What Day Is The Sabbath ???

[Brakelite]

Even when Sabbatarians today set out to keep the Sabbath day, are they truly "keeping the Sabbath?" To "keep the Sabbath" as it was required under the old covenant would involve compliance with specific regulations (Exodus 16:23; 35:3; Leviticus 23:32; Jeremiah 17:21) that were strictly enforced.

If keeping the Sabbath day was still required today, so would the burnt offerings which went along with them (Leviticus 19:30; 23:2-3; Numbers 28:1-10; 29:39-40; I Chronicles. 23:30-31; II Chronicles 31:2-4; Isaiah 1:13). So no kindling a fire in any of your dwellings on the sabbath (Exodus 35:3). Every man must remain in his place on the sabbath (Exodus 16:29). No trading (Amos 8:5). No marketing (Nehemiah 10:31; 13:15,19).

These were commanded by God to Israel (Exodus 35:1). "The Israelites are to observe the Sabbath, celebrating it for the generations to come as a lasting covenant. It will be a sign between me and the Israelites forever, for in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, and on the seventh day he abstained from work and rested." (Exodus 31:16-17). Moses gives the reason the Sabbath was given to the nation Israel: “Remember that you were slaves in Egypt and that the Lord your God brought you out of there with a mighty hand and an outstretched arm. Therefore the Lord your God has commanded you to observe the Sabbath day” (Deuteronomy 5:15).

If keeping the Sabbath day is still in affect, then why don't Sabbatarians seek to obey ALL that the LORD has commanded? How can someone keep a certain law when he only keeps part of it? If the Sabbath day laws were still in effect today, then according to Exodus 31:12-18; 35:1-3; and Numbers 15:32-36, anyone who profaned the Sabbath was put to death and any person who does any work on it, that person shall be cut off from his people. So who is going to enforce that? The Jewish synagogue or perhaps the Seventh day Adventist church? Since we do not live under a theocratic state under the old covenant as ancient Israel did, no Sabbatarian can live consistently under these Mosaic regulations.

You sound like a Pharisee. "You are not keeping the law". Methinks you don't understand how the Sabbath was intended to be kept any more than they.

 

[Brakelite]

Hi,

From what history book or from whom did you learn this?

Curious

The Catholic Church itself admits this in her own catechisms.

 

[Brakelite]

No Sabbath commands in the NT!

Gal 3 As many as are of the works of the Law are under the curse.

Do you need a command? Do you need a command to not murder your neighbor? OR would you happily do that if it weren't repeated in the NT?I would hardly think that were there case, so why do you demand others keep the commandment? As well as all the other requirements of the OT sanctuary laws and ceremonial accoutrements? I'm a Sabbath keeper. But I don't observe Sabbath because it's a commandment. I don't do so out of duty or a desire to be righteous and obedient. Can you think what reasons I might choose to observe Sabbath other than the law says so?

 

[marksman]

Well I agree with you that there isn't scripture that says we must or even should meet on Sunday. There is scripture that says they met on Sunday and (after checking in to the verse) 1Cor 16:2 DOES say they were to set aside money on Sunday. We may have to revisit that phrase again.

On the other hand, I don't see a verse that say they met "daily" in "homes". No doubt they were apt to meet any day of the week. Yes they were homes but what you fail to realize or acknowledge is that they ceased to be homes when Church was being held. They went back to being homes when the service was over.

You also fail to mention or acknowledge they (Jesus and the Apostles) taught in synagogues and temples (that I DO have a verse for).

Marksman, I don't mind people meeting in homes on whatever day of the week. Even with that, there are prescribed guidelines on how to conduct it. What I do not agree with is a tearing down today's Churches and schedules. I have no problem with bucking tradition, but not if the tradition is in line and/or allowed in the Bible.

1Cor 16:2 On one of the sabbaths, let each of you put by himself, storing up whatever he is prospered, that there not be collections then when I come. That is the literal interpretation.

Act 2:46 And continuing steadfastly with one mind day by day in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, they shared food in gladness and simplicity of heart...

ceased to be homes when Church was being held. No such thing as church in those days. It was known as the ecclesia.

You also fail to mention or acknowledge they (Jesus and the Apostles) taught in synagogues and temples (that I DO have a verse for). Jesus did not teach in the synagogue after he ascended into heaven.

but not if the tradition is in line and/or allowed in the Bible. Can you show where denominations are in line with scripture?

