Are we in a post moral relativist culture.

[stevesonthebay]

I say this because it seems that the counter culture has been around for some time now. It began with the 60's revolutions as a reaction against the church and establishment.

It moved into academia with Post Modernist Critical theories. It then finally infiltrated mainstream culture and norms.

But I think enough time has gone by that we can now look back and see how this ideology has been lived out in reality.

And its not a pretty picture.

Its almost like what the moral revolution was rejecting in the traditional beliefs is now being seen in a new light of a failed ideology and in failing has only strengthened the truth that was being rejected.

Except now as we see the lies and evil that comes from the relativists worldview. Or rather its inevitable consequences. The relativists knows it. Or has little moral basis and almost has to admit that this actually promotes evil. But so what they say. Its a right.

The moral relativists experiment has been allowed to flourish and its now found wanting. But rather than acknowledge there is moral truths and a truth giver. It seems the relativist is doubling down. Taking a side.

Because this is fundementally about who is god of this world. The Self or God. Has it now come to the point where each side has declared their positions and its game on ?

Its now a case of taking sides in a spiritual battle. Not one of social reform or human rights. But a spiritual battle for souls.

 

[TitusTwoWife]

Jesus came to bring division. It makes sense that things are becoming more polarized as time goes on.

I've seen articles about Gen Z turning to God in droves. I find that encouraging. Many are called. Few are chosen.

 

[stevesonthebay]

Yes I have heard that young people are turning to the churches and God. As though what they have seen in the chaos of rejecting God has caused them to see God as the answer.

I think as more people reject God and Christians are singled out and hated the more true Christians will rise up. As true Christians rise up they will shine Christ and cause others to be saved. While also causing haters to become more hateful towards God and Christians.

 

[TitusTwoWife]

Yes I have heard that young people are turning to the churches and God. As though what they have seen in the chaos of rejecting God has caused them to see God as the answer.

I think as more people reject God and Christians are singled out and hated the more true Christians will rise up. As true Christians rise up they will shine Christ and cause others to be saved. While also causing haters to become more hateful towards God and Christians.

I agree. Well said.

 

[PS95]

I say this because it seems that the counter culture has been around for some time now. It began with the 60's revolutions as a reaction against the church and establishment.

It moved into academia with Post Modernist Critical theories. It then finally infiltrated mainstream culture and norms.

But I think enough time has gone by that we can now look back and see how this ideology has been lived out in reality.

And its not a pretty picture.

Its almost like what the moral revolution was rejecting in the traditional beliefs is now being seen in a new light of a failed ideology and in failing has only strengthened the truth that was being rejected.

Except now as we see the lies and evil that comes from the relativists worldview. Or rather its inevitable consequences. The relativists knows it. Or has little moral basis and almost has to admit that this actually promotes evil. But so what they say. Its a right.

The moral relativists experiment has been allowed to flourish and its now found wanting. But rather than acknowledge there is moral truths and a truth giver. It seems the relativist is doubling down. Taking a side.

Because this is fundementally about who is god of this world. The Self or God. Has it now come to the point where each side has declared their positions and its game on ?

Its now a case of taking sides in a spiritual battle. Not one of social reform or human rights. But a spiritual battle for souls.

The 60's were such a pivotal time- lawlessness clothed to appear as love.
"Make love not war", Being chaste was now laughed at not honored.
Removing prayer from schools-
Women's rights turned women into career women seekers- which sent children either to death via abortion or a life raised by others in daycare centers.
"Sex, drugs and rock n roll"-
Hatred for your country- your parents are old fashioned-- and God who?

That all snuck it's way into the 70's with wife swapping and a ton of divorces- each decade we lose more and more- now we are actually at the place where condoning sin is seen as mandatory or you are intolerant. Legalizing abortion-
We went down further each decade since-
Our institutions have all been infiltrated with evil coming down from the top- from schools to colleges- to medicine- it's everywhere.
Methodist, Lutheran, etc - churches taken over by their own hierarchy to be now pride warriors calling it inclusive and loving.
The people in those churches fought, but had no choice but to leave and let them take over.
Grace was turned into licentiousness. Makes me wonder about having any hierarchy of man rather than autonomy.
WHAT a mess.
But there are some godly- true gospel teaching churches left- seek those out- no church is perfect.
Pride is a huge problem in people and also in the churches-
When a church claims to be the only true one- or has an answer for every little thing instead of saying- "not sure on some things esp eschatology" beware- any church not teaching about growing in the Lord and walking in the Spirit and obedience- not our flesh- run-

 

[Jericho]

Christianity is the true counter-culture, especially now.

