Are Doctrines affected by Modern Versions

[Davy]

A resounding yes!
These type of errors started in the very early church.. remember that the wolves were in the flock before the end of the apostolic age.

In the KJV the Catholics changed elohim to angels multiple times.

There are multiple places even back then that are biased to prove the nicene creed.

Then after the vulgar the johness comma 1 john 5.7 was added to again enhance doctrine. Back then to only had 1 or two word to interpret into. Now there are ~20 different translations from Hebrew for the word evil, etc.

Just compare using the blue Bible of the verse Isaiah 45.7. Protestants and Catholics have been lead astray by believing God couldn't create evil. When He himself created all things. Another good error is to know who the good and faithful witness is and who the Amen is. Then read rev 3.14 in the vulgate. It should change your whole belief in who God is

The list of man's traditions thar added to and took away has not stopped. They have emasculated our faith and remove the power of God from most of us.

Read the KJV. Read about each book and verse. But beware. When the verse fragments were accepted as doctrine and what year. Fast and prayer as Satan has put all doctrine and believers asleep

Sounds like you have sunken into even more doctrines of men by trying to spotlight corruptions...

The Bible does... teach a 3 Person Godhead of The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit. Trying to strike out the 1 John 5:7 verse, even IF... it were an addition by the Catholic Church (which it wasn't), that still will not strike out all the MANY Scripture witnesses of the 3-Person GODHEAD.

Isaiah 45:7 debates about God creating evil, come simply from NOT understanding that Scripture. God does... create evil, FOR THIS PRESENT WORLD TIME. But He is NOT the creator of evil. Satan was. How?

In the Old Testament prophets, like Isaiah and Ezekiel, God used the title of "the Assyrian" also as a title pointing to Satan (see Isaiah 30:30-33). Specifically in Isaiah 10, God shows that "the Assyrian" is God's "rod of Mine anger". Even in Judges 9:23, God sent an evil spirit between Abimelech and the men of Shechem.

The question then is, would ANY of that evil have existed for God to use against the wicked IF Satan had not rebelled against God in the old world? The answer of course would be no. Per the parable in Ezekiel 28, God said He created Satan 'perfect in his ways' originally, then iniquity was found in him, for he coveting God's Throne that was his job to guard, being a covering cherub. It was Satan's rebellion in that old world that BEGAN evil and death and sin. God did NOT create it. But God certainly WILL... use evil during this present world to punish with. And that is how He meant that He creates evil per Isaiah 45:7, meaning He uses evil for this present world.

In the world to come, once Satan, death, and hell are destroyed in the future "lake of fire", there will be NO MORE sin, no more death, no more evil, ever again.

Your attempt to twist the meaning of Rev.3:14 is also a corruptness from men's confusion -- Christ Jesus is The "Amen" there, and the word "creation" is that in the Greek. We know from other Scripture that The Father created ALL things through The Son (Hebrews). So it shouldn't be problem to understand that is NOT pointing to Jesus as having been created because He wasn't, but the creation was made thru... Jesus. But you say that should change our whole belief of who God is? What a FALSE TWIST! It changes nothing about Jesus Christ being the "express image" of The Father! You ought to try reading Hebrews 1, instead of suggesting false Jew doctrine that Jesus Christ is not GOD.

Matt 1:21-23
21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.
22 Now all this was done, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying,
23 "Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.
KJV

 

[Truther]

Are the spirit, water and blood also persons?

No, verse 7 contextually is speaking of the manifestations of God in various ways as verse 8 does.

 

[rebuilder 454]

Nonsense, even though you didn't specifically point to a single example, so I will generalize also, see

[1] KJV Bible Vindicated​

​

[2] KJB Articles​

​

[3]

The Mss evidence is overwhelming for the KJB text type. The verses under question were indeed 'removed' (they do not merely 'differ').

Niv = not inspired version.
At our men's bible study, that meets three times a week, we are in Ephesians currently

most of the men have NIV Bibles. Only two of us have King James Version. I have three Greek Interlinear Bibles. Even before I learned it, I could tell King James was taken precisely from the Greek. There's almost no difference in the King James version and the Textus receptus.

