A Third Jewish Temple is Required

[Earburner]

If the antichrist is supernatural as the Bible claims and he could snap his fingers and lightning came down
Why could he not snap his fingers and a temple appear?

If you are not expecting the unexpected, you are going to be taken up with the deception

I believe everybody’s putting too much attention on the temple, and that will be their downfall

No! Everyone of church-ianity is promoting the LIE, that there will be to come a fictitious, one man wonder, that THEY call "THE Antichrist".

In the KJV, one will NOT find the words: "The Antichrist". However, there is "THAT spirit of antichrist", and therefore infects MANY to be antichrists.

 

[Stash]

No! Everyone of church-ianity is promoting the LIE, that there will be to come a fictitious, one man wonder, that THEY call "THE Antichrist".

In the KJV, one NOT find the words: "The Antichrist". However, there is "THAT spirit of antichrist", and therefore infects MANY to be antichrists.

At our church, we study current events and see how they apply to the Bible

Yes, there are many antichrist walking around today

However, none of them is supernatural
That’s why Trump cannot be the antichrist

Without sounding like a jerk when I read what people say, I could pretty much tell they’re going to be taken up by the antichrist with his delusions

 

[Earburner]

At our church, we study current events and see how they apply to the Bible

Yes, there are many antichrist walking around today

However, none of them is supernatural
That’s why Trump cannot be the antichrist

Without sounding like a jerk when I read what people say, I could pretty much tell they’re going to be taken up by the antichrist with his delusions

No again! There will be NO "supernatural" "THE Antichrist" to come at all!!
All of that is a fabrication, due to misinterpreting Daniel, concerning the "little horn" and the prophecy of the "70 weeks".
Both the "little horn" and the 70th week were fulfilled long ago.

 

[Stash]

That’s your opinion
So you’re saying the two witnesses have already been killed by the antichrist and they have risen after 3 1/2 days

That absolutely makes no sense

Please give me a Bible verse or a theory on the two witnesses that laid in the street and don’t tell me it was the church

Because I will laugh

 

[Earburner]

That’s your opinion
So you’re saying the two witnesses have already been killed by the antichrist and they have risen after 3 1/2 days

That absolutely makes no sense

Please give me a Bible verse or a theory on the two witnesses that laid in the street and don’t tell me it was the church

Because I will laugh

Let the scriptures interpret the book of Rev., and not Rev. to interpret the scriptures.

KJV Zech. 4
[14] Then said he, These are the  TWO anointed ones, that stand by [for] the LORD of the whole earth.

KJV Luke 1
[11] And there appeared unto him an angel of the Lord standing on the right side of the altar of incense.
[12] And when Zacharias saw him, he was troubled, and fear fell upon him.
[13] But the angel said unto him, Fear not, Zacharias: for thy prayer is heard; and thy wife Elisabeth shall bear thee a son, and thou shalt call his name John.
[14] And thou shalt have joy and gladness; and many shall rejoice at his birth.
[15] For he shall be great in the sight of the Lord, and shall drink neither wine nor strong drink; and he shall be filled with the Holy Ghost, even from his mother's womb.

KJV Mat. 19
[12] For there are some eunuchs, which were so born [being eunuchs] from their mother's womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs of men: and there be eunuchs, which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it.

KJV Mat. 11
[7] And as they departed, Jesus began to say unto the multitudes concerning John, What went ye out into the wilderness to see? A reed shaken with the wind?
[8] But what went ye out for to see? A man clothed in soft raiment? behold, they that wear soft clothing are in kings' houses.
[9] But what went ye out for to see? A prophet? yea, I say unto you, and more than a prophet.
[10] For this is he, of whom it is written, Behold, I send my messenger before thy face, which shall prepare thy way before thee.
[11] Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath NOT risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is LEAST in the kingdom of heaven is GREATER than he.
[12] And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force.
[13] For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.
[14] And if ye will receive it, this is Elias, which was for to come.
[15] He that hath ears to hear, let him hear.

John 1*
[51] And he saith unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto you, *Hereafter YE shall SEE heaven OPEN, and the  ANGELS of God ascending and descending upon the Son of man. > aka "The Transfiguration"

 

[Davy]

You have interpreted that backwards.

Nope!
I did NOT interpret what Jesus said as "backwards".

It's your misplaced faith you put in charlatans that misteach what Jesus said about being the 1st one TAKEN that is your problem...

Matt 24:28
28 For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together.
KJV

Luke 17:36-37
36 Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
37 And they answered and said unto Him, "Where, Lord?" And He said unto them, "Wheresoever the body (carcase) is, thither will the eagles be gathered together."
KJV

 

[Earburner]

Nope!
I did NOT interpret what Jesus said as "backwards".

It's your misplaced faith you put in charlatans that misteach what Jesus said about being the 1st one TAKEN that is your problem...

Matt 24:28
28 For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together.
KJV

Luke 17:36-37
36 Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
37 And they answered and said unto Him, "Where, Lord?" And He said unto them, "Wheresoever the body (carcase) is, thither will the eagles be gathered together."
KJV

The way you said it sounded backwards to me.
Ok! So then, we do agree that when the Lord returns from Heaven in all His Glory, all born again saints shall be FIRST gathered unto the Lord in the air, being changed into the Lord's likeness of His Immortality.

 

[Davy]

The way you said it sounded backwards to me.
Ok! So then, we do agree that when the Lord returns from Heaven in all His Glory, all born again saints shall be FIRST gathered unto the Lord in the air, being changed into the Lord's likeness of His Immortality.

