101G
Well-Known Member
thanks for the reply, so are you saying that there is no distinction between the three persons?
PICJAG.
Why the trinity?
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PICJAG.
They are three in one true God.
God can be in multiple places at one time. As born again Christians the Holy Spirit is living in multiple members of the Body of Christ, therefore being in multiple places at one time.
Jesus may have died on the Cross, but His Father form and Spirit form were still living and Jesus was resurrected on the third day.
101G
Well-Known Member
thanks but this is not what i asked, "is there no distinction between the three persons?", since you say all three wear the title "LORD".
so my question still stand to be answered.
PICJAG.
In three different forms there is a distinction, yet, all three are the same God.
Jesus Christ was sent into this world as God in human form, the Father was still in Heaven and is also God, the Holy Spirit was sent to each of us born again Christians as God in Holy Spirit form, the Helper.
101G
Well-Known Member
ok good, so you're saying then there is distinction.... correct? ok, thanks
now taking the title "LORD", which you say all have, Isaiah 44:24 "Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I am the LORD that maketh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself;"
now this, John 1:1 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."
John 1:2 "The same was in the beginning with God."
John 1:3 "All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made."
ok Josho, is this the same LORD, and or the same person here in John 1:3 as in Isaiah 44:24? yes or no?
PICJAG.
101G
Well-Known Member
101G
Well-Known Member
Thank you, is not the One who is in John 1:3 is the one you call son? yes or no?
PICJAG.
Where are you going with this? What's your position on this topic? I thought you believed in the Trinity too?
101G
Well-Known Member
Where I'm going with this is where the bible leads. and my Position on this topic is that there is only "ONE" God who "shared"/ or Diversified himself in flesh. and no I don't believe in three separate persons in the Godhead, meaning I don't believe in any Trinity. I'm a "diversified oneness".
now your honesty is a good report from you, for this is the same person who made all things, JESUS.
now my position is clear, God is one person "SHARED". Jesus is the Father, (the Holy Ghost/Spirit), and Jesus, he is the Son, (the Holy Ghost/Spirit SHARED "equally in flesh)
we all agree that it is ONE GOD, but where we disagree is three separate person vs ONE person "SHARED, and that ONE person is the Holy Ghost, JESUS himself.
the only thing separating us is "Shared" vs "Seperation" of Person. that's all. I believe in One God, so do you, but I believe that this ONE God is the equal "Share" of himself in flesh. that;s the sticking point.
see as you said the person in Isaiah 44:24 is the same person in John 1:3. but the REVELATION is this. in Isaiah 44:24 the person there said that he was "ALONE", and "BY HIMSELF". so if there was a second or third person he could not be alone, for God is everywhere. see the problem of two other separate persons? the bible clearly say no to any three persons.
lastley, titles are not PERSONS, the title "Father" is the same Person as he who holds the title the Son......... The Holy Spirit. (you proved that by the Isaiah 44:24 and John 1:3) scriptures. see where the trinity puts the Holy Spirit? last, well he is First and only......... in a shared stated of "diversity".
this is my point, God is the "equal" SHARE of himself in flesh, meanin God is only ONE person.
PICJAG.
Thanks for sharing your viewpoint. I agree all three are equal.
It is like how God can be at multiple places at one time.
I cannot see why any Christian wants to disagree about any of the three being God.
Father, Son and Holy Spirit are the same God.
101G
Well-Known Member
thanks for the reply, but when we see "Father", "Son", and "Holy Ghost", we in our minds see three, but not understand it's only one who is shared. understand this, "knowing" and "Understanding" a thing are two different animals. our eyes see 3 but it's only one.
