Kermos
Well-Known Member
EXAMINING REVELATION 22:17OK, I can see that you have found room to squirm around Rev. 22:17. So, I shall add to that with Heb. 2[9] But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.
ho thelon labeto hydor zoes dorean (Greek Revelation 22:17)
the desiring receive water of-life gratuitously (English word for word from Greek Revelation 22:17)
let the one who wishes take the water of life without cost (NASB Revelation 22:17)
Grammatical constructs:
- ho is the direct object which translates to English as "the" which is not an indirect object.
- thelon is a verb.
- labeto a form of lambano both being a verb which carries not only "receive" but also "to be siezed by"
- the Greek word "hos" which translates to English as "who" is absent.
- the Greek word "pas" which translates to English as "every" is absent.
The word "ho"/"the" negates the possibility for the word whosoever whatsoever, for example "the whosoever" fails as nonsensical grammatically. There is NO "whosoever" in the passage of Revelation 22:17, in point of fact, this sounds much more like a promise with "the desiring receive water of-life gratuitously" (English word for word from Greek Revelation 22:17)!
Earburner, "whosoever" is not there implicitly nor explictly. Free willers try to use "whosoever" as a promiscuos and permissive word. Your "room to squirm" anecdote is ambiguous, so you could mean that you still think Revelation has "whosoever" in it or possibly that you still believe the passage is about salvation if you ever thought such. Your statement is vague. I do not want you to forget that Revelation carries a severe penalty as the Apostle John wrote "if anyone adds to them, God will add to him the plagues which are written in this book" (Revelation 22:18).
In reality, the NASB translation is very close with "let the one who wishes take the water of life without cost" (Revelation 22:17) for which two Greek words translate to English as "the one who wishes" or "the one desiring" or "the one wanting" or "the desiring" or "the wanting", that context of Revelation 22:17 is attraction; moreover, when the Apostle John's words in Revelation 22:17 are taken in accord with Lord Jesus' words of "apart from Me you can do nothing" (John 15:5) thus there is no promiscuos and permissive sense, so a person cannot "desire" the water of life without the Lord Jesus!
Regardless, this is NOT about salvation since a person cannot "choose" Lord Jesus because Lord Jesus said "you did not choose Me, but I chose you" (John 15:16), so "the desiring" mentioned in Revelation 22:17 are already chosen/elect by Lord Jesus.
This has been covered in this thread, and you repeat error by trying to use Revelation 22:17 as a proof text for a person to choose Jesus, that is, do the impossible for man (Matthew 19:25-26).
Since the Book of Hebrews is written to we believers, then this results in the Holy Spirit being needed to understand the passages in the perspective as a partaker in the assembly of God; therefore, that "every one" in Hebrews 2:9 refers to we people in the assembly of God as well as the unconverted that God has yet to bring into the assembly of God. All the New Testament epistles have this characteristic of being written to believers, so the perspective plays on the contextual circumstances of all the epistles as well.
Hebrews 2:9-10 states "But we do see Him who was made for a little while lower than the angels, [namely], Jesus, because of the suffering of death crowned with glory and honor, so that by the grace of God He might taste death for everyone. For it was fitting for Him, for whom are all things, and through whom are all things, in bringing many sons to glory, to perfect the author of their salvation through sufferings", so we find a narrowing of the focus "the author of their salvation" with the "their" being "bringing many sons to glory" with for Jesus "are all things" and "through" Jesus "are all things" - SEE THAT IT IS ABOUT JESUS - HIS POWER - HIS GLORY - HIS WORK IN SALVATION OF MAN - that "everyone" in Hebrews 2:9 are "every one" (even more Greek accurate) that Lord Jesus chooses since Lord Jesus' words said "you did not choose Me, but I chose you" (John 15:16) and the Hebrews 2:9 "every one" cannot mean absolutely every person who ever lived since Lord Jesus also said "many are called, but few are chosen" (Matthew 22:14).