About sin, the commandments and humility before God

[GRACE ambassador]

op: "about sin, the commandments, and humility before God"?

I believe better stated would be "about sin, humility before God,
forgiveness of ALL sin, and fulfilling ALL the law [commandments]
in ONE Word." How's that? ie:

A) about sin:

"All have sinned and fallen short Of The GLORY Of God"
(Rom 3:23)
+
"the wages of sin is [the Second] death..."
(Rom 6:23; Rev 20:11-15; 21:8)​

B) humility before God:

repent/believe 'HIS Remedy' (for sin) in Today's Dispensation:

The Gospel Of The GRACE (UNmerited Favor) Of God!:​

C) God's Will, Today, Very Simply:

► faith ◄
1) Past Tense = "...God delivered us from so great a death...":

God Establishes HIS Eternal Relationship With those who
humbly repent (change mind that "sin is Wrong!") and:

believe, 100% trust, place Total faith, In The LORD JESUS CHRIST,
HIS Death (Precious BLOOD - Causes osas), Burial, And HIS Resurrection,
According To The Scriptures!
(1 Corinthians 15:3-4; cp Ephesians 2:8-9; Romans 3-5 KJB!)

"GRACE Through faith" In The Merits
Of HIS ALL-Sufficient BLOOD Results:

All sins Forgiven, His Eternal Life, And, Peace With God!
(Ephesians 1:7; Colossians 2:13; Romans 6:23; Romans 5:1)

This Is Eternal Deliverance From the Penalty of sin,
The So Great A [ Second ] Death! (Revelation 21:8) =
Justification and Spiritual Sanctification
(2 Corinthians 1:10a cp Romans 3:24)

(ALL-Sufficient BLOOD osas?:
More Biblical Confirmation is here: God's ETERNAL Assurance! And:
God's OPERATION On All HIS New-born babes In CHRIST!)

1) ► faith ◄ God's ETERNAL Justification/Relationship Is First, And, Then:

►► love ◄◄
(2) Present Tense = "...God doth deliver us...":

humility before God:

All believers Should do "good works (faith which worketh by love!)"
{Which will Never Equal CHRIST's Payment For the above Penalty of sin!},
for Which we Are Created In CHRIST JESUS, to perform for Him, having
"been Called into fellowship With Him!" (Ephesians 2:10; 1 Corinthians 1:9)
Amen?:

We "work out our own salvation" (Philippians 2:12). This
Should Be a lifetime of Daily submission, and renewing,
being "not conformed to this world" (Romans 12:1-2),
for Grace Deliverance From the Power of sin!}
(2 Corinthians 1:10b) = personal sanctification:

(2a) Christ Living In us, To Fulfil:

All Of His Law (commandments), In ONE Word: ►► love ◄◄
thy neighbor as thyself!" (Galatians 5:14; Romans 13:8-10)​

(2b) His Spirit Guiding and Teaching us, How To:

"Study to shew thyself Approved Unto God, a
workman that needeth not to be ashamed, Rightly
Dividing The Word Of Truth!" (2 Timothy 2:15 KJB)​

Note: Saturating ourselves with These is a lot less "grieving * The
In-Dwelling Holy Spirit" (Eph 4:30), and thus not "quenching * Him"
(I Thess 5:19), leading to Much Better:

Eternal Results: reward [or loss *] (1 Corinthians 3:8-15),
ruling and reigning [or not *] With CHRIST, Which Will Finally Be
At The Judgment Day!

* More helpful study: Finishing The Race
►► love ◄◄ and, Finally:

The FINAL Culmination of 'osas' members of The Body Of Christ!:

►►► Blessed Hope [faith turned INTO 'sight!']◄◄◄
(3) Future Tense = "...God Will Yet Deliver us":

CHRIST's Glorification of All "members" Of HIS Body!!
{This Is Eternal Deliverance From the Presence of sin!}
(1 Thessalonians 4:13-18; 1 Corinthians 15:51-57;
2 Corinthians 1:10c). Hallelujah! Praise HIS Excellent Name!!
----------------------------------
Conclusion:

BIG Differences Between the THREE tenses Of God's Eternal Salvation,
And Between God's Relationship And our fellowship! Correct?
--------------------------------------------------------------
Precious friend(s):

Please Be Very RICHLY Encouraged, Enlightened, Exhorted, And Edified In
The LORD JESUS CHRIST, And In His Word Of Truth, Rightly Divided!

The apostle of GRACE (2 Min With The BIBLE)

 

[amigo de christo]

Let all praise and thank the Glorious Lord .

 

[Lambano]

Forgetting those things which are behind and pressing forward to the mark , the prize in Christ .
Focus on the prize that cometh at the end of our faith .

