Can Amils reasonably explain the following by keeping gymnastics and moving the goalpost out of it?

[Truth7t7]

The latter:
And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth? rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

"3rd post no response"

You have a hard time understanding that those seen in Revelation 20:4-6 are "The Souls" and "The Dead" they are in the Lord's eternal realm where one day is a thousand years (Outside Of Literal Earthly Time)

A believer that died 1,000 years ago entered the Lord's eternal realm, just as the believer that dies tomorrow or one day before the Lord's second coming will enter the Lord's eternal spiritual realm where one day is a thousand years (Spiritual Eternal Realm) = Thousand Years, the Lord's eternal

You as a premillennialist want to take the words "Thousand Years" and turn it into literal earthly time in a kingdom on this earth "False"!

 

[Truth7t7]

Why don't you try and address some of the questions I have asked? Your response here is not an argument nor an answer to any of the questions I have asked. Use Daniel 7 to prove Amil then. I used it in another thread to disprove it. You all have nothing that actually proves your timeline.

There Will Be No 1,000 Year Millennial Kingdom Upon This Earth, Jesus Christ Returns In Fire And Final Judgement, Dissolving This Existing Earth By Fire, Immediately After The Tribulation

This Existing Heaven And Earth Will Be (Replaced) By The New Heaven, Earth, Jerusalem, A New Creation, At The Return Of Jesus Christ

(Behold, I Make All Things New)

2 Peter 3:10-13KJV
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Revelation 21:1-5KJV
1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.

Matthew 24:29-30KJV
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

1 Corinthians 3:13KJV
13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

Luke 17:29-30KJV
29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

2 Thessalonians 1:7-9KJV
7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

Malachi 3:2KJV
2 But who may abide the day of his coming? and who shall stand when he appeareth? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap:

Psalm 46:6KJV
6 The heathen raged, the kingdoms were moved: he uttered his voice, the earth melted.

Psalm 50:3KJV
3 Our God shall come, and shall not keep silence: a fire shall devour before him, and it shall be very tempestuous round about him.

Psalm 97:5KJV
5 The hills melted like wax at the presence of the Lord, at the presence of the Lord of the whole earth.

Isaiah 66:15KJV
15 For, behold, the Lord will come with fire, and with his chariots like a whirlwind, to render his anger with fury, and his rebuke with flames of fire.

Zechariah 14:12KJV
12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the Lord will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

Nahum 1:5-6KJV
5 The mountains quake at him, and the hills melt, and the earth is burned at his presence, yea, the world, and all that dwell therein.
6 Who can stand before his indignation? and who can abide in the fierceness of his anger? his fury is poured out like fire, and the rocks are thrown down by him.

Revelation 20:9KJV
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

 

[rwb]

Why don't you try and address some of the questions I have asked? Your response here is not an argument nor an answer to any of the questions I have asked. Use Daniel 7 to prove Amil then. I used it in another thread to disprove it. You all have nothing that actually proves your timeline.

Why don't you address my replies to you? Dan 7 helps to prove what I've said. The reason you and AI are unable to reconcile Dan 7 and Rev 20 is that you make no distinction of Old Covenant saints and New Covenant saints. Nor have you demonstrated any understanding of the SPIRITUAL Kingdom of God that the coming of Christ came to earth with. A Kingdom that can only be known and entered when one is born again.

The Old Covenant faithful souls slain for the Word of God and their testimony were not crying out to God from heaven. They could not go to heaven after being killed until the promised One came to make atonement for sin and defeat death. These OC faithful souls cried out to God from the bosom of Abraham, which was what the place of the faithful dead was called in days of Old. (Lk 16:22-23)

They died waiting for the promised Messiah to come with the Kingdom of God. To be under the altar was to be [spiritually] covered by the sacrificial atoning blood through promise. When Christ came with the Kingdom of God is when the souls cried out for vengeance. That's when they were given white robes, signifying righteousness of the saints, (Rev 7:9-17) and told "they should yet rest for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled."

Therefore, time (little season) for them began when Christ came to earth with the Kingdom of God. The little season for the faithful saints then would be finished when Christ went to the cross and resurrected from the dead. That would be about 3-3 1/2 years later.

