All the righteous Jews in Israel will be removed or chased out of Israel during the tribulation peri

[Eric E Stahl]

[SIZE=14pt]All the righteous Jews in Israel will be removed or chased out of Israel during the tribulation period. All the rebellious Jews will be killed.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=14pt]Isaiah 5:24-30[/SIZE]
24 Therefore as the fire devoureth the stubble, and the flame consumeth the chaff, so their root shall be as rottenness, and their blossom shall go up as dust: because they have cast away the law of the LORD of hosts, and despised the word of the Holy One of Israel.
25 Therefore is the anger of the LORD kindled against his people, and he hath stretched forth his hand against them, and hath smitten them: and the hills did tremble, and their carcases were torn in the midst of the streets. For all this his anger is not turned away, but his hand is stretched out still.
26And he will lift up an ensign to the nations from far, and will hiss unto them from the end of the earth: and, behold, they shall come with speed swiftly:

[SIZE=12pt](((America is at the other end of the earth from Israel)))[/SIZE]

27 None shall be weary nor stumble among them; none shall slumber nor sleep; neither shall the girdle of their loins be loosed, nor the latchet of their shoes be broken:
28 Whose arrows are sharp, and all their bows bent, their horses' hoofs shall be counted like flint, and their wheels like a whirlwind:
29 Their roaring shall be like a lion, they shall roar like young lions: yea, they shall roar, and lay hold of the prey, and shall carry it away safe, and none shall deliver it.

30 And in that day they shall roar against them like the roaring of the sea: and if one look unto the land, behold darkness and sorrow, and the light is darkened in the heavens thereof.

In verses 29-30 the women and children will be evacuated during the 6th seal when the fire falls and the heavens are darkened. They will be reunited with the surviving men after the tribulation, see Zechariah 12:10-

Zechariah 12:10-14
[SIZE=10pt]10[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt] And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]11[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt] In that day shall there be a great mourning in Jerusalem, as the mourning of Hadadrimmon in the valley of Megiddon. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]12[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt] And the land shall mourn, every family apart; the family of the house of David apart, and their wives apart; the family of the house of Nathan apart, and their wives apart; [/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]13[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt] The family of the house of Levi apart, and their wives apart; the family of Shimei apart, and their wives apart; [/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]14[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt] All the families that remain, every family apart, and their wives apart. [/SIZE]


[SIZE=10pt]The Jewish soldiers will remain and fight the end times wars as allies of the antichrist who will come to Israel’s defense and set up his base camp see Daniel 11:36-45.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=10pt]At the midst of the tribulation the antichrist will go into the rebuilt temple and declare that he is god. Israel will rebel and the antichrist who is in control of the whole earth at that time will call the armies of the world to come and surround Jerusalem see Zechariah 14:1-5.[/SIZE]


[SIZE=10pt]Zechariah 14:1-5[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]1[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt] Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]2[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt] For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]3[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt] Then shall the LORD go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]4[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt] And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]5[/SIZE][SIZE=10pt] And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with thee. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=10pt](((This is where the Jewish soldiers will flee to when the Lord the lamb splits the Mount of Olives.)))[/SIZE]

[SIZE=10pt]Isaiah 16:1-5[/SIZE]
1 Send ye the lamb to the ruler of the land from Sela to the wilderness, unto the mount of the daughter of Zion.
2 For it shall be, that, as a wandering bird cast out of the nest, so the daughters of Moab shall be at the fords of Arnon.
3 Take counsel, execute judgment; make thy shadow as the night in the midst of the noonday; hide the outcasts; bewray not him that wandereth.
4Let mine outcasts dwell with thee, Moab; be thou a covert to them from the face of the spoiler: for the extortioner is at an end, the spoiler ceaseth, the oppressors are consumed out of the land.
5 And in mercy shall the throne be established: and he shall sit upon it in truth in the tabernacle of David, judging, and seeking judgment, and hasting righteousness.

When Jesus comes in the Eastern sky, He will be over the Jewish soldiers 1/3 of the way south on the Jordan side of the Dead Sea at the river ford on the Arnon River.

 

[Poppin]

But....there are no 'righteous' (in God's eyes) jews in Israel today are there? He may have mercy on some and call some to Jesus, but...
Does God consider anyone who rejects His Son to be righteous?

1 John 2
Beware of Antichrists
21I have not written to you because you do not know the truth, but because you do know it, and because no lie is of the truth. 22Who is the liar but the one who denies that Jesus is the Christ? This is the antichrist, the one who denies the Father and the Son. 23Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father; the one who confesses the Son has the Father also

the Bible says anyone who rejects Jesus is antichrist.
not only that it says they do not have or know the Father.

 

[Dodo_David]

But....there are no 'righteous' (in God's eyes) jews in Israel today are there? He may have mercy on some and call some to Jesus, but...
Does God consider anyone who rejects His Son to be righteous?

1 John 2
Beware of Antichrists
21I have not written to you because you do not know the truth, but because you do know it, and because no lie is of the truth. 22Who is the liar but the one who denies that Jesus is the Christ? This is the antichrist, the one who denies the Father and the Son. 23Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father; the one who confesses the Son has the Father also

the Bible says anyone who rejects Jesus is antichrist.
not only that it says they do not have or know the Father.

Poppin, there are Messianic Jews in Israel, the kind who worship Jesus as Messiah, but they are in a minority and persecuted if their faith in Messiah Jesus is made known.

 

[Poppin]

hi Eric E Stahl.
all those passages you quoted from daniel and isaiah and zechariah were fulfilled a long time ago.
they refer to the return from exile in Babylon. the remnant returned and rebuilt the city and the walls and the slowly built the temple (which Herod renovated and made the magnificant buildings the disciples asked jesus about when he said there would not be one of those stones left standing).

this is speaking about siege of the roman armies, leadin up to the total desolation of 70AD.

Mark 13
The Abomination of Desolation
14"But when you see the ABOMINATION OF DESOLATION standing where it should not be (let the reader understand), then those who are in Judea must flee to the mountains. 15"The one who is on the housetop must not go down, or go in to get anything out of his house;

Jesus is clearly speaking to that generation, about Herod's Temple:

Mark 13
Temple Destruction Foretold
1As He was going out of the temple, one of His disciples said to Him, "Teacher, behold what wonderful stones and what wonderful buildings!" 2And Jesus said to him, "Do you see these great buildings? Not one stone will be left upon another which will not be torn down."

it is heartbreaking to see Jesus weeping over jerusalem, for He knows that the Covenant Curses must be poured out on her. His disciples heeded His warning, and they escaped that terrible horror.

Luke 19
Jesus Weeps over Jerusalem
43"For the days will come upon you when your enemies will throw up a barricade against you, and surround you and hem you in on every side, 44and they will level you to the ground and your children within you, and they will not leave in you one stone upon another, because you did not recognize the time of your visitation."

and tragically that's what happened. reading Josephus really makes clear how terrible it all was - civil war inside; the romans advancing outside...brothers murdering brothers, mothers eating their children...and the crazed zealots who seemed to always be the source of agitation running around dressed as women, stabbing and raping their own kinsmen. i wonder of these zealots were the converts Jesus spoke of.


here, in His pronouncement of the Old Covenant Curses, he mentions them. but i don't know for certain. commentators say they were more oppressive and cruel than the Pharisees who converted them. perhaps Judas Isacriot was one? that is speculation.