I use to be a trinitarian because I was taught to see 3, but there was verses in the bible that was not adding up to three. in my younger days I just put it off until I could not put it off any longer. all scripture must homogenize with each other, and many in my first belief was not doing that. so I went to God and was strip down to nothing and had to start all over from scratch, and Oh what a difference did it make, not only in my knowledge, but in my personal LIFE. what I was taught was incorrect, and I blame no one but ME. no, my teachers only taught what they was taught, and what their teachers was taught and no one STOP to see if what they was teaching lined up with what the bible was teaching. so I had to RE-NEW my MIND, just as the bible states. and no, it was not easy, but the Lord Jesus had mercy on me and stayed with me until I got a good working knowledge of what he taught, "Diversified Oneness". and when I learned it, the bible just open up, and became understandable. and now I see "diversity" from Genesis to Revelation, and all in between. but one must be willing to have their eyes open and their minds re-newed by God. and when they do oh what newness of LIFE is such a joy, meaning in knowing the truth.
so, my Joy now is to speak what God has revealed to me. I see what the apostles saw, what the early church father saw and the early church disciples saw.
with "Diversified Oneness", all those so-called hard question that men claim are hard to understand, it's so easy now to understand and REVEAL them.
so with diversified oneness I now KNOW how God can be in Heaven and at the sane time on earth in flesh, or how he "alone" made man in his own image of "ONENESS". it's all right there in the bible in plain sight, but the devil has blinded people with their own sight of the eyes.
but the time will come when this knowledge of "diversified oneness" will open many christian minds. only time will tell.
PICJAG.
A good question. The Father is all in all God, who has three forms, Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
The Holy Spirit is God's communion with us, who makes us who we are, whose purpose is the bring us to the Father and teach us. The trinity is the Father, God, the whole. Jesus is the essence of the Father, His word in human form.
In a sense our worship is of the Father in Christ, the Father in the Holy Spirit. God is the focus of all eternal, forever. The tension is Jesus is God but not his full expression, and likewise the Holy Spirit. We worship God, the whole.
which side of the fence is it that you think is in error?
Trinity or No Trinity ?
quietthinker
Well-Known Member
I think it is more helpful to understand the role of Jesus's incarnation and how he relates to his Father......the role of God's Spirit will then come into perspective.
This is what surfaces.....the Father defers to the Son ('this is my beloved Son, listen to him')....the Son defers to the Father ('the Father is greater than I')....God's Spirit defers to the Son (when the Spirit of Truth is come he will testify of me') ...because the Son is the visible/approachable reality of God.
Be careful how you hear.
We are assigned to worship God THROUGH Jesus.
Nobody comes to the Father but by him.
Never go to court in heaven without your defense attorney.
Never bypass Jesus in any way to get to his God.
As a matter of fact, every bit of what God consists of is inside the omnipresent spirit body of Jesus now, so going around him is impossible.
God is our God and Father THROUGH Jesus now.
101G
Well-Known Member
GINOLJC, to all.
I am glad and encourage that many of christians here on the site are asking questions, and that's a good thing. one of the Last questions that was asked was this one which is a good one. "God was in Christ reconciling the world unto Himself (2 Corinthians 5:19)".
many say the TERM "God" here, who is a Spirit, is in reference to the "Father". but one forgets one thing, John 1:14 "And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth."
question time, is not the Word God himself? for John 1:1 states "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." if the word is God then do we have two Gods? no. here many equate the Word with the "Son". so how is the Son "Made flesh", who is God according to John 1:1c and yet, it was God in Christ reconciling the world unto Himself. did a third of God become flesh? see the problem now?
well many would say see 101G, that's have to be two separate and distinct Persons. Good question, but also if the Word is a separate and distinct person who is God then you have two separate and distinct Gods, or one would have some of God or all of God in that flesh. but one might say well 101G, no it's just one God and two separate and distinct persons here. then my question is, if these two are separate persons how is the Son the make of all thing, and the Father is the maker of all things? there is not two makers. and on top of that the one who now many say is the same person in John 1:3 and isaiah 44:24 who made all things is the same person. (which is true), but now we have a big problem, for the same one persons said in Isaiah 44:24 that he was alone and by himself when he Made all things. now that puts a crimp in the two and separate person theory. well again one might say well their titles are interchangable. if so, then all the distinction goes out the window, as well as any seperatation. for if their titles are interchangable, then there is no distinction, which means there is no separation.