'Bout time somebody quoted Philippians 3:13-14.

 

[Lambano]

Its ok to remember.
Its ok to have some memories that are regretful.
ITs ok to feel some responsibility for a failure or for some harm you caused.

You are loved, Lambano. Regret is such a horrible feeling and one I know well. I just don't think God wants us to live with that and carry it around. Every day really is a new day.

Not that I don't feel regret; I do. Especially for the busted relationships. Sometimes things are broken and can't be fixed this side of the World to Come. But "regrets are inappropriate" they taught us at Born Free.

There were two points I was trying to make, and I probably already already did, so I should shut up already. But of course I can't keep my trap shut.

The first, in line with Devin's OP, is that the Love Commands (love God with all your heart, soul, mind, and strength; love your neighbor as yourself) aren't easy; they're hard as hell. To love means to make the other person's wants and needs and happiness and well-being part of your own. And I don't know about you, but while I'm pretty good at making sure I'm well-fed and clothed and sheltered and have clean water and good medical care and plenty of toys to play with, I'm not so good at making sure my 8 billion neighbors have the same; not even the handful of neighbors God has brought into my life. And as for making God's desires part of my own... Well, Jesus is working with me on that. Hopefully, I'm better than I was.

The second point is this: Six decades of observing failure in keeping both the Love commands and the Thou Shalt Nots (which are really just a subset of the Love commands), especially my own failures, has given me an appreciation of just how deeply the power of Sin is embedded inside us. Inside me. It remind me just how badly I need God's grace. And made me pretty cynical about human nature. Cynical, and maybe, just maybe, humble before God.

And yet faithfulness requires that we (I) keep trying. Do you know how much trust it takes to keep plugging, knowing full well that you're going to fail?

 

[Robert Gwin]

I've seen a lot of posts recently about OSAS and the other side of obeying the commandments. And I just feel that people are not being taught the scriptures correctly. I have been studying the scriptures for some time now and have developed my own views about sin and what it is. Lets take a look at that.

1 John 5:17
17 All unrighteousness is sin, and there is sin not leading to death.

But what is sin that leads to death? Well we know of the 10 commandments and such that lead to death as spelled out in the old testament.

I came across the sheep and goats and saw that Jesus said those that don't adhere to those directives will be cast into hell. Matthew 25:31-46. So it would appear that these "sheep and goats" sins are death.

The book of revelation also spells out sins which lead to the lake of fire and death. Revelation 21:8.

Because of these scriptures I have come to the conclusion that I am not perfect and in need of repentance daily. And I noticed that the Catholics promote this type of repentance. But what other churches do?

And I see that some churches teach that if you obey the commandments (10 of them or so) you will go to heaven. And they leave out all of the commandments of Jesus, like the sheep and goats.

So what I learned from this is that we truly are at the mercy of the Almighty Righteous God's judgment. And I think I need to reflect that in my prayers to God. That I am a sinner and desire mercy.

So I think we should be teaching a merciful and loving God. And we should be encouraging people towards "all" of these teachings of Jesus, not just some of them.

All people sin, daily Devin. Jehovah provided a ransom for those who sin, ignorantly I might add. There really is no redemption for those who practice sin Heb 10:26

 

[dev553344]

All people sin, daily Devin. Jehovah provided a ransom for those who sin, ignorantly I might add. There really is no redemption for those who practice sin Heb 10:26

Well I think that's the point of the thread. You pointed out that people who sin ignorantly are excused. But I'm not sure you can speak on behalf of all of these daily sinners that they are ignorant of their sin. I certainly am not.

 

[dev553344]

Along those lines we find the perfected in the bible:

Matthew 5:48
48 Therefore you shall be perfect, just as your Father in heaven is perfect.


Matthew 19:21
21 Jesus said to him, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell what you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me.”

Matthew 6:19-21
Lay Up Treasures in Heaven
19 “Do not lay up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy and where thieves break in and steal; 20 but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys and where thieves do not break in and steal. 21 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.

 

[Wynona]

Not that I don't feel regret; I do. Especially for the busted relationships. Sometimes things are broken and can't be fixed this side of the World to Come. But "regrets are inappropriate" they taught us at Born Free.

There were two points I was trying to make, and I probably already already did, so I should shut up already. But of course I can't keep my trap shut.

