A Sobering Reality

  • Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.

    You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

newnature

Active Member
Mar 24, 2011
737
128
43
Acts 17:11, how much more should we be testing everything we hear today, sometimes standing for truth means walking away, sometimes it means leaving a church that has embraced false teaching, sometimes it means distancing yourself from people who refuse to align with scripture and sometimes it means speaking up, even when it costs you relationships. Luke 12:51, that doesn’t mean we are called to be argumentative or hateful, it means that truth divides, it separates light from darkness, it separates deception from righteousness and sometimes it separates us from people who refuse to accept the truth. Are you tolerating false teaching in your life or are you listening to messages that contradict God’s word, because they make you feel good or are you following leaders who preach a different gospel, because they are popular or are you afraid to stand up for truth, because you don’t want to offend.

John reminds us, truth is not negotiable, we don’t get to rewrite it, we don’t get to soften it, we don’t get to tolerate what God calls false, because in the end, compromise with deception, is still deception and we cannot afford to welcome it into our lives, anyone who rejects Jesus’ teachings is not of God. We live in a time, when many claim to follow Jesus, but the Jesus they follow is not the Jesus of the Bible, some say he was just a good teacher, others claim he was just one path among many, some take his words and twist them to fit modern beliefs, but John makes it clear, if you reject the teachings of Jesus, you do not belong to God. 2 John 1:9, anyone who runs ahead, anyone who goes beyond what Jesus taught, anyone who adds or takes away from his message, they do not have God. It doesn’t matter how spiritual someone sounds, it doesn't matter how much they talk about God, if they do not hold to Jesus’ true teaching they are not of God.

This is a sobering reality, because today, many have abandoned the foundation of Jesus words in pursuit of new revelations, we see it everywhere, people claim to have special knowledge that isn’t in the Bible, they claim that God is revealing new truths that contradict scripture, some say God is doing a new thing, he’s moving beyond the Bible, but God does not change. Malachi 3:6, Hebrews 13:8, this means his word does not evolve to fit culture, his truth does not shift with human opinions, his teachings are not outdated, they are eternal, but this is where many fall into deception. A man building a house, he lays a foundation of solid stone, strong enough to withstand any storm, but over time he starts listening to new ideas. He hears that brick is stronger, then someone convinces him that wood is better, then another tells him to build on sand, because times have changed. So he abandons his foundation and build something new and then the storm comes, the rain pours, the wind beats against the house and because he left the original foundation his house collapses and this is exactly what happens when people abandon the true teachings of Jesus.

Most people go to church, but live exactly like anyone who has never entered a church, same values, same priorities, same habits, same way of treating others, same love of money, same obsession with comfort, same inability to forgive and when someone points out this contradiction, the answer is always the same. Thank God for his grace, nobody’s perfect, we’re all works in progress and that’s also true, nobody’s perfect and we’re all in process, but there’s a giant difference between being in the process of transformation and being stuck in spiritual mediocrity, while using grace as an excuse, there’s a difference between falling and getting up versus living permanently fallen while declaring you’re covered by grace. Romans 6:1-2, in the first century, there were people using grace as a license to keep sinning, Paul’s answer isn’t diplomatic, it’s not a well, try to do your best, it’s an absolute and definitive by no means the idea of continuing in sin while depending on grace is completely incompatible with real salvation.

Paul says, we who have died to sin, past tense, it already happened, it’s not something you hope to achieve someday, it’s something that should have already happened if you’ve really been born again. Dying to sin doesn’t mean you’ll never sin again, it means sin no longer has the same power over you, it means you no longer live in it as your natural state, it means when you sin it hurts, it bothers you, you can’t just move on as if nothing happened. Have you really died to sin, not in theory, not because you said it in a salvation prayer years ago, but in the present reality of your life, when you sin, does it cause you real pain or do you simply acknowledge it was wrong, say a quick prayer and move on with your life.

Psalm 23:4, David reveals a reality most believers never expect in the middle of God’s will, David doesn’t say I avoided the valley or God kept me from the valley, he says I walk through it. The valley is not a detour, it’s part of the path, following the shepherd does not exempt you from darkness, it equips you to conquer it. The phrase shadow of death is a Hebrew expression that means deep darkness, the kind of terror where you cannot see what’s coming next, where danger feels close enough to touch your skin. A shadow is a real shape, whose power depends entirely on your perspective, a shadow cannot harm you, it cannot touch you, it looks like death, but it is not death, some of the most intimidating things in your life right now are not realities, they are shadows.