Matthew 23:15
"Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You travel over land and sea to win a single convert, and when you have succeeded, you make them twice as much a child of hell as you are.

Written in love for you, as a brother in Jesus Christ Our Lord,
grace mercy and peace to you,
Poppin.

Poppin, there are Messianic Jews in Israel, the kind who worship Jesus as Messiah, but they are in a minority and persecuted if their faith in Messiah Jesus is made known.

right. i didn't mean christians. i meant the jewish people...the unbelieving jewish people.
i consider messianic jews to be christians.

Dodo_David, i don't believe The State of Israel plays any role in bible prophecy. i think it was a political arrangement, to have a homeland for the jewish people. which is fine. i just wish everyone would stop fighting and live and let live. there are Palestinian and other Arab christians there too. yet i do not call them Arab believers. i call them christians. there is not supposed to be any distinction between jew and gentile in Christ, but these last few decades we seem to be making distinctions again. i'm not sure that is a good idea. Jesus broke down the wall and made on man of the two. unity comes from (in my opinion) not being ashamed of the Gospel nor of the Name Jesus (Yeshua) or Christian (Mosiach).

1 Peter 4:16
However, if you suffer as a Christian, do not be ashamed, but praise God that you bear that name.

Peter said we are not to be ashamed of the name of Christian - 5546. Christianos
the New Testament was written in Koine greek, and greek was the language of the "world" at that time (following Alexander's conquests). i believe this was all according to God's plan.

Israel was not replaced by the church or by gentiles - believing Israel, the Israel of God was expanded, just as James testified to when he said here, that not only had God restored the house of David, He was bringing in the gentiles, just as promised to Abraham.

Acts 15
12And all the assembly fell silent, and they listened to Barnabas and Paul as they related what signs and wonders God had done through them among the Gentiles. 13After they finished speaking, James replied, “Brothers, listen to me. 14Simeon has related how God first visited the Gentiles, to take from them a people for his name. 15And with this the words of the prophets agree, just as it is written,

16 “‘After this I will return,
and I will rebuild the tent of David that has fallen;
I will rebuild its ruins,
and I will restore it,
17 that the remnant of mankind may seek the Lord,
and all the Gentiles who are called by my name,
says the Lord, who makes these things 18known from of old.’

19Therefore my judgment is that we should not trouble those of the Gentiles who turn to God, 20but should write to them to abstain from the things polluted by idols, and from sexual immorality, and from what has been strangled, and from blood. 21For from ancient generations Moses has had in every city those who proclaim him, for he is read every Sabbath in the synagogues.”

Glory to God! they understood that God had restored the House of David, that the remnant could seek Him and that the gentiles could be called by His name!

AMEN!

peace, peace and grace
Poppin
sorry for the distraction, but why, when i click quote to someone's post then reply, it places everything into the long post i had made to someone else?? sorry, i am silly.

hopefully this post will be a separate post. i don't want it to connect with my previous post. i don't why it keeps doing that.

hi Eric E Stahl.
All the righteous Jews in Israel will be removed or chased out of Israel during the tribulation period. All the rebellious Jews will be killed.

This is sort of what happened. but they escaped, when , according to Josephus, Cestius Gallus who had placed Vespasian in charge of the rebellion, pulled back, giving the Christians time to escape:

Flavius Josephus (A.D. 75)
It then happened that Cestius was not conscious either how the besieged despaired of success, nor how courageous the people were for him; and so he recalled his soldiers from the place, and by despairing of any expectation of taking it, without having received any disgrace, he retired from the city, without any reason in the world. (Wars of the Jews, II, XIX, 6,7)

Wars of the Jews
by Flavius Josephus
Chapter 19
What Cestius Did Against The Jews; And How, Upon His Besieging Jerusalem, He Retreated From The City Without Any Just Occasion In The World. As Also What Severe Calamities He Under Went From The Jews In His Retreat

the church fathers also write of the christians flight to Pella.

Eusebius (325)
But the people of the church in Jerusalem had been commanded by a revelation, vouchsafed to approved men there before the war, to leave the city and to dwell in a certain town of Perea called Pella. (History of the Church 3:5:3)

Eusebius (325)
"The whole body, however, of the church at Jerusalem, having been commanded by a divine revelation, given to men of approved piety there before the war, removed from the city, and dwelt at a certain town beyond the Jordan, called Pella. Here those that believed in Christ, having removed from Jerusalem, as if holy men had entirely abandoned the royal city itself, and the whole land of Judea; the divine justice, for their crimes against Christ and his apostles finally overtook them, totally destroying the whole generation of these evildoers form the earth. (History of the Church 3:5)

Epiphanius (375)
For when the city was about to be captured and sacked by the Romans, all the disciples were warned beforehand by an angel to remove from the city, doomed as it was to utter destruction. On migrating from it they settled at Pella, the town already indicated, across the Jordan. It is said to belong to Decapolis (On Weights and Measures 15)

After a lull in the military operations, owing to civil war and political turmoil in Rome, Vespasian was called to Rome and appointed as Emperor in 69. With Vespasian's departure, [his son - not yet caeser but prince] Titus moved to besiege the center of rebel resistance in Jerusalem in early 70. (wikipedia).

Titus accomplished the destruction (which Jesus had decreed, and which daniel has seen in his visions) and prince titus was made caesar afterwards.

in Christ our Lord,
Poppin

 

[Eric E Stahl]

But....there are no 'righteous' (in God's eyes) jews in Israel today are there? He may have mercy on some and call some to Jesus, but...
Does God consider anyone who rejects His Son to be righteous?

1 John 2
Beware of Antichrists
21I have not written to you because you do not know the truth, but because you do know it, and because no lie is of the truth. 22Who is the liar but the one who denies that Jesus is the Christ? This is the antichrist, the one who denies the Father and the Son. 23Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father; the one who confesses the Son has the Father also

the Bible says anyone who rejects Jesus is antichrist.
not only that it says they do not have or know the Father.

Hi Poppin,

Their are a few Christian Jews in Israel now. But day will come when 1/3 of the Jews will accept Jesus as Lord after he judges them and the world with fire.

[SIZE=10pt]Ezekiel 39:6-8[/SIZE]
6 And I will send a fire on Magog, and among them that dwell carelessly in the isles: and they shall know that I am the LORD.

7So will I make my holy name known in the midst of my people Israel; and I will not let them pollute my holy name any more: and the heathen shall know that I am the LORD, the Holy One in Israel.

8 Behold, it is come, and it is done, saith the Lord GOD; this is the day whereof I have spoken.

[SIZE=10pt]Zechariah 13:7-9[/SIZE]
7Awake, O sword, against my shepherd, and against the man that is my fellow, saith the LORD of hosts: smite the shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered: and I will turn mine hand upon the little ones._

8 And it shall come to pass, that in all the land, saith the LORD, two parts therein shall be cut off and die; but the third shall be left therein.

9 And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The LORD is my God.

hi Eric E Stahl.
all those passages you quoted from daniel and isaiah and zechariah were fulfilled a long time ago.
they refer to the return from exile in Babylon. the remnant returned and rebuilt the city and the walls and the slowly built the temple (which Herod renovated and made the magnificant buildings the disciples asked jesus about when he said there would not be one of those stones left standing).

this is speaking about siege of the roman armies, leadin up to the total desolation of 70AD.

