A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit:

[amadeus]

i don't think so wadr. i know the pov seems self-evident, but try and go find some Validation for this; i don't believe you will be able to

For me the proof is in the pudding, in this case me being the pudding:

"But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you." John 14:26

People, including me, still speak with double tongues, as I understand it, because they/we do not make use of what they/we have received as per the gift of the Holy Ghost [Acts 2:38]. Having received it they/we then must allow themselves/ourselves to be taught. This is why I also emphasize not quenching the Spirit [the Holy Ghost in us].

 

[bbyrd009]

pudding

i'll go find the v that says "control your tongue," but it's put a diff way i guess, not coming to me at the moment. Ah, but a review of any v with tongue in it etcetc i'll be back

 

[amadeus]

i'll go find the v that says "control your tongue," but it's put a diff way i guess, not coming to me at the moment. Ah, but a review of any v with tongue in it etcetc i'll be back

The key to all as I see it is in who hold our reins? We do until and if we turn them over to the Lord. But this is not a one time handover of the control. Every time we get up on the horse's back we must take his reins into our hands and direct his steps. We are the horse.

"O LORD, I know that the way of man is not in himself: it is not in man that walketh to direct his steps." Jerem 10:23

Notice below the psalmist prayer:
"O that my ways were directed to keep thy statutes!" Psalm 119:5

So that brings us back to Jesus providing the answer to the prayer here:

"But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you." John 14:26

This Comforter is not to be our director, the controller of our reins if we don't permit it. We are only as a horse who is still running wild eating and playing and everything as the whim takes us... until we hand the reins over to Him. Every morning, every new decision to be made... we need to decide to hand the reins over to Him again... until the end of the journey.

 

[quietthinker]

Question is: does a none believer, one that has not been born again, experience this war between flesh and Spirit. If they are not born again; is the Spirit of God their to convict?

The Spirit of God convicts but they do not experience the internal struggle. Their allegiance calls for no internal conflict. Their energies are fundamentally spent on self glorification.

 

[bbyrd009]

i'd be careful how you define unbeliever there

 

[bbyrd009]

10 For, “Whoever would love life and see good days must keep their tongue from evil and their lips from deceitful speech."

 

[VictoryinJesus]

i'd be careful how you define unbeliever there

Please explain what you mean? (I ask with interest, not as a demand.)

 

[APAK]

The Spirit of God convicts but they do not experience the internal struggle. Their allegiance calls for no internal conflict. Their energies are fundamentally spent on self glorification.

Yes, totally agree brother..

The real internal spiritual struggle between the natural man that is dead, in reality dying (we are not perfect), and the new seed and spirit that is perfecting us (we are not perfect yet) as the new creature that keeps us truly righteous and secure and rescued from death to eternal life. The dead man and the new man are bitter enemies and never compatible. As and if the believer matures, I can say with some experience this struggle becomes more manageable as time ticks on. The new man wins much more- victory and freedom becoming in the spirit as a likeness of Christ.

Praise God Almighty,

APAK

 

[bbyrd009]

Please explain what you mean? (I ask with interest, not as a demand.)

well i would not be thinking that a Hindu or even a Wiccan who is doing works meet for rebound has any issues with being accepted by God; God does not care what you call yourself, and there is no accounting for beliefs; we are only called to account for our actions

 

[bbyrd009]

The Spirit of God convicts but they do not experience the internal struggle. Their allegiance calls for no internal conflict. Their energies are fundamentally spent on self glorification.

just as easily describes many who would describe themselves as Christian though, right

 

[Stranger]

(Matt. 7:19-20) "Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them."

This has to do with false prophets. (Matt. 7:15) "Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves."

So, you shall know the false prophet or teacher by the fruit he produces. But, there is a problem. The false prophet/teacher comes in sheeps clothing. If he came as morally degenerate with his outward sins being seen by all, he is easily exposed. But he doesn't. He comes as a sheep. He comes in goodness, and sincerity, and nothing immoral will be seen in him.

So, how can you recognize him by his fruit? The fruit is going to be that which is produced by the Spirit of God in a true prophet or teacher. The false prophet/teacher is tapped into another spirit, and his fruit is not of God. If you set up a man teaching a Bible class who is a believer and one God has called to teach, when he teaches the Holy Ghost will minister to those listening, and they will recognize it But if a non-beiever, posing as a believer starts a Bible class, it will be empty of the Spirit. Nothing there. The believers who came will go away empty and their spirit parched.

Then next week, guess which Bible class has more members, and which one has fewer. As (Matt. 7:16) says, "Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?" Do you go to the thorn vine to get grapes? No, you go to where there are grapes.

