Was the Transfiguration a vision, or an actual appearance of Moses and Elijah?

marks said:

You can check this at Scripture4All.org. Great resource!

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I checked it out, but did not find what you mentioned….all I found was what you copied and pasted….can you link me to the information that discusses the point you mentioned…..please.

St. SteVen said:

No. I am fighting for Christians to wake up to real faith.

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I endeavor to do the same thing….

St. SteVen said:

There are genuine problems in the church. My topics attest to this.

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Could it be that the “church” system itself is the problem? Could it be that all those many denominations in Christendom all teach the same lies? Yet they all have irreconcilable differences. Does God produce division among his people…or unity? What should we expect to see? (1 Cor 1:10)

There is only one truth, so how does a person find the truth where it does not exist?

St. SteVen said:

--- PARODY ---

Person #1: Receive the free gift of eternal life.
Person #2: No thanks.
Person #1: I said it was free.
Person #2: There must be some strings attached.
Person #1: Well, of course.
Person #2: It's not a free gift then, right?
Person #1: You had better take it... or else!
Person #2: Say what?
Person #1: Otherwise you will be incinerated!
Person #2: What sort of free gift is that?

Indeed.

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If that was the reality, then why would anyone be attracted to this “Christianity”?
All the different “branches“ of this Christianity are all based on the same lies?
A trinity of gods, belief in immortal souls, and hellfire. None of these teachings exist in Scripture.

Was the gift really ever free? Did it have no cost at all? What did it cost the ones who provided it?

The “strings” attached are actually ‘conditions’ provided by the ones who wanted all to adhere to a standard of conduct to apply to everyone, so that no one would offend God or each other…..the very reason why God gave his laws to Israel…..one set of beliefs and one standard of conduct for all…..but these standards have to be willingly accepted, or you don’t have in your personality what God is looking for in a cohesive and peaceful people to do his will “on earth as it is in heaven”.

Was it ever offered on coercion of eternal torture….or was it offered on a take it or leave it basis?

The free gift is conditional because it keeps the selfish and insincere ones out of the offer…..they don’t want conditions.…but there is no selfishness permitted in God’s universal family. We do not operate independently without concern for God and for our fellow man. Free will is only free within the parameters that God stated.

If Adam had just accepted the terms of his gift of life, he could have secured for himself and all his progeny, a wonderful, eternal future, enjoying all that God provided free of charge….only asking for compliance with his wishes…which were always for our benefit.

Your parody is so twisted but then, so is most people’s “Christianity”….and the arguments never cease.
Jesus argued for the truth, but not many listened even to the son of God. So, “few” will be found on the road to life at the end of the day….(Matt 7:13-14) because humans do not change.
Will we be among them, surrendering our will to God’s?
He knows who is willing to do that, and he knows the ones who want things done “their way”.

We all have choices but they need to be made intelligently….not emotionally….and definitely not selfishly.

Lambano said:

A contradictory view is in Revelation 6:9-10:

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When you examine the context and the beliefs of the ones to whom these supposedly contradictory statements were made, you will see that the interpretation is contradictory, not the Scripture…..God’s word can never contradict itself.

Lambano said:

When the Lamb broke the fifth seal, I saw underneath the altar the souls of those who had been killed because of the word of God, and because of the testimony which they had maintained; 10 and they cried out with a loud voice, saying, “How long, O Lord, holy and true, will You refrain from judging and avenging our blood on those who live on the earth?”

Here the disembodied souls of the dead martyrs can talk, and they seem to be a bit pissed-off and want vengeance.

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This is figurative just as the verse in Genesis 4:4-11 is figurative of justice not being done.

When Cain murdered his brother…..”Jehovah said to Cain: “Where is your brother Abel?” and he said: “I do not know. Am I my brother’s guardian?” 10 At this He said: “What have you done? Listen! Your brother’s blood is crying out to me from the ground.”

It is injustice crying out to God, that this represents. All will answer to God for what they have done, because “each will give an accounting of himself to God” (Rom 4:12) Justice will be done.

Lambano said:

Then you have the Witch of En-dor (NASB calls her a medium, but for all we know, she was an extra-large) calling up the shade of Samuel in 1 Samuel 28:7-20.