Mark 13
The Abomination of Desolation
14"But when you see the ABOMINATION OF DESOLATION standing where it should not be (let the reader understand), then those who are in Judea must flee to the mountains. 15"The one who is on the housetop must not go down, or go in to get anything out of his house;

Jesus is clearly speaking to that generation, about Herod's Temple:

Mark 13
Temple Destruction Foretold
1As He was going out of the temple, one of His disciples said to Him, "Teacher, behold what wonderful stones and what wonderful buildings!" 2And Jesus said to him, "Do you see these great buildings? Not one stone will be left upon another which will not be torn down."

it is heartbreaking to see Jesus weeping over jerusalem, for He knows that the Covenant Curses must be poured out on her. His disciples heeded His warning, and they escaped that terrible horror.

Luke 19
Jesus Weeps over Jerusalem
43"For the days will come upon you when your enemies will throw up a barricade against you, and surround you and hem you in on every side, 44and they will level you to the ground and your children within you, and they will not leave in you one stone upon another, because you did not recognize the time of your visitation."

and tragically that's what happened. reading Josephus really makes clear how terrible it all was - civil war inside; the romans advancing outside...brothers murdering brothers, mothers eating their children...and the crazed zealots who seemed to always be the source of agitation running around dressed as women, stabbing and raping their own kinsmen. i wonder of these zealots were the converts Jesus spoke of.


here, in His pronouncement of the Old Covenant Curses, he mentions them. but i don't know for certain. commentators say they were more oppressive and cruel than the Pharisees who converted them. perhaps Judas Isacriot was one? that is speculation.

Matthew 23:15
"Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You travel over land and sea to win a single convert, and when you have succeeded, you make them twice as much a child of hell as you are.

Written in love for you, as a brother in Jesus Christ Our Lord,
grace mercy and peace to you,
Poppin.


right. i didn't mean christians. i meant the jewish people...the unbelieving jewish people.
i consider messianic jews to be christians.

Dodo_David, i don't believe The State of Israel plays any role in bible prophecy. i think it was a political arrangement, to have a homeland for the jewish people. which is fine. i just wish everyone would stop fighting and live and let live. there are Palestinian and other Arab christians there too. yet i do not call them Arab believers. i call them christians. there is not supposed to be any distinction between jew and gentile in Christ, but these last few decades we seem to be making distinctions again. i'm not sure that is a good idea. Jesus broke down the wall and made on man of the two. unity comes from (in my opinion) not being ashamed of the Gospel nor of the Name Jesus (Yeshua) or Christian (Mosiach).

1 Peter 4:16
However, if you suffer as a Christian, do not be ashamed, but praise God that you bear that name.

Peter said we are not to be ashamed of the name of Christian - 5546. Christianos
the New Testament was written in Koine greek, and greek was the language of the "world" at that time (following Alexander's conquests). i believe this was all according to God's plan.

Israel was not replaced by the church or by gentiles - believing Israel, the Israel of God was expanded, just as James testified to when he said here, that not only had God restored the house of David, He was bringing in the gentiles, just as promised to Abraham.

Acts 15
12And all the assembly fell silent, and they listened to Barnabas and Paul as they related what signs and wonders God had done through them among the Gentiles. 13After they finished speaking, James replied, “Brothers, listen to me. 14Simeon has related how God first visited the Gentiles, to take from them a people for his name. 15And with this the words of the prophets agree, just as it is written,

16 “‘After this I will return,
and I will rebuild the tent of David that has fallen;
I will rebuild its ruins,
and I will restore it,
17 that the remnant of mankind may seek the Lord,
and all the Gentiles who are called by my name,
says the Lord, who makes these things 18known from of old.’

19Therefore my judgment is that we should not trouble those of the Gentiles who turn to God, 20but should write to them to abstain from the things polluted by idols, and from sexual immorality, and from what has been strangled, and from blood. 21For from ancient generations Moses has had in every city those who proclaim him, for he is read every Sabbath in the synagogues.”

Glory to God! they understood that God had restored the House of David, that the remnant could seek Him and that the gentiles could be called by His name!

AMEN!

peace, peace and grace
Poppin

sorry for the distraction, but why, when i click quote to someone's post then reply, it places everything into the long post i had made to someone else?? sorry, i am silly.

hopefully this post will be a separate post. i don't want it to connect with my previous post. i don't why it keeps doing that.

hi Eric E Stahl.
All the righteous Jews in Israel will be removed or chased out of Israel during the tribulation period. All the rebellious Jews will be killed.

This is sort of what happened. but they escaped, when , according to Josephus, Cestius Gallus who had placed Vespasian in charge of the rebellion, pulled back, giving the Christians time to escape:

Flavius Josephus (A.D. 75)
It then happened that Cestius was not conscious either how the besieged despaired of success, nor how courageous the people were for him; and so he recalled his soldiers from the place, and by despairing of any expectation of taking it, without having received any disgrace, he retired from the city, without any reason in the world. (Wars of the Jews, II, XIX, 6,7)

Wars of the Jews
by Flavius Josephus
Chapter 19
What Cestius Did Against The Jews; And How, Upon His Besieging Jerusalem, He Retreated From The City Without Any Just Occasion In The World. As Also What Severe Calamities He Under Went From The Jews In His Retreat

the church fathers also write of the christians flight to Pella.

Eusebius (325)
But the people of the church in Jerusalem had been commanded by a revelation, vouchsafed to approved men there before the war, to leave the city and to dwell in a certain town of Perea called Pella. (History of the Church 3:5:3)

Eusebius (325)
"The whole body, however, of the church at Jerusalem, having been commanded by a divine revelation, given to men of approved piety there before the war, removed from the city, and dwelt at a certain town beyond the Jordan, called Pella. Here those that believed in Christ, having removed from Jerusalem, as if holy men had entirely abandoned the royal city itself, and the whole land of Judea; the divine justice, for their crimes against Christ and his apostles finally overtook them, totally destroying the whole generation of these evildoers form the earth. (History of the Church 3:5)

Epiphanius (375)
For when the city was about to be captured and sacked by the Romans, all the disciples were warned beforehand by an angel to remove from the city, doomed as it was to utter destruction. On migrating from it they settled at Pella, the town already indicated, across the Jordan. It is said to belong to Decapolis (On Weights and Measures 15)

After a lull in the military operations, owing to civil war and political turmoil in Rome, Vespasian was called to Rome and appointed as Emperor in 69. With Vespasian's departure, [his son - not yet caeser but prince] Titus moved to besiege the center of rebel resistance in Jerusalem in early 70. (wikipedia).

Titus accomplished the destruction (which Jesus had decreed, and which daniel has seen in his visions) and prince titus was made caesar afterwards.

in Christ our Lord,
Poppin

Poppin,

Zephaniah 1:1-3
1 The word of the LORD which came unto Zephaniah the son of Cushi, the son of Gedaliah, the son of Amariah, the son of Hizkiah, in the days of Josiah the son of Amon, king of Judah.

2I will utterly consume all things from off the land, saith the LORD.

3I will consume man and beast; I will consume the fowls of the heaven, and the fishes of the sea, and the stumblingblocks with the wicked: and I will cut off man from off the land, saith the LORD.


When God sends the tribulation judgment by fire even the animals and birds will be killed. I believe God will cause man to fight a nuclear war.

 

[Dodo_David]

For what it's worth, Messianic Jews calls themselves that because they observe the written Torah, which is something that modern-day Christians don't do.

