Temporal Lobe Epilepsy

[aspen]

I've worked with folks with head injuries for 20 years and have research many common problems associated with trauma to the brain. One these conditions results from damage to the second sulcus of the left temporal lobe, which is located right above your left ear. The damage can be caused by blunt trauma, stroke, or epilepsy and usually results in Broca's aphasia - a language problem. Like all people with brain injury, fatigue is common.

One of the more perculiar and rare symptoms includes a god complex, prophet complex or a special religious fixation. Mary Baker Eddy - the founder of Christian science suffered from a form of epilepsy that fits the symptoms of temporal lobe epilepsy. The prophetess of Seventh Day Adventists, Ellen White received a mass head injury from being hit with rocks from school mates on her way home from school - soon after a 6 to 8 month recovery, she began having visions form God and writing her prophecies. I suspect Jim Jones might have suffered from this condition based on the story of his life and conversion from a social-activist minister to infamous cult leader - of course his drug use needs to be taken into consideration, but it may have simply given him the energy to carry out his god complex.

All though this condition is somewhat rare, I have treated 2 patients who believed they were special agents of God, who also have damage to their left temporal lobe. Both patients behaved normally, but complained of blinding headaches, which they associated with visions from God, yet produced information that seemed foreign to all religions I am aware of, but rooted in pseudo-Biblical scholarship.

Unlike schizophrenia and other thought disorders, patients with this type of damage to their brains have organized thoughts - they appear rational and many have a certain charisma about them. People of character before their injury still retain their character, but take on a belief that they have been chosen by God to impart a special message to humanity. Like people with thought disorders, many have a manifesto that they have written that they want the world to see - but following the pattern, their manifestos appear rational and convincing.

I bring this information to you all because I think it is interesting, but also as a possible discernment tool - for example, it is always in the back of my mind when I read mystic literature or encounter strange doctrine or ideas that appear rational and well researched, yet fall outside the bounds of orthodoxy. Anyway, I do not mind discussing this further if anyone is interested.

 

[bud02]

I bring this information to you all because I think it is interesting, but also as a possible discernment tool - for example, it is always in the back of my mind when I read mystic literature or encounter strange doctrine or ideas that appear rational and well researched, yet fall outside the bounds of orthodoxy. Anyway, I do not mind discussing this further if anyone is interested.

Its an interesting topic, and first hand information is always valuable. I see things like drugs both legal and illegal also have a profound impact on peoples spirituality, people exhibit the very same mannerism under the influence you point out. So in a nut shell I don't believe damage or trauma is directly addressing this phenomena but are simply rare cases of a much more observable condition " pharmakeia " Does it always result in apostasy? I don't believe so. We are all imperfect men, the Lord works threw this imperfection, the only true complete man was Jesus in whom we are confident every word that proceeded from Him was true. Which leads to a question. In the back of my mind when I read from a self proclaimed catholic " the bounds of orthodoxy " are you referring to the catholic definition of orthodoxy?

http://www.newadvent...then/11330a.htm
Orthodoxy (orthodoxeia) signifies right belief or purity of faith. Right belief is not merely subjective, as resting on personal knowledge and convictions, but is in accordance with the teaching and direction of an absolute extrinsic authority. This authority is the Church founded by Christ, and guided by the Holy Ghost. He, therefore, is orthodox, whose faith coincides with the teachings of the Catholic Church. As divine revelation forms the deposit of faith entrusted to the Church for man's salvation, it also, with the truths clearly deduced from it, forms the object and content of orthodoxy.

Although the term orthodox or orthodoxy does not occur in the Scriptures, its meaning is repeatedly insisted on. end quote
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The very word itself implies men following men. Is that the fullness of the NT message? Mt 15:14-16 . If it is I assure you, you will be disappointed. Rev 3:20
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orthodox [ˈɔːθəˌdɒks]adj1. conforming with established or accepted standards, as in religion, behaviour, or attitudes2. (Christianity / Ecclesiastical Terms) conforming to the Christian faith as established by the early Church[via Church Latin from Greek orthodoxos, from orthos correct + doxa belief]orthodoxly adv

Orthodox [ˈɔːθəˌdɒks]adj1. (Christianity / Eastern Church (Greek & Russian Orthodox)) of or relating to the Orthodox Church of the East2. (Non-Christian Religions / Judaism) (sometimes not capital)a. of or relating to Orthodox Judaismb. (of an individual Jew) strict in the observance of Talmudic law and in personal devotions

 

[aspen]

