Mrk 16:17-18 applies today, really ? Let's see :)

[Dryhn]

Are you really a believer ?
If so, take the test


17And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
18They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.

cast out devils
speak new tongues - speak to lost tribe in their language
take up serpents
drink deadly thing
lay hands heal - go to cancer ward & heal the dying

If you can't do the above then you are not a believer

 

[markalan]

Are you really a believer ?
If so, take the test


17And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
18They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.

cast out devils
speak new tongues - speak to lost tribe in their language
take up serpents
drink deadly thing
lay hands heal - go to cancer ward & heal the dying

If you can't do the above then you are not a believer

I would say that "follow them" is referring to the communal Church, not every individual believer.

Paul's experience on Malta when a snake bit him, shows that there are specific circumstances for that to occur.

I have witnessed 3 on the list but only heard testimonies about snake bite and food poisoning - all were in specific situations as directed by the Lord, not arbitrarily practiced by believers.

And not everyone Paul prayed for was healed (Trophimus 2 Timothy 4:20)

 

[Dryhn]

I would say that "follow them" is referring to the communal Church, not every individual believer.

Paul's experience on Malta when a snake bit him, shows that there are specific circumstances for that to occur.

I have witnessed 3 on the list but only heard testimonies about snake bite and food poisoning - all were in specific situations as directed by the Lord, not arbitrarily practiced by believers.

And not everyone Paul prayed for was healed (Trophimus 2 Timothy 4:20)

I would say that "follow them" is referring to the communal Church, not every individual believer.

Them = Church not every believer

17And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
18They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.

Verses please that supports your thoughts

 

[markalan]

I would say that "follow them" is referring to the communal Church, not every individual believer.

Them = Church not every believer

17And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
18They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.

Verses please that supports your thoughts

Notice how the singular (he) in verse 16 changes to the plural (them) in verse 17:

He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved;
but he that believeth not shall be damned.
And these signs shall follow them that believe

It is essential that every individual believe the Gospel - among them who believe will be these signs.

"Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular.
And God hath set some in the church, first apostles,
secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers,
after that miracles, then gifts of healings,
helps, governments, diversities of tongues.
Are all apostles? are all prophets? are all teachers?
are all workers of miracles?
Have all the gifts of healing?
do all speak with tongues? do all interpret?"
1 Cor 12:27-30

 

[Dryhn]

Notice how the singular (he) in verse 16 changes to the plural (them) in verse 17:

He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved;
but he that believeth not shall be damned.
And these signs shall follow them that believe

It is essential that every individual believe the Gospel - among them who believe will be these signs.

"Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular.
And God hath set some in the church, first apostles,
secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers,
after that miracles, then gifts of healings,
helps, governments, diversities of tongues.
Are all apostles? are all prophets? are all teachers?
are all workers of miracles?
Have all the gifts of healing?
do all speak with tongues? do all interpret?"
1 Cor 12:27-30

Referring to Mark 16:17-18
Them/those/they depending on which Bible = more than one

Since you believe you are one of them/they/those referred to in Mk 16:17-18
Can you :-
cast out devils
speak new tongues - speak to lost tribe in their language
take up serpents
drink deadly thing
lay hands heal - go to cancer ward & heal the dying

 

[ScottA]

Are you really a believer ?
If so, take the test


17And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
18They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.

cast out devils
speak new tongues - speak to lost tribe in their language
take up serpents
drink deadly thing
lay hands heal - go to cancer ward & heal the dying

If you can't do the above then you are not a believer

That is quite a display of lack of faith...and understanding.

Why have you omitted “Most assuredly, I say to you, he who believes in Me, the works that I do he will do also; and greater works than these he will do, because I go to My Father?" Surely, you have no idea what He meant--because each of those works he listed in Mark 16-17 were the lessor works, and only of the kind He did!

 

[Dryhn]

That is quite a display of lack of faith...and understanding.

Why have you omitted “Most assuredly, I say to you, he who believes in Me, the works that I do he will do also; and greater works than these he will do, because I go to My Father?" Surely, you have no idea what He meant--because each of those works he listed in Mark 16-17 were the lessor works, and only of the kind He did!

Can you :-

cast out devils
speak new tongues - speak to lost tribe in their language
take up serpents
drink deadly thing
lay hands heal - go to cancer ward & heal the dying

 

[ScottA]

Can you :-

cast out devils
speak new tongues - speak to lost tribe in their language
take up serpents
drink deadly thing
lay hands heal - go to cancer ward & heal the dying

Can you interpret those words according to the greater works definition that Jesus only alluded to, but gave in spirit?

