Christ was Incarnated, not Created! Jesus is Eternal God!!

[GISMYS_7]

Christ was incarnated, not created Jesus is eternal God!

There are those who teach that the Father always existed and that Christ was created. Perish the thought! Christ always existed and was not created. Isaiah 43:10 states, Before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. In simple English, no God was created before or after Jehovah. They coexisted as a Trinity eternally. Thus Christ was from all eternity or He wasn't. Either He always existed or He didn't. Since no God was created before or after Jehovah, we take Micah 5:2 for what it says about the One who was to come to earth and experience a human birth. He was from of old, from everlasting. Thus, His human birth was not His creation. Rather, as we discussed earlier in this chapter, the word incarnation comes from the Latin words in and carnis, meaning "in the flesh."

An eternal God having a birth is not contradictory. In eternity He was God. To become a man, a birth had to occur. None of us can become another species without the miracle of a birth. God had to become incarnated (become flesh) so that He could shed the pure, sinless blood that flowed in His veins. The miracle of the Holy Spirit's insemination of the virgin Mary's ova and womb with the body and blood of God the Son made this shedding of blood possible. This was a necessity because the blood of animals could not take away sin, only cover the sinner's transgression.

Hebrews 10:4 states, For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins. So verse 5 has Christ saying, A body hast thou prepared me. God lived in that body, went to the cross in that body, shed the blood in that body to take away the sins that had only been covered, died in that body, arose three days later in that same body, ascended to heaven in that body, and will throughout eternity live in that body in which He had the birth. For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily (Colossians 2:9).

There it is. The eternal God left heaven to be born into human flesh because a body could contain sinless blood through a virgin birth. That blood was shed for sins and can wash you from every stain and taint of this world's defilement when you put your trust in the God in whom the Philippian jailor trusted, the Lord Jesus Christ. Do it today.
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[101G]

There are those who teach that the Father always existed and that Christ was created. Perish the thought! Christ always existed and was not created. Isaiah 43:10 states, Before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. In simple English, no God was created before or after Jehovah. They coexisted as a Trinity eternally.

your subject title is good, but you statement is in a error. listen you quoted Isaiah 43:10 correctly, but then you turned around and said, "They coexisted". did you not hear Isaiah 43:10 correctly?. ME is a single designation, there is no they here

Thus Christ was from all eternity or He wasn't. Either He always existed or He didn't. Since no God was created before or after Jehovah, we take Micah 5:2 for what it says about the One who was to come to earth and experience a human birth.

Good, I'm glad you quoted Micah 5:2. now who came? was it the Son or the LORD all caps?. let the record speak. Isaiah 35:4 "Say to them that are of a fearful heart, Be strong, fear not: behold, your God will come with vengeance, even God with a recompence; he will come and save you". NOW, who came and save us? GOD right, but you say it's three person of God. so let the bible narrow it down for us. #1. Isaiah 45:21 "Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is none beside me". I and me are single designations, and then the bible tops it off with this, "there is none beside me". that right there should put an end to the "They". but one more to clearly eliminate the "They". #2. Isaiah 43:11 "I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour". the LORD all caps is the only saviour.

Now please understand me. I agree with you the Lord Jesus is not Created, but Incarnate in flesh. it's just the methods or the doctrine you present is not correct.

Peace in Christ Jesus/Yeshua.

 

[GISMYS_7]

What man may choose to believe does not change any Truth!!! God's Word is all eternal living Truth!!

 

[101G]

What man may choose to believe does not change any Truth!!! God's Word is all eternal living Truth!!

that is true, but if some men teach the truth wrong thing then they are eternal dead. 2 Timothy 2:15 "Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness".

Peace in Christ Jesus.

 

[GISMYS_7]

LOL!! Truth is Truth no matter what little men may think or say!!!

 

[bbyrd009]

LOL!! Truth is Truth no matter what little men may think or say!!!

GIS, 101G did not speak down to you at all, even as a babe in Christ

 

[GISMYS_7]

A little man must be above before he can speak down. Tweak!!

 

[101G]

GIS, 101G did not speak down to you at all, even as a babe in Christ

bbyrd009, leave him alone, remember, "But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness".

one cannot argue or bable with oneself... (smile).

Peace in Christ Yeshua.

 

[DPMartin]

bbyrd009, leave him alone, remember, "But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness".

one cannot argue or bable with oneself... (smile).

Peace in Christ Yeshua.

yes you can. but some just love attention of any kind they can get. also there are many who feel powerless and disenfranchised and seek out religion for some sort of feeling they are not helpless and weak. which is one of reasons secular doesn't think much of religion when they see the kind that post such postings.

 

[tigger 2]

OP:

"Since no God was created before or after Jehovah, we take Micah 5:2 for what it says about the One who was to come to earth and experience a human birth. He was from of old, from everlasting. Thus, His human birth was not His creation."

Micah 5:2 - part 1

It's true that his human birth was not his creation. But a closer look at Micah 5:2 shows that his creation was much earlier than his human birth.

Some trinitarians tell us Micah 5:2 (or 5:1 in some versions) teaches that Jesus has always existed (“from everlasting” [olam in Hebrew] - KJV). And since only God has existed for all eternity, Jesus must be God!

But look at other trinitarian translations of Micah 5:2. (E.g., “O Bethlehem ..., from you shall come forth (yatsah - Heb.) for me one who is to be ruler in Israel, whose origin (4163, motsaah - Heb.) is from of old, from ancient (olam - Heb.) days ” - RSV, cf. AT, CEB, CJB, ERV, ESV, God's Word, JB, LEB, MEV, Mo, NAB, NCV, NEB, NET, NIV, NJB, NLT, NRSV, REB, WEB, Byington, and Young's.)