 

[Poppin]

Hi Poppin,

Their are a few Christian Jews in Israel now. But day will come when 1/3 of the Jews will accept Jesus as Lord after he judges them and the world with fire.

[SIZE=10pt]Ezekiel 39:6-8[/SIZE]
6 And I will send a fire on Magog, and among them that dwell carelessly in the isles: and they shall know that I am the LORD.

7So will I make my holy name known in the midst of my people Israel; and I will not let them pollute my holy name any more: and the heathen shall know that I am the LORD, the Holy One in Israel.

8 Behold, it is come, and it is done, saith the Lord GOD; this is the day whereof I have spoken.

[SIZE=10pt]Zechariah 13:7-9[/SIZE]
7Awake, O sword, against my shepherd, and against the man that is my fellow, saith the LORD of hosts: smite the shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered: and I will turn mine hand upon the little ones._

8 And it shall come to pass, that in all the land, saith the LORD, two parts therein shall be cut off and die; but the third shall be left therein.

9 And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The LORD is my God.


Poppin,

Zephaniah 1:1-3
1 The word of the LORD which came unto Zephaniah the son of Cushi, the son of Gedaliah, the son of Amariah, the son of Hizkiah, in the days of Josiah the son of Amon, king of Judah.

2I will utterly consume all things from off the land, saith the LORD.

3I will consume man and beast; I will consume the fowls of the heaven, and the fishes of the sea, and the stumblingblocks with the wicked: and I will cut off man from off the land, saith the LORD.


When God sends the tribulation judgment by fire even the animals and birds will be killed. I believe God will cause man to fight a nuclear war.

Hello Eric.

"But day will come when 1/3 of the Israelis will accept Jesus as Lord after he judges them and the world with fire."

where does the bible say that? if you are referring to Zechariah, that was fulfilled. it's not today or in our future.

Zechariah 13:7
"Awake, O sword, against My Shepherd, And against the man, My Associate," Declares the LORD of hosts. "Strike the Shepherd that the sheep may be scattered; And I will turn My hand against the little ones.

fulfilled:

Matthew 26:31
Then Jesus told them, "This very night you will all fall away on account of me, for it is written: "'I will strike the shepherd, and the sheep of the flock will be scattered.'

Mark 14:27
"You will all fall away," Jesus told them, "for it is written: "'I will strike the shepherd, and the sheep will be scattered.'

John 16:32
"A time is coming and in fact has come when you will be scattered, each to your own home. You will leave me all alone. Yet I am not alone, for my Father is with me.

Zechariah 13
The Shepherd Struck, Sheep Scattered
8"It will come about in all the land," Declares the LORD, "That two parts in it will be cut off and perish; But the third will be left in it. 9"And I will bring the third part through the fire, Refine them as silver is refined, And test them as gold is tested. They will call on My name, And I will answer them; I will say, 'They are My people,' And they will say, 'The LORD is my God.'"

1 Peter 4
Suffering as Christians
12Beloved, do not be surprised at the fiery ordeal among you, which comes upon you for your testing, as though some strange thing were happening to you; 13but to the degree that you share the sufferings of Christ, keep on rejoicing, so that also at the revelation of His glory you may rejoice with exultation.

1 Peter 2:25
For "you were like sheep going astray," but now you have returned to the Shepherd and Overseer of your souls.

concerning Magog, Genesis says he is a descendant of Japeth.

Genesis 10
The Japhethites
1Now these are the records of the generations of Shem, Ham, and Japheth, the sons of Noah; and sons were born to them after the flood. 2The sons of Japheth were Gomer and Magog and Madai and Javan and Tubal and Meshech and Tiras.

and again here:

1 Chronicles 1:5
The sons of Japheth: Gomer, Magog, Madai, Javan, Tubal, Meshek and Tiras.

scholars; historians and Biblical commentators have varying opinions on these people were (are). but the bible says Magog is of Japeth.
they do seem to have some agreement that they lived in the Caucasus region

Noah blessed Shem and prayed that he would dwell in the tents of Shem.

Genesis 9
Shem's Blessing and Noah's Death
26He also said, "Blessed be the LORD, The God of Shem; And let Canaan be his servant. 27"May God enlarge Japheth, And let him dwell in the tents of Shem; And let Canaan be his servant." 28Noah lived three hundred and fifty years after the flood.

Isaiah 66:19
"I will set a sign among them, and I will send some of those who survive to the nations--to Tarshish, to the Libyans and Lydians (famous as archers), to Tubal and Greece, and to the distant islands that have not heard of my fame or seen my glory. They will proclaim my glory among the nations.

Ephesians 3
This mystery is that the Gentiles are fellow heirs, members of the same body, and partakers of the promise in Christ Jesus through the gospel.

concerning the identity of Gog/Magog, it is useful to consider all sources. and if viewing the short apocalyptic passages in Revelation 20, whether one is premillennial looking for to a future 1,000 year kingdom or amillennial (saying everything must occur before the 2nd coming), it am inclined, especially having studied Daniel line by line in accordance with history and the bible's internal witness that:

in ezekiel's time Magog, Meshech, Tubal, Gomer and Beth-togarmah were known as the Scythians.
in 7BC, the time of Ezekiel and Jeremiah, the Scythians attacked Syria and Judea. Later, they attacked Egypt. the year Jeremiah was called, the Assyrians, were using mercenary Scythian (Magog's) horsemen. they came against Egypt and Judah.

Jeremiah 4
Disaster from the North
5Declare in Judah and proclaim in Jerusalem, and say, "Blow the trumpet in the land; Cry aloud and say, 'Assemble yourselves, and let us go Into the fortified cities.' 6"Lift up a standard toward Zion! Seek refuge, do not stand still, For I am bringing evil from the north, And great destruction. 7"A lion has gone up from his thicket, And a destroyer of nations has set out; He has gone out from his place To make your land a waste. Your cities will be ruins Without inhabitant.

Jeremiah 1:15
I am about to summon all the peoples of the northern kingdoms," declares the LORD. "Their kings will come and set up their thrones in the entrance of the gates of Jerusalem; they will come against all her surrounding walls and against all the towns of Judah.

"Magog founded those that from him were named Magogites, but who are by the Greeks called Scythians." [Josephus 1:6:1]

the Ancient History Encyclopedia says of the Scythians:

c. 1000 BCE
Scythians migrate from Persia into the Asian steppes.
700 BCE - 300 BCE
Scythians dominate the western Asian steppes.
c. 676 BCE
Scythians and Mannaens attack Assyria.
c. 600 BCE - c. 300 BCE
The Scythians prosper north of the Black Sea.

i believe that though ezekiels' prophecies of Magog were fulfilled by indivudals; John uses the term (as jews do to this day), "from the four corners of the earth" to represent all the people hostile to Christ and His people. I do not believe the Bible teaches Gog is Russia; or that Gog/Magog invades the Land of israel in our furture.

Revelation 20 is about the church..christians. and is clearly a 'post-millennial' (or in my case post Messianic Era (just prior to the return of Christ when rebellious unsaved people from around the world will persecute and attack Christians, the beloved city, which by the time of the writing of the apsotles had come to mean the Church. this much is clear.

