Pre-possessed

Netchaplain · Oct 26, 2016

What parents could there be that would desire their child to earn love and favor from them in place of merely receiving it? These can never be earned since love and favor are antecedent to anything children do, and seeing that this acceptance is unattainable by any action (other than faith concerning salvation), all things received are all things “given” (1 Tim 6:17).

Surely in all things God has the best in mind for His children, in that what was established in reference to “works” (first covenant) by man is incomparable to that which is established by grace in Christ. When the subject is our relationship with God it is always better to receive than give (i.e. Luke 10:42), for as we know there is nothing other than love and gratitude (praise) the creature can offer to the Creator.
- NC

[SIZE=14pt]Pre-possessed[/SIZE]

After the fall, and until grace reigned, everything was on the ground of work*. Able offers the firstling of his flock; it is his work - no doubt a work of faith; faith in God led him to do the right thing, by it was his act. But now, the light of grace does not lead the awakened soul to offer, but to accept the fullness of the offering which has been made. Now gift or grace is in quite a different way than work. Each blessing is provided, and the believer is free to accept in faith, not doing any act to secure it. “Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ” (Eph 1:3).

Let us look at the difference between Israel entering the land, and the man in Christ. Everything depended on their act. They must go in and possess the land. True, God brought them in, but they had to act in order to possess, and those who went in without faith did not remain possessors.

Now the believer is united to the Lord Jesus, and is in full title and ownership of the heavenly places before he enjoys any of it. True, as he accepts in faith the portion which grace has given him, the greater is his sense of possession and consequently of his enjoyment. In the one case the act was necessary in order to obtain possession; in the other, there was as much title before enjoying possession, as there was consequent to possession. If I only possess heaven in proportion to my act of faith as in the case with Israel respecting Canaan, I have no right of possession but as I secure it; my sense of owning the land is only as I set foot on it.

Hence I am necessarily anxious of my progress; my possession depends on it; whereas with a believer now, he has full title before he lays hold of any of it, and every apprehension of his portion only stimulates him the more to advance, and to be in association with Him who is there. It is the vastness of the blessing which he has in association with the Lord Jesus, which makes him long to apprehend it more, as Paul says, “That I may apprehend that for which I am apprehended of Christ Jesus” (Phil 3:12).

It is the breath and length, and depth and height, which occupy him who has the Lord Jesus dwelling in his heart by faith. He does not depend on his own progress for assurance of possession, but he is so assured of the unsearchable riches of Christ as his position, that he dwells on it in faith; and thus, as the greatness of his possession is realized, he longs to enter still more into what he is sure is his.

We all know the tendency there is in our hearts, and often in proportion to our earnestness to be on the line of attainment, instead of being simple recipients; and it is well for us to note the difference in state which the effort to attain produces, from that which grace or the acceptance of gift produces. One who is in the former is never even; he is elated at any sense of his progress, and depressed if he becomes conscious of his losing ground; though generally he is too well pleased with his own engrossment of desire to advance, and obtain more.

In the other, in proportion as the grace is simply held, there is a great evenness. There is ever a sense of being far behind in enjoying the vastness of what has been conferred; and there is the greatest thankfulness for a sight of it, while with each new acquisition, there is the sense that “the draught which lulls our thirsting awakes out thirst anew.” The one is like a man making a fortune; while the other is exploring the vastness of the gift bestowed on him; one necessarily is occupied with what he is doing; the other is praising the Lord for what He has done and shared with him.

- J B Stoney

Poster’s Opinion:
* “the ground of work”: or “works,” though now (OT) man (Israel - as representative of mankind) placed on trial due to the fall, works are what then and now manifests those who are of faith in God. Works have always been the life-flow concerning the evidence of faith, and faith is always the life-flow concerning the enablement of works!

Miles J Stanford Daily Devotional: http://www.abideabove.com/hungry-heart/

justaname · Oct 28, 2016

I might add works were instate before the fall.