Now, the new world translation of the Jehovah Witnesses, from my understanding ,comes from the alexandrian text. The alexandrian text was rejected by the church fathers because it was corrupted. I believe it did come out of Egypt. Now the King James version from my understanding is translated out of Latin and the Textus receptus. However I believe the NIV was translated out of the alexandrian text, and, by the way, from my understanding ,there was a homosexual on the board that "translated" the "not inspired version"..NIV.
As a serious bible student, i will never ever own a NIV.
All believers should own a greek interlinear.
If they study it, they will burn that NIV because it will sicken them with all those the omissions and perversions.
When the NIV omits sentences in certain verses in the footnotes it will say older manuscripts do not include these words. Now that is an out and out perversion of the truth because the text is receptus outdates that alexandrian text.

you just can't believe how in the world they could get it that wrong. And yet us King James people are looked down on and mocked as if we are the ones that are defective

 

[Hobie]

True Brother, the Critical Text (Vaticanus, Sinaiticus, Alexzandrinus manuscriptes) was too corrupt for copying purposes, which is still unknown to the majority of Christians. They were abandoned from 600 ad to 1844, and their recent discovery has earned them a popularity merely due to age.

Nearly all the modern translations are derived from these codices and are misleading many Bible believing readers of God's Word. The true source of Scripture must contain the entire Word, but the modern translations omit hundreds of entire and partial passages (Mat 4:4).

The deception has caused a lot of confusion and misunderstanding to say the least.

 

[Arthur81]

Lets compare one verse, 1 John 4:3:

NIV - but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world.

RSV - and every spirit which does not confess Jesus is not of God. This is the spirit of antichrist, of which you heard that it was coming, and now it is in the world already.

ASV and every spirit that confesseth not Jesus is not of God: and this is the spirit of the antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it cometh; and now it is in the world already.

KJV - And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

We see here in 1 John 4:3 that the NIV takes out the whole point in the text, "NIV leaves out the fact that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh--yet another swipe at the divinity of Christ." https://mundall.com/erik/NIV-KJV.htm

"Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God: And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world." (1John 4:2-3 KJV)

"Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God: and every spirit that confesseth not Jesus is not of God: and this is the spirit of the antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it cometh; and now it is in the world already." (1John 4:2-3 ASV)

"The way to recognize the Spirit of God is this: every spirit which acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, and no spirit is from God which does not acknowledge Jesus. This is the spirit of antichrist; you have been warned that it was to come, and now here it is, in the world already!" (1John 4:2-3 REB)

"This is how you will be able to know whether it is God's Spirit: anyone who acknowledges that Jesus Christ came as a human being has the Spirit who comes from God. But anyone who denies this about Jesus does not have the Spirit from God. The spirit that he has is from the Enemy of Christ; you heard that it would come, and now it is here in the world already." (1John 4:2-3 GNB92)

In the TR used by the KJV, the phrase "Jesus Christ is come in the flesh" was duplicated by a copyist in v3 from v2 and there is no change in doctrine. For many years I wrote my confession of faith, my belief system, with the proof texts from the KJV. In recent years I checked those proof texts with the REB (Revised English Bible of the UK) and no doctrine was changed. This is surprising since the REB is a Dynamic Equivalence Translation, not word for word.

 

[Hobie]

Niv = not inspired version.
At our men's bible study, that meets three times a week, we are in Ephesians currently

most of the men have NIV Bibles. Only two of us have King James Version. I have three Greek Interlinear Bibles. Even before I learned it, I could tell King James was taken precisely from the Greek. There's almost no difference in the King James version and the Textus receptus.

Now, the new world translation of the Jehovah Witnesses, from my understanding ,comes from the alexandrian text. The alexandrian text was rejected by the church fathers because it was corrupted. I believe it did come out of Egypt. Now the King James version from my understanding is translated out of Latin and the Textus receptus. However I believe the NIV was translated out of the alexandrian text, and, by the way, from my understanding ,there was a homosexual on the board that "translated" the "not inspired version"..NIV.
As a serious bible student, i will never ever own a NIV.
All believers should own a greek interlinear.
If they study it, they will burn that NIV because it will sicken them with all those the omissions and perversions.
When the NIV omits sentences in certain verses in the footnotes it will say older manuscripts do not include these words. Now that is an out and out perversion of the truth because the text is receptus outdates that alexandrian text.

you just can't believe how in the world they could get it that wrong. And yet us King James people are looked down on and mocked as if we are the ones that are defective

Where can you get the Greek Interlinear Bible, is it only online.

 

[Arthur81]

Where can you get the Greek Interlinear Bible, is it only online.

Go to Amazon.com and search for: "greek english interlinear new testament" Many will come up for you to review. You can get the very latest one, NA28. You can search for Hebrew - English interlinear or Greek - English Interlinear as well. But, keep in mind that the glosses in the various Interlinear NTs vary and are not identical.