(John 10:1-5)

Stranger

 

[Stranger]

well i would not be thinking that a Hindu or even a Wiccan who is doing works meet for rebound has any issues with being accepted by God; God does not care what you call yourself, and there is no accounting for beliefs; we are only called to account for our actions

That's a lie. Our belief is accounted for by God. A Hindu or Wiccan can do all the good works they like. Doesn't help them at all.

Stranger

 

[VictoryinJesus]

well i would not be thinking that a Hindu or even a Wiccan who is doing works meet for rebound has any issues with being accepted by God; God does not care what you call yourself, and there is no accounting for beliefs; we are only called to account for our actions

I understand bbyrd009 that we can’t go around assuming who is born again of Spirit and who is not. I get only God knows the heart of a man. But I am also careful and confused: when those that openly hate God talk of love and life and preservation of others and are good humanitarians. You see this in Hollywood. Open tender-hearts that bleed openly and display they idolize themselves, not God. I guess the judgment all comes down to the works, are the works of God...or are they more works of man and mans so very goodness spilled out before others. I don’t say that to be hateful. I say it because you see so many where it is obvious while openly they claim total joy and peace and love ...but obviously you can see true torment and loneliness and a person that has no idea why they are really here. That is just my thoughts, wrong...maybe. I’m firm believer in “out of the abundance of the heart” a man shows what is inside.

 

[Enoch111]

well i would not be thinking that a Hindu or even a Wiccan who is doing works meet for rebound has any issues with being accepted by God; God does not care what you call yourself, and there is no accounting for beliefs; we are only called to account for our actions

Not sure what you mean by "rebound" but this is TOTALLY FALSE (in multiple ways). So I would suggest you get back to the Bible.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

(Matt. 7:19-20) "Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them."

This has to do with false prophets. (Matt. 7:15) "Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves."

So, you shall know the false prophet or teacher by the fruit he produces. But, there is a problem. The false prophet/teacher comes in sheeps clothing. If he came as morally degenerate with his outward sins being seen by all, he is easily exposed. But he doesn't. He comes as a sheep. He comes in goodness, and sincerity, and nothing immoral will be seen in him.

So, how can you recognize him by his fruit? The fruit is going to be that which is produced by the Spirit of God in a true prophet or teacher. The false prophet/teacher is tapped into another spirit, and his fruit is not of God. If you set up a man teaching a Bible class who is a believer and one God has called to teach, when he teaches the Holy Ghost will minister to those listening, and they will recognize it But if a non-beiever, posing as a believer starts a Bible class, it will be empty of the Spirit. Nothing there. The believers who came will go away empty and their spirit parched.

Then next week, guess which Bible class has more members, and which one has fewer. As (Matt. 7:16) says, "Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?" Do you go to the thorn vine to get grapes? No, you go to where there are grapes.

(John 10:1-5)

Stranger

I understand but isn’t it more than pertaining to only those false prophets in sheeps clothing?

(Nevermind) way off topic.

 

[JesusIsFaithful]

I understand but isn’t it more that pertaining to only those false prophets in sheeps clothing?

Try reading a different application and you may find what Jesus was actually talking about at this link at that thread.

https://www.christianityboard.com/threads/the-iniquity-of-the-nicene-creed.26391/#post-425597

For why it is relevant, the Nicene creed of 381 A.D. is ecumenical in nature and thus by uniting the churches by an agreement to that creed ( which the Catholic Church is agreeing to and using as well ), is considered as gathering grapes of thorns and figs of thistles; hence the fruit of the false prophet.

The harm in including the worship of the Holy Spirit with the Father and the Son is that when the focus is on the Holy Spirit in worship, seducing spirits may come in with signs and lying wonders of confusion, thus seducing believers in chasing after them for a sign. Indeed, the next time, the believers will address the Holy Spirit in worship to come and fall on them, and they believe He is responding even though God is not the author of confusion.

This is why Jesus said about how the way is broaden in the worship place in coming to God the Father by including the worship of the Holy Spirit as Another Go To Person of the Triune God to approach God the Father by in worship instead of by the only way of the Son in coming to Him in worship.

Jesus even exposes the consequences of those saved believers in iniquity that can claim all those wonderful works of God in their "movement of the Spirit" ( which is not really the Holy Spirit at all FYI ) by assigning how believers will fall down in those movements for not heeding His words in how they are to come to God the Father by in worship, prayer, and fellowship which is by the only way of the Son.

John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me....
13 And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14 If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it.

So the reason why when saved believers pray to the Holy Spirit in coming to fall on them again and again and again are in state of confusion is because they approached God the Father the wrong way in worship and that is why it was not the Holy Spirit answering those prayers because that is not His job to be doing, but the Son's so that the Father may be glorified in the Son for answers to prayers.

By that iniquity of broadening the way in the worship place by honoring the Holy Spirit with the Father & the Son, they allow seducing spirits to come in when the focus is on the Spirit and they will take the spotlight in the worship place for believers to chase after in receiving them for a sign and fall down in doing so in confusion.