Perhaps the greatest divine order begins at the conception of humanity where in the garden the Creator told them, "Be fruitful and multiply, and fill the earth, and subdue it" (Genesis 1:28). This is the inauguration of the theology of vocation, thus man was created as a being that works. "The Bible begins talking about work as soon as it begins talking about anything— that is how important and basic it is"[SIZE=12pt][1][/SIZE], Keller states. Concerning work and the intrinsic function it serves in the human experience Keller explains, "Work is as much a basic human need as food, beauty, rest, friendship, prayer, and sexuality; it is not simply medicine but food for our soul.[SIZE=12pt][2][/SIZE] Without meaningful work we sense significant inner loss and emptiness."[SIZE=12pt][3][/SIZE] This then is profound in understanding anthropology in relation to vocation. As the human creature is first received into the creation, it is ordered dominion and stewardship from God. As God worked effectuating creation, so too the creature was called to operate, mimicking the Almighty.
Paul Sands correlates this divine order of vocation with the imago dei.[SIZE=12pt][4][/SIZE] This concept dovetails well in understanding vocation in relation divine action and divine order. Sands expands on this concept explaining, "The language of vocation is functional, which correlates well with the ‘royal- functional’[SIZE=12pt][5][/SIZE] view of the imago Dei favored by most Old Testament scholars."[SIZE=12pt][6][/SIZE] This idea ties the concept of vocation to the human experience as intrinsic to our identity and nature.[SIZE=12pt][7][/SIZE]

[SIZE=12pt][1][/SIZE] Timothy Keller, Every Good Endeavor: Connecting Your Work to God's Work (New York, New York: Penguin Group, 2012), 33

[SIZE=12pt][2][/SIZE] Keller provides a contrast between the biblical concept of work and the Hellenistic view where gods and men lived harmoniously without having to do any work from the Hellenistic perspective and the Genesis describes God's activity using the Hebrew mlkh, the word for ordinary human work. (Keller, 34)

[SIZE=12pt][3][/SIZE] Keller, 35

[SIZE=12pt][4][/SIZE] Paul Sands, "The Imago Dei As Vocation" Evangelical Quarterly 82.1 (2010) 28-41 accessed October 12, 2016 http://www.biblicalstudies.org.uk/pdf/eq/2010-1_028.pdf

[SIZE=12pt][5][/SIZE] Sands clarifies, " The royal-functional view is based on the recognition that Genesis 1:26-28 says less about the nature of the imago than about the task assigned to humankind…" He further qualifies the idea, " In keeping with this royal vocation, human beings have been granted ‘dominion’ in the earth. There is general agreement that dominion does not define the imago Dei, but the ideas are intertwined and inseparable. The syntax of 1:26 suggests that humans were created in the image so that they might exert dominion" (Sands, 37)

[SIZE=12pt][6][/SIZE] Sands, 37

[SIZE=12pt][7][/SIZE] This is not to say human identity is tied to a particular vocation one may hold at any given time, rather that vocation in and of itself is congenital in the imago die and as such we reflect God through the activity of vocation.

Netchaplain · Oct 28, 2016

justaname said:
I might add works were instate before the fall.

Perhaps the greatest divine order begins at the conception of humanity where in the garden the Creator told them, "Be fruitful and multiply, and fill the earth, and subdue it" (Genesis 1:28). This is the inauguration of the theology of vocation, thus man was created as a being that works. "The Bible begins talking about work as soon as it begins talking about anything— that is how important and basic it is"[SIZE=12pt][1][/SIZE], Keller states. Concerning work and the intrinsic function it serves in the human experience Keller explains, "Work is as much a basic human need as food, beauty, rest, friendship, prayer, and sexuality; it is not simply medicine but food for our soul.[SIZE=12pt][2][/SIZE] Without meaningful work we sense significant inner loss and emptiness."[SIZE=12pt][3][/SIZE] This then is profound in understanding anthropology in relation to vocation. As the human creature is first received into the creation, it is ordered dominion and stewardship from God. As God worked effectuating creation, so too the creature was called to operate, mimicking the Almighty.
Paul Sands correlates this divine order of vocation with the imago dei.[SIZE=12pt][4][/SIZE] This concept dovetails well in understanding vocation in relation divine action and divine order. Sands expands on this concept explaining, "The language of vocation is functional, which correlates well with the ‘royal- functional’[SIZE=12pt][5][/SIZE] view of the imago Dei favored by most Old Testament scholars."[SIZE=12pt][6][/SIZE] This idea ties the concept of vocation to the human experience as intrinsic to our identity and nature.[SIZE=12pt][7][/SIZE]

[SIZE=12pt][1][/SIZE] Timothy Keller, Every Good Endeavor: Connecting Your Work to God's Work (New York, New York: Penguin Group, 2012), 33

[SIZE=12pt][2][/SIZE] Keller provides a contrast between the biblical concept of work and the Hellenistic view where gods and men lived harmoniously without having to do any work from the Hellenistic perspective and the Genesis describes God's activity using the Hebrew mlkh, the word for ordinary human work. (Keller, 34)

[SIZE=12pt][3][/SIZE] Keller, 35

[SIZE=12pt][4][/SIZE] Paul Sands, "The Imago Dei As Vocation" Evangelical Quarterly 82.1 (2010) 28-41 accessed October 12, 2016 http://www.biblicalstudies.org.uk/pdf/eq/2010-1_028.pdf

