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You completely missed the point. He was not talking about apostasy in general, he was talking about mass apostasy. Did you read the passage I showed you? 2 Timothy 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves...

Yes. It is the day Christ returns and we're caught up to Him, as Paul mentioned in 2 Thess 2:1. He was saying that they shouldn't believe anyone who says that day had already come which would mean they had missed being gathered to Christ at His coming. I don't know what you're talking about. The...

Paul was talking about something that had to occur before "our being gathered to Him". He obviously wouldn't say that our departing and being gathered to Him had to take place first before our departing and being gathered to Him. So, there is no basis whatsoever for seeing the "falling away" as...

Because if it had already come then that would mean they somehow missed being caught up to Christ which would mean they were not Christians like they thought they were. You can't see how that would be troubling?

So, do you think only those who believe in a pre-trib rapture do those things?

How are you coming to this conclusion? Can you please tell me exactly how you interpret the following passage: 2 Thess 2:1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, 2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither...

Give me just one or two examples so I can see what you're talking about. We all have something against that, but we don't all agree as to when someone is doing that.

I'm sure you will agree with me that their claim is completely ludicrous and based only on doctrinal bias rather than being an honest, objective interpretation of the text.

I never said that we can just declare any given text to be symbolic without being able to offer any evidence to support that. I was mainly just arguing against the idea that the text itself (such as the text referencing a sword coming out of Christ's mouth) has to specifically indicate that...

Sure it is. 2 Thessalonians 2:1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, 2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand. 3...

I'm pretty sure all of us here believe that. And what does this mean? Who do you think God gives the accurate interpretation of scripture to? Wouldn't it be those who ask for wisdom as James said we should do (James 1:5-7)? And those who try to be like the Bereans by examining the scripture...

The pre-trib rapture view also teaches that the church won't be on earth when the mass falling away Paul talked about in that passage occurs. I don't see how the mass falling away can occur without the church being here because it has do do with many in the church falling away from the faith.

No, I haven't. It seems like you have something against symbols.

I didn't mention in my post what I believed it symbolized, but I agree with you that it symbolizes His word. On the day He returns He will destroy all of His enemies who rejected His word (Matt 24:35-39, 2 Thess 1:7-10, 2 Peter 3:10-12, Rev 19:17-18, Rev 20:9, etc.). John 12:48 There is a judge...

This is all obvious to everyone. Why do you think there is even the need to make an obvious point like this? There isn't. So what? The Bible doesn't have to declare them to be symbols in order to be symbols. That's my point. Such as the sword coming out of Christ's mouth. That is a symbol, but...

Is that what the following says? Revelation 19:17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun, who cried in a loud voice to all the birds flying in midair, “Come, gather together for the great supper of God, 18 so that you may eat the flesh of kings, generals, and the mighty, of horses and their...

It talks about fire coming down on the earth itself and Peter compared that event to the flood in Noah's day (2 Peter 3:5-7) which shows that the fire will come down on the entire earth. What mortal could survive that? No one. That's why Paul said this about that same day of the Lord when...

And who exactly do you think He will reign over on the earth at that time? Do you agree that all believers will be changed and have immortal bodies at that point (1 Cor 15:50-54)? Based on 2 Peter 3:10-12, all unbelievers would be killed on the day He returns. Since you agree that 2 Peter...

What is your point? Some scripture doesn't clearly indicate one way or another whether something is symbolic or literal. So, when you interpret those texts literally when I think they are symbolic, should I tell you that your interpretation lacks Scriptural authority?

It also describes things like a woman sitting on many waters while reading a beast with seven heads and ten horns. Is that literal, too? My doctrine comes from the Bible. My doctrine recognizes obvious symbolic language such as when it talks about a sword coming out of Christ's mouth. There will...