The first, in line with Devin's OP, is that the Love Commands (love God with all your heart, soul, mind, and strength; love your neighbor as yourself) aren't easy; they're hard as hell. To love means to make the other person's wants and needs and happiness and well-being part of your own. And I don't know about you, but while I'm pretty good at making sure I'm well-fed and clothed and sheltered and have clean water and good medical care and plenty of toys to play with, I'm not so good at making sure my 8 billion neighbors have the same; not even the handful of neighbors God has brought into my life. And as for making God's desires part of my own... Well, Jesus is working with me on that. Hopefully, I'm better than I was.

The second point is this: Six decades of observing failure in keeping both the Love commands and the Thou Shalt Nots (which are really just a subset of the Love commands), especially my own failures, has given me an appreciation of just how deeply the power of Sin is embedded inside us. Inside me. It makes me appreciate just how badly I need God's grace. And made me pretty cynical about human nature. Cynical, and maybe, just maybe, humble before God.

And yet faithfulness requires that we (I) keep trying. Do you know how much trust it takes to keep plugging, knowing full well that you're going to fail?

The devil is the defeated one. Not us.

 

[amigo de christo]

'Bout time somebody quoted Philippians 3:13-14.

 

[amigo de christo]

Sound those praises out unto the glorious Lord . Flee all appearance of evil . And having all affections above on the LORD .

 

[Desire Of All Nations]

It sounds more like you are teaching a permissive God. Rom. 6:23 is clear that the wages of sin is death. There is no wiggle room on that. God being merciful doesn't mean He looks the other way on some sins and drop the hammer on other sins.

I don't think we should be mainly following the ten commandments but we should be following what Jesus commanded:

Love one another
Give to the least of these
Witness and make disciples

I agree that not enough churches teach the importance of giving to the poor. If we don't, we'll be like the goats that get weeded out of the Kingdom.

The words "i don't think" automatically disqualifies everything else you have to say because it's clearly not based on what the Bible shows. Jesus' teaching about love doesn't contradict the obligation to keep the 10 commandments because they list how God and other people are supposed to be loved according to God's standard of morality.

Jesus' ministry was not based on the human emotion this world and its false religions call love. It was based on living by God's commandments(1 Jhn 5:2-3), . If a man beat his wife half to death every day, has extramarital sex, or fantasize about having sex with other people, can he honestly say that he loves her? No. Biblical love is demonstrated through action, and not words or emotions.

Revelation describes true Christians as people who keep God's commandments(Rev. 12:17, 14:12). It is completely contradict and illogical to tell people to love one another while also telling them to disregard the instructions God laid out for accomplishing that task. The "Christians" who teach against living by God's commandments are in fact the goats that are in danger of being told to get lost.

Sin is biblically defined as violating any 1 of God's commandments(Jas. 2:10, 1 Jh 3:4), not your feelings, church rules, conscience, or personal dogma. And guess what everybody is going to be judged by? God's commandments(Jas. 2:12)! Anybody who teaches against God's law in any way, shape, or form is not teaching the true gospel of Christ, and therefore they are a liar!

 

[Lambano]

Well I think that's the point of the thread. You pointed out that people who sin ignorantly are excused. But I'm not sure you can speak on behalf of all of these daily sinners that they are ignorant of their sin. I certainly am not.

All (or almost all) sins are premeditated. We have no excuse.

 

[dev553344]

All (or almost all) sins are premeditated. We have no excuse.

Yep. I think sometimes people sin without knowing, but I also think for Christians that have the Holy Spirit to guide them it is usually warned before sinning or while sinning.

 

[dev553344]

It sounds more like you are teaching a permissive God. Rom. 6:23 is clear that the wages of sin is death. There is no wiggle room on that. God being merciful doesn't mean He looks the other way on some sins and drop the hammer on other sins.
The words "i don't think" automatically disqualifies everything else you have to say because it's clearly not based on what the Bible shows. Jesus' teaching about love doesn't contradict the obligation to keep the 10 commandments because they list how God and other people are supposed to be loved according to God's standard of morality.

Jesus' ministry was not based on the human emotion this world and its false religions call love. It was based on living by God's commandments(1 Jhn 5:2-3), . If a man beat his wife half to death every day, has extramarital sex, or fantasize about having sex with other people, can he honestly say that he loves her? No. Biblical love is demonstrated through action, and not words or emotions.

Revelation describes true Christians as people who keep God's commandments(Rev. 12:17, 14:12). It is completely contradict and illogical to tell people to love one another while also telling them to disregard the instructions God laid out for accomplishing that task. The "Christians" who teach against living by God's commandments are in fact the goats that are in danger of being told to get lost.

Sin is biblically defined as violating any 1 of God's commandments(Jas. 2:10, 1 Jh 3:4), not your feelings, church rules, conscience, or personal dogma. And guess what everybody is going to be judged by? God's commandments(Jas. 2:12)! Anybody who teaches against God's law in any way, shape, or form is not teaching the true gospel of Christ, and therefore they are a liar!