No good tree will produce an evil fruit and no evil tree will produce a good fruit. That means the rudiment ( that tree ) of worshiping the "Holy Spirit" that by receiving those spirits after a sign in those apostate crazy phenomenon, if you see that as an evil fruit, then the preaching of receiving a baptism of the Holy Ghost apart from salvation by a sign of tongues is also an evil fruit from that same evil tree.

Many that seek to receive the Holy Spirit apart from salvation in order to get tongues without interpretation do fall down in doing so in those movements in churches. Just because it does not happen all the time, is why Jesus said that no good tree will produce an evil fruit.

I blame the broadening of the way in the worship place on the Nicene creed of 381 A.D. and the answer to avoid that iniquity is to lean on Jesus Christ for the help in narrowing the way back to the straight gate in keeping your eyes on the Son, the Bridegroom, in coming to God the Father by in worship, prayer, and fellowship. That is what the indwelling Holy Spirit is leading believers to do to avoid false spirits as in the spirits of the antichrists as they would take the spotlight from the Son, but the indwelling Spirit would never do that.

Luke 13:24 Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. 25 When once the master of the house is risen up, and hath shut to the door, and ye begin to stand without, and to knock at the door, saying, Lord, Lord, open unto us; and he shall answer and say unto you, I know you not whence ye are: 26 Then shall ye begin to say, We have eaten and drunk in thy presence, and thou hast taught in our streets. 27 But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity. 28 There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out. 29 And they shall come from the east, and from the west, and from the north, and from the south, and shall sit down in the kingdom of God. 30 And, behold, there are last which shall be first, and there are first which shall be last.

 

[Stranger]

I understand but isn’t it more than pertaining to only those false prophets in sheeps clothing?

(Nevermind) way off topic.

It can be when the topic is about the contrast between the works of the flesh and fruit of the spirit. I think here however the fruit of the spirit is the emphasis. The question is 'what spirit' is producing the fruit, and that the believer will go to where the Spirit of God is producing the fruit. He will recognize the false spirit by their fruits.

Stranger

 

[VictoryinJesus]

It can be when the topic is about the contrast between the works of the flesh and fruit of the spirit. I think here however the fruit of the spirit is the emphasis. The question is 'what spirit' is producing the fruit, and that the believer will go to where the Spirit of God is producing the fruit. He will recognize the false spirit by their fruits.

Stranger

Something I struggle with that you maybe can explain. What is the difference between fruit and works? Fruit makes sense since it is clearly produced by the Spirit? can fruit be produced by another spirit(meaning evil?). But something you said above makes me think I confuse the two: fruit and works(deeds). Is fruit what the Spirit bears? And works(deeds) what the flesh bears. Or is it not that simple. For instance: if I am ruled by a new Master(God) instead of by that old sin nature; does this produce evident works(deeds) visible in the flesh? The old sin nature no longer having dominion over us? James 2:18 18Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

Every time I think it makes sense, then it doesn't.

 

[Stranger]

Something I struggle with that you maybe can explain. What is the difference between fruit and works? Fruit makes sense since it is clearly produced by the Spirit? can fruit be produced by another spirit(meaning evil?). But something you said above makes me think I confuse the two: fruit and works(deeds). Is fruit what the Spirit bears? And works(deeds) what the flesh bears. Or is it not that simple. For instance: if I am ruled by a new Master(God) instead of by that old sin nature; does this produce evident works(deeds) visible in the flesh? The old sin nature no longer having dominion over us? James 2:18 18Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

Every time I think it makes sense, then it doesn't.

I know the works of the flesh are listed pretty thoroughly in (Gal. 5:17-21). And the fruit of the Spirit also. (Gal. 5:22-25)

I am not for trying to analyze everything we do to a 'T'. Though we be body, soul, and spirit, we are one person and only God can see those distinctions within us. And whether it is a work of the flesh or a fruit of the Spirit, our body is involved to be moved. If I am in the Spirit and bearing fruit of the Spirit, it will manifest itself in a work accordingly. Though my body is used, it is not a work of the flesh. It is a good work resulting from being in the Spirit as characterized by (Gal. 5:22-25).

But if I am in the flesh, then my body will be responding to those things listed in (Gal. 5:17-21). And it will produce works of the flesh. The question always is, is the Spirit controlling me or is the body of flesh controllng? But here again, we can go crazy trying to analyze it too much. I think we just go. Walk in the Spirit and we will not fulfill the lust of the flesh. (Gal. 5:16) When we stumble we just get back up and keep on going.

Stranger

 

[bbyrd009]

Every time I think it makes sense, then it doesn't.

a rabbi would usually say "welcome to Torah!" right in here lol