The fellowservants and their brethren I believe were Old Covenant Hebrew faithful who, like Abraham, heard the gospel preached through the prophets of Old, and according to grace through faith believed God. (see Gal 3:8) I believe they are called the elect remnant of God from the Old Covenant nation of Israel reserved for everlasting life by God (Ro 11:4). And their brethren also, I believe is Christ our Lord. (Mt 12:46-49)

The fellowservants killed as they, are depicted as those who are the many (spiritual) bodies of the old covenant saints who came out of the graves after the resurrection of Christ (Mt 27:52-53). Before ascending to heaven after His resurrection, Christ first descended to the lower parts of the earth, (graves of Old called the bosom of Abraham) to set the captives free (Eph 4:8-10). The fellowservants also included those Hebrew saints living under the Old Covenant who believed in Christ through the preaching of John-the-Baptist, who went about telling first century Jews the good news, preaching repentance for the One they were waiting for had come.

The little season for the souls of them that were slain of Old came to an end when Christ came to earth a man. And that is when a/the thousand years for Satan to be bound began [and when the thousand years for spiritually living and reigning with Christ began]. When the thousand years have ended, then Satan will also have a little season of freedom from the pit, (Rev 20:3,7) because that's when preaching the Gospel of the Kingdom of God through Christ will be fulfilled, salvation ended.

We have no way of knowing how much time Satan will be given in the days when the seventh trumpet begins to sound (Rev 10:5-7). But, if we gage his time according to the little season for the souls of Old, we know it will not be ONE thousand more years of time once the last trumpet begins to sound.

Because they cried out to God in heaven from the bosom of Abraham, which is the place where faithful saints after physical death went; IOW the resting place for the physically dead saints of Old. They want to know how long before they will be with the promised One in heaven and set free from bondage to the grave. God does not give them an exact time but assures them their waiting will not be much longer, because that is how "little season" is defined, certainly NOT One thousand years.

Why in your discourse with AI do neither you nor AI show any understanding for the FACT that with His coming Christ ushered in the spiritual Kingdom of God? Your whole discourse seems to assume only a physical Kingdom of God that you are still waiting for.

 

[Truth7t7]

The little season for the souls of them that were slain of Old came to an end when Christ came to earth a man. And that is when a/the thousand years for Satan to be bound began [and when the thousand years for spiritually living and reigning with Christ began]. When the thousand years have ended, then Satan will also have a little season of freedom from the pit, (Rev 20:3,7) because that's when preaching the Gospel of the Kingdom of God through Christ will be fulfilled, salvation ended.

Satan is "Currently" bound from "One Specific Purpose", And One Only?

"Deceive The Nations" To Battle

The Non-Literal 1,000 Years (Revelation) 20:1-6 Are Taking Place Now In The Lords Spiritual, And Will Cease At The Future Second Coming

If A Tribulation Saint Were To Die One Day Before The Second Coming, He Enters Into The Non-Literal 1,000 Year Reign

Many That Promote Millennialism Falsely Teach, Satan Cant Be Presently Bound Because Evil Exist In The World?

Satan Is Presently Bound As Is Clearly Seen In (Revelation) 20:7-8 Below That Interprets (Deceive The Nations) Is To Battle, Not General Evil In The World Presently.

Satan Is Loosed At The End Of The Tribulation When The 6th Vial Is Poured Out As Seen In (Revelation) 16:12, The Deception Is Devils In False Miracles Going Forth To The Kings Of The Earth, To Gather Them To The Final Battle (Satans Little Season)

(Revelation) 20:1-9KJV
1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

(Revelation) 16:12-14 & (Revelation) 20:7-8 Same Deception In Gathering The Nations To The Very Same Final Battle In "Parallel" Teachings Of The Same Event

(Revelation) 16:12-17KJV
12 And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared.
13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.
14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.
15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.
16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.
17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.

 

[Davidpt]

The Old Covenant faithful souls slain for the Word of God and their testimony were not crying out to God from heaven. They could not go to heaven after being killed until the promised One came to make atonement for sin and defeat death. These OC faithful souls cried out to God from the bosom of Abraham, which was what the place of the faithful dead was called in days of Old. (Lk 16:22-23)

The suggestion that the 5th seal martyrs are exclusively OC faithful waiting in Abraham's Bosom completely breaks down when we allow the Book of Revelation to define its own vocabulary.

