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Then why does He count himself still with them by saying "we" and "us"? It still makes not sense! Here's why; He is talking about himself in the present tense, not the past tense in Romans 7:19. Romans 7:19 -- For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do...

So... John AND Paul are both non believers? Read verse 8 again; 1 John 1:8 -- If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. John counts himself among his audience by saying we and us So... John and Paul are both unbelievers? Wow... I'm starting to get the...

Romans 7:19 Paul himself said that he still sinned... it's right there in black and white. So, Paul isn't a Christian?

Seems as though Paul believed that too.

But, again; Paul admitted that he still sinned, even as he wrote this letter! So... Paul was an unbeliever?

1.) What does this have to do with what brother @Anthony D'Arienzo said? 2.) Anyone who believes themselves to be without sin deceives themselves [1 John 1:8]

And if he is not, he is, according to her logic, calling himself a non believer while at the same time writing Scripture. ....hmmmm....

1.) Paul does not say that. He says the we as Christians will indeed sin, but that we should not be ok with sin in our lives. 2.) Again, this is 1 whole letter. In the original text there were no chapter and verse divisions; it was just one whole message. Paul does not himself make this...

Really? Because... when Paul wrote these originally, they were letters to the church. No chapter or verse divisions at all. It all flowed as 1 complete letter, which means that throughout the entire letter it had the same intended target audience. He wrote this letter to the church and the...

So, Peter and Paul are also not Christians?

Truth! Only Christ has attained perfection on earth! It also begs the question; can these now sinless people then intercede for us with the Father?

5. This corruption of nature, during this life, doth remain in those that are regenerated [1]; and although it be, through Christ, pardoned, and mortified; yet both itself, and all the motions thereof, are truly and properly sin. [2] [1] ~ Proverbs 20:9 ~ Ecclesiastes 7:20 ~ Romans 7:14 ~...

Absolutely! I'd say that how you believe you are justified shows whether or not you are a Christian!

I read her comment while reading my WCF, about how the Word of God is the Supreme Judge. The first thought that came to my mind was "Oh, boy; me and my heresy learning all about the effectiveness of the Word of God." :D Made me laugh a lot harder than I'd like to admit

*Me the grumpy Presbyterian murmuring under his breath about covenant signs* Only playing, brother! It is a blessing to see another brother in Christ joining the forum! Welcome from me! A note to those who read this: Notice how we can have differences in things like baptism, and yet still...

Tulipian... Follower of John Calvin... That's like saying "It's not red... it's scarlet."

Agreed. Which is why I refuse to debate someone who insists on "One-verse" theology. The WHOLE of Scripture must uniformly claim something for it to be taken as true.

I agree. My only point was that, if we are going to be biased, our bias should be towards the Word of God; not towards a preconceived notion about a belief system without regard to it's Scriptural grounds.

I agree. In fact, if Calvinism wasn't Scriptural, I personally would not adhere to the doctrine. However, when you read the Institutes, and see that nearly every page of the over 1,600 page work has Scripture written everywhere, and every one of Calvin's thoughts are formulated from the...

Yes He did. But this righteousness which Christ spoke of was not our own, but His righteousness imputed to our account. ~ Romans 3:10-12 ~ Romans 4:13 The righteousness that is greater than the Pharisees is the righteousness of Christ! ~ 2 Corinthians 5:21