The two men in the field, one TAKEN and the other left behind is NOT about Jesus coming 1st to gather His Church.

Because Jesus' answer that the 1st one TAKEN will be as a dead carcase wheresoever the fowls are gathered, is about being TAKEN by the false-Christ, because the false-Christ comes BEFORE Jesus comes.

This is why the Pre-trib Rapture theory is false, because it preaches Jesus comes to gather His Church PRIOR to the "great tribulation", when Jesus showed His coming is AFTER the "great tribulation". So His Message is to WAIT on Him. And the two in the field analogy is that He wants us to REMAIN in the field working for Him, waiting for His coming after the tribulation.

 

[Phoneman777]

Davy, didja know the ECFs taught the "Restrainer" was the Pagan Roman Empire that, once taken out of the way, would give immediate rise to the Antichrist - unlike your Jesuit Futurist nonsense which has you still waiting for Antichrist 1500 years later?

That's why Paul didn't dare reiterate in his 2 Thessalonians 2 letter what he'd previously told them in person about who the Restrainer was, lest the letter fall into the hands of Roman authorities and Christianity be wiped off the face of the Earth before the wax seal of Caesar's extermination order cooled off.

 

[Phoneman777]

"Just the facts ma'am."

1. The Daniel 9:27 and Daniel 11:31 events of ending the daily sacrifice and placing an IDOL abomination inside the temple causing it to become spiritually desolate, was prophesied for the END by Lord Jesus Christ in Matthew 24 and Mark 13...

Matt 24:15-21
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand
16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:
17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:
18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.
19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
KJV

Mark 13:14-19
14 But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains:
15 And let him that is on the housetop not go down into the house, neither enter therein, to take any thing out of his house:
16 And let him that is in the field not turn back again for to take up his garment.
17 But woe to them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!
18 And pray ye that your flight be not in the winter.
19 For in those days shall be affliction, such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be.
KJV

2. The above Scripture proof by Lord Jesus Himself, reveals that "abomination of desolation" IDOL event is reserved for the very end of this world, for the time of "great tribulation" that He warned about in those verses also.

3. The confirming of the "covenant" of Daniel 9:27 is the "league" of Daniel 11:21-23 which the "vile person" will make at the end of this world with a small group of orthodox Jews in Jerusalem. That "league" is the confirming of the 'old covenant' among the orthodox Jews at the end of this world, meaning re-establishing the old covenant worship among the unbelieving Jews in today's Jerusalem. That "vile person" represents the final Antichrist in Jerusalem at the very end of this present world.

4. The orthodox Jews believe that when Messiah returns, the Levitical priesthood and animal sacrifices will be re-established, and that must include a new temple in Jerusalem.

5. Old covenant worship involved the daily sacrifices, and worship inside a Jewish temple, in Jerusalem. That is what MUST be re-instituted for the end among the orthodox Jews in Jerusalem in order for the "abomination of desolation" prophecy to be fulfilled.

6. Because Jesus referred to this Daniel 9:27 and Daniel 11:31 "abomination of desolation" prophecy as a SIGN in His Olivet discourse, and linked it with the time of "great tribulation" at the end of this world, this means these events will happen in the FINAL generation on earth that will see Jesus' future return.

6. Because the "abomination of desolation" prophecy in Daniel involves a STANDING JEWISH TEMPLE, with an IDOL ABOMINATION placed in it, this means there will... be a 3rd Jewish Temple built in Jerusalem in order for this prophecy to be fulfilled.

The Cornerstone Is Ready

The event of the cornerstone started the fulfillment of the end-time prophecy of Isaiah and Micah

www.templemountfaithful.org

Davy, buddy, how many times I gotta tell you God would never refer to a building as the "temple of God" in which the sacrifices denying the Lamb of God would be a national middle finger in the face of God?

How many times, Davy? How many times I gotta tell you that every time Paul calls the church a "temple" he uses the same Greek word "naos" that he used in 2 Thessalonians 2 for "temple of God"?

The "Temple of God" is the church which "fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord."

The Papal Rome Antichrist immediately arose when the Pagan Rome "Restrainer" was taken out of the way, and it sat down in the "church" showing itself to be God, while dragging every stripe and type of pagan doctrine into Christianity, including:

• idolatry
• Sunday sacredness
• immortality of the soul
• eternal torment
• and the most reprehensible of all - the necessity of the catholic intercessory priesthood for salvation

...as well as a host of other false doctrines from what the intrepid Luther called "the Roman dunghill of decretals".

 

[Earburner]

The two men in the field, one TAKEN and the other left behind is NOT about Jesus coming 1st to gather His Church.

Because Jesus' answer that the 1st one TAKEN will be as a dead carcase wheresoever the fowls are gathered, is about being TAKEN by the false-Christ, because the false-Christ comes BEFORE Jesus comes.

This is why the Pre-trib Rapture theory is false, because it preaches Jesus comes to gather His Church PRIOR to the "great tribulation", when Jesus showed His coming is AFTER the "great tribulation". So His Message is to WAIT on Him. And the two in the field analogy is that He wants us to REMAIN in the field working for Him, waiting for His coming after the tribulation.

But I am not of the "Pre-trib theory". I am of the "in the Same Day of when theory".
KJV Luke 17:26-30; 2Thes. 1:7&10.

Edit: In the Day of Christ's visible and Glorious return, the redemption of all the saints and the destruction of all the unsaved wicked will be a simultaneous event, all in the SAME Day.