Its an interesting topic, and first hand information is always valuable. I see things like drugs both legal and illegal also have a profound impact on peoples spirituality, people exhibit the very same mannerism under the influence you point out. So in a nut shell I don't believe damage or trauma is directly addressing this phenomena but are simply rare cases of a much more observable condition " pharmakeia " Does it always result in apostasy? I don't believe so. We are all imperfect men, the Lord works threw this imperfection, the only true complete man was Jesus in whom we are confident every word that proceeded from Him was true. Which leads to a question. In the back of my mind when I read from a self proclaimed catholic " the bounds of orthodoxy " are you referring to the catholic definition of orthodoxy?

http://www.newadvent...then/11330a.htm
Orthodoxy (orthodoxeia) signifies right belief or purity of faith. Right belief is not merely subjective, as resting on personal knowledge and convictions, but is in accordance with the teaching and direction of an absolute extrinsic authority. This authority is the Church founded by Christ, and guided by the Holy Ghost. He, therefore, is orthodox, whose faith coincides with the teachings of the Catholic Church. As divine revelation forms the deposit of faith entrusted to the Church for man's salvation, it also, with the truths clearly deduced from it, forms the object and content of orthodoxy.

Although the term orthodox or orthodoxy does not occur in the Scriptures, its meaning is repeatedly insisted on. end quote
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The very word itself implies men following men. Is that the fullness of the NT message? Mt 15:14-16 . If it is I assure you, you will be disappointed. Rev 3:20
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
orthodox [ˈɔːθəˌdɒks]adj1. conforming with established or accepted standards, as in religion, behaviour, or attitudes2. (Christianity / Ecclesiastical Terms) conforming to the Christian faith as established by the early Church[via Church Latin from Greek orthodoxos, from orthos correct + doxa belief]orthodoxly adv

Orthodox [ˈɔːθəˌdɒks]adj1. (Christianity / Eastern Church (Greek & Russian Orthodox)) of or relating to the Orthodox Church of the East2. (Non-Christian Religions / Judaism) (sometimes not capital)a. of or relating to Orthodox Judaismb. (of an individual Jew) strict in the observance of Talmudic law and in personal devotions

Bud2

This could easily get into a Catholic vs. Protestant thread - I am hoping to keep it on track. However, if you really are interested in discussing similarities and differences between Catholics and Protestants, I am perfectly capable and willing to present the Catholic side of things, but only with the permission of of the admin. If this is something you want to pursue - start a thread and get Hammerstone's approval and I will certainly engage you in conversation, dialog, or debate.

As far as the topic goes, you are right about the difficulty of diagnosis based on looking at symptoms alone. However, there are tell tale signs that suggest head injury - the rational presentation is one, fatigue is another, and physical presentation may also give clues - specifically, the presence of s[font="arial][size="2"]pasticity[/size][/font] or hemiplegia, In any case, it is not the impaired person that is necessarily at risk of Hell, but their follower that may be lead astray.

 

[bud02]

I'll take that as a yes.
I think I've said before a faith unworthy of mention for fear of reprisals is surly not worth mention or knowing.

The reason for the question should be obvious, how do you divide the word of God?
You have answered that question, He, therefore, is orthodox, whose faith coincides with the teachings of the Catholic Church.
Now you and I both know you don't teach the catholic doctrine openly.
Sooo I have no desire to continue the dialog if nothing can be accomplished, or to the point the Lord be manifest. Even though you keep your true beliefs hidden our dialog will go no where simply because I don't find the catholic teaching true. Now I've just saved us a disagreement, an argument, and come straight to the point. Your a counselor you should learn to do the same.

 

[aspen]

I'll take that as a yes.
I think I've said before a faith unworthy of mention for fear of reprisals is surly not worth mention or knowing.

The reason for the question should be obvious, how do you divide the word of God?
You have answered that question, He, therefore, is orthodox, whose faith coincides with the teachings of the Catholic Church.
Now you and I both know you don't teach the catholic doctrine openly.
Sooo I have no desire to continue the dialog if nothing can be accomplished, or to the point the Lord be manifest. Even though you keep your true beliefs hidden our dialog will go no where simply because I don't find the catholic teaching true. Now I've just saved us a disagreement, an argument, and come straight to the point. Your a counselor you should learn to do the same.

I told you my conditions - they are reasonable. I would not invite you to a Catholic site that did not allow debate and try goading you into one. Implying that the worthiness of the doctrine of my church is based on whether or not I choose to engage in conversation that breaks the rules of this site is childish, If you are serious about a debate you know what you need to do. This is the last time I will speak about this,

 

[bud02]

I told you my conditions - they are reasonable. I would not invite you to a Catholic site that did not allow debate and try goading you into one. Implying that the worthiness of the doctrine of my church is based on whether or not I choose to engage in conversation that breaks the rules of this site is childish, If you are serious about a debate you know what you need to do. This is the last time I will speak about this,

I don't interpret the conditions you quote as silencing religious beliefs.
Denominational Posts – Excessive posts either attempting to either push a single denomination (or group) or attacking another denomination are included in this rule.