Galatians 4
Example of Hagar and Sarah
21Tell me, you who desire to be under the law, do you not listen to the law? 22For it is written that Abraham had two sons, one by a slave woman and one by a free woman. 23But the son of the slave was born according to the flesh, while the son of the free woman was born through promise. 24Now this may be interpreted allegorically: these women are two covenants. One is from Mount Sinai, bearing children for slavery; she is Hagar. 25Now Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia;e she corresponds to the present Jerusalem, for she is in slavery with her children. 26But the Jerusalem above is free, and she is our mother. 27For it is written,

“Rejoice, O barren one who does not bear;
break forth and cry aloud, you who are not in labor!
For the children of the desolate one will be more
than those of the one who has a husband.”

28Now you,f brothers, like Isaac, are children of promise. 29But just as at that time he who was born according to the flesh persecuted him who was born according to the Spirit, so also it is now. 30But what does the Scripture say? “Cast out the slave woman and her son, for the son of the slave woman shall not inherit with the son of the free woman.” 31So, brothers, we are not children of the slave but of the free woman.

sorry for such a long post. it is time for bed.
God bless and keep you
Poppin

 

[Eric E Stahl]

Hello Eric.

"But day will come when 1/3 of the Israelis will accept Jesus as Lord after he judges them and the world with fire."

where does the bible say that? if you are referring to Zechariah, that was fulfilled. it's not today or in our future.

Zechariah 13:7
"Awake, O sword, against My Shepherd, And against the man, My Associate," Declares the LORD of hosts. "Strike the Shepherd that the sheep may be scattered; And I will turn My hand against the little ones.

fulfilled:

Matthew 26:31
Then Jesus told them, "This very night you will all fall away on account of me, for it is written: "'I will strike the shepherd, and the sheep of the flock will be scattered.'

Mark 14:27
"You will all fall away," Jesus told them, "for it is written: "'I will strike the shepherd, and the sheep will be scattered.'

John 16:32
"A time is coming and in fact has come when you will be scattered, each to your own home. You will leave me all alone. Yet I am not alone, for my Father is with me.

Zechariah 13
The Shepherd Struck, Sheep Scattered
8"It will come about in all the land," Declares the LORD, "That two parts in it will be cut off and perish; But the third will be left in it. 9"And I will bring the third part through the fire, Refine them as silver is refined, And test them as gold is tested. They will call on My name, And I will answer them; I will say, 'They are My people,' And they will say, 'The LORD is my God.'"

1 Peter 4
Suffering as Christians
12Beloved, do not be surprised at the fiery ordeal among you, which comes upon you for your testing, as though some strange thing were happening to you; 13but to the degree that you share the sufferings of Christ, keep on rejoicing, so that also at the revelation of His glory you may rejoice with exultation.

1 Peter 2:25
For "you were like sheep going astray," but now you have returned to the Shepherd and Overseer of your souls.

concerning Magog, Genesis says he is a descendant of Japeth.

Genesis 10
The Japhethites
1Now these are the records of the generations of Shem, Ham, and Japheth, the sons of Noah; and sons were born to them after the flood. 2The sons of Japheth were Gomer and Magog and Madai and Javan and Tubal and Meshech and Tiras.

and again here:

1 Chronicles 1:5
The sons of Japheth: Gomer, Magog, Madai, Javan, Tubal, Meshek and Tiras.

scholars; historians and Biblical commentators have varying opinions on these people were (are). but the bible says Magog is of Japeth.
they do seem to have some agreement that they lived in the Caucasus region

Noah blessed Shem and prayed that he would dwell in the tents of Shem.

Genesis 9
Shem's Blessing and Noah's Death
26He also said, "Blessed be the LORD, The God of Shem; And let Canaan be his servant. 27"May God enlarge Japheth, And let him dwell in the tents of Shem; And let Canaan be his servant." 28Noah lived three hundred and fifty years after the flood.

Isaiah 66:19
"I will set a sign among them, and I will send some of those who survive to the nations--to Tarshish, to the Libyans and Lydians (famous as archers), to Tubal and Greece, and to the distant islands that have not heard of my fame or seen my glory. They will proclaim my glory among the nations.

Ephesians 3
This mystery is that the Gentiles are fellow heirs, members of the same body, and partakers of the promise in Christ Jesus through the gospel.

concerning the identity of Gog/Magog, it is useful to consider all sources. and if viewing the short apocalyptic passages in Revelation 20, whether one is premillennial looking for to a future 1,000 year kingdom or amillennial (saying everything must occur before the 2nd coming), it am inclined, especially having studied Daniel line by line in accordance with history and the bible's internal witness that:

in ezekiel's time Magog, Meshech, Tubal, Gomer and Beth-togarmah were known as the Scythians.
in 7BC, the time of Ezekiel and Jeremiah, the Scythians attacked Syria and Judea. Later, they attacked Egypt. the year Jeremiah was called, the Assyrians, were using mercenary Scythian (Magog's) horsemen. they came against Egypt and Judah.

Jeremiah 4
Disaster from the North
5Declare in Judah and proclaim in Jerusalem, and say, "Blow the trumpet in the land; Cry aloud and say, 'Assemble yourselves, and let us go Into the fortified cities.' 6"Lift up a standard toward Zion! Seek refuge, do not stand still, For I am bringing evil from the north, And great destruction. 7"A lion has gone up from his thicket, And a destroyer of nations has set out; He has gone out from his place To make your land a waste. Your cities will be ruins Without inhabitant.

Jeremiah 1:15
I am about to summon all the peoples of the northern kingdoms," declares the LORD. "Their kings will come and set up their thrones in the entrance of the gates of Jerusalem; they will come against all her surrounding walls and against all the towns of Judah.

"Magog founded those that from him were named Magogites, but who are by the Greeks called Scythians." [Josephus 1:6:1]

the Ancient History Encyclopedia says of the Scythians:

c. 1000 BCE
Scythians migrate from Persia into the Asian steppes.
700 BCE - 300 BCE
Scythians dominate the western Asian steppes.
c. 676 BCE
Scythians and Mannaens attack Assyria.
c. 600 BCE - c. 300 BCE
The Scythians prosper north of the Black Sea.

i believe that though ezekiels' prophecies of Magog were fulfilled by indivudals; John uses the term (as jews do to this day), "from the four corners of the earth" to represent all the people hostile to Christ and His people. I do not believe the Bible teaches Gog is Russia; or that Gog/Magog invades the Land of israel in our furture.

Revelation 20 is about the church..christians. and is clearly a 'post-millennial' (or in my case post Messianic Era (just prior to the return of Christ when rebellious unsaved people from around the world will persecute and attack Christians, the beloved city, which by the time of the writing of the apsotles had come to mean the Church. this much is clear.

Galatians 4
Example of Hagar and Sarah
21Tell me, you who desire to be under the law, do you not listen to the law? 22For it is written that Abraham had two sons, one by a slave woman and one by a free woman. 23But the son of the slave was born according to the flesh, while the son of the free woman was born through promise. 24Now this may be interpreted allegorically: these women are two covenants. One is from Mount Sinai, bearing children for slavery; she is Hagar. 25Now Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia;e she corresponds to the present Jerusalem, for she is in slavery with her children. 26But the Jerusalem above is free, and she is our mother. 27For it is written,

“Rejoice, O barren one who does not bear;
break forth and cry aloud, you who are not in labor!
For the children of the desolate one will be more
than those of the one who has a husband.”