John does not leave the nature of this testimony up to human speculation. The phrase the word of God and the testimony is John's specific, technical signature throughout the book for the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

Let’s let the text define itself.

The identity link in Revelation 1:9---John defines this exact phrase in the very first chapter when describing his own imprisonment on Patmos

Revelation 1:9I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ

John was not exiled for holding an OC shadow or waiting in Abraham's Bosom--he was exiled for preaching the historical, resurrected Jesus Christ. This is the exact same dual phrase used of the souls in Revelation 6:9---for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held


If there is any doubt about what the word testimony means in apocalyptic vision, the interpreting angel clearly defines it for us.

Revelation 19:10--I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

To hold the testimony is to bear witness to the completed, historical work of Jesus Christ.


This completely settles the matter. When we look at the parallel group sitting on the thrones at the beginning of the Millennium, John uses the exact same linguistic fingerprint to describe them.

Revelation 20:4---and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness(testimony)of Jesus, and for the word of God-------




The text dictates that the souls under the altar in Revelation 6 are martyred for the testimony of Jesus Christ. They are new covenant era martyrs---including those who die during the future tribulation period

Trying to force these souls back into an OC 3.5 year historical window between Christ's birth and the cross requires completely erasing John's own definitions of testimony, and forcing the beast's image into ancient history. The text plays out seamlessly---they die for Jesus, they are told to wait a little season, and they do not receive the ruling krima kingdom until the little horn beast is utterly destroyed in the burning flame.

testimony
marturia
mar-too-ree'-ah
from martuV - martus 3144; evidence given (judicially or genitive case):--record, report, testimony, witness.

Revelation 1:2 Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony(marturia) of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw

Revelation 1:9 I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony(marturia) of Jesus Christ.

Revelation 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony(marturia) which they held:

Revelation 11:7 And when they shall have finished their testimony(marturia), the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.

Revelation 12:11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony(marturia); and they loved not their lives unto the death

Revelation 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony(marturia) of Jesus Christ.

Revelation 19:10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony(marturia) of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony(marturia) of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

Revelation 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness(marturia) of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

Every single one of these verses (marturia) is meaning the testimony of Jesus. But you want us to have it meaning the testimony of OC saints. When the little season happens in the future, not to be confused with satan's little season, 2K years will have preceded it. 2K years does not equal a little season by any means. 2K years is 1/3 of the amount of time since Adam. Therefore, plenty of time for there to already be numerous NT church era martyrs before the arrival of the little season meant in Revelation 6.

--------------------------

Demographics of the Church Age: The Scale of Christian Martyrdom​

If we look at church history from an objective, statistical standpoint, the claim that the fifth seal had to close in the first century because there "weren't enough New Covenant martyrs yet" completely falls apart under historical data.

Leading demographic researchers, including the Center for the Study of Global Christianity (CSGC), estimate that approximately 70 million Christians have been martyred for their faith over the past 2,000 years.

Here is how those numbers break down across church history:

• The First 19 Centuries (AD 33–1900): An estimated 25 million believers laid down their lives. This includes the early Roman persecutions, the waves of martyrdom during the missionization of Europe, and the intense global conflicts of the Reformation eras.
  
• The 20th Century (1901–2000): Strikingly, the 20th century produced more martyrs than the previous 19 centuries combined. Approximately 45 million Christians were martyred, largely under oppressive, state-enforced secular regimes, communist purges, and fascist dictatorships (such as the Soviet gulags).
  
• The 21st Century (2001–Present): The phenomenon remains a massive, ongoing physical reality. Demographers estimate that roughly 1.9 million Christians have been killed for their faith since the turn of the century (averaging tens of thousands per year in highly hostile regions). In fact, a dedicated Vatican monitoring commission recently verified over 1,700 modern cases of explicit, individual martyrdom situations documented just since the year 2000.

 

[Davidpt]

"3rd post no response"

You have a hard time understanding that those seen in Revelation 20:4-6 are "The Souls" and "The Dead" they are in the Lord's eternal realm where one day is a thousand years (Outside Of Literal Earthly Time)

A believer that died 1,000 years ago entered the Lord's eternal realm, just as the believer that dies tomorrow or one day before the Lord's second coming will enter the Lord's eternal spiritual realm where one day is a thousand years (Spiritual Eternal Realm) = Thousand Years, the Lord's eternal

You as a premillennialist want to take the words "Thousand Years" and turn it into literal earthly time in a kingdom on this earth "False"!