Nope. This isn't an OASIS thread or Legalism thread. It's an exploration of what sin is so that we don't try to provide some sort of false benchmark for righteousness like the 10 commandments, see the Tax Collector and Pharisee of Luke 18:9-14 for that. It's a promotion of the sheep and goats of Matthew 25:31-46 and Revelation 21:8. I'm promoting a merciful and loving God for those that try to follow Gods words, all of them.

 

[dev553344]

I would like to point out the passage where the Apostles are amazed at who "can" be saved. Indicating God requires perfection to save someone. Although it is not expressly stated that only the perfect will be saved, the Apostles seem to believe that fact and Jesus appears to confirm it. And Jesus says with God all things are possible, meaning he has a way to save us un-perfected sinners. And I believe that way to be the Lord Jesus the Christ, having fullfilled the sacrifice for sin.

Matthew 19:17-26

17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,

19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

20 The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet?

21 Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.

22 But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful: for he had great possessions.

23 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven.

24 And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

25 When his disciples heard it, they were exceedingly amazed, saying, Who then can be saved?

26 But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible.

 

[Lambano]

Yep. I think sometimes people sin without knowing, but I also think for Christians that have the Holy Spirit to guide them it is usually warned before sinning or while sinning.

I think I may want to dig into this a little deeper, since the focus of this thread is (refreshingly) more about sin as a failure to do good for others.

I'm thinking about your (quite remarkable) exchanges with StunnedByGrace about helping the homeless. I often want to help, but I know just giving them money may not be the right thing to do. I could spend some time talking with them (and I sometimes do) to find out what their needs are, but then the light changes to green and people start honking... So, being so self-involved that I don't care enough to find out what others' needs are is itself a sin. A sin in ignorance, yes, but it's a willful ignorance.

I have a similar situation with my physical neighbors. I'm introverted and not very outgoing, and my neighborhood is transitional, so I really don't talk to my neighbors much anymore.

This is something I think I need to pray about. Pray for God to supply what I so obviously lack.

 

[dev553344]

I think I may want to dig into this a little deeper, since the focus of this thread is (refreshingly) more about sin as a failure to do good for others.

I'm thinking about your (quite remarkable) exchanges with StunnedByGrace about helping the homeless. I often want to help, but I know just giving them money may not be the right thing to do. I could spend some time talking with them (and I sometimes do) to find out what their needs are, but then the light changes to green and people start honking... So, being so self-involved that I don't care enough to find out what others' needs are is itself a sin. A sin in ignorance, yes, but it's a willful ignorance.

This is something I think I need to pray about.

Yes in my heart I feel something that is ignoring charity and ignoring their needs. That's what I experience when I'm at the red light that turns green. And I feel a little guilt because of it.

I like charity feelings and the Joy and Love I get from God when I act in charity. Which I think renews the Holy Spirit in me.

 

[Robert Gwin]

Well I think that's the point of the thread. You pointed out that people who sin ignorantly are excused. But I'm not sure you can speak on behalf of all of these daily sinners that they are ignorant of their sin. I certainly am not.

Deliberate sinners are certainly another story Dev, there is a limit to God's forgiveness. Sure on occasion many Christians commit a serious sin, David being a prime example (yes he was not a Christian, but he was one of God's people). Those who practice serious sin however, especially knowing it is wrong, will have no forgiveness, if my understanding of Scripture is correct anyway.

 

[dev553344]

Deliberate sinners are certainly another story Dev, there is a limit to God's forgiveness. Sure on occasion many Christians commit a serious sin, David being a prime example (yes he was not a Christian, but he was one of God's people). Those who practice serious sin however, especially knowing it is wrong, will have no forgiveness, if my understanding of Scripture is correct anyway.

Well, then this is the point of the thread. What's more serious of a sin than one that would get people cast into the lake of fire and hell? Like spelled out in the sheep and goats? Matthew 25-31-46 and Revelation 21:8. Those are apparently serious enough for God to cast them into hell for it.

 

[dev553344]

It would appear that the root of all sin is selfishness. From the sheep and goats to the ten commandments. Not helping those that are less fortunate. Or hurting others thru adultry and theft. Even lies hurt others like bearing false witness to get someone thrown in jail, or lying about God and not giving him full credit with witchcraft and sorcery. These sins can all be traced back to selfishness.

And perhaps the solution is charity and love from God. Being honest with self and others and what harm could come if we commit one of these sins. I think God doesn't want us to be selfish and wants to teach us about Love. And I think that's part of the point of the scriptures. He wants us to be more like Him.