28Now you,f brothers, like Isaac, are children of promise. 29But just as at that time he who was born according to the flesh persecuted him who was born according to the Spirit, so also it is now. 30But what does the Scripture say? “Cast out the slave woman and her son, for the son of the slave woman shall not inherit with the son of the free woman.” 31So, brothers, we are not children of the slave but of the free woman.

sorry for such a long post. it is time for bed.
God bless and keep you
Poppin

Poppin,
The following passages have not been fullfiled but soon will come to pass.

[SIZE=18pt]Fire in the Sky [/SIZE]

The following scriptures will happen during the day of the Lord which is very,very near and hasteth greatly because Israel has gathered see Zephaniah 1:14-2-3.

Ezekiel 39:1-8
1 Therefore, thou son of man, prophesy against Gog, and say, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I am against thee, O Gog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal:
2 And I will turn thee back, and leave but the sixth part of thee, and will cause thee to come up from the north parts, and will bring thee upon the mountains of Israel:
3 And I will smite thy bow out of thy left hand, and will cause thine arrows to fall out of thy right hand.
4 Thou shalt fall upon the mountains of Israel, thou, and all thy bands, and the people that is with thee: I will give thee unto the ravenous birds of every sort, and to the beasts of the field to be devoured.
5 Thou shalt fall upon the open field: for I have spoken it, saith the Lord GOD.
6And I will send a fire on Magog, and among them that dwell carelessly in the isles: and they shall know that I am the LORD.
7 So will I make my holy name known in the midst of my people Israel; and I will not let them pollute my holy name any more: and the heathen shall know that I am the LORD, the Holy One in Israel.
8 Behold, it is come, and it is done, saith the Lord GOD; this is the day whereof I have spoken.

Jeremiah 25:15-17,
15 For thus saith the LORD God of Israel unto me; Take the wine cup of this fury at my hand, and cause all the nations, to whom I send thee, to drink it.
16 And they shall drink, and be moved, and be mad, because of the sword that I will send among them.
17 Then took I the cup at the LORD's hand, and made all the nations to drink, unto whom the LORD had sent me:
18 To wit, Jerusalem, and the cities of Judah, and the kings thereof, and the princes thereof, to make them a desolation, an astonishment, an hissing, and a curse; as it is this day;

29 For, lo, I begin to bring evil on the city which is called by my name, and should ye be utterly unpunished? Ye shall not be unpunished: for I will call for a sword upon all the inhabitants of the earth, saith the LORD of hosts.
30 Therefore prophesy thou against them all these words, and say unto them, The LORD shall roar from on high, and utter his voice from his holy habitation; he shall mightily roar upon his habitation; he shall give a shout, as they that tread the grapes, against all the inhabitants of the earth.

[SIZE=16pt] (((God cause man to fight man by nuclear war)))[/SIZE]
31A noise shall come even to the ends of the earth; for the LORD hath a controversy with the nations, he will plead with all flesh; he will give them that are wicked to the sword, saith the LORD.
32 Thus saith the LORD of hosts, Behold, evil shall go forth from nation to nation, and a great whirlwind shall be raised up from the coasts of the earth.
33 And the slain of the LORD shall be at that day from one end of the earth even unto the other end of the earth: they shall not be lamented, neither gathered, nor buried; they shall be dung upon the ground.



[SIZE=10pt]2 Peter 3:10[/SIZE]–15 KJV
[SIZE=10pt]10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]14 Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=10pt]Revelation 6:12[/SIZE]–14 KJV
[SIZE=10pt]12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=10pt]Isaiah 34:1[/SIZE]–8 KJV
[SIZE=10pt]34 Come near, ye nations, to hear; and hearken, ye people: let the earth[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]hear, and all that is therein; the world, and all things that come forth of it.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]2 For the indignation of the Lord is upon all nations, and his fury upon all their armies: he hath utterly destroyed them, he hath delivered them to the slaughter.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]3 Their slain also shall be cast out, and their stink shall come up out of their carcases, and the mountains shall be melted with their blood.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]4 And all the host of heaven shall be dissolved, and the heavens shall be rolled together as a scroll: and all their host shall fall down, as the leaf falleth off from the vine, and as a falling fig from the fig tree.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=10pt]Another Old Testament prophet, Isaiah, also foresaw the nuclear war and he prophesied that the heavens will burn and roll up as a scroll. Apparently, all of the airplanes and nuclear missiles will fall from the sky during the war when the atmosphere burns. This judgment will be on all nations.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=10pt]Isaiah 51:5[/SIZE]–11 KJV
[SIZE=10pt]5 My righteousness is near; my salvation is gone forth, and mine arms shall judge the people; the isles shall wait upon me, and on mine arm shall they trust.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]6 Lift up your eyes to the heavens, and look upon the earth beneath: for the heavens shall vanish away like smoke, and the earth shall wax old like a garment, and they that dwell therein shall die in like manner: but my salvation shall be for ever, and my righteousness shall not be abolished.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=10pt]Isaiah 25:1[/SIZE]–7 KJV
[SIZE=10pt]4 For thou hast been a strength to the poor, a strength to the needy in his distress, a refuge from the storm, a shadow from the heat, when the blast of the terrible ones is as a storm against the wall.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]5 Thou shalt bring down the noise of strangers, as the heat in a dry place; even the heat with the shadow of a cloud: the branch of the terrible ones shall be brought low.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]6 And in this mountain shall the Lord of hosts make unto all people a feast of fat things, a feast of wines on the lees, of fat things full of marrow, of wines on the lees well refined.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]7 And he will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=10pt]In Isaiah 30:25[/SIZE]–26, it says that the sun will become seven times stronger in the day of great slaughter. The day of great slaughter happens when the nuclear war takes place and the ozone layer is burned up as a scroll. Malachi 4:1 says that the earth will burn as an oven. In looking to the encyclopedia to see what parts of the atmosphere can burn, you will discover that the ozone is a triple oxygen molecule.
[SIZE=10pt]The ozone layer and the hydrogen layer are next to each other in the atmosphere above the earth. The chemical reaction when they burn is as follows:[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]Heat + oxygen + hydrogen = H2O (water) + greater heat[/SIZE]
[SIZE=10pt]The ozone and hydrogen layers will be set on fire over Israel by an atomic blast, and then they will burn like the Hindenburg blimp. When the ozone and hydrogen burn, it will form hot water vapor that will condense into water droplets that will then become rain, which will form great hailstones that will fall to the earth along with torrential rain. When the atmosphere burns, the heavens will roll up as a scroll all the way around the earth, over every nation.[/SIZE]

 

[Poppin]

Hi Eric.
But Zephaniah warns Judah and Jerusalem of the coming exile, destruction by Nebuchadnezzar. In with the warnings and descriptions of what will happen and that a humble remnant will be saved out of it, God also talks about His judgment on the nations - which did happen. Edom was laid waste, Moab, etc.
In the terrible news about the coming day of YHWH (judgment) is good news of a gathering of a remnant through it, they would be brought back. And they were. Ezra and Nehemiah received the decree and went back to rebuild.

Zephaniah does see a near view (judgment with Nebuchadnezzar as th instrument), then a middle view with the return and joy of those who were there and or heard the Good News of Messiah going forth out of Zion, and then like the other prophets, he describes a final restoration when God's people are with Him in the new heavens and the new earth.

