Christianity in these modern times.
YOU said that a Christian can commit a sin and not be cast out of the Kingdom.
Please read what you said...it's in the English language.

No I did NOT! That's what you say I said! Why do you not answer the question that I've asked rather than trying to twist what I actually said? Please try to discern the difference between asking a question and making a statement. Here again is my question:

"If sin committed by a born-again Christian can cast them out of the Kingdom of God, who then can be saved?"

The purpose for asking this question is to prove the life we have in Christ is ETERNAL and NOTHING can cast born again believers away from God! It was not asked to prove Christians have a license to willfully commit sin. Do you believe that every person who professes to have been born again has both known and entered the Kingdom of God?

 

[rwb]

rwb
There are many warnings in the NT.
Warnings are not given where there is no danger.

Warnings are given when danger is present.

Why the warnings, what is the present danger? Show me a single verse that tells us eternal life we have through Christ when we have been born again is NOT really ETERNAL life! If the eternal life we have received through Christ can be lost, Christ would not have promised the life we receive in Him is eternal, which means never ending, forever!

 

[GodsGrace]

No I did NOT! That's what you say I said! Why do you not answer the question that I've asked rather than trying to twist what I actually said? Please try to discern the difference between asking a question and making a statement. Here again is my question:

"If sin committed by a born-again Christian can cast them out of the Kingdom of God, who then can be saved?"

The purpose for asking this question is to prove the life we have in Christ is ETERNAL and NOTHING can cast born again believers away from God! It was not asked to prove Christians have a license to willfully commit sin. Do you believe that every person who professes to have been born again has both known and entered the Kingdom of God?

You've done it again rwb.
You don't even realize it.
Look above.
You just said this:

"The purpose for asking this question is to prove the life we have in Christ is ETERNAL and NOTHING can cast born again believers away from God! "

Listen to what you said:
NOTHING CAN CAST A BORN AGAIN BELIEVER AWAY FROM GOD.

Then you followed up with saying that this is not a license to sin.

Yes sir.
If you tell someone that nothing they do can cast them from God...
it IS a license to sin.


You're asking me a question that has no reply.
How could I possibly know if a person is really saved or not?

Let's stick to scripture if you wish to discuss.

 

[GodsGrace]

Why the warnings, what is the present danger? Show me a single verse that tells us eternal life we have through Christ when we have been born again is NOT really ETERNAL life! If the eternal life we have received through Christ can be lost, Christ would not have promised the life we receive in Him is eternal, which means never ending, forever!

I gave you scripture.
FALLING FROM A STANDING POSITION.
A HOUSE THAT WILL FALL
BEING DISQUALIFIED FROM THE RACE

How much do you need?
Start by explaining what YOU think those verses mean and then I'll give you plenty more.

 

[rwb]

You've done it again rwb.
You don't even realize it.
Look above.
You just said this:

"The purpose for asking this question is to prove the life we have in Christ is ETERNAL and NOTHING can cast born again believers away from God! "

Listen to what you said:
NOTHING CAN CAST A BORN AGAIN BELIEVER AWAY FROM GOD.

Then you followed up with saying that this is not a license to sin.

Yes sir.
If you tell someone that nothing they do can cast them from God...
it IS a license to sin.


You're asking me a question that has no reply.
How could I possibly know if a person is really saved or not?

Let's stick to scripture if you wish to discuss.

I gave you scripture.
FALLING FROM A STANDING POSITION.
A HOUSE THAT WILL FALL
BEING DISQUALIFIED FROM THE RACE

How much do you need?
Start by explaining what YOU think those verses mean and then I'll give you plenty more.

You haven't shown me a single verse that tells us our eternal life isn't really eternal. Why? It appears that you believe the eternal life Christ has promised every born-again believer can only be ours if we keep ourselves pure and undefiled by sin! In this I rest my case against your doctrine! Your doctrine believes eternal life is not dependent upon Christ, but that it is dependent upon our perfect obedience. Therefore, as my question implies NONE shall be saved, because NONE are righteous before God of themselves, apart from Christ we can do nothing to save ourselves.

Romans 6:23 (KJV) For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

 

[rwb]

Listen to what you said:
NOTHING CAN CAST A BORN AGAIN BELIEVER AWAY FROM GOD.

Show me this sin that a born-again believer can commit to cast them away from God? Born again believers HAVE ETERNAL LIFE!

 

[GodsGrace]

You haven't shown me a single verse that tells us our eternal life isn't really eternal. Why? It appears that you believe the eternal life Christ has promised every born-again believer can only be ours if we keep ourselves pure and undefiled by sin! In this I rest my case against your doctrine! Your doctrine believes eternal life is not dependent upon Christ, but that it is dependent upon our perfect obedience. Therefore, as my question implies NONE shall be saved, because NONE are righteous before God of themselves, apart from Christ we can do nothing to save ourselves.

Romans 6:23 (KJV) For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Romans 6:23
The gift of God is eternal life THROUGH Jesus Christ our Lord.

Is He your Lord?

Luke 6:46
46“Why do you call Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ and do not do what I say?


1. You have not replied to any of my scripture posts.

2. You are stating that it is OK to NOT obey Jesus.
You are stating that a person could sin and still be saved.


If you reply, please reply to the verses I've given you.

You keep asking for what I've already provided.

 

[GodsGrace]

Show me this sin that a born-again believer can commit to cast them away from God? Born again believers HAVE ETERNAL LIFE!

If you say so rwb.

I'm done here.

 

[Titus]

WATER BAPTISM CAUSES DIVISION

TRUTH CAUSES DIVISION
John 17:17,
- sanctify them through thy truth thy word is truth

Luke 12:51-53,
- Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth, I tell you, Nay but rather division

 

[rwb]

If you say so rwb.

I'm done here.

I understand! I've planted, another may water, and if it be the will of God your understanding shall be increased that you might be able to one day give an answer from the Word of God for how the life we receive when we have been born again of Christ's Spirit is ETERNAL LIFE that is dependent solely upon the grace of God through faith in Jesus Christ.

 

[David1701]

I gave you scripture.
FALLING FROM A STANDING POSITION.
A HOUSE THAT WILL FALL
BEING DISQUALIFIED FROM THE RACE

How much do you need?
Start by explaining what YOU think those verses mean and then I'll give you plenty more.

1 John 3:4-10 (E.S.V.)
4 Everyone who makes a practice of sinning also practices lawlessness; sin is lawlessness.
5 You know that he appeared in order to take away sins, and in him there is no sin.
6 No-one who abides in him keeps on sinning; no one who keeps on sinning has either seen him or known him.
7 Little children, let no one deceive you. Whoever practices righteousness is righteous, as he is righteous.
8 Whoever makes a practice of sinning is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the works of the devil.
9 No-one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for God’s seed abides in him, and he cannot keep on sinning because he has been born of God.
10 By this it is evident who are the children of God, and who are the children of the devil: whoever does not practise righteousness is not of God, nor is the one who does not love his brother.

The conduct that characterises our lives is the proof of whether or not we have been saved. If someone habitually wants to sin, then that is proof that that person is not born again.

We all sin sometimes; but, those who have been saved are sorry and confess their sins to God, asking for his forgiveness, through the blood of Christ.