Fear is a shadow, condemnation is a shadow, betrayal is a shadow, rejection is a shadow, financial panic is a shadow, the diagnoses that keeps you awake at night may be a shadow, the enemy’s greatest weapon is not destruction, it is distraction. The enemy wants you to confuse shadows for substance, to respond to illusions as if they were outcomes, but David exposes the lie, evil only wins when you stop walking. The shepherd never calls you to camp in the valley, he calls you to pass through it, the valley is not your destination, it is your transition. Here’s the stunning truth, God is not the God who removes valleys, he is the God who walks in them, he does not promise a path without darkness, he promises his presence within it.

The valley teaches what the pasture cannot, faith without sight, courage without crowds, identity without applause, trust without explanation, some of the deepest revelations of God are not found on the mountain top, they are discovered in the darkness, when every other voice has gone silent. David isn’t fearless because he avoided shadows, he is fearless because he learned to walk through them, the shadow may look like death, but the shepherd is life, the valley may look like defeat, but the shepherd is victory, the circumstance may look impossible, but the shepherd walks beside you step by step until what terrified you becomes a testimony.

 
  • Like
Reactions: soberxp

amigo de christo

Well-Known Member
Sep 12, 2020
38,038
61,751
113
54
San angelo
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Correct my friend .
To tolerate and accept sin is compromise and it will not save one soul .
To allow sin to remain upon one is not love at all .
Ye shall not HATE your neighbor in your heart , you shall REBUKE him and NOT ALLOW sin upon him .
Any love of GOD would have corrected sin and error and UNBELEIF .
Todays love that many now follow does the opposite , IT allows sins to remain upon unrepentant
it allows EVEN UNBELEIF to remain upon the false religoins .
IT even hollers and says A TRUTH and yet uses such TRUTH to expound upon a lie and lies .
Example .
IT hollers GOD IS LOVE , but then uses that phrase to actually rebuke those who do correct sin and error
and to also justify certain sins as b eing good . And ev en uses that phrase To make a real broad road
OF UNBELIEF that it claims IS TO GOD . The d evil is a liar and he can quoate anything . WHEN he do
HE gonna twist it .
 

Wrangler

Well-Known Member
Feb 14, 2021
21,329
9,279
113
57
Shining City on a Hill
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Acts 17:11, how much more should we be testing everything we hear today, sometimes standing for truth means walking away, sometimes it means leaving a church that has embraced false teaching, sometimes it means distancing yourself from people who refuse to align with scripture and sometimes it means speaking up, even when it costs you relationships. Luke 12:51, that doesn’t mean we are called to be argumentative or hateful, it means that truth divides, it separates light from darkness, it separates deception from righteousness and sometimes it separates us from people who refuse to accept the truth. Are you tolerating false teaching in your life or are you listening to messages that contradict God’s word, because they make you feel good or are you following leaders who preach a different gospel, because they are popular or are you afraid to stand up for truth, because you don’t want to offend.
Great OP!
 

ScottA

Well-Known Member
Feb 24, 2011
15,944
7,131
113
www.FinishingTheMystery.com
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Acts 17:11, how much more should we be testing everything we hear today, sometimes standing for truth means walking away, sometimes it means leaving a church that has embraced false teaching, sometimes it means distancing yourself from people who refuse to align with scripture and sometimes it means speaking up, even when it costs you relationships. Luke 12:51, that doesn’t mean we are called to be argumentative or hateful, it means that truth divides, it separates light from darkness, it separates deception from righteousness and sometimes it separates us from people who refuse to accept the truth. Are you tolerating false teaching in your life or are you listening to messages that contradict God’s word, because they make you feel good or are you following leaders who preach a different gospel, because they are popular or are you afraid to stand up for truth, because you don’t want to offend.

John reminds us, truth is not negotiable, we don’t get to rewrite it, we don’t get to soften it, we don’t get to tolerate what God calls false, because in the end, compromise with deception, is still deception and we cannot afford to welcome it into our lives, anyone who rejects Jesus’ teachings is not of God. We live in a time, when many claim to follow Jesus, but the Jesus they follow is not the Jesus of the Bible, some say he was just a good teacher, others claim he was just one path among many, some take his words and twist them to fit modern beliefs, but John makes it clear, if you reject the teachings of Jesus, you do not belong to God. 2 John 1:9, anyone who runs ahead, anyone who goes beyond what Jesus taught, anyone who adds or takes away from his message, they do not have God. It doesn’t matter how spiritual someone sounds, it doesn't matter how much they talk about God, if they do not hold to Jesus’ true teaching they are not of God.