The prophets have to have a complete fulfillment in their own day or near to it; as well as often they are seeing a far fulfillment. But we can not just lift whole cloth their writings in history and drop them into the future, i don't think.
this is a very interesting subject. It certainly makes we afraid to sin, it reminds me that God wants upright living and with Himself known alone as God.
Thank you.
God Bless you!
Poppin

 

[Cooter]

Hello Poppin - glad to see you posting on this site. I must say that you are closest to the truth as anyone that I have seen on this board. Here is a brief summary of the main events that occurred during the fall of Jerusalem. There is much more information if you are interested.

All of Matt 24 has been fulfilled as of 70AD (except the second coming of Jesus). It was not a “falling away” from Christianity that Paul talked about but rather the “rebellion” of the Jews against Rome. After the rebellion started it was then that the Terrorist leader Eleazar ben Simon took over the Temple and desecrated it far worse then it ever had been in history. He was the "Man of sin" or "Son of perdition" that Paul spoke of. The word translated “falling away” can and often is translated "Rebellion.” Josephus's account all fits together very well - that is, with the prophesies of Jesus, Paul, and Daniel. This scripture in 2Thess 2 came to pass just 14 years after it was written by paul in 52AD.

The sequence of events were as follows...

1. 
   The restrainer was taken away – The Shekinah glory of God was seen leaving the temple. A month or so later the heavenly host was heard leaving the temple on Pentecost of 66AD)
   
2. 
   Now that the restrainer has been taken away - the “rebellion” begins
   
3. 
   The terrorists took over the Temple - the Roman garrison is slaughtered
   
4. 
   Agrippa II sent an army of 2,000 men to put down the rebellion (failed - retreated)
   
5. 
   Nero sent Cestius with the 12th legion to quell the rebellion
   
6. 
   Army surrounding city (12th legion + auxilliaries)
   
7. 
   Man of sin (terrorists) is in control of the Temple - Eleazar ben Simon
   
8. 
   Cestius fled for no known reason on Chesvan 5th 66AD
   
9. 
   Terrorists pursued Cestius – destroyed most of 12th legion (5,800)
   
10. 
    Terrorists were gone after Cestius for about 8 days total
    
11. 
    Christians had about only 8 days to flee Judea and the city. This is why Jesus' warning was so very urgent.
    
12. 
    Christians fled to Pella according to tradition
    
13. 
    Daniel's 1,290 day clock began running on Cheshvan 4th
    
14. 
    1,290 days later the daily sacrifice failed on Tammuz 17th 70AD
    
15. 
    45 days later the terrorists surrendered to Titus (1,335 days total)
    
16. 
    Everyone was shocked and surprised when the terrorists surrendered
    
17. 
    God had cut the siege short so the elect could survive. Siege of Titus lasted 136 days total
    
18. 
    Afterward the city and the Temple were totally destroyed
    
19. 
    Only one structure remained – the fortress Antonia – now errantly called the Temple Mount.
    

Jesus said that “Immediately after the tribulation of those days” he was going to return for his people in his second coming - which would have been the end of time. But as we know in hindsight - this was delayed. All of the events of Matt 24 has been fulfilled as of 70AD – except as noted.

Larry

 

[ENOCH2010]

Who was it in the past, that died of a head wound and came back to life ?

 

[Poppin]

Hello Poppin - glad to see you posting on this site. I must say that you are closest to the truth as anyone that I have seen on this board. Here is a brief summary of the main events that occurred during the fall of Jerusalem. There is much more information if you are interested.

All of Matt 24 has been fulfilled as of 70AD (except the second coming of Jesus). It was not a “falling away” from Christianity that Paul talked about but rather the “rebellion” of the Jews against Rome. After the rebellion started it was then that the Terrorist leader Eleazar ben Simon took over the Temple and desecrated it far worse then it ever had been in history. He was the "Man of sin" or "Son of perdition" that Paul spoke of. The word translated “falling away” can and often is translated "Rebellion.” Josephus's account all fits together very well - that is, with the prophesies of Jesus, Paul, and Daniel. This scripture in 2Thess 2 came to pass just 14 years after it was written by paul in 52AD.

The sequence of events were as follows...

1. 
   The restrainer was taken away – The Shekinah glory of God was seen leaving the temple. A month or so later the heavenly host was heard leaving the temple on Pentecost of 66AD)
   
2. 
   Now that the restrainer has been taken away - the “rebellion” begins
   
3. 
   The terrorists took over the Temple - the Roman garrison is slaughtered
   
4. 
   Agrippa II sent an army of 2,000 men to put down the rebellion (failed - retreated)
   
5. 
   Nero sent Cestius with the 12th legion to quell the rebellion
   
6. 
   Army surrounding city (12th legion + auxilliaries)
   
7. 
   Man of sin (terrorists) is in control of the Temple - Eleazar ben Simon
   
8. 
   Cestius fled for no known reason on Chesvan 5th 66AD
   
9. 
   Terrorists pursued Cestius – destroyed most of 12th legion (5,800)
   
10. 
    Terrorists were gone after Cestius for about 8 days total
    
11. 
    Christians had about only 8 days to flee Judea and the city. This is why Jesus' warning was so very urgent.
    
12. 
    Christians fled to Pella according to tradition
    
13. 
    Daniel's 1,290 day clock began running on Cheshvan 4th
    
14. 
    1,290 days later the daily sacrifice failed on Tammuz 17th 70AD
    
15. 
    45 days later the terrorists surrendered to Titus (1,335 days total)
    
16. 
    Everyone was shocked and surprised when the terrorists surrendered
    
17. 
    God had cut the siege short so the elect could survive. Siege of Titus lasted 136 days total
    
18. 
    Afterward the city and the Temple were totally destroyed
    
19. 
    Only one structure remained – the fortress Antonia – now errantly called the Temple Mount.
    

Jesus said that “Immediately after the tribulation of those days” he was going to return for his people in his second coming - which would have been the end of time. But as we know in hindsight - this was delayed. All of the events of Matt 24 has been fulfilled as of 70AD – except as noted.

Larry

Awesome Larry!
I find it very edifying and amazing when i read about those prophecies and how they came to pass - every tiny detail.
Amen
Poppin

 

[ENOCH2010]

Poppin, you say all has been fulfilled. Most people are still looking for this prophecy to be fulfilled, which states a person will die from a head wound, and be brought back to life. If this has already happened, who was it?

 

[Poppin]

Poppin, you say all has been fulfilled. Most people are still looking for this prophecy to be fulfilled, which states a person will die from a head wound, and be brought back to life. If this has already happened, who was it?

Julius Caesar, Augustus, Tiberius, Caligula, and Claudius. = five kings (of the BEAST ROME)
kings or rulers or evil men are also described as beasts.
NERO is identified as the beast who first persecuted Christians.
He belonged to a (blood) line of Caesars (see the five above) which ended with HIM (add “the other has not yet come (7th), and when he comes, he must remain a little while." - this was Galba who reigned less than 7 months)

Nero (beast) was the 6th king of Rome (beast), and his persecution of Christians began in November 64AD continuing until June 68 AD. when he committed suicide, - a period of 42 months.

Revelation 13:3
“And I saw one of his heads as if it had been slain, and his fatal wound was healed. And the whole earth was amazed and followed after the beast.”

After Nero committed suicide (by stabbing himself in the throat), the Julius through Claudius line of emperors came to an end.

The (blood line) Caesars had received worship as GODS (by the whole world - the Roman Empire - the known world at that time) had been cut off when NERO was killed by the sword.