 

[Earburner]

Davy, buddy, how many times I gotta tell you God would never refer to a building as the "temple of God" in which the sacrifices denying the Lamb of God would be a national middle finger in the face of God?

How many times, Davy? How many times I gotta tell you that every time Paul calls the church a "temple" he uses the same Greek word "naos" that he used in 2 Thessalonians 2 for "temple of God"?

The "Temple of God" is the church which "fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord."

The Papal Rome Antichrist immediately arose when the Pagan Rome "Restrainer" was taken out of the way, and it sat down in the "church" showing itself to be God, while dragging every stripe and type of pagan doctrine into Christianity, including:

• idolatry
• Sunday sacredness
• immortality of the soul
• eternal torment
• and the most reprehensible of all - the necessity of the catholic intercessory priesthood for salvation

...as well as a host of other false doctrines from what the intrepid Luther called "the Roman dunghill of decretals".

Did you know that in all of the NT scriptures, there are ONLY two prophetic "mothers", that are ever spoken of? Please see all of Gal. 4.
The Papacy is not one of those two "mothers", nor is it the beast having seven heads.

Rev. 13
[1] And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.
[2] And the [Sea] beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion:
and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.
Biblically speaking, on what prophetic heads in Daniel did the Papacy ever sit on??
Iows, WHEN was the Papacy ever there, WHEN the leopard (3rd beast), the bear (2nd beast) and the Lion (1st beast) ruled on the earth? Ans. The Papacy was never sitting on any one of them , but Israel did!!

Now, keeping with John's writing in 96AD., John knew well of the destruction of Jerusalem in 70AD. Therefore, by referencing Daniel about the "make up" of the "Sea Beast", who were the 7 heads, as described in the following?
[9] And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains [kingdoms], on which the woman sitteth.
[10] And there are seven kings [kingdoms]: five are fallen [past], and ONE IS [present], and the other is not yet come [future]; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.

Ever since the Roman Empire collapsed, and the dispersion of it's people into Europe (iron/clay), the Sea beast having 10 horns (but are not known of yet), is still with us, and has been EVOLVING into its final form of becoming a Global Economic Empire, which is form of empire that has never come upon the earth.

So the question is: who were the seven heads, long before John wrote Rev. in 96AD?? You can count them in Daniel, as Rev. 13:2 reveals them.
[11] And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth [head], and IS OF the seven, [heads] and goeth into perdition.

Our clue, that the final form of the Sea beast will be an economic empire:
Rev. 13
[16] And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond [all people], to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
[17] And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark [Digital ID for individuals], or the name of the beast [for governments], or the number of his name [for businesses].

Though this is a brief outline of my understanding, it is enough to reveal that the Sea beast is "carrying" (KJV) earthly Jerusalem (the daughter of Zion), and NOT that of the Papacy!!

Oh, and by the way, since "Jerusalem which now is", is the "Daughter of Zion", it is evident that she once HAD a "mother", of which is "Heavenly Jerusalem" above, the mother of us all [who are of faith]. Unfortunately, the "Daugher of Zion" "is fallen", by becoming a "whore", and is now herself a "mother" also, being that of "the mother of harlots"

 

[Phoneman777]

Did you know that in all of the NT scriptures, there are ONLY two prophetic "mothers", that are ever spoken of? Please see all of Gal. 4. The Papacy is not one of those two "mothers"

Galatians 4 does NOT depict an apostate church - it's an illustration concerning the passing away of the OC and the arrival of the NC.

nor is it the beast having seven heads.

It's incredible how Jesuit Futurists like yourself deny what the entire Protestant Historicist world knew and taught for centuries, as if papal Jesuits are qualified to teach us anything.

The Beast of Revelation 13 - the papacy - incorporates all the attributes of the previous beasts/horns that came before it ("yet their lives were prolonged for a season and a time" before the arrival of the papal Little Horn). Any Jew receiving word of Revelation 13 would immediately turn to Daniel 7 to decipher the symbolism, but you Jesuit Futurists can't?

Biblically speaking, on what prophetic heads in Daniel did the Papacy ever sit on??

There's no mention of the Beast sitting on any heads.

WHEN was the Papacy ever there, WHEN the leopard (3rd beast), the bear (2nd beast) and the Lion (1st beast) ruled on the earth?

What Bible are you reading? The Beast of Revelation 13 is identical to the Little Horn of Daniel which arose after the 4 beasts and ten horns, which is exactly what the ECFs all taught - what you're claiming was unknown to the world until the Jesuit Counter Reformation.

Therefore, by referencing Daniel about the "make up" of the "Sea Beast", who were the 7 heads, as described in the following?
[9] And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains [kingdoms], on which the woman sitteth.

John specifically says the "Sea Beast" is "that great city which reigneth over the kings of the Earth" - ROME!

Everyone knows Rome is known as "the seven hilled city". Jesuit Futurists argue "Jerusalem" but Jerusalem NEVER "reigned over the kings of the Earth...Rome did!

[10] And there are seven kings [kingdoms]: five are fallen [past], and ONE IS [present], and the other is not yet come [future]; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.