[SIZE=12pt][5][/SIZE] Sands clarifies, " The royal-functional view is based on the recognition that Genesis 1:26-28 says less about the nature of the imago than about the task assigned to humankind…" He further qualifies the idea, " In keeping with this royal vocation, human beings have been granted ‘dominion’ in the earth. There is general agreement that dominion does not define the imago Dei, but the ideas are intertwined and inseparable. The syntax of 1:26 suggests that humans were created in the image so that they might exert dominion" (Sands, 37)

[SIZE=12pt][6][/SIZE] Sands, 37

[SIZE=12pt][7][/SIZE] This is not to say human identity is tied to a particular vocation one may hold at any given time, rather that vocation in and of itself is congenital in the imago die and as such we reflect God through the activity of vocation.

Hi JAN - Thanks for your reply. The basic point I'm trying to share is that salvation does not come by works, but works demonstrate salvation. Salvation results from grace and faith, but "not by works" (Eph 3:9), and that no eventual works evinces no faith.

Thanks for your site labors and God bless!

justaname · Oct 28, 2016

NetChaplain said:
Hi JAN - Thanks for your reply. The basic point I'm trying to share is that salvation does not come by works, but works demonstrate salvation. Salvation results from grace and faith, but "not by works" (Eph 3:9), and that no eventual works evinces no faith.

Thanks for your site labors and God bless!

As to your point I agree. What I shared was not to combat rather to compliment and to show works are ordained from the beginning of creation for man. Thus in this man was to work not for attaining God's love or affirmation, for truly he had this when God proclaimed "It is very good", rather work in and of itself was good. After the fall works, along with the whole of creation, were tainted with sin, yet through Christ they have been redeemed. (This last statement being inferred through your post not explicit in mine).

I think sometimes works have a certain stigma amongst some protestants and are almost looked down upon.

Netchaplain · Oct 29, 2016

justaname said:
As to your point I agree. What I shared was not to combat rather to compliment and to show works are ordained from the beginning of creation for man. Thus in this man was to work not for attaining God's love or affirmation, for truly he had this when God proclaimed "It is very good", rather work in and of itself was good. After the fall works, along with the whole of creation, were tainted with sin, yet through Christ they have been redeemed. (This last statement being inferred through your post not explicit in mine).

I think sometimes works have a certain stigma amongst some protestants and are almost looked down upon.

Thanks for letting me know your thoughts on this thread, and I didn't see your reply as a debate but as an elaboration on the subject of works, as you've indicated.

Blessings to your Family!

skypair · Nov 12, 2016

NetChaplain said:
What parents could there be that would desire their child to earn love and favor from them in place of merely receiving it? These can never be earned since love and favor are antecedent to anything children do, and seeing that this acceptance is unattainable by any action (other than faith concerning salvation), all things received are all things “given” (1 Tim 6:17).

Click to expand...

Surely in all things God has the best in mind for His children, in that what was established in reference to “works” (first covenant) by man is incomparable to that which is established by grace in Christ. When the subject is our relationship with God it is always better to receive than give (i.e. Luke 10:42), for as we know there is nothing other than love and gratitude (praise) the creature can offer to the Creator.

Well, God establishes that He loves all of us from birth, Acts 17:26-27. We ARE His offspring. So it is not so much "works" that continue to ingratiate us to Him but OBEDIENCE. Obedience in the OT involved works of the flesh (as you note). But obedience in the NT involves obedience of the spirit and soul.

Think about it. In the OT, it was obedience to the 10 commandments .. in the NT per Mt 5:21-22 (anger = killing), our spirits are invoked to obedience. Same with Salvation. In the OT, the offering of two goats symbolized death to the old man and life to the new man which led unto salvation. Today we accomplish that in prayer to the Father repenting and trusting Christ as our Savior, right?

And like you say, what we have on the inside, the inner man (Ro 7:22 law - OT, Ro 8:2 the Holy Spirit - NT) is what appears on the outside by faith. We are no longer servants not knowing what our Lord desires and plans but we are "priests and kings unto God" (Rev 1:6) offering our own sacrifices in prayer and obedience.

I must say that I enjoy discussions with you, NC. Your thoughts stimulate me to greater understanding of my own thoughts. Thanks!

skypair

Netchaplain · Nov 12, 2016

I must say that I enjoy discussions with you, NC. Your thoughts stimulate me to greater understanding of my own thoughts. Thanks!

skypair

Thank you for letting me know of your desire for sharing and will also enjoy communicating with you!

God bless!

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Pre-possessed

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