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The witch of Endor was the only spirit medium left in the land as Saul, under God’s instruction, had evicted them. When the prophet Samuel died, it left Saul feeling vulnerable because he had lost God’s favor due to his own disobedience and then compounded it by seeking out a person whose practices God had forbidden in Israel. (Deut 18:9-12)

Only the woman saw the spirit and heard what it said….because the Jews had no belief in disembodied souls, but that notion was taking hold in Israel, so when the living prophets would not speak to Saul, he wanted to hear the words of the prophet he had always turned to, but since Samuel had died, in his desperation Saul allowed a spirit medium to conjugate up a demon impersonating the dead prophet.

Lambano said:

st. So, the Jewish people some kind of belief in ghosts and an afterlife and such, but it's vague and inconsistent.

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This belief permeates all false worship, even in Israel when their kings turned to false religious practices and beliefs….just like Christendom has done, following in her footsteps. History repeats because humans do not learn from the errors of the past, and are therefore doomed to repeat them.

Lambano said:

Paul's main goal in life was to attain the Resurrection from the dead. If he believed the soul lives on in a disembodied state, why would this be his goal?

10 I want to know Christ—yes, to know the power of his resurrection and participation in his sufferings, becoming like him in his death, 11 and so, somehow, attaining to the resurrection from the dead. - Philippians 3:10-11.

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Exactly…..what Paul looked forward to was the same as what all the other apostles and anointed ones looked forward to….
Dying in the flesh and being raised in the spirit as Jesus was. The Holy Spirit gave them that longing.

But according to Paul’s words in 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17…that was not to occur until the Lord returned.

”Moreover, brothers, we do not want you to be ignorant about those who are sleeping in death, so that you may not sorrow as the rest do who have no hope. 14 For if we have faith that Jesus died and rose again, so too God will bring with him those who have fallen asleep in death through Jesus. 15 For this is what we tell you by Jehovah’s word, that we the living who survive to the presence of the Lord will in no way precede those who have fallen asleep in death; 16 because the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a commanding call, with an archangel’s voice and with God’s trumpet, and those who are dead in union with Christ will rise first. 17 Afterward we the living who are surviving will, together with them, be caught away in clouds to meet the Lord in the air; and thus we will always be with the Lord.”

After “sleeping in death”, upon their resurrection, those who qualify for that “first resurrection” will be “kings and priests“ with their King Christ Jesus in heaven, (Rev 20:6) chosen to rule over redeemed mankind and to bring them back to God’s first purpose for this earth and all living things upon it. (Rev 21:2-4)

This is what the Lord’s Prayer is all about…..with the ‘coming’ of God’s Kingdom, God’s will can then “be done on earth as it is in heaven.“

God did not create the earth as a training ground for heaven…it was designed to be our permanent home.

Aunty Jane said:

When you examine the context and the beliefs of the ones to whom these supposedly contradictory statements were made, you will see that the interpretation is contradictory, not the Scripture…..God’s word can never contradict itself.

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I have not yet conceded that assumption. Assuming that Scripture presents a single, monolithic worldview blinds us to seeing what it actually DOES say.

Aunty Jane said:

...and to bring them back to God’s first purpose for this earth and all living things upon it. (Rev 21:2-4)

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Hey, @St. SteVen, now we're talking about the Great Restoration of all things. Softball, right down the middle!

... And he takes a weak hack at it and fouls off the pitch.

St. SteVen said:

I should discuss UR with Aunty Jane?

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Why wouldn't you? Just because she'll humiliate you in front of all these people?

St. SteVen said:

Pretty sure we're not on the same page.
In general I have learned to avoid discussion with her.
No end to the endless posts. Rather exhausting.
I'm satisfied that I know where she is coming from.
No need to beat a dead horse.

[

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Aunty Jane said:

I checked it out, but did not find what you mentioned….all I found was what you copied and pasted….can you link me to the information that discusses the point you mentioned…..please.

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You can do this.

ntgreek.org

Much love!

LuxMundi said:

The verse says "No one has ascended into heaven but he who descended out of heaven...". I've never said it says anything other than that. All I ever did was explain why Jesus was the first human to enter Heaven and say that this verse supports that.

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That's exactly my point. This verse does not address that. OK, I've told you, you reject, and you persist.

Much love!

LuxMundi said:

That verse implies

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Implies? No, it does not. But enough repeating myself.

Much love!