I may not have read all posts in this thread yet. Sometimes I get behind because I'm focusing on other things. I still have things to focus on at home that have zero to do with this forum.

 

[Davidpt]

Satan is "Currently" bound from "One Specific Purpose", And One Only?

"Deceive The Nations" To Battle

The Non-Literal 1,000 Years (Revelation) 20:1-6 Are Taking Place Now In The Lords Spiritual, And Will Cease At The Future Second Coming

If A Tribulation Saint Were To Die One Day Before The Second Coming, He Enters Into The Non-Literal 1,000 Year Reign

Many That Promote Millennialism Falsely Teach, Satan Cant Be Presently Bound Because Evil Exist In The World?

Satan Is Presently Bound As Is Clearly Seen In (Revelation) 20:7-8 Below That Interprets (Deceive The Nations) Is To Battle, Not General Evil In The World Presently.

Satan Is Loosed At The End Of The Tribulation When The 6th Vial Is Poured Out As Seen In (Revelation) 16:12, The Deception Is Devils In False Miracles Going Forth To The Kings Of The Earth, To Gather Them To The Final Battle (Satans Little Season)

(Revelation) 20:1-9KJV
1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

(Revelation) 16:12-14 & (Revelation) 20:7-8 Same Deception In Gathering The Nations To The Very Same Final Battle In "Parallel" Teachings Of The Same Event

(Revelation) 16:12-17KJV
12 And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared.
13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.
14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.
15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.
16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.
17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.

It's certainly possible both battles could be meaning one and the same. But then again, maybe 2 battles is not absurd after all. Before the millennium, satan is deceiving the nations. During the millennium he no longer is. After the millennium he deceives the nations again. That equals 2 times he deceives the nations rather than just one time. Therefore, one battle might lead to getting cast into the pit. The other battle might lead to him getting cast into the LOF.

Amil has him deceiving the nations 1 time rather than 2 times. Amil has him deceiving the nations before, during, and after the thousand years. That equals one not 2 times. Unless Amil wants us to believe something absurd. That the past 2k years Amil calls the millennium, satan hasn't been deceiving a single nation. Amil has him battling the church spiritually nonstop throughout the millennium and his little season. Except, guess what? In Revelation 20, the battle against the church is not during the millennium, it is after the millennium.

 

[Truth7t7]

The latter:
And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth? rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

"4th post no response"

You have a hard time understanding that those seen in Revelation 20:4-6 are "The Souls" and "The Dead" they are in the Lord's eternal realm where one day is a thousand years (Outside Of Literal Earthly Time)

A believer that died 1,000 years ago entered the Lord's eternal realm, just as the believer that dies tomorrow or one day before the Lord's second coming will enter the Lord's eternal spiritual realm where one day is a thousand years (Spiritual Eternal Realm) = Thousand Years, the Lord's eternal

You as a premillennialist want to take the words "Thousand Years" and turn it into literal earthly time in a kingdom on this earth "False"!

 

[Truth7t7]

It's certainly possible both battles could be meaning one and the same. But then again, maybe 2 battles is not absurd after all. Before the millennium, satan is deceiving the nations. During the millennium he no longer is. After the millennium he deceives the nations again. That equals 2 times he deceives the nations rather than just one time. Therefore, one battle might lead to getting cast into the pit. The other battle might lead to him getting cast into the LOF.

Amil has him deceiving the nations 1 time rather than 2 times. Amil has him deceiving the nations before, during, and after the thousand years. That equals one not 2 times. Unless Amil wants us to believe something absurd. That the past 2k years Amil calls the millennium, satan hasn't been deceiving a single nation. Amil has him battling the church spiritually nonstop throughout the millennium and his little season. Except, guess what? In Revelation 20, the battle against the church is not during the millennium, it is after the millennium.

Satan is "Currently" bound from "One Specific Purpose", And One Only?

"Deceive The Nations" To Battle

The Non-Literal 1,000 Years (Revelation) 20:1-6 Are Taking Place Now In The Lords Spiritual, And Will Cease At The Future Second Coming

If A Tribulation Saint Were To Die One Day Before The Second Coming, He Enters Into The Non-Literal 1,000 Year Reign

Many That Promote Millennialism Falsely Teach, Satan Cant Be Presently Bound Because Evil Exist In The World?