 

[Deborah_]

Where can you get the Greek Interlinear Bible, is it only online.

I've got two interlinears, one is just the New Testament and the other is the whole Bible (Hebrew and Greek). Strangely, they haven't caused me to want to burn my NIV. Quite the reverse - they demonstrate what a good translation it is.

 

[rebuilder 454]

Where can you get the Greek Interlinear Bible, is it only online.

The book stores here do not even know what it is.
I got my last one online.
Greens interlinear of the received text. Textus receptus.
It has king james as the parallel.

 

[rebuilder 454]

I've got two interlinears, one is just the New Testament and the other is the whole Bible (Hebrew and Greek). Strangely, they haven't caused me to want to burn my NIV. Quite the reverse - they demonstrate what a good translation it is.

That is definitely bizarre

The king james is almost word for word of the textus receptus.
Niv is vastly different.
Not a good translation at all.

 

[JohnDB]

Well,
The only way to read scriptures is in the original languages and not any translation at all.

The exact "crime" that in part Stephen was martyred for.

 

[Truther]

The book stores here do not even know what it is.
I got my last one online.
Greens interlinear of the received text. Textus receptus.
It has king james as the parallel.

I have an interlinear. It was made to create the appearance that the king James is wrong. It isn’t worth a plug nickle.

 

[Deborah_]

That is definitely bizarre

The king james is almost word for word of the textus receptus.
Niv is vastly different.
Not a good translation at all.

Well, obviously opinions differ, don't they!

 

[Hobie]

Go to Amazon.com and search for: "greek english interlinear new testament" Many will come up for you to review. You can get the very latest one, NA28. You can search for Hebrew - English interlinear or Greek - English Interlinear as well. But, keep in mind that the glosses in the various Interlinear NTs vary and are not identical.

How so, can you give a example...

 

[Wrangler]

The Bible does... teach a 3 Person Godhead of The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit.

No. It doesn’t but this brings up the converse of the OP; doctrines (false doctrines) driving older and bad translations.

 

[Arthur81]

How so, can you give a example...

When it comes to the culture wars that began with opposition to such translations of "young woman" in Isaiah 7:14, then the LGBTQ activism following the 1969 Stonewall Riots, followed by the 1973 Roe vs Wade Supreme Court decision; I go to translations earlier in the 20th century, the 1901 ASV is my standard. But, on one verse, I can illustrate what I mean, 1 Cor. 6:9; where there is no variation in the Greek among the texts used in Greek-English Interlinear NTs. On the Greek malakos and arsenokoites, translated "effeminate" and "abusers of themselves with mankind" as it is in the KJV, and followed in the RV & ASV; of the Interlinears I have access to, the Greek is translated as follows:

The the 1897 George Ricker Berry gloss on the TR is "abusers of themselves as women" and "abusers of themselves with men".

The interlinear literal translation of the Greek New Testament with the authorized version conveniently presented in the margins for ready reference : Berry, George Ricker, 1865-1945 : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

archive.org

The 1958 English gloss, using The Greek, twenty-first edition of Eberhard Nestle's 'Novum Testament Graece', By Reverend Alfred Marshall. First published using the KJV, and then later in 1976 using the NIV in the margins - "voluptuous persons" and "sodomites".

The Tyndale Greek-English Interlinear NT using Nestle-Aland 27th Edition(1990) -
"effeminate" and "homosexuals".

The Tyndale Greek-English Interlinear NT using the Nestle-Aland Edition(2020) -
"male prostitutes" and "homosexuals".

If you use the 1828 Webster's to research the meaning of the English in the KJV, RV, ASV & YLT you'll find it agrees with the 1958 gloss by Reverend Alfred Marshall. It is interesting that the NRSVue footnote says the Greek words are of uncertain meaning. I find that the meanings were all the same until the 1946 RSV combined malakos and arsenokoites into the one word "homosexuals". That misleading translation was changed in the 1972 Rev RSV to "sexual perverts".

If you check the 1828 Webster's on the KJV word "effeminate", the definition includes "voluptuous", the very word used in the 1958 gloss by Reverend Alfred Marshall. I believe Marshall is the best wording.