so what's the answer to this dilemma? have you consider that God who is One person "SHARED" himself in Flesh? this would answer all the trinity doctrine question without the added baggage of separation of persons and distinction of persons, which the believers of such doctrine run into all the time, and wined up in more confusion and more mystery. God is not the author of Confusion. when trinitarians run into such verse as here in 2 Corinthians 5:19, and John 1:1 and Revelation 1:4 & 5 just to name a few they are confused. but to know and UNDERSTAND that and who God is, meaning that he is only a single person who shared himself in flesh is the Game changer to knowing the truth. I struggle with those same dilemmas until I surrendered to the truth and all those mysteries, and confusions, and so called hard question vanish into thin air when I was taught by God himself the correct doctrine based on truth.
now I have no confusion about the scriptures, no mysteries about God, and the Godhead, nor any hard questions to understand. I have now only complete peace and full assurance in what I was taught by God.
it took only one thing. I gave up the ball and chain of being ignorant and in darkness. for to be made FREE IS freedom INDEED. for Life and peace in FOUND IN Christ Jesus.
PICJAG.
I am glad and encourage that many of christians here on the site are asking questions, and that's a good thing. one of the Last questions that was asked was this one which is a good one. "God was in Christ reconciling the world unto Himself (2 Corinthians 5:19)".
many say the TERM "God" here, who is a Spirit, is in reference to the "Father". but one forgets one thing, John 1:14 "And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth."
question time, is not the Word God himself? for John 1:1 states "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." if the word is God then do we have two Gods? no. here many equate the Word with the "Son". so how is the Son "Made flesh", who is God according to John 1:1c and yet, it was God in Christ reconciling the world unto Himself. did a third of God become flesh? see the problem now?
well many would say see 101G, that's have to be two separate and distinct Persons. Good question, but also if the Word is a separate and distinct person who is God then you have two separate and distinct Gods, or one would have some of God or all of God in that flesh. but one might say well 101G, no it's just one God and two separate and distinct persons here. then my question is, if these two are separate persons how is the Son the make of all thing, and the Father is the maker of all things? there is not two makers. and on top of that the one who now many say is the same person in John 1:3 and isaiah 44:24 who made all things is the same person. (which is true), but now we have a big problem, for the same one persons said in Isaiah 44:24 that he was alone and by himself when he Made all things. now that puts a crimp in the two and separate person theory. well again one might say well their titles are interchangable. if so, then all the distinction goes out the window, as well as any seperatation. for if their titles are interchangable, then there is no distinction, which means there is no separation.
so what's the answer to this dilemma? have you consider that God who is One person "SHARED" himself in Flesh? this would answer all the trinity doctrine question without the added baggage of separation of persons and distinction of persons, which the believers of such doctrine run into all the time, and wined up in more confusion and more mystery. God is not the author of Confusion. when trinitarians run into such verse as here in 2 Corinthians 5:19, and John 1:1 and Revelation 1:4 & 5 just to name a few they are confused. but to know and UNDERSTAND that and who God is, meaning that he is only a single person who shared himself in flesh is the Game changer to knowing the truth. I struggle with those same dilemmas until I surrendered to the truth and all those mysteries, and confusions, and so called hard question vanish into thin air when I was taught by God himself the correct doctrine based on truth.
now I have no confusion about the scriptures, no mysteries about God, and the Godhead, nor any hard questions to understand. I have now only complete peace and full assurance in what I was taught by God.
it took only one thing. I gave up the ball and chain of being ignorant and in darkness. for to be made FREE IS freedom INDEED. for Life and peace in FOUND IN Christ Jesus.
PICJAG.
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