Marymog
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- Mar 7, 2017
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Thank you. The title of this discussion is: Contradiction Or Paradox?
I believe it better fits the contradiction category. Do you?
Contradiction Or Paradox?
- Thread starter BarneyFife
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I believe it better fits the contradiction category. Do you?
Hi Mary,
While Jesus may have been calling Peter "satan", He may have just the same been calling Peter the Adversary, as that is what the word means. It would still be with a sting, but not necessarily calling Peter the devil.
Much love!
I don't think God will ever act contrary to His Own nature.
It's like saying, can the sun freeze? Except more so.
Much love!
Grailhunter
Well-Known Member
Grailhunter
Well-Known Member
lol Just a joke....sorry.
As you probably know back during the Ecumenical Counsels they pondered the nature and substance of God. It is the folly of fools, but back then people died over it.
Another topic: Our knowledge of good and evil is primitive compared to what God knows, God understands, what God does. I submit that whatever Christ did or what He will do in the future is "right." But what is wrong for us, is to "judge" the actions. God cannot transgress against Himself. But then again there is no Mosaic Law or Christian belief that restricts Him. At the level that we understand we can only know what He will do, is right. So the question itself if Christ sinned, demonstrates a lack of understanding.
Hi @Grailhunter,
I read this morning something which caught my eye concerning God's nature. It was that God is Christ-like, for Christ is God manifest in the flesh isn't He? Which reminds me of the conversation that our Lord had with Philip in John 14, for in verse 9 we read:-
'Jesus saith unto him,
Have I been so long time with you,
and yet hast thou not known me, Philip?
he that hath seen me hath seen the Father;
and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?'
Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris
'For whatsoever things were written aforetime
were written for our learning,
that we through patience and comfort of the scriptures might have hope.
Now the God of patience and consolation grant you to be likeminded
one toward another according to Christ Jesus:
That ye may with one mind and one mouth glorify God,
even the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.
Wherefore receive ye one another,
as Christ also received us to the glory of God.'
(Romans 15:4)
were written for our learning,
that we through patience and comfort of the scriptures might have hope.
Now the God of patience and consolation grant you to be likeminded
one toward another according to Christ Jesus:
That ye may with one mind and one mouth glorify God,
even the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.
Wherefore receive ye one another,
as Christ also received us to the glory of God.'
(Romans 15:4)
Rocky Wiley
Active Member
Do you know there were many fake Jews, those that called themselves Jews that were not.
Joh 8:33 They answered him, We be Abraham's seed, and were never in bondage to any man: how sayest thou, Ye shall be made free?
They were of Abraham and Esau. Esau married women that he was told not to do. That was because they were of their father the devil. Therefore Esau's children were also of the Devil. When the Jews were captured and taken out of their country they intermarried with the locals who were the children of the devil. When the temple was rebuilt is was by real Jews and those that begin to call themselves Jews and became scribes and Pharisees.
Joh 8:42 Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.
Joh 8:43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.
Joh 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
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ChristisGod
Well-Known Member
jbf has made a false claim and is in direct contradiction to Jesus teaching on the Sabbath since He is LORD of the Sabbath and He is the One who defines work and what that entails.
Work is defined as what a person does for a living 6 days a week, how he labors and earns a living in providing for his household. Serving God and doing His work on the Sabbath is not " work" that is forbidden in the commandment. Scripture says there are those who work on the Sabbath as in the priests and the high priest. They are doing Gods work, serving Him, obeying Him, worshiping Him on that day.
If is was a sin to do any work for the Lord on the Sabbath then we could not have anyone preach/teach, pastor the flock on the Sabbath since it would be " work " as that is their vocation.
Its pure RUBBISH and the reason why Jesus rebuked the Pharisees and healed and ;picked grain on the Sabbath because it was not work but honoring to God, serving God, worshiping God to do what Jesus was doing.
If Jesus is "guilty " of breaking the letter of the law as @justbyfaith falsely claims then so is the Father guilty of breaking the letter of the law. For Jesus only said in did what He saw the Father saying and doing as per John 5.
hope this helps !!!
Work is defined as what a person does for a living 6 days a week, how he labors and earns a living in providing for his household. Serving God and doing His work on the Sabbath is not " work" that is forbidden in the commandment. Scripture says there are those who work on the Sabbath as in the priests and the high priest. They are doing Gods work, serving Him, obeying Him, worshiping Him on that day.
If is was a sin to do any work for the Lord on the Sabbath then we could not have anyone preach/teach, pastor the flock on the Sabbath since it would be " work " as that is their vocation.
Its pure RUBBISH and the reason why Jesus rebuked the Pharisees and healed and ;picked grain on the Sabbath because it was not work but honoring to God, serving God, worshiping God to do what Jesus was doing.
If Jesus is "guilty " of breaking the letter of the law as @justbyfaith falsely claims then so is the Father guilty of breaking the letter of the law. For Jesus only said in did what He saw the Father saying and doing as per John 5.
hope this helps !!!