See, Jesuit Futurists always cast aside the precise prophetic template in Daniel and Revelation and appeal to the not-so-precise prophecy of Revelation 17 to "prove" their Jesuit Futurist nonsense. While none of us can say for certain what it all means, by sticking to the prophetic template and timeline of Daniel and Revelation, the best explanation I've found so far is concerning the 7 kings:

1. Babylon
2. MP
3. Greece
4. Pagan Rome
5. Papal Rome
6. ("is not, yet is") Wounded papacy operating behind the scenes via papal-controlled secret Luciferian societies arising from the "bottomless pit" to control the world during this interim (click the link!)
7. "not yet come" - Image of the Beast
8. "eighth, of the 7" - final NWO confederacy under ultimate papal control

Some may disagree, but they cannot deny this interpretation sticks to the prophetic timeline while Jesuit Futurists interpretations don't even occupy the same Scriptural universe.


Why don't you set aside Jesuit Futurist nonsense and take a hard look at Protestant Historicism?

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLTbHLOB5jHyPxt6B3dZfpVCTpDK6VdBUi

Ever since the Roman Empire collapsed, and the dispersion of it's people into Europe (iron/clay), the Sea beast having 10 horns (but are not known of yet)

Unknown only to Jesuit Futurists like yourself who cast aside the word of the ECFs, the word of the Protestant Reformers, the word of modern depositories of Protestant eschatological truth like myself, and appeal to 19th century Jesuit "diversionary tactic" errors - Futurism and Preterism - which were invented to send those in search of antichrist to the past or the future and away from papal Rome!

So the question is: who were the seven heads, long before John wrote Rev. in 96AD?? You can count them in Daniel, as Rev. 13:2 reveals them.
[11] And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth [head], and IS OF the seven, [heads] and goeth into perdition.

I've already shown you above the closest interpretation to the prophetic timeline ^^^ from which you Jesuit Futurists erroneously depart so you can make Daniel and Revelation support Jesuit Futurist nonsense.

Our clue, that the final form of the Sea beast will be an economic empire:
Rev. 13
[16] And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond [all people], to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
[17] And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark [Digital ID for individuals], or the name of the beast [for governments], or the number of his name [for businesses].

Though this is a brief outline of my understanding, it us enough to reveal that the Sea beast is "carrying" (KJV) earthly Jerusalem (the daughter of Zion), and NOT that of the Papacy!!

If you knew what the papacy was, you might finally understand prophecy!

The papacy is the "union of church and state" and will be the head of the coming NWO, as mentioned in Revelation 18 - so, of course it will be involved with economic affairs of the world. Have you never read "Rerum Novarum" or "Laudato Si" which are all about total papal control of the planet?

No - because you've well drunk the Jesuit Koolaid and are looking for the rise of Antichrist in exactly the place Jesuit Futurism sends those who seek it: the future.

 

[Earburner]

Galatians 4 does NOT depict an apostate church - it's an illustration concerning the passing away of the OC and the arrival of the NC.

Exactly, and that's the point. The RCC does not ever deny that the Eternal Son, aka the Lamb of God, has come to us in the flesh!

However, Gal. 4 speaks allegorically of the ONLY TWO MOTHERS in all of NT scripture.
1. The "fallen whore", the mother of harlots, being Jerusalem that now is, and is in bondage with her children [Israel and their "semetic" family feudal wars].

2. "Heavenly Jerusalem" above, which is the mother of us all [who are of faith].

It's incredible how Jesuit Futurists like yourself deny what the entire Protestant Historicist world knew and taught for centuries, as if papal Jesuits are qualified to teach us anything.

The Beast of Revelation 13 - the papacy - incorporates all the attributes of the previous beasts/horns that came before it ("yet their lives were prolonged for a season and a time" before the arrival of the papal Little Horn). Any Jew receiving word of Revelation 13 would immediately turn to Daniel 7 to decipher the symbolism, but you Jesuit Futurists can't?

Mistake #1: there was no future "little horn" to come, after the prophecy was fulfilled by Antiochus Epiphanes lV.

There's no mention of the Beast sitting on any heads.

So now, the Papacy is the 10H Beast, and not the whore, as you believe? Which is it?
You shouldn't switch back and forth to your likeing.

Well of course it wasn't the Papacy that sat on EACH of the seven heads, ever since Babylon (1st beast- Dan.) to the Roman Empire (4th beast-Dan.). It was Jerusalem/Israel.

What Bible are you reading? The Beast of Revelation 13 is identical to the Little Horn of Daniel which arose after the 4 beasts and ten horns, which is exactly what the ECFs all taught - what you're claiming was unknown to the world until the Jesuit Counter Reformation.

As I did say: that is mistake #1.

John specifically says the "Sea Beast" is "that great city which reigneth over the kings of the Earth" - ROME!

Again, how does the 10H Beast "carry" the "whore", if the "whore" is the 10H beast??
Sorry, you should know by now that it is those Jews who say they are Jews and are not, but ARE "the synagogue of satan"

Everyone knows Rome is known as "the seven hilled city". Jesuit Futurists argue "Jerusalem" but Jerusalem NEVER "reigned over the kings of the Earth...Rome did!

It's not about 7 literal hills/ mountains, but rather 7 kingdoms, beginning from Babylon to the Roman Empire. Israel has sat on all of them, while the Papacy has done no such thing.