This is a sobering reality, because today, many have abandoned the foundation of Jesus words in pursuit of new revelations, we see it everywhere, people claim to have special knowledge that isn’t in the Bible, they claim that God is revealing new truths that contradict scripture, some say God is doing a new thing, he’s moving beyond the Bible, but God does not change. Malachi 3:6, Hebrews 13:8, this means his word does not evolve to fit culture, his truth does not shift with human opinions, his teachings are not outdated, they are eternal, but this is where many fall into deception. A man building a house, he lays a foundation of solid stone, strong enough to withstand any storm, but over time he starts listening to new ideas. He hears that brick is stronger, then someone convinces him that wood is better, then another tells him to build on sand, because times have changed. So he abandons his foundation and build something new and then the storm comes, the rain pours, the wind beats against the house and because he left the original foundation his house collapses and this is exactly what happens when people abandon the true teachings of Jesus.

Most people go to church, but live exactly like anyone who has never entered a church, same values, same priorities, same habits, same way of treating others, same love of money, same obsession with comfort, same inability to forgive and when someone points out this contradiction, the answer is always the same. Thank God for his grace, nobody’s perfect, we’re all works in progress and that’s also true, nobody’s perfect and we’re all in process, but there’s a giant difference between being in the process of transformation and being stuck in spiritual mediocrity, while using grace as an excuse, there’s a difference between falling and getting up versus living permanently fallen while declaring you’re covered by grace. Romans 6:1-2, in the first century, there were people using grace as a license to keep sinning, Paul’s answer isn’t diplomatic, it’s not a well, try to do your best, it’s an absolute and definitive by no means the idea of continuing in sin while depending on grace is completely incompatible with real salvation.

Paul says, we who have died to sin, past tense, it already happened, it’s not something you hope to achieve someday, it’s something that should have already happened if you’ve really been born again. Dying to sin doesn’t mean you’ll never sin again, it means sin no longer has the same power over you, it means you no longer live in it as your natural state, it means when you sin it hurts, it bothers you, you can’t just move on as if nothing happened. Have you really died to sin, not in theory, not because you said it in a salvation prayer years ago, but in the present reality of your life, when you sin, does it cause you real pain or do you simply acknowledge it was wrong, say a quick prayer and move on with your life.

Psalm 23:4, David reveals a reality most believers never expect in the middle of God’s will, David doesn’t say I avoided the valley or God kept me from the valley, he says I walk through it. The valley is not a detour, it’s part of the path, following the shepherd does not exempt you from darkness, it equips you to conquer it. The phrase shadow of death is a Hebrew expression that means deep darkness, the kind of terror where you cannot see what’s coming next, where danger feels close enough to touch your skin. A shadow is a real shape, whose power depends entirely on your perspective, a shadow cannot harm you, it cannot touch you, it looks like death, but it is not death, some of the most intimidating things in your life right now are not realities, they are shadows.

Fear is a shadow, condemnation is a shadow, betrayal is a shadow, rejection is a shadow, financial panic is a shadow, the diagnoses that keeps you awake at night may be a shadow, the enemy’s greatest weapon is not destruction, it is distraction. The enemy wants you to confuse shadows for substance, to respond to illusions as if they were outcomes, but David exposes the lie, evil only wins when you stop walking. The shepherd never calls you to camp in the valley, he calls you to pass through it, the valley is not your destination, it is your transition. Here’s the stunning truth, God is not the God who removes valleys, he is the God who walks in them, he does not promise a path without darkness, he promises his presence within it.

The valley teaches what the pasture cannot, faith without sight, courage without crowds, identity without applause, trust without explanation, some of the deepest revelations of God are not found on the mountain top, they are discovered in the darkness, when every other voice has gone silent. David isn’t fearless because he avoided shadows, he is fearless because he learned to walk through them, the shadow may look like death, but the shepherd is life, the valley may look like defeat, but the shepherd is victory, the circumstance may look impossible, but the shepherd walks beside you step by step until what terrified you becomes a testimony.