John admitted that Jesus broke the Law.
John showed Jesus working on the sabbath, telling the disciples to go pick corn and telling the healed man to carry his bed home, which was strictly forbidden in the 10 commandments.
Maybe the Law giver was able to change it per Hebrews 7?...
12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.
I thought Christ came to magnify the law (Isaiah 42:21) and fulfill it (Matthew 5:17).
I don't understand all the resistance against keeping God's appointed (Hebrews 4:4) day of rest. The ever-growing number of theories designed to minimize it are also puzzling.
Am I to understand that God never intended His people to keep the liberal Sabbath from the beginning of time? I thought He kept it Himself in the beginning.
Genesis 2
2And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made. 3And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.
For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it. (Exodus 20:11)
2And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made. 3And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.
For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it. (Exodus 20:11)
And if man was not made to keep the Sabbath, why was it declared to have been made for him?
And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath: (Mark 2:27)
The Sabbath came after man was created and before sin entered the world.
It is often claimed that Sabbath-keepers place too much emphasis on the Sabbath. But it seems to me that for every defense of the Sabbath, there is a seven-fold decrying of it.
I was not raised keeping the true Sabbath. But when I was informed about its significance and beauty, so far from the burden it is thought to be, I found it to be a refreshing, liberating institution. The idea that God will bless and facilitate its keeping, which is liberating and refreshing, is still a great wonder to me. To be able to come apart, and enter an abundant temporal and spiritual rest in Christ seems anything but disagreeable. It is like rich icing on an already grace-filled cake.
And while it can be made burdensome (and is by many) this was foretold and remedied with promise in Isaiah 58:
13“If you keep your feet from breaking the Sabbath
and from doing as you please on my holy day,
if you call the Sabbath a delight
and the Lord’s holy day honorable,
and if you honor it by not going your own way
and not doing as you please or speaking idle words,
14then you will find your joy in the Lord,
and I will cause you to ride in triumph on the heights of the land
and to feast on the inheritance of your father Jacob.”
and from doing as you please on my holy day,
if you call the Sabbath a delight
and the Lord’s holy day honorable,
and if you honor it by not going your own way
and not doing as you please or speaking idle words,
14then you will find your joy in the Lord,
and I will cause you to ride in triumph on the heights of the land
and to feast on the inheritance of your father Jacob.”
The mouth of the Lord has spoken.
ChristisGod
Well-Known Member
Pure fabrication on your part as that is NOT what John said. Its what Jesus was falsely accused of by the religious Pharisees. Hence Jesus said they hated Me without a cause in fulfillment of prophecy.
You are twisting scripture and are just as guilty as jbf with your HERETICAL view of Jesus and the Sabbath law regarding work and its true meaning.
hope this helps !!!
John said this...
18 Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God.
10 The Jews therefore said unto him that was cured, It is the sabbath day: it is not lawful for thee to carry thy bed.
11 He answered them, He that made me whole, the same said unto me, Take up thy bed, and walk....
8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the Lord thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
11 He answered them, He that made me whole, the same said unto me, Take up thy bed, and walk....
8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the Lord thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
ChristisGod
Well-Known Member
14 Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore; for it is holy unto you: every one that defileth it shall surely be put to death: for whosoever doeth any work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people.
15 Six days may work be done; but in the seventh is the sabbath of rest, holy to the Lord: whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.
16 Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a perpetual covenant.
15 Six days may work be done; but in the seventh is the sabbath of rest, holy to the Lord: whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.
16 Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a perpetual covenant.
ChristisGod
Well-Known Member
and you do not know the meaning of the word work........................
next................................................................
were the priests working in the tabernacle considered work ?
if so then God made them violate the sabbath by making them " work " in the temple.
next..............................................
you have very poor hermenuetics and make the bible CONTRADICT itself.
next................................................................
were the priests working in the tabernacle considered work ?
if so then God made them violate the sabbath by making them " work " in the temple.
next..............................................
you have very poor hermenuetics and make the bible CONTRADICT itself.
Show me where he quoted the accusers?
Also, is carrying your bed across town, work?
Did John agree with this statement he made?...
18 Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God.
18 Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God.
Within the commandment itself, "work" is narrowly defined. But a study of the Levitical laws reveals that either priestly work on the Sabbath is acceptable or excused (which has far-reaching implications summed up in the declaration of Christ that is lawful to do good on the Sabbath--Matthew 12:12), or that the priests indeed violated or profaned the Sabbath with their duties. Frankly, I believe Christ was speaking rhetorically when He said this. I think He perceived that suggesting such a thing would cause them to consider the matter more carefully than they otherwise would. I don't believe He actually thought David broke the law, either, by taking of the shewbread. The Lord has always preferred the keeping of the spirit of the law above the letter. Principle must always be upheld, even when policy cannot be.
O that there were such an heart in them, that they would fear me, and keep all my commandments always, that it might be well with them, and with their children for ever! (Deuteronomy 5:29)
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