As I pointed out above I want an honest dialog that represents your belief. You hide behind this rule to avoid professing your faith. I'll give you an example. From the christian dress forum.

Religusnut is right about this issue - the verse is about restrictions on dressing in drag. On the scale of 1 to 10 of major spiritual issues - 1 being a minor issue and 10 being critical - this is a 1.

On a side note, I am totally in favor of school uniforms for all children and adolescents. We spend millions of dollars on the latest styles for our kids to dress up (actually to dress down - they show more flesh every year) only to our societies' determent - intercity gang expression right do to mean, economic class division.


I sure wish the Bible mentioned the evil of sexualizing and profiting off our children just to fuel the marketplace.

Then Jarbreaker called you out on your statement.

"1 being a minor issue and 10 being critical "

There is no "sliding scale" for sin!

Now, you personally may feel this way --- this thought is not scriptural.

Now we both know this sliding scale is not your personal opinion. Its what you are taught by those you think hold the truth.
Does mortal or venial sin ring a bell.
How about I post the heading found under moral and venial sins from the catholic encyclopedia.

Nature of sin
Division of sin
Material and formal sin
Internal sin
The capital sins or vices
Moral sin
And lo and behold next we find ---- Biblical description of sin
systems which deny sin or distort its true notion
Protestant errors
Philosophical sin
Conditions of mortal sin
Imputability
Malice

Effects
Venial sin does not deprive the soul of sanctifying grace, or diminish it. It does not produce a macula, or stain, as does mortal sin, but it lessens the lustre of virtue — "In anima duplex est nitor, unus quiden habitualis, ex gratia sanctificante, alter actualis ex actibus virtutem, jamvero peccatum veniale impedit quidem fulgorem qui ex actibus virtutum oritur, non autem habitualem nitorem, quia non excludit nec minuit habitum charitatis" (I-II:89:1). Frequent and deliberate venial sin lessens the fervour of charity, disposes to mortal sin (I-II:88:3), and hinders the reception of graces God would otherwise give. It displeases God (Revelation 2:4-5) and obliges the sinner to temporal punishment either in this life or in Purgatory. We cannot avoid all venial sin

I do think Jar breaker is speaking of Gods definition of sin. Above thats your sliding scale from 1 to 10. Your just being plan dishonest about your faith. If thats what you believe say so. NOTE This is not an attack its stating the facts about your faith. Something you seem to be incapable of doing.

Oh brother......

You really think I was rating sin?

If you want to be useful go feed the hungry and stop sitting around judging hypothetical women......gimme a break

 

[religusnut]

Aspen I too work with people as a volunteer counselor pretty often. I am seeing some very interesting results as well. I assure you that nothing I teach or apply would fit in any of your terms of Orthodoxy. I learned a long time ago that if it works forget how orthodox/unorthodox it is.

Last week I had a session with a young man that is 20 years old. 3 years ago he had an abscess of some sort happen in his brain. He was partially paralyzed on his left side. He physically looked like a stroke victim. This week when I talked to him he was walking much better and was actually able to go out and shoot basket ball.

I have seen people suffering from severe migraine headaches received tremendous relief. One group that I have studied with sees 90+% success rate in counseling with ladies with fibromyalgia.

What we teach and do is not orthodox but it works. Almost always through counseling and prayer.

 

[aspen]

Aspen I too work with people as a volunteer counselor pretty often. I am seeing some very interesting results as well. I assure you that nothing I teach or apply would fit in any of your terms of Orthodoxy. I learned a long time ago that if it works forget how orthodox/unorthodox it is.

Last week I had a session with a young man that is 20 years old. 3 years ago he had an abscess of some sort happen in his brain. He was partially paralyzed on his left side. He physically looked like a stroke victim. This week when I talked to him he was walking much better and was actually able to go out and shoot basket ball.

I have seen people suffering from severe migraine headaches received tremendous relief. One group that I have studied with sees 90+% success rate in counseling with ladies with fibromyalgia.

What we teach and do is not orthodox but it works. Almost always through counseling and prayer.

I am a big believer in the plasticity of the brain - my sister recovered from a horrific accident and brain injury - God can work through all injuries. Also, the old belief that recovery has to happen in the first ten years has finally been thrown out the window. My sister is still making progress in executive functioning 30 years after the accident.