williemac said:
Of course. In my humble opinion, moral perfection (righteousness) is something that is inherited by reproduciton rather than created. We receive it from God through the new birth. Adam did not have that experience. But there may well be another angle to it. Adam was in an envoirnment that brought temptation into the picture. In the new heavens and earth, there will be no such thing.
As well, I have concluded in my studies that there is another test that all free thinking members of creation, angels included, under go. It is seen in the original sin of Lucifer, who wanted and determined to sit on the throne as God. In this determination, there are several decisions that coincide: One will question or oppose the integrity of God or at least His authority. As a default or result, one will reject, oppose, or question the idea that God has the right to determine our individual callings and purposes.
I believe that moral imperfection (unrighteousness, sin) has its origin from this original iniquity. God has for the benfit of mankind, removed the barrier that sin has created between man and God. Sin is wrong and bad and hurtful and destructive, and all those things, but it is not the issue that stands between man and God.
The church, I believe, for the most part, has been obsessed with the sin issue. I think this is a diversion. She has been going about trying to solve a dead issue; one that God has already solved. Not that we should sin or condone sin, but many have taken to accepting the lie that sin can remove our good standing with God. How is that possible? The cross is responsible for our good standing, not our behavior. How can our behavior be thrown into the equation after the fact? There are many reasons why this cannot be the case.
The real issue is rather, our humility in accepting that God's role is to render us in good standing, and our role to accept it by faith. The real issue is that which has always been the real issue. Pride vs. humility; Self exaltation vs. the rightful exaltation of God. As long as a person is going about the business of rendering himself in good standing with God, he has been duped into playing God's role. God did not throw Adam out of His presence. He merely temporarily removed man's access to the tree of life. He continued to be in relationship with Adam and mankind. The lie is that sin has caused God to turn His back on us. The truth is that sin has removed life from us, not God's presence. It is man through a guilty conscience that rather turns his back on, or hides from God, as Adam and Eve did in the beginning.
Does anyone need help with sin? Come boldly into the Holy of Holies, to find grace to help in time of need. The role of the sacrifice of Jesus was/is to purge our guilty conscience (Heb.10:2,22). Sin is not our main obsticle in serving God, but rather the impression of guilt.
Man has always had it backwards. We do not clean up our lives in order to be in God's presence. The fact is, abiding in His presence is that which gives us the strength, power, and ability to clean up our lives. Jesus said..." Abide in Me and you WILL bear fruit". (paraphrased..John15:4,5)
The devil himself is delighted when we put the cart before the horse. Blessings in Christ, Howie
At first it was due to Eve misunderstanding which tree was the forbidden for she did not receive God's Word directly from God but SECOND HAND and thought it was the tree in the MIDST of the garden she was not to eat of, and Satan did not correct her. Adam was told which tree not to eat of before Eve was taken out of him. But then Adam is guilty for obeying Eve to please her instead of disobeying God's Word, and that caused Adam to hide from God because he knew he had done wrong.
Yet later on we see that Cain was banished from God's presence for the sin character that he portrayed. When Cain got jealous of his brother Abel who pleased God, God told Cain that if you do better won't you be accepted? So while it proves he Ca
in/Can, yet he won't, but Abel was able. Cain wanted to lower his competetion to his level instead of raising up his standards. So he killed the competetion to level the "field", Just as most who are corrupted do. His down fall was his unbelief, he did not really believe in God nor turn to Him for help or else he would have understood that God sees all, nothing escapes his eye. Man CAN fool man, but not God.
By the way, have you ever heard a VOICE WALKING? The Voice is the Word of God who is Jesus, Jesus was walking in the garden in the cool of the day. My sheep(followers) hear(will listen to) my voice(Word).
Gen 3:8-10
8 And they heard
the voice of the LORD God
walking in the garden in the cool of the day: and Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the LORD God amongst the trees of the garden.
9 And the LORD God called unto Adam, and said unto him, Where art thou?
10 And he said,
I heard thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I was naked; and I hid myself.
KJV
Gen 3:17
17 And unto Adam he said,
Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;
KJV
Gen 4:6-7
6 And the LORD said unto Cain, Why art thou wroth? and why is thy countenance fallen?
7
If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.
KJV
If you also realize that this is not the same man and woman created on the 6thday. This is the account of the FIRST Adam who was created ALONE and is being revealed to us of him in the GENERATIONS of the Heaven and Earth when God first created them in the first heaven and earth in Gen.1:1 that was destroyed by Gen.1:2. If you look you will see that this Adam was created before all other things, even Eve. But in the account of the 6th day creation all things were already here before the male and female were created. Just as we are looking for a new heavens and a new earth at the end of our fallen age. Seedtime and harvest will never cease as long as their is an earth says God. Harvest is HERE! and there will be the 7th day rest of the earth for her to replenish the soil and then it will be seedtime again after the 1,000yrs.
Gen 2:4-8
4
These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens,
5 And every plant of the field
before it was in the earth, and every herb of the field
before it grew: for the LORD God had not caused it to rain upon the earth, and there was not a man to till the ground.
6 But there went up a mist from the earth, and watered the whole face of the ground.
7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
8 And the LORD God planted a garden eastward in Eden; and
there he put the man whom he had formed.
KJV
2 Peter 2:4-5
4
For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;
5 And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly;
KJV