 

[Hobie]

Hi, and thanks for the instructional reply and comments! Also, Wescott and Hort were part (I think established) of a cult called The Ghostly Guild, which was evil in all it's doings!
(Westcott and the Ghostlie Guild)

Hmm, looking that up..
"

• 
  As a Cambridge undergraduate Westcott organised a club which he named Hermes, a mythological guide of departed souls to Hades. This club met from 1845–48 and was evidently a precursor to the Ghost Club.
• Westcott and Hort were among the founders of the Ghost Club (or “Bogie Club” as scoffers called it) in 1850, with the purpose of investigating “ghosts and all supernatural appearances of effects, being disposed to believe such things really exist.” Such practices are condemned in the Scriptures in Deut 18:11.
• Both of them were friends of Charles Darwin, Sigmund Freud, and Carl Jung who were enemies of the cause of Christ."...https://www.febc.edu.sg/v15/article/def_the_inside_story_of_westcott_and_hort

 

[Behold]

We see here in 1 John 4:3 that the NIV takes out the whole point in the text, "NIV leaves out the fact that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh--yet another swipe at the divinity of Christ." https://mundall.com/erik/NIV-KJV.htm

Yes, Wescott and HORT Were into the "occult".


And, its a fact that many "new" bibles, alter, change, omit, .. verses.... is how they water down, or remove altogether, bible doctrine.


Let me show you what i mean.

Lets say that every person who is a member of this forum, is in a room with me and im preaching.
So, i can choose a verse, a NT verse, and say, "lets all read".
And everyone turns to the verse, and i start reading, and i look up, and many are not reading.
They are looking at me, and they are confused...
Why? Because their "bible" does not have the verse in it, that im reading.
ANd many other bibles, have a strangely worded verse, that practically makes no "english language" sense.

WHAT A Marketing LIE to present , just to make more $$$$$$$$$$$$$ MONEY by creating yet another "NEW Version".

And isn't it remarkable that all "new" bibles are created "they say", to be "clearer" and "more easily understandable"..

So, What is all that?
That is the DEVIL's WORK...
He caused this.., over many many years.
Reader, the DEVIL, is alive, also.
Really.
And He hates God, and he despises Jesus, and YOU, because you belong to them.. So, he has used all his power to ruin bibles, create cults, and on and on, as this harms the foundation regarding what HOLY Jesus started with His shed Blood and death.

See, .. Satan has 2 main ministries.,. .

1.) Keep people in unbelief so that they die and go to hell.

2.) Create confusion and strife within the body of Christ, continually.

Reader, New Testament Bible Doctrine is what Satan wants to destroy, as the "doctrine for the Church", is beyond important,... and when its altered, or omitted, then that "new bible" is no longer valid.
Many "christians' are the theological victim of a bad bible version.
The NIV is one of the worse versions ever created by a group of people who wanted to "dumb down" and "completely alter", bible doctrine, according to what THEY want you to believe.
And THEY are not the only who have done this...... EVIL deed.

And in these end times, when so much of Christianity has gotten away from the True Gospel...... its no wonder that this one Bible, is probably the most popular.

 

[Netchaplain]

Yes, Wescott and HORT Were into the "occult".

And, its a fact that many "new" bibles, alter, change, omit, .. verses.... is how they water down, or remove altogether, bible doctrine.

Good comments! It's all definitely Satan's continued attack from the time he said, "Yea, hath God said," wrestling His Word for doubt (Gen 3:1), which only delays Christian maturity but never affect salvation! These false translations are an addition to the ongoing immaturity of the Church, of which most will be at a low level upon Christ's final advent; but I believe He will immediately bring all the saved up to par at that time!

 

[Behold]

Good comments! It's all definitely Satan's continued attack from the time he said, "Yea, hath God said," wrestling His Word for doubt (Gen 3:1), which only delays Christian maturity but never affect salvation! These false translations are an addition to the ongoing immaturity of the Church, of which most will be at a low level upon Christ's final advent; but I believe He will immediately bring all the saved up to par at that time!

Spiritual Growth requires spiritual food, and spiritual training.

And So much of this, is given as revelation by God through His word.

Many Christians are "martha" Christians, vs "mary" Christians.
In other words, they are so busy doing nothing that matters as their discipleship...., vs, sitting at the feet of the Master, getting the revelation.

And that revelation...., is hindered, when the word of God is missing, or omitted, from the bible versions = millions of people are using.

The Bible is a Book of Word-Truth and Word-Light and Word-LIFE, and when some of it, or much of it, is not found in a "new bible" then that bible restricts the believers spiritual growth..
Blocks it.
So, if THAT bible produced their denomination, and produced their MINISTER..... then that is just the total worst case scenario, altho the Devil is mighty proud of his accomplishment.
No doubt.