19. Didn't God Choose Us Long Before We Accepted Him?

[Helen]

Another of @Willie T questions from his thread on the 75 questions.

I can't find this one 'followed through' on his thread -

19. Didn't God Choose Us Long Before We Accepted Him?

 

[Dave L]

Another of @Willie T questions from his thread on the 75 questions.

I can't find this one 'followed through' on his thread -

19. Didn't God Choose Us Long Before We Accepted Him?

Jesus says we have eternal life. That means we were always saved in God's mind and brought forth in time.

 

[Helen]

Jesus says we have eternal life. That means we were always saved in God's mind and brought forth in time.

Well I can say a big amen to that Dave! :)

Question asked and answered. lol Short thread

 

[Episkopos]

Well I can say a big amen to that Dave! :)

Question asked and answered. lol Short thread

Not so fast! ;) God foreknows things because He is God. He sees the future as well as the past. All of time is laid out before Him. But since His is the biggest secret-keeper in the universe don't expect any hints on the outcomes of individuals.

Now most people think that God would never elect someone to fail...IOW all born again people can't possibly go wrong.

But God is bigger than that. In a great house there are vessels of honour AND vessels of dishonour. God can work with whatever people do. Just look at Judas Iscariot. Was he not one of the innermost circles of Jesus? And if he was that close...imagine how many people are trying to follow Christ, are radical in their claims of salvation...yet will be rejected as bringing shame to Christ.

That is why the fear of the Lord is wise.

Remember that judgment day has not yet taken place. There are many surprises to come. The last will be first and the first will be last. Many believers will be rejected and many who have not been given the opportunity to believe will be accepted.

God is sovereign. Better to fear the Lord than to be smug and make superficial judgment about eternity.

 

[Helen]

lol, yup

YAY!!! Finally, I knew it, so you do believe that you are chosen in Him!! :)

 

[Helen]

Now most people think that God would never elect someone to fail...IOW all born again people can't possibly go wrong.

Do you think so..."most people"...hummm maybe.
I can't see that really, as we have in black and white all the failures of King David, Peter etc etc...
There would not be the verse about a righteous man falling 7 times and getting up, if there was no failure on the child of God's path.

As you will see, in the other thread...I am on the other side of the fence when it comes to Judas.

 

[bbyrd009]

Another of @Willie T questions from his thread on the 75 questions.

I can't find this one 'followed through' on his thread -

19. Didn't God Choose Us Long Before We Accepted Him?

No, as, just like in the anthropomorphism used to illuminate attributes of God but not meant to personify Him, "choose" is being used to indicate approval of those who act righteously, and not to indicate God literally making a forward-active "choice"
wadr

Iow there are no people in God either, at least according to Scripture, but that does not stop Romans from saying "God in three, or even one, persons" now does it. Can't Quote it, but wth right, God has a Hand, and I can Quote that!
lol

 

[bbyrd009]

YAY!!! Finally, I knew it, so you do believe that you are chosen in Him!! :)

Sorry, I meant "yup, the professors of wisdom have become fools" so to speak, lol.
any time someone is that sure they are by definition whacked in the head ok
imo.

 

[Episkopos]

Do you think so..."most people"...hummm maybe.
I can't see that really, as we have in black and white all the failures of King David, Peter etc etc...
There would not be the verse about a righteous man falling 7 times and getting up, if there was no failure on the child of God's path.

As you will see, in the other thread...I am on the other side of the fence when it comes to Judas.

But we will be judged harder than they in the OT. Grace brings a much harder judgment. An encounter with holiness ups the ante.

28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?

 

[bbyrd009]

Tbh I'm not sure we are even held accountable, as long as we cannot understand, read with two eyes, look up into the sky, etc. dunno

Do you think so..."most people"...hummm maybe.
I can't see that really, as we have in black and white all the failures of King David, Peter etc etc...
There would not be the verse about a righteous man falling 7 times and getting up, if there was no failure on the child of God's path.

As you will see, in the other thread...I am on the other side of the fence when it comes to Judas.

even Romans daughters can get raised, huh?
Imo you show your heart @ Judas, and that is a very good idea, being as how Judas represents the Christianity that looks up into the sky for a literal Jesus to come riding in on His white horse and put on that crown, that after all Judas was most likely just trying to manipulate Jesus into taking?