Not only does this verse not teach that Jesus has always existed, it even speaks of his origin in very ancient times. (Origin: “a coming into existence” - Webster’s New World Dictionary, 1973.)

Why would these trinitarian translations admit such a thing? Perhaps because it is difficult to honestly translate the Hebrew motsaah with a word that does not include this understanding. (Even when “goings forth” is the rendering, it appears it should also be with the understanding of “originating.” For example, if we said “the command went forth from the King,” we obviously mean the command originated with - or sprang from - the king! And when Micah 5:2 says of the Messiah: “O Bethlehem ..., from you shall come forth [the Messiah],” it can only mean that, in his earthly existence, he originated in Bethlehem!)

Obviously for so many respected trinitarian translators to choose this meaning (“origin”) they must feel there is no other honest choice! The only meanings given by Gesenius for this word in his highly-respected Lexicon are “origin, springing” - #4163, Gesenius - cf. Micah 5:1 in The Jewish Publication Society’s Bible translation, 'Tanakh.'

And 'A Concise Hebrew and Aramaic Lexicon of the Old Testament' gives the only meaning for this word as used in Micah 5 as "origin." - p. 187, Eerdmans.

It would make no sense to interpret this as meaning the Messiah’s human origin springs from ancient times. We have just been told that in Micah’s time the Messiah’s human origin was to be a future event and would take place in Bethlehem. Also there are no humans who haven’t sprung from the very first pair in ancient Eden. It would be ridiculous to make the point that the human Messiah came from ancient stock since every human has done so. It must mean that his pre-existence as a spirit person in heaven originated in very ancient times (as the very beginning of God’s creation - Rev. 3:14; Prov. 8:22). The Bible Greek of the ancient Septuagint, in fact, at Micah 5:2 says: “and his goings forth were from the beginning [arkhe], from ancient days [aionos].”

The NIV Study Bible, in a footnote for Micah 5:2 explains: “origins...from of old. His beginnings were much earlier than his human birth.”

BUT THE TRUE, ETERNAL GOD HAD NO BEGINNING!

 

[tigger 2]

Micah 5:2 - Part 2

As for the Hebrew word olam, it can also be understood as “ancient times” or “of old” and does not necessarily refer to “eternity.” Here is how it (olam) is used in the following scriptures in the NASB:

of old (Gen 6:4)

days of old (Deuteronomy 32:7)

`From ancient times (Joshua 24:2)

from ancient times. (1 Samuel 27:8)

the ancient path (Job 22:15)

the ancient boundary (Proverbs 22:28)

the ancient boundary (Proverbs 23:10)

the ancient nation (Isaiah 44:7)

ancient ruins (Isaiah 58:12)

ancient ruins (Isaiah 61:4).

the days of old. (Isaiah 63:9)

the days of old (Isaiah 63:11)

an ancient nation, (Jeremiah 5:15)

the ancient paths (Jeremiah 6:16)

the ancient paths (Jeremiah 18:15)

the ancient waste places (Ezekiel 26:20)

the days of old (Malachi 3:4)

Micah 5:2 literally says "days of olam." This same wording is found again in Micah at

Micah 7:14: Let them feed in Bashan and Gilead as in the days of old [‘days of olam’].

Try substituting “eternity” in the above scriptures. It’s clear that the NASB has rendered olam correctly in those scriptures.

So, adding the fact that the Messiah had a beginning in this verse to the possibility of olam meaning “ancient” as translated here in numerous trinitarian Bibles (and in many other scriptures), it seems evident that the RSV has correctly rendered Micah 5:2 -

(RSV) Micah 5:2 But you, O Bethlehem Ephrathah, who are little to be among the clans of Judah, from you shall come forth for me one who is to be ruler in Israel, whose origin is from of old, from ancient days.

It’s also important to examine Micah 5:4 where Jehovah is recognized as being the God of the Messiah! (The NIVSB tells us in a footnote for this verse that the LORD [‘Jehovah’] here - the God of the Messiah - refers to “God the Father.”)

 

[101G]

The EVERLASTING ONE is the Root. the OFFSPRING, is the ETERNAL SHARE. Revelation 22:16 "I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star".
OFFSPRING: G1085 γένος genos (ǰe'-nos) n.
kin.
{abstract or concrete, literal or figurative, individual or collective}
[from G1096]
KJV: born, country(-man), diversity, generation, kind(-red), nation, offspring, stock
Root(s): G1096

G1096 γίνομαι ginomai (ǰiy'-no-mai) v.
1. to cause to be (“gen”-erate).
2. (reflexively) to become (come into being).
3. (of events) to happen.
KJV: arise, be assembled, be(-come, -fall, -have self), be brought (to pass), (be) come (to pass), continue.

definition #1 and #2. tell us what was cause, or come to be. answer HIS FLESH.

The Lord Jesus is the ETERNAL Spirit "shared" in flesh, so he is continuous. there is no beginning for the Spirit, only the flesh that the Spirit came in had a begining.

 

[bbyrd009]

A little man must be above before he can speak down. Tweak!!

look, i understand how it is when you are brand new in the Lord and zealous and all ok, still young and full of spit lol, but maybe you can see that that you just said there was my whole point, and i was trying to do you a favor ok. If you feel you have to speak up or down to ppl, then you have so far missed the point, iow. we already have BoL for that here lol