See, Jesuit Futurists always cast aside the precise prophetic template in Daniel and Revelation and appeal to the not-so-precise prophecy of Revelation 17 to "prove" their Jesuit Futurist nonsense. While none of us can say for certain what it all means, by sticking to the prophetic template and timeline of Daniel and Revelation, the best explanation I've found so far is concerning the 7 kings:

1. Babylon
2. MP
3. Greece
4. Pagan Rome
5. Papal Rome
6. ("is not, yet is") Wounded papacy operating behind the scenes via papal-controlled secret Luciferian societies arising from the "bottomless pit" to control the world during this interim (click the link!)
7. "not yet come" - Image of the Beast
8. "eighth, of the 7" - final NWO confederacy under ultimate papal control

In your list you forgot the "four heads" of the four Hellenistic empires, "in the latter part of their kingdom" of the Grecian Empire, the 3rd beast. Dan. 8:22-23.
That means that you have erroneously foisted 4 others in place of them.
You need to fall back and correct that error.

The two legs of iron was Rome and Constanstinople, of which dispersed into Europe, being the feet of iron/clay.
From out of Europe, the 10 horns shall be appointed by the Sea beast, to burn the "whore" [Israel] with fire, just before Jesus returns.
Get ready for world WW3 in the Euphrates region. Rev. 9:13-21

Some may disagree, but they cannot deny this interpretation sticks to the prophetic timeline while Jesuit Futurists interpretations don't even occupy the same Scriptural universe.


Why don't you set aside Jesuit Futurist nonsense and take a hard look at Protestant Historicism?

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLTbHLOB5jHyPxt6B3dZfpVCTpDK6VdBUi

Unknown only to Jesuit Futurists like yourself who cast aside the word of the ECFs, the word of the Protestant Reformers, the word of modern depositories of Protestant eschatological truth like myself, and appeal to 19th century Jesuit "diversionary tactic" errors - Futurism and Preterism - which were invented to send those in search of antichrist to the past or the future and away from papal Rome!

I've already shown you above the closest interpretation to the prophetic timeline ^^^ from which you Jesuit Futurists erroneously depart so you can make Daniel and Revelation support Jesuit Futurist nonsense.

If you knew what the papacy was, you might finally understand prophecy!

The papacy is the "union of church and state" and will be the head of the coming NWO, as mentioned in Revelation 18 - so, of course it will be involved with economic affairs of the world. Have you never read "Rerum Novarum" or "Laudato Si" which are all about total papal control of the planet?

No - because you've well drunk the Jesuit Koolaid and are looking for the rise of Antichrist in exactly the place Jesuit Futurism sends those who seek it: the future.

And you think that the RCC, along with the thousands of protestant denominations of church-ianity are not the "harlots" of their mother Jerusalem, that NOW IS??
What is "Christian Zionism", but the foolish belief that God still has Israel as His chosen people!!
If they don't come to God through faith in Jesus now, they are each equally lost, as would be any Gentile.

 

[Phoneman777]

Exactly, and that's the point. The RCC does not ever deny that the Eternal Son, aka the Lamb of God, has come to us in the flesh!

I don't expect Jesuit Futurists and Jesuit Preterists to know how it is the papal antichrist denies Jesus Christ has come in the flesh - they're too busy drinking the Jesuit Koolaid to give Protestant Historicism the attention it deserves, though it defined the entire Protestant world for over 300 years until just about 150 years ago...so, I'll explain:

The catholic doctrine of the "Immaculate Conception" is not about Jesus - it's about Mary. Supposedly, Mary was "immaculately conceived" by her parents and was born "spared from all stain of original sin". Therefore, her flesh combined with the Holy Spirit produced a Savior that has not come in the same flesh as the rest of us have: "fallen flesh". The Scripture is clear that "He Himself, also, likewise, took part of the same" flesh because "He took not on Him the nature of angels; but He took on Him the seed of Abraham."

Therefore, "Just as no man cometh to the Father except through the Son, no man cometh to the Son accept through Mary".

The liar "Mother Teresa" was quoted, "No Mary, no Jesus".

Since "Anti-Christos" means to "in the place of" or "instead of Christ" or "in behalf of" Christ, now you understand the basis for the false catholic doctrine of "Intercession" which requires the believer to seek out Mary or the Saints or the catholic priesthood as mediator between him and Jesus...because the "different" flesh of Jesus makes Him "unapproachable" without mediation. Of course, this means nothing to those who are satisfied with only with Jesuit Futurism and Preterism sensationalist eschatology.

 

[Phoneman777]

Exactly, and that's the point. The RCC does not ever deny that the Eternal Son, aka the Lamb of God, has come to us in the flesh!

In another post, I showed how the Roman church does just that via their "Immaculate Conception" doctrine.

1. The "fallen whore", the mother of harlots, being Jerusalem that now is, and is in bondage with her children [Israel and their "semetic" family feudal wars].

No - the "whore" is an apostate church, not those who've dropped off the prophetic timeline forever when the Gospel was taken from them and given to the Gentiles.

Mistake #1: there was no future "little horn" to come, after the prophecy was fulfilled by Antiochus Epiphanes lV.

No way the Greek Antiochus arose "among" the Ten Horns that arose out of the fallen Roman Empire! Good gravy, man, you're blown by every wind of Jesuit doctrine because you don't stick to the prophetic timeline!

You shouldn't switch back and forth to your likeing.

Switch back and forth between what? The Ten Horns of Daniel and Revelation are the same, with perhaps a dual prophecy of a coming "ten world divisions" like the "Club or Rome" or something.

Well of course it wasn't the Papacy that sat on EACH of the seven heads, ever since Babylon (1st beast- Dan.) to the Roman Empire (4th beast-Dan.). It was Jerusalem/Israel.

Wrong! I've told you "the woman is that great city with reigneth over the kings of the Earth" - Jerusalem never reigned over the Earth, nor is it the city upon 7 hills upon which the woman sits - it's ROME.