 

[Helen]

No, as, just like in the anthropomorphism used to illuminate attributes of God but not meant to personify Him, "choose" is being used to indicate approval of those who act righteously, and not to indicate God literally making a forward-active "choice"
wadr

Well I see an active 'choice'.

I believe the godhead ( Jesus slain before the creation of the world) His choice foreknowing Adam etc etc and the outcome...and His choice of being the answer in the death of the cross...God made the Plan, and had the beginning , the middle, and the end of the Plan...in His hand.

I see our part and our choices as being our choice of how close or far away in the kingdom and our inheritance. The Plan of salvation was made, but the choice of inheritance is in our hands to walk-it-out faithfully to the end.

They knew what Adam would do. They 'knew us' then too.
I believe the whole PLAN is The Bride ( Rev)...and those who would love God for naught. ( I do not believe that all the Church is in the Bride) but too many rabbit trails here...
..love God Because He is who He is, not as a vending machine to answer our prayers and wants. As you know, I believe God is a heart person...
WE see someone who we think is messed up and wrong in things..God see the heart..He knows if the heart is 'after Him'. WE see someone who "looks like" they have it all together and a perfect do it right christian...and God sees the HEART.

Sorry, rambling here. whoops.

 

[bbyrd009]

Well I see an active 'choice'.

I believe the godhead ( Jesus slain before the creation of the world) His choice foreknowing Adam etc etc and the outcome...and His choice of being the answer in the death of the cross...God made the Plan, and had the beginning , the middle, and the end of the Plan...in His hand.

They knew what Adam would do. They 'knew us' then too.
I believe the whole plan is The Bride/ Rev...and those who would love God for naught. ( I do not believe that all the Church is in the Bride) but too many rabbit trails here...
..love God Because He is who He is, not as a vending machine to answer our prayers and wants. As you know, I believe God is a heart person...
WE see someone who we think is messed up and wrong in things..God see the heart..He knows if the heart is 'after Him'. WE see someone who "looks like" they have it all together and a perfect do it right christian...and God sees the HEART.

Sorry, rambling here. whoops.

i guess as long as you see ppl in God you will also need to see an active choice, but I might ask when the last time any of the spirits you manifested were observed to be making any choices? But I agree with the last bit, sure.

 

[bbyrd009]

Do you have questions for God, that you believe you might get an opportunity to like literally ask Him after you have died? Fwiw I would abandon these notions if you want to partake in Christ ok. Go ask dave what the definition of Eternal is, and be guided accordingly imo.

 

[Helen]

Sorry, I meant "yup, the professors of wisdom have become fools" so to speak, lol.
any time someone is that sure they are by definition whacked in the head ok
imo.

Hahaha!! I should have known :)

 

[bbyrd009]

Hahaha!! I should have known :)

Ha well cmon, we all understand on a fundamental level that the more someone insists, the less likely they are to be right, right. So if you believe ppl who say "this is that, that is this," when the Bible says the opposite, then who is to blame? Do you think God is going to accept responsibility there? I tell you that yes, I guess He will in a sense, but the consequences are a different story.

Another way to crack that nut imo is to see that determinists wanna give God all the responsibility, right, but they want to claim all the (imagined, future) "rewards?" So an interesting exercise imo is go find a single one of these--who incidentally will usually be braying non-stop about how Bible is Word--who can ref seek a reward for doing what they were supposed to be doing all along anyway without looking, and don't be holding your breath obv lol

 

[Jane_Doe22]

Another of
19. [B]Didn't God Choose Us Long Before We Accepted Him?[/B]

Long before you even comprehended it: God loved you, He urged you to come to Him, sent His Son to die for you, and has been there for you.
I hesitate to answer the "God choose us" part of this though, because it has a big Calvinist vibe to it, which I don't agree with. God has loved, urged, died, and been there fo every single person that's ever walked this Earth, not just those that have/will at some point accept Him.

 

[Helen]

Long before you even comprehended it: God loved you, He urged you to come to Him, sent His Son to die for you, and has been there for you.
I hesitate to answer the "God choose us" part of this though, because it has a big Calvinist vibe to it, which I don't agree with. God has loved, urged, died, and been there [B]for every single person that's ever walked this Earth[/B], not just those that have/will at some point accept Him.

Amen Jane, amen. :)