But the Empire with it's god-men kings did NOT end yet. Because after Nero came Galba - the 7th and last of that line. And the pagans continued to follow the beast....when it was revived after what should have been a mortal wound...under TITUS.

“the other has not yet come (7th), and when he comes, he must remain a little while." - this was Galba who reigned less than 7 months.

We see right here John telling us that the beast Nero's death and the end of that line (Galba's short reign accomplished little but signified the end of the Julian line) should have brought the Beast Empire to an end...but it didn't - YET.

After the end of the Julian-Nero line, the Empire was crumbling, civil war chaos and catastrophes (just as Daniel 2 said - the Stone would bring down that empire eventually) After Nero's death there was actually a quick succession of 3 Caesars but they all ended quickly and violently and

1) accomplished nothing regarding reviving the Beast
2) are not included in God's reckoning because of that


BUT - then came Titus Flavius Vespasian, and he established a NEW dynasty which revived the PAGAN Roman Empire (not the Roman Catholic Church stuff) and it thrived again for quite some time.
and all the world (pagan) followed after it. saying who can make war with it?

Titus, as we know was the prince (later made Caesar) who was decreed (see Daniel 9) to come with his people (military) and destroy the city and sanctuary and be the instrument of God's Judgment on the Great Harlot Jerusalem.

Bless you,
Poppin

i actually did not include other variations on the ceasars and the order they are given in revelation.
there are other proposals.
we can discuss them. i'll post after someone else does, or i know there are other posters here who have a variation of the ceasars (i.e. Galba vs Titus etc)

the point is, the beast beast was Nero.
the beast empire was Rome.

 

[Retrobyter]

Shalom, Cooter. (Like the turtle?)

Hello Poppin - glad to see you posting on this site. I must say that you are closest to the truth as anyone that I have seen on this board. Here is a brief summary of the main events that occurred during the fall of Jerusalem. There is much more information if you are interested.

All of Matt 24 has been fulfilled as of 70AD (except the second coming of Jesus). It was not a “falling away” from Christianity that Paul talked about but rather the “rebellion” of the Jews against Rome. After the rebellion started it was then that the Terrorist leader Eleazar ben Simon took over the Temple and desecrated it far worse then it ever had been in history. He was the "Man of sin" or "Son of perdition" that Paul spoke of. The word translated “falling away” can and often is translated "Rebellion.” Josephus's account all fits together very well - that is, with the prophesies of Jesus, Paul, and Daniel. This scripture in 2Thess 2 came to pass just 14 years after it was written by paul in 52AD.

The sequence of events were as follows...

1. 
   The restrainer was taken away – The Shekinah glory of God was seen leaving the temple. A month or so later the heavenly host was heard leaving the temple on Pentecost of 66AD)
   
2. 
   Now that the restrainer has been taken away - the “rebellion” begins
   
3. 
   The terrorists took over the Temple - the Roman garrison is slaughtered
   
4. 
   Agrippa II sent an army of 2,000 men to put down the rebellion (failed - retreated)
   
5. 
   Nero sent Cestius with the 12th legion to quell the rebellion
   
6. 
   Army surrounding city (12th legion + auxilliaries)
   
7. 
   Man of sin (terrorists) is in control of the Temple - Eleazar ben Simon
   
8. 
   Cestius fled for no known reason on Chesvan 5th 66AD
   
9. 
   Terrorists pursued Cestius – destroyed most of 12th legion (5,800)
   
10. 
    Terrorists were gone after Cestius for about 8 days total
    
11. 
    Christians had about only 8 days to flee Judea and the city. This is why Jesus' warning was so very urgent.
    
12. 
    Christians fled to Pella according to tradition
    
13. 
    Daniel's 1,290 day clock began running on Cheshvan 4th
    
14. 
    1,290 days later the daily sacrifice failed on Tammuz 17th 70AD
    
15. 
    45 days later the terrorists surrendered to Titus (1,335 days total)
    
16. 
    Everyone was shocked and surprised when the terrorists surrendered
    
17. 
    God had cut the siege short so the elect could survive. Siege of Titus lasted 136 days total
    
18. 
    Afterward the city and the Temple were totally destroyed
    
19. 
    Only one structure remained – the fortress Antonia – now errantly called the Temple Mount.
    

Jesus said that “Immediately after the tribulation of those days” he was going to return for his people in his second coming - which would have been the end of time. But as we know in hindsight - this was delayed. All of the events of Matt 24 has been fulfilled as of 70AD – except as noted.

Larry

That's very close to being accurate. I was especially intrigued by the next-to-last sentence, "But as we know in hindsight - this was delayed." Consider two things:

First, we know that Yeshua` said that he was going to return TO His people at His second coming, "immediately after the tribulation of those days." What caused the "delay" was that we are still IN the tribulation of those days. However, they were IN the tribulation of those days beginning with Yeshua`s denouncement of the religious leaders - the elders of the tribe of Y'hudah - and His pronouncement of "desolation" on them:

Matthew 23:37-39
37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!
38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.
39 For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord. (Hebrew of Psalm 118:26: Baruwkh haba' b-shem YHWH.)
KJV

That is NOT just a coincidence!

Second, you've got to understand that MANY, MANY Christians make the common mistake that the "tribulation" = the "seventieth Seven" of Dani'el 9. Consequently, they will frequently say that the "tribulation period" is 7 years long or that the "great tribulation" is 3.5 years long. This forces one to say that either the 3.5-year "great tribulation" was in the first century, or it is yet to happen some time in the future. The word "tribulation," however, comes from the Greek word "thlipsis" which means "pressure" or "distress." It doesn't even mean "persecution." That's the Greek word "dioogmos." (I use "oo" for an omega and "o" for an omicron.)

The "tribulation," then, is merely the PRESSURE that has been put on God's people, primarily the Hebrews but also the justified believers of the Way, down through the last two thousand years! It is described as "the times of the Goyim (Gentiles)" because it is during this time that Yerushalayim (Jerusalem) has been trodden under foot by the Goyim. (Luke 21:24.) The Goyim STILL have a major presence today in the Old City. Three fourths of the City is under Goyiy governing, the Armenian Quarter, the Christian Quarter, and the Muslim Quarter.

It is also called the "time of Ya`aqov's (Jacob's) trouble." (Jeremiah 30:7.) This is a period in human history when the Hebrews are squeezed by a "tightness," a "pressure." It is during this time that they will be chased from their temporary homes, hounded, persecuted, and yes, killed wherever they go. This is PRECISELY what has happened to the Hebrew people all across Europe and Russia over the last 2,000 years! It's only been recently that they were given back their homeland, the LAND OF ISRA'EL, following their greatest struggle to date - the Holocaust! Right after they received their inheritance and made a declaration of independence, they were immediately accosted by the surrounding countries of Muslims who wanted to destroy the fledgling country! Through God's hand of miraculous power, they survived. Against seemingly impossible odds, they FLOURISHED!

We are rapidly drawing close to the end of this time of Ya`aqov's trouble, and it is THEN, when they can FINALLY say, "Baruwkh haba' b-shem YHWH," "Welcome, Comer with YHWH'S authority," that Yeshua` will return as promised. (John 14:1-4; Acts 1:9-11; Revelation 1:7; 19:11-21) At that time, God will restore the count of Sevens and finish the last half of the seventieth Seven. To purpose was to install the Messiah, and He has YET to be installed as Isra'el's King. This will be rectified when He comes.