Satan Is Presently Bound As Is Clearly Seen In (Revelation) 20:7-8 Below That Interprets (Deceive The Nations) Is To Battle, Not General Evil In The World Presently.

Satan Is Loosed At The End Of The Tribulation When The 6th Vial Is Poured Out As Seen In (Revelation) 16:12, The Deception Is Devils In False Miracles Going Forth To The Kings Of The Earth, To Gather Them To The Final Battle (Satans Little Season)

(Revelation) 20:1-9KJV
1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

(Revelation) 16:12-14 & (Revelation) 20:7-8 Same Deception In Gathering The Nations To The Very Same Final Battle In "Parallel" Teachings Of The Same Event

(Revelation) 16:12-17KJV
12 And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared.
13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.
14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.
15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.
16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.
17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.

 

[Truth7t7]

The latter:
And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth? rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

"4th post no response"

You have a hard time understanding that those seen in Revelation 20:4-6 are "The Souls" and "The Dead" they are in the Lord's eternal realm where one day is a thousand years (Outside Of Literal Earthly Time)

A believer that died 1,000 years ago entered the Lord's eternal realm, just as the believer that dies tomorrow or one day before the Lord's second coming will enter the Lord's eternal spiritual realm where one day is a thousand years (Spiritual Eternal Realm) = Thousand Years, the Lord's eternal

You as a premillennialist want to take the words "Thousand Years" and turn it into literal earthly time in a kingdom on this earth "False"!

 

[rwb]

Revelation 1:9I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ

John was not exiled for holding an OC shadow or waiting in Abraham's Bosom--he was exiled for preaching the historical, resurrected Jesus Christ. This is the exact same dual phrase used of the souls in Revelation 6:9---for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held

Are you confusing the Apostle John with John-the-Baptist?

Do you notice in Rev 6:9 they were not beheaded for being a witness of Jesus as John says he was. John-the-Baptist, having died before the cross and resurrection would be among those under the altar because he was a Jewish fellowservant who died in faith waiting for the promised Messiah to come. JTB preached repentance from dead works because the Kingdom of heaven was at hand as proclaimed through the prophets of Old. He proclaimed what he had been taught through the law and prophets. But the Apostle John exiled to Patmos for preaching the name of Jesus, died after the cross and resurrection, therefore the gates of heaven through the advent of Christ were opened for whosoever dies in faith after the Christ's cross and resurrection. So, the Apostle John would not have to wait for Jesus to come as those of Old had.

The faithful saints of Old knew of a Messiah who would come, but they lived and died before He came to earth a man and was called Jesus.

Re 6:9 ¶ And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:

This completely settles the matter. When we look at the parallel group sitting on the thrones at the beginning of the Millennium, John uses the exact same linguistic fingerprint to describe them.

Revelation 20:4---and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness(testimony)of Jesus, and for the word of God-------

Yes, it should settle the matter, but I doubt it will. These martyred souls, no doubt from the advent of Christ are among the martyred dead of Rev 20. But the beheaded souls lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years and within this symbolic time became martyred for their faith. Rev 20:4 is a depiction of all saints both from Old and New Covenant who were physically alive and suffered as martyrs for their faithfulness to God and Christ Jesus our Lord.

Revelation 20:4 (KJV) And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

The martyred souls of Rev 20:4 are spiritually alive in heaven after physical death AFTER the advent of Christ making atonement for sin and defeating death. They are seen alive in heaven AFTER Satan was bound for a/the thousand years.

The text dictates that the souls under the altar in Revelation 6 are martyred for the testimony of Jesus Christ. They are new covenant era martyrs---including those who die during the future tribulation period

You aren't reading very well. There is no mention of Jesus Christ. Why? Because they lived and died before the coming of Christ Jesus to earth a man. They had their own trials and tribulation through the power of the beasts Daniel writes of.

Revelation 6:9 (KJV) And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:

Trying to force these souls back into an OC 3.5 year historical window between Christ's birth and the cross requires completely erasing John's own definitions of testimony, and forcing the beast's image into ancient history.

You really need to take off your blinders when you read replies. You have a tendency (deliberate?) to read in part and to add what you believe as though you're accurately quoting the view of others.