This is so long it should have been a blog entry. You said a lot that is good, but you went on and on, so I didn't even finish reading. :(
 

Gottservant

Well-Known Member
Oct 19, 2022
2,942
885
113
47
Greensborough
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
Gender
Male
What annoys me, is that believers don't seem to understand that the rubber has to hit the road.

Jesus said "I am sending you out" "pray that you escape the things of the world and are able to stand before Me" - this means we have to be ready to go and committed to praying about it!

I'm not going to say "you are not a Christian", but how long is your Christianity going to last, if you don't do what you are told?
 
  • Like
Reactions: newnature

newnature

Active Member
Mar 24, 2011
737
128
43
What annoys me, is that believers don't seem to understand that the rubber has to hit the road.

Jesus said "I am sending you out" "pray that you escape the things of the world and are able to stand before Me" - this means we have to be ready to go and committed to praying about it!

I'm not going to say "you are not a Christian", but how long is your Christianity going to last, if you don't do what you are told?
 

newnature

Active Member
Mar 24, 2011
737
128
43
What is your point--in one paragraph?
When Paul saying be careful how you live, it’s making the most of every opportunity, every one of us by the presence of God in our lives, has this presence that’s urging us to become more and more capable of just making good decisions with our lives. How should we live in our new identity, whatever your story is, you are absolutely loved and cherished by your Creator, Jesus loved you and gave himself for you, they say, here’s your life, go for it and be wise, make the most of it. There’s this connection between being wise and just making wise decisions with our life and God’s commitment to be personally present with us. If I’m wise, I’m cultivating this understanding that in any given day I can make decisions that are more in line or less in line with God’s will, but many of us have a conception of God’s will as if it’s some secret hidden purpose that you need to figure out for your life. We talk about it, am I in God’s will, am I going against God’s will, we think God’s will as if it’s some point on a map and I need to find out where the point is, and then figure out how I’m supposed to get there, that’s not how the Bible talks about God’s will.
 

ScottA

Well-Known Member
Feb 24, 2011
15,944
7,131
113
www.FinishingTheMystery.com
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
When Paul saying be careful how you live, it’s making the most of every opportunity, every one of us by the presence of God in our lives, has this presence that’s urging us to become more and more capable of just making good decisions with our lives. How should we live in our new identity, whatever your story is, you are absolutely loved and cherished by your Creator, Jesus loved you and gave himself for you, they say, here’s your life, go for it and be wise, make the most of it. There’s this connection between being wise and just making wise decisions with our life and God’s commitment to be personally present with us. If I’m wise, I’m cultivating this understanding that in any given day I can make decisions that are more in line or less in line with God’s will, but many of us have a conception of God’s will as if it’s some secret hidden purpose that you need to figure out for your life. We talk about it, am I in God’s will, am I going against God’s will, we think God’s will as if it’s some point on a map and I need to find out where the point is, and then figure out how I’m supposed to get there, that’s not how the Bible talks about God’s will.
Kinda like "What would Jesus do?"
 

ScottA

Well-Known Member
Feb 24, 2011
15,944
7,131
113
www.FinishingTheMystery.com
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Are you tolerating false teaching in your life or are you listening to messages that contradict God’s word, because they make you feel good or are you following leaders who preach a different gospel, because they are popular or are you afraid to stand up for truth, because you don’t want to offend.
This is a good point.

Unfortunately for us who live during these times, much of what is practiced is from hand-me-down hearsay, unknowingly rooted in the "destructive heresies" of the "false teachers" spoken of by Peter, which after all this time are so polished even by some well-intentioned men of God, that it's believable. Which now makes the actual truth sound like "a different gospel", one to be shunned, because we have been lead to believe a "private interpretation" of long ago.

Good men of God ought rather to be hearing what the Spirit says. But even that is now twisted to align with those "false" "teachings of men" from long ago. Unfortunately.
 
  • Like
Reactions: newnature

newnature

Active Member
Mar 24, 2011
737
128
43
Kinda like "What would Jesus do?"
Paul talks about God’s will, about the parameters that God has set in place for our new life, as new kinds of humans in Jesus. Purity with regard to having sex to someone your not married to, this is not God’s will and so, that’s where the pressure is there, that’s a way to ruin your life real quick. Biblical authors referred to God’s will, it has to do with discerning what’s pleasing to God. All kinds of things could be God’s will and in many passages in Paul, Paul talks about the renewal of your mind, a Christians mind is renewed when your new identity in the gospel, you will be able to cultivate the skill of discerning what God’s will is, the good and perfect will, it’s gaining the intuition.
 