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

In speaking of this rest (3:18; 4:1, 3-6, 8) the author consistently used the same word for “rest” (katapausis). Suddenly, in speaking about the “rest” that remains for the people of God, he uses a different word (sabbatismos, used only here in the NT) meaning specifically a Sabbath rest. In the context of his teaching, this refers fundamentally to the “Sabbath rest” which is found in Christ (“Come … I will give you rest,” Matt. 11:28-30). Thus we are to “strive to enter that rest” (4:11).

Please be consistent. You are contradicting yourself; it is not the Scriptures which contradict.

'katapausis' - "rest from above" // 'anapausis' rest anew = <fundamentally> the same and exactly therefore, fundamentally DIFFERENT, SEPARATE and OPPOSITE 'Sabbatismos' being horizontal "Sabbath-day's rest FOR THE PEOPLE of God" and 'katapausis'//'anapausis' being vertical "The Rest-of-GOD-from-above".

<<In the context this (sabbatismos) refers fundamentally to the “Sabbath rest”>> ...which is found in Christ-- true, BUT IS "FOR THE PEOPLE of God REMAINING VALID” –Christ being God's true "Rest".

The resourcefulness of Christians who just have that
Catholic DISLIKE for the Seventh Day Sabbath OF THE LORD GOD,
as if because no one is able to keep the Sabbath they
might LOOSE THEIR SALVATION!
Where's God's forgiveness?
What happened to his grace?
WHERE ARE THE MERITS OF JESUS CHRIST?
OR DO THEY HAVE TO EARN THEIR SALVATION
WITH THEIR OWN FLAWLESS WORKS OF THE LAW !?

 

[marksman]

I know, I know....you’re a self taught theologian which means you’re never wrong.

I am not and have never said I am a self-taught theologian. I have been blessed to sit under the tutorship of many fine men, have read books written by many fine men, and have been given the ability to sort out the good from the bad by the Spirit of God as he said he would in scripture.

I can't help it if I am not a slave to catholic theology and prefer to give it a miss so that I do not have to give up all the good things that I have learnt and experienced.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

ceased to be homes when Church was being held. No such thing as church in those days. It was known as the ecclesia.

What's this? <<when Church was being held>> there was <<No such thing as church in those days>>?

What's this, <<No such thing as church in those days>> ... <<It (??) was known as the ecclesia>>??

This is contradicting oneself.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

I .. have been given the ability to sort out the good from the bad by the Spirit of God as he said he would in scripture.

there goes your credibility in my human opinion. I believe the Third Commandment.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

 

[mjrhealth]

View attachment 9494

@marksman

Joh_14:17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

Joh_16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

I guess that is how we know those who are of this world.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

I'm a Sabbath keeper. But I don't observe Sabbath because it's a commandment. I don't do so out of duty or a desire to be righteous and obedient. Can you think what reasons I might choose to observe Sabbath other than the law says so?

I pray that I will be a believer of the Sabbath of the LORD GOD because Jesus gave the People of God the Rest in God "on the Sabbath", from the first Seventh Day out of the Saving Hand of God, to the Sabbath of God's Saving his People when they came up from the Depths of the Sea, to the Last Passover of Jesus, when God Raised Him from the dead and grave "on", and "in" "the day which is after the Preparation ... before the First Day of the week ... THE SABBATH ... the third day" which The Truth, "said, He would rise again".

This is the only reason, I think, which, over and above that the Law says so, is more than enough reason that anyone <might choose to observe Sabbath>.

 

[Brakelite]

Seems so strange that something Jesus said was given to man as a gift, is described by so many of His professed people to be a burden.

 

[mjrhealth]

Do you need a command? Do you need a command to not murder your neighbor? OR would you happily do that if it weren't repeated in the NT?I would hardly think that were there case, so why do you demand others keep the commandment? As well as all the other requirements of the OT sanctuary laws and ceremonial accoutrements? I'm a Sabbath keeper. But I don't observe Sabbath because it's a commandment. I don't do so out of duty or a desire to be righteous and obedient. Can you think what reasons I might choose to observe Sabbath other than the law says so?

No because it does nothing for anyone. Adds nothing to and takes nothing from, as the bible says,

Col_2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
Col 2:17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

So no cannot see any reason at all.

I drink water everyday because with out it I will die, same with breathing, not keeping the sabbath doesnt do anything for anyone.

Bit like Jesus

Joh_6:33 For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world.
Joh_6:35 And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.
Joh_6:48 I am that bread of life.
Joh_6:51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.