 

[markalan]

Referring to Mark 16:17-18
Them/those/they depending on which Bible = more than one

Since you believe you are one of them/they/those referred to in Mk 16:17-18
Can you :-
cast out devils
speak new tongues - speak to lost tribe in their language
take up serpents
drink deadly thing
lay hands heal - go to cancer ward & heal the dying

I am most certainly "one of them", that is a member of the body of Christ - - as Paul expressed it: "Now you are the body of Christ and individually members of it." (1 Cor 12:27)

Paul went on to say that not all are used to do all those signs (1 Cor 12:27-30).

My previous comment was that I have witnessed three of those signs ... in our church (as in most churches) people have been prayed for who were healed. Have you not experienced that in your church?

 

[Dryhn]

Can you interpret those words according to the greater works definition that Jesus only alluded to, but gave in spirit?

Are you unable to understand :-

17And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
18They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.

 

[ScottA]

Are you unable to understand :-

17And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
18They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.

By asking, you show that it is you who does not understand.

Why do you ask questions, if you don't want the correct answers?

 

[Dryhn]

I am most certainly "one of them", that is a member of the body of Christ - - as Paul expressed it: "Now you are the body of Christ and individually members of it." (1 Cor 12:27)

Paul went on to say that not all are used to do all those signs (1 Cor 12:27-30).

My previous comment was that I have witnessed three of those signs ... in our church (as in most churches) people have been prayed for who were healed. Have you not experienced that in your church?

Do you believe you are one of "them" mentioned in :-

17And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
18They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.

Yet you are unable to :-

cast out devils
speak new tongues - speak to lost tribe in their language
take up serpents
drink deadly thing
lay hands heal - go to cancer ward & heal the dying

Conclusion, those verses applies to believers in a different age

PS, where is "Body of Christ" taught before Paul ?
Just the verses please :)

 

[markalan]

Can you interpret those words according to the greater works definition that Jesus only alluded to, but gave in spirit?

I've wondered why most translations say "greater" and not "more" as it is often understood.

 

[ScottA]

I've wondered why most translations say "greater" and not "more" as it is often understood.

Yes, and the error insinuated in the Original Post, is the measurable difference between heaven and earth, the flesh and the Spirit. And apparently, he has no idea.

 

[markalan]

where is "Body of Christ" taught before Paul ?
Just the verses please :)

Are you suggesting that Paul did not agree with Jesus?

Jesus did not use the term "body of Christ" ... but He used similar expressions, such as Church (ekklesia)
Mat 16:18 "on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it".

 

[Dryhn]

Yes, and the error insinuated in the Original Post, is the measurable difference between heaven and earth, the flesh and the Spirit. And apparently, he has no idea.

See how you go with 2 simple questions :)

Who did Christ in Acts 9:15, Rom 11:13, Rom 15:16 chose a Apostle & Minister to you ?
Who did ALL the Apostles in Gal 2:7-9 agree teaches you the Gospel

 

[Dryhn]

Are you suggesting that Paul did not agree with Jesus?

Jesus did not use the term "body of Christ" ... but He used similar expressions, such as Church (ekklesia)
Mat 16:18 "on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it".

ALL the Apostles taught correctly for their audience :)
eg Gal 2:7-9 who did ALL the Apostles agree would teach markalan the Gospel ?

 

[markalan]

ALL the Apostles taught correctly for their audience :)
eg Gal 2:7-9 who did ALL the Apostles agree would teach markalan the Gospel ?

Paul was certainly the principal author of the NT, and established the doctrinal basis of the gentile Church.

When you say "their audience" are you suggesting we are not Paul's "audience" today?

Who do you think Jesus was talking to in Mark 16:17-18?

Who do you think Paul was talking to in 1 Cor 12:27-31?

 

[Anchorite]

Are you really a believer ?
If so, take the test


17And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
18They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.

cast out devils
speak new tongues - speak to lost tribe in their language
take up serpents
drink deadly thing
lay hands heal - go to cancer ward & heal the dying

If you can't do the above then you are not a believer

There is no record in the gospels that Jesus went to leper colonies and healed them all, so you cannot say we must go to cancer wards and heal all the dying.

Jesus said “thy faith hath healed thee”.

A sick person must believe that God will heal them.

 

[markalan]

There is no record in the gospels that Jesus went to leper colonies and healed them all, so you cannot say we must go to cancer wards and heal all the dying.

Jesus said “thy faith hath healed thee”.

A sick person must believe that God will heal them.

Jesus healed all those who came to Him in faith.

When He did go into a place where there was a multitude of sick people (Pool of Bethesda), Jesus only healed one man.