ScottA

Well-Known Member
Feb 24, 2011
15,944
7,131
113
www.FinishingTheMystery.com
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Paul talks about God’s will, about the parameters that God has set in place for our new life, as new kinds of humans in Jesus. Purity with regard to having sex to someone your not married to, this is not God’s will and so, that’s where the pressure is there, that’s a way to ruin your life real quick. Biblical authors referred to God’s will, it has to do with discerning what’s pleasing to God. All kinds of things could be God’s will and in many passages in Paul, Paul talks about the renewal of your mind, a Christians mind is renewed when your new identity in the gospel, you will be able to cultivate the skill of discerning what God’s will is, the good and perfect will, it’s gaining the intuition.
The place that we are in, in this world and this life we now live, that place where every person fines themselves--it is more than learning to do what is good according to the things we face and experience in this world--it is preparation for transitioning from this elementary form of life in flesh and blood to that higher place of God who is spirit and perfect. So in our little lives and experiences--yes--we should do what is right in God's eyes, but more importantly, go forth as passing through, and do so with expectation of that which is greater than can be known or experienced in this lowly form.

How then ought we to live? As if with "one foot on the land and one on the sea"--as one foot in this world doing what Jesus would do walking through this "valley of the shadow of death" as it gets darker, and yet also with one foot in heaven, as walking "with God in the cool of the evening"--with reflection. Walking in such a way leaves a reflection on the surface of the water, even a reflection of ourselves like a mirror allowing us to keep in-check--that as we walk we are even unable to leave the one and be solely in the other (as having two feet in this world, or two in heaven). For a time, both feet are indeed in the world, but as we proceed, as our time wanes, the one should decrease while the other increases--this is "Christ in us." Then comes the end.

It is coming--The End--and that is how we ought to now live.
 

newnature

Active Member
Mar 24, 2011
737
128
43
The place that we are in, in this world and this life we now live, that place where every person fines themselves--it is more than learning to do what is good according to the things we face and experience in this world--it is preparation for transitioning from this elementary form of life in flesh and blood to that higher place of God who is spirit and perfect. So in our little lives and experiences--yes--we should do what is right in God's eyes, but more importantly, go forth as passing through, and do so with expectation of that which is greater than can be known or experienced in this lowly form.

How then ought we to live? As if with "one foot on the land and one on the sea"--as one foot in this world doing what Jesus would do walking through this "valley of the shadow of death" as it gets darker, and yet also with one foot in heaven, as walking "with God in the cool of the evening"--with reflection. Walking in such a way leaves a reflection on the surface of the water, even a reflection of ourselves like a mirror allowing us to keep in-check--that as we walk we are even unable to leave the one and be solely in the other (as having two feet in this world, or two in heaven). For a time, both feet are indeed in the world, but as we proceed, as our time wanes, the one should decrease while the other increases--this is "Christ in us." Then comes the end.

It is coming--The End--and that is how we ought to now live.
Paul’s asking us to entertain this idea, how does the human being get to a place where something that’s clearly morally wrong or clearly destructive to their body or to other people, where they are fine with that. Paul uses this word of becoming calloused, someone gets to a place where they become so hardened to the well-being of other people or themselves, that they make decisions like that.
 

Wrangler

Well-Known Member
Feb 14, 2021
21,329
9,279
113
57
Shining City on a Hill
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Gender
Male
something that’s clearly morally wrong or clearly destructive to their body or to other people, where they are fine with that. Paul uses this word of becoming calloused, someone gets to a place where they become so hardened to the well-being of other people or themselves, that they make decisions like that.
I think it is what and HOW we do things. Compassion or not.
 

newnature

Active Member
Mar 24, 2011
737
128
43
I think it is what and HOW we do things. Compassion or not.
Paul says, it starts in your mind, in your thinking and your mindset, there’s some darkening, the lights turned off and your ability to make connections anymore. This is Paul’s greater portrait of human beings who estranged themselves from God by declaring themselves to be God and by declaring themselves to be the ultimate judges of right and wrong, they are the captain of the ship that their little subculture defines for them.