I have need of Him everyday, for without Him I will surely die, but the sabbath does nothing.

 

[Brakelite]

No because it does nothing for anyone. Adds nothing to and takes nothing from, as the bible says,

Col_2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
Col 2:17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

So no cannot see any reason at all.

I drink water everyday because with out it I will die, same with breathing, not keeping the sabbath doesnt do anything for anyone.

Bit like Jesus

Joh_6:33 For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world.
Joh_6:35 And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.
Joh_6:48 I am that bread of life.
Joh_6:51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.

I have need of Him everyday, for without Him I will surely die, but the sabbath does nothing.

How do you know?

 

[Brakelite]

No because it does nothing for anyone. Adds nothing to and takes nothing from, as the bible says,

Col_2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
Col 2:17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

So no cannot see any reason at all.

I drink water everyday because with out it I will die, same with breathing, not keeping the sabbath doesnt do anything for anyone.

Bit like Jesus

Joh_6:33 For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world.
Joh_6:35 And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.
Joh_6:48 I am that bread of life.
Joh_6:51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.

I have need of Him everyday, for without Him I will surely die, but the sabbath does nothing.

So what Jesus said was given for mankind as a gift, you say, nah, does nothing for anyone. You sure about that?

 

[mjrhealth]

So what Jesus said was given for mankind as a gift, you say, nah, does nothing for anyone. You sure about that?

Himself, yes we rest in Him, are you sure its just not Pride,Jesus never gave us the sabbath, neither did God, God gave the sabbath to the Israelites as,

Exo_31:16 Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a perpetual covenant.

dont see the gentiles Greeks mentioned in that, and are we not under the"new" covenant.

You know teh story, if it doesnt do anything than why do you get so mad, I dont keep it doesnt benefit me none so should it matter, does it matter if some choose sunday, or even monday or every day for God, does it matter??

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

Joh_14:17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

Joh_16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

I guess that is how we know those who are of this world.

I think that is how Jesus meant we shall know if it is the Holy Spirit of God or not, because HE, "shall not speak of Himself; but whatsoever He shall hear" THE WORD OF GOD speaks. "He shall witness of ME" THE WORD OF GOD.

 

[mjrhealth]

I think that is how Jesus meant we shall know if it is the Holy Spirit of God or not, because HE, "shall not speak of Himself; but whatsoever He shall hear" THE WORD OF GOD speaks. "He shall witness of ME" THE WORD OF GOD.

Yes Jesus the word of God who am in the flesh, You know that Bit, The word I speak they are spirit and they are life, I have never heard the bible speak, have you.

Joh 5:39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.
Joh 5:40 And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life.

And they dont You know that Golden Calf the Israelites worshiped because they couldnt wait for God to speak, that one

 

[Brakelite]

1Cor 16:2 On one of the sabbaths, let each of you put by himself, storing up whatever he is prospered, that there not be collections then when I come. That is the literal interpretation.

I cannot find any translation or version suggesting that the collection is to be set aside on Sabbath. Each one I found said first day of the week... Sunday... First day....Not Sabbath...7th day.

 

[FHII]

1Cor 16:2 On one of the sabbaths,

It's only one way it can be literally translated. Each word can have similar alternative meanings. "One" is "Mia" in Greek. Mia can also be translated to mean "first". "Sabbaton" is Greek for "Day of the week". It can be translated to "Sabbath", "Sabbath's" but also to mean, "the intraval between two Sabbath's": in other words "week".

Thus, "Mia sabbaton" actually can be translated properly to "first day of the week". It could be translated to "one of the sabbaths", as you pointed out, but it would be an improper translation.

Which is the proper translation? Context must be applied to figure it out. Paul is speaking of collecting money. He wants it done before he or his helper gets there so they won't have to gather before hand. The way you are translating it means they could pick one Sabbath... Any one of their choice... To do it. That would be totally inefficient and it's not setting aside "as they have prospered". Since they didn't know when Paul or his servant was coming, it makes more sense to set aside weekly.

In respect to this verse, you could make other points which are stronger. For example, he wasn't directly calling for them to worship on Sunday, only to set aside an offering. But as for the translation... "Upon the first day of the week" is the proper translation.

Act 2:46 And continuing steadfastly with one mind day by day in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, they shared food in gladness and simplicity of heart...

Oh ok... So they went to the Temple day by day and had dinner and fellowship from house to house. Yea... Good point.