Again, how does the 10H Beast "carry" the "whore", if the "whore" is the 10H beast??

Because Revelation 13 depicts the papacy but Revelation 17 depicts the papacy in greater detail. I hope by now you understand God's prophetic principle of "Repetition and Enlargement".

Did Daniel 2 show us the Little Horn antichrist? No - that came later in Daniel 7. So, too, the "Beast of Revelation 13" is the papacy - the union of church and state - but the "Whore Riding the Beast in Revelation 17" is the unmistakable depiction of the catholic church in control of the secular governments of the world.

Just as wicked pagan priestess Jezebel controlled the direction of the king, so too, the wicked Whore holds the reins of the beast upon which she rides.

Sorry, you should know by now that it is those Jews who say they are Jews and are not, but ARE "the synagogue of satan"

"Jews" is a symbolic prophetic expression for "Christians" - everyone knows Christians were called "Jews" by Pagan Rome because they, among other things, kept the Sabbath day!

That's right, Earburner, you didn't know that, did you? Read what Socrates Scholasticus and St. Patrick have to say about which day was kept throughout the Christian world.

It's not about 7 literal hills/ mountains, but rather 7 kingdoms, beginning from Babylon to the Roman Empire. Israel has sat on all of them, while the Papacy has done no such thing.

John says the city "reigns over the kings of the Earth".

In your list you forgot the "four heads" of the four Hellenistic empires, "in the latter part of their kingdom" of the Grecian Empire, the 3rd beast. Dan. 8:22-23.

Really? They remained GREEK which is why no one but you draws a distinction.

That means that you have erroneously foisted 4 others in place of them.
You need to fall back and correct that error.

False distinction on your part isn't "erroneous foisting" on our part.

The two legs of iron was Rome and Constanstinople, of which dispersed into Europe, being the feet of iron/clay.
From out of Europe, the 10 horns shall be appointed by the Sea beast, to burn the "whore" [Israel] with fire, just before Jesus returns.
Get ready for world WW3 in the Euphrates region. Rev. 9:13-21

LOL The two legs represent Rome, not Constantinople. Did you forget that prophecy concerns nations that impact God's people? Compared to the extreme expansion and persecution of Christianity in the Western Roman Empire, Constantinople was merely a byword.

And you think that the RCC, along with the thousands of protestant denominations of church-ianity are not the "harlots" of their mother Jerusalem, that NOW IS??

The papacy is the Antichrist/Little Horn/Man of Sin/Beast of Revelation 13/Whore Riding the Beast - while "apostate Protestantism" is the "False Prophet" which will be the driving force behind the "image to the beast" when the religious laws now on the books will be enforced, contrary to the 1st Amendment.

What is "Christian Zionism", but the foolish belief that God still has Israel as His chosen people!!
If they don't come to God through faith in Jesus now, they are each equally lost, as would be any Gentile.

It seems this is the only area upon which we agree. Zionists use and abuse Christianity when the "bless them that bless you, curse them that curse you" promise applies not to them, but "Abraham's seed" - the church.

 

[Earburner]

I don't expect Jesuit Futurists and Jesuit Preterists to know how it is the papal antichrist denies Jesus Christ has come in the flesh - they're too busy drinking the Jesuit Koolaid to give Protestant Historicism the attention it deserves, though it defined the entire Protestant world for over 300 years until just about 150 years ago...so, I'll explain:

The catholic doctrine of the "Immaculate Conception" is not about Jesus - it's about Mary. Supposedly, Mary was "immaculately conceived" by her parents and was born "spared from all stain of original sin". Therefore, her flesh combined with the Holy Spirit produced a Savior that has not come in the same flesh as the rest of us have: "fallen flesh". The Scripture is clear that "He Himself, also, likewise, took part of the same" flesh because "He took not on Him the nature of angels; but He took on Him the seed of Abraham."

Therefore, "Just as no man cometh to the Father except through the Son, no man cometh to the Son accept through Mary".

The liar "Mother Teresa" was quoted, "No Mary, no Jesus".

Since "Anti-Christos" means to "in the place of" or "instead of Christ" or "in behalf of" Christ, now you understand the basis for the false catholic doctrine of "Intercession" which requires the believer to seek out Mary or the Saints or the catholic priesthood as mediator between him and Jesus...because the "different" flesh of Jesus makes Him "unapproachable" without mediation. Of course, this means nothing to those who are satisfied with only with Jesuit Futurism and Preterism sensationalist eschatology.

"Beware of the leaven [religion] of the pharisees", aka "the wisdom of men"-1 Cor. 2:5.
For example: the "Early church fathers-ECF" were not anointed by the Holy Spirit, but rather were "theo-logical", using their "natural minds" to discern God's word.
Personally, I do not acknowledge the ECF, nor do I quote them.

How is that which the "religion" of the RCC demands from its members, any different than what the "religion" of the Baptists, SDAs, Pentecostals, Methodists, Mormons, or JWs etc. demand from their members?? All of it is not Christianity, but rather the theo-logical doctrines and traditions of men, aka church-ianity.

Scripturally, the word "antichrist" is thoroughly and completely described by the Holy Spirit in the epistles of John. There is no need for anyone to put an additional "spin" on it.

 

[Timtofly]

See, Jesuit Futurists always cast aside the precise prophetic template in Daniel and Revelation and appeal to the not-so-precise prophecy of Revelation 17 to "prove" their Jesuit Futurist nonsense. While none of us can say for certain what it all means, by sticking to the prophetic template and timeline of Daniel and Revelation, the best explanation I've found so far is concerning the 7 kings:

1. Babylon
2. MP
3. Greece
4. Pagan Rome
5. Papal Rome
6. ("is not, yet is") Wounded papacy operating behind the scenes via papal-controlled secret Luciferian societies arising from the "bottomless pit" to control the world during this interim (click the link!)
7. "not yet come" - Image of the Beast
8. "eighth, of the 7" - final NWO confederacy under ultimate papal control

Some may disagree, but they cannot deny this interpretation sticks to the prophetic timeline while Jesuit Futurists interpretations don't even occupy the same Scriptural universe.

This is hardly Scripture according to Daniel 2. It is too papacy centered and missing the whole point of the actual church.

Satan is always the primary head of the beast. Not the papacy, or some secret world order. The beast is wounded because since the Reformation, the church has been holding the beast in check, through the power of Holy Spirit. That is what keeps the mortal wound going. The church is the rock cut out without hands that destroyed the image in the toes causing the fatal end to the first 5 kingdoms including the papacy. That was the outcome of the Reformation. Not church theology that caused further splintering of the church. The historist are stuck in the past, just not as deep as preterist.

The church is not centered and controlled by some central authority of human governance. That is what caused the apostasy in the first place. Remember when Israel wanted a king like all the other nations? The church was to fill the earth, that means local people all over the earth under the submission of the Holy Spirit.

The dragon/sea beast/scarlet beast only has 7 heads, so there will only be 7 earthly empires not 8. Your math is wrong. The 8th kingdom is the 7th head, but it will only happen after a 7th Kingdom. So look in Revelation, before you start guessing. The 6th head is wounded, and literally defunct. It is splintered, because there never was going to be a 6th world empire. You say people are working behind the scenes, in high places with Satan. That is probably true, but no nation wants to give in to a single nation, unless they get to be that single nation, so all you get is a stalemate.

So the Second Coming is the game changer, because the church is removed, and Satan may in fact heal the 6th head. The problem is that the Second Coming not only removes the church, but it places the Prince to come, yes Jesus as King, to actually sit on a throne in Jerusalem. That is Scripture: Matthew 25:31-32

"When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory: And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:"

So the 6th head may be healed, but is now in direct competition with God, now seen visibly on the earth. Not just Jesus on a throne. God sitting on the GWT is in plain sight, as all spiritual blindness has been lifted. Revelation 6:14-16

"And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places. And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb."

Not only is there a shake up of current world government, but all on earth can see the face of the one sitting on the GWT, the one that in the OT, no one could look upon and live.

So we have the 7th Kingdom right there in Jerusalem. And there is tribulation and trouble like none else because during the first 6 Trumpets and the 7 Thunders, Jesus is going to be tossing people into the LOF, or redeeming them out of Adam's dead corruptible flesh, in preparation for the Day of the Lord. And the 7th Trumpet declares the 7th Kingdom: Revelation 11:15

"And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever."

So if there even is an 8th kingdom, it will be 3.5 days after Jesus is declared King, and split the week of the days of the 7th Trumpet in half. And Satan being the 7th and primary head, is the beast that was, is not, and yet is. Jesus will abdicate the throne, and take the 144k to wait 42 months on Mount Zion.

That is what John wrote in Revelation. Nothing about a covert apostate church, with a false papacy sitting as God. Satan wants you all to think everything is in the past, and then there will be a "left behind" period of trouble, in preparation for a Second Coming. But Jesus is going to come first, and no warning will indicate any time to get ready, and that is why there is so much trouble. If people are not ready for a thief in the night, that thief will be a surprise. The longer Jesus does not return, the shorter the length of this trouble will be, and the longer the elect have to join the church. Because the time of the church is now, not after the 7th Seal is opened.

Once the 5th Seal is opened, the church will be complete, and in heaven, waiting for Jesus and the angels to gather the final harvest. And the battle of Armageddon is not that Second Coming. The Second Coming will not be announced ahead of time like the battle of Armageddon is.

 

[Davy]

Davy, didja know the ECFs taught the "Restrainer" was the Pagan Roman Empire that, once taken out of the way, would give immediate rise to the Antichrist - unlike your Jesuit Futurist nonsense which has you still waiting for Antichrist 1500 years later?

That's why Paul didn't dare reiterate in his 2 Thessalonians 2 letter what he'd previously told them in person about who the Restrainer was, lest the letter fall into the hands of Roman authorities and Christianity be wiped off the face of the Earth before the wax seal of Caesar's extermination order cooled off.

The Pre-trib Rapture crowd teaches the one restraining in 2 Thess.2:6-7 is The Holy Spirit, and they are wrong about that too. Some of the early Church fathers also thought the "mystery of iniquity" Paul mentioned was the Roman emperor Nero, but it's not.

The one doing the withholding is Archangel Michael, as the withholding idea was first mentioned at the end of Daniel 10. We are given the timing when the Antichrist is loosed by Archangel Michael in Revelation 12:7-9 for the end of this world.

And the "mystery of iniquity" is about the very beginning of the prophesied battle between the two seeds God mentioned in Genesis 3:15, which Jesus also pointed to with His parable of the tares of the field. That some would instead focus upon Nero instead of grasping the greater matter about the "tares" of Matthew 13 reveals the problem in Bible understanding many still have today.

 

[Davy]

Davy, buddy, how many times I gotta tell you God would never refer to a building as the "temple of God" in which the sacrifices denying the Lamb of God would be a national middle finger in the face of God?

You own words BETRAY YOU. You can't even get the words out of what Paul said in the 2 Thess.2:4 about the coming "man of sin" sitting in that "temple of God" exalting himself as GOD.

Paul most definitely WAS... pointing to THE TRADITIONAL JEWISH STONE TEMPLE in Jerusalem with that "temple of God" phrase.


The Sieges of Jerusalem:

The following is a complete list of the sieges :

1. By the tribe of Judah against the Jebusites, about 1443 B.C. This was some 700 years before Rome was founded. It was only partial, for in David's reign we still find the Jebusites occupying the citadel (the future Zion). The solemn words in Judg. 1:8, describing this first siege, vividly portray the after history of the city.
   
   
2. By David against the Jebusites (2Sam. 5:6-10; 1Chron. 11:4-7), about 960 B.C.
   
   
3. By Shishak king of Egypt, against Rehoboam (1Kings 14:25, 26. 2Chron. 12:2-12), about 875 B.C. To this there was only a feeble resistance; and the Temple was plundered.
   
   
4. By the Philistines, Arabians, and Ethiopians, against Jehoram (2Chron. 21:16, 17), about 794 B.C. In this siege the royal palace was sacked, and the Temple again plundered.
   
   
5. By Jehoash king of Israel, against Amaziah king of Judah (2Kings 14:13, 14), about 739 B.C. The wall was partially broken down, and the city and Temple pillaged.
   
   
6. By Rezin king of Syria, and Pekah king of Israel, against Ahaz (2Chron. 28), about 630 B.C. The city held out, but Ahaz sought the aid of Tiglath-Pileser king of Assyria, for whom he stripped the Temple.
   
   
7. By Sennacherib king of Assyria, against Hezekiah (2Kings 24:10-16), about 603 B.C. In this case the siege was raised by a Divine interposition, as foretold by Isaiah the prophet.
   
   
8. By Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon, against Jehoiakim (2Chron. 36:6-7), about 496 B.C., when the Temple was partly pillaged.
   
   
9. By Nebuchadnezzar again, against Jehoiachin (2Chron. 36:10), about 489 B.C., when the pillage of the Temple was carried further, and 10,000 people carried away.
   
   
10. By Nebuchadnezzar, against Zedekiah (2Chron. 36:17-20), 478-477 B.C. In this case the Temple was burnt with fire, and the city and the Temple lay desolate for fifty years.
    
    
11. By Ptolemy Soter king of Egypt, against the Jews, 320 B.C. More that 100,000 captives were taken to Egypt.
    
    
12. By Antiochus the Great, about 203 B.C.
    
    
13. By Scopus, a general of Alexander, about 199 B.C., who left a garrison.
    
    
14. By Antiochus IV, surnamed Epiphanes, 168 B.C. This was the worst siege since the 10th. The whole city was pillaged; 10,000 captives taken; the walls destroyed; the altar defiled; ancient manuscripts perished; the finest buildings were burned; and the Jews were forbidden to worship there. Foretold Dan. 11.
    
    
15. By Antiochus V, surnamed Eupator, against Judas Maccabaeus, about 162 B.C. This time honorable terms were made, and certain privileges were secured.
    
    
16. By Antiochus VII, surnamed Sidetes king of Syria, against John Hyrcanus, about 135 B.C.
    
    
17. By Hyrcanus (son of Alex. Jannaeus) and the priest Aristobulus. The siege was raised by Scaurus, one of Pompey's lieutenants, about 65 B.C.
    
    
18. By Pompey against Aristobulus, about 63 B.C. The machines were moved on the Sabbath, when the Jews made no resistance. Only thus was it then reduced; 12,000 Jews were slain. [Antigonus, son of Aristobulus, with a Parthian army, took the city in 40 B.C.; but there was no siege, the city was taken by a sudden surprise.]
    
    
19. Herod with a Roman army besieged the city in 39 B.C. for five months.
    
    
20. By Titus, A.D. 69 (See Ap. 50. VI, p. 61). The second Temple (Herod's) was burnt, and for fifty years the city disappeared from history, as after the 10th siege (Jer. 20:5).
    
    
21. The Romans had again to besiege the city in A.D. 135 against the false Messiah, Bar-Cochebas, who had acquired possession of the ruins. The city was obliterated, and renamed AElia Capitolina, and a temple was erected to Jupiter. For 200 years the city passed out of history, no Jews being permitted to approach it. This siege was foretold in Luke 19:43, 44; 21:20-24.
    
    
22. After 400 years of so-called Christian colonization, through the country; thousands were massacred, and the Church of the Holy Sepulchre was destroyed. The Emperor Heraclius afterwards defeated him, and restored the city and the church.
    
    
23. The Caliph Omar, in A.D. 636-7, besieged the city against Heralius. It was followed by capitulation on favorable terms, and the city passed into the hands of the Turks, in whose hands it remains to the present day.
    
    
24. Afdal, the Vizier of the Caliph of Egypt, besieged the two rival factions of Moslems, and pillaged the city in 1098.
    
    
25. In 1099 it was besieged by the army of the first Crusade.
    
    
26. In 1187 it was besieged by Saladin for seven weeks.
    
    
27. The wild Kharezmian Tartar hordes, in 1244, captured and plundered the city, slaughtering the monks and priests.
    
    
28. There will be a 28th according to Zech. 14, which will be raised by Messiah, even as the 7th was by Jehovah.