 

[ShineTheLight]

Jesus came to bring division.

It starts with the family. This is spoke about in Luke, Matthew, and Micah.

 

[stevesonthebay]

The 60's were such a pivotal time- lawlessness clothed to appear as love.
"Make love not war", Being chaste was now laughed at not honored.
Removing prayer from schools-
Women's rights turned women into career women seekers- which sent children either to death via abortion or a life raised by others in daycare centers.
"Sex, drugs and rock n roll"-
Hatred for your country- your parents are old fashioned-- and God who?

That all snuck it's way into the 70's with wife swapping and a ton of divorces- each decade we lose more and more- now we are actually at the place where condoning sin is seen as mandatory or you are intolerant. Legalizing abortion-
We went down further each decade since-
Our institutions have all been infiltrated with evil coming down from the top- from schools to colleges- to medicine- it's everywhere.
Methodist, Lutheran, etc - churches taken over by their own hierarchy to be now pride warriors calling it inclusive and loving.
The people in those churches fought, but had no choice but to leave and let them take over.
Grace was turned into licentiousness. Makes me wonder about having any hierarchy of man rather than autonomy.
WHAT a mess.

I think the revolutions of the 60's and 70's were the expression of culture that had been brewing for some time. It was not just the liberation and freedom of secular ideas. But also a consequence of the church acting so badly that turned many off God.

But even this was the infiltration of the world coming into the church rather than anything wrong with God or the gospel. As time went one the world began to dominate and Englighenment led people toquestion everything and rationalise the truth away.

The idea that love itself was a force for good was a false twist of Gods love in Christ. Love is a powerful emotion for which people relate to as good. But like all meanings today it has been hijacked to represent something different and sinful. Like peace where the world has created a certain idea compared to Christ peace that surpasses all understanding.

The lines have been blurred and this was satans intent all along. Like in the garden when he rationalised that God did not really sayshould not eat the fruit of the tree of knowledge. That we could become like God by taking matters into our own hands.

But there are some godly- true gospel teaching churches left- seek those out- no church is perfect.
Pride is a huge problem in people and also in the churches-
When a church claims to be the only true one- or has an answer for every little thing instead of saying- "not sure on some things esp eschatology" beware- any church not teaching about growing in the Lord and walking in the Spirit and obedience- not our flesh- run-

Yes I think the sin of pride like other meanings has been turned on its head. Pride use to be a sin and now its a virtue.

There are good Christians and they are not making a noise or engaging in the culture war. They are quietly being good Samaritans and sacrificing themselves for others.

From what I understand there is some sort of revival happening with young people. They have seen the evil and chaos of past generations and are turning back to God. Seeing that Christ is the way, truth and life.

I think when the world rejects God and gets to a point where evil is presented as good and good as evil God will remind people of the truth. His spirit will come alive again so that people can know God and be saved.

 

[stevesonthebay]

If there are truths that Christ claims. That there is a truth to morality and reality then despite the development of rationalism and relative thinking sooner or later this will eat itself. Over time the relativist paradigm will not work anymore and be exposed.

But I think this cannot be exposed just by rationalism because basically it comes down to a worldview belief that there is not ultimate truth. It has to be lived out over time so that the relativist idea is shown to not work and is unreal.

This is more about an experiential aspect then a rational or scientific testing. You claim the truth many times and this gradually proves false it you live it out many times. Despite people claiming relativism they live like there is truth. Its a bot like free will. People claim there is none while living like there is. And in fact are not able to function coherently without free will.

I think after a few hundred years of enlightened and now relativist thought in a postmodernist world we are beginning to see the unreality of relativism.

A good example is how the ideologues claimed that multiculturalism was the new moral truth of a happy and equal utopia. Yet we are now seeing how multi beliefs and ideologies cannot co exist in any rational way. You can't limit someones belief and culture. It either has to be fully realised or not at all.

Now we see conflicts in world view beliefs and ideologies the same people who claimed that morality and belief was relative are forced to become dogmatic in defending one particular idea about morality and belief. While rejecting certain morals and beliefs.

As Christ said there is only one truth and that truth will set you free. This is more a comment on reality itself. No matter how you look at it there can only be one truth and reality.

 

[markalan]

Its now a case of taking sides in a spiritual battle. Not one of social reform or human rights. But a spiritual battle for souls.

I fully agree with your assessment that we are in a spiritual battle.

Rather than the revelation of Jesus Christ in Scripture being the rock the Church is built on, many churches now perceive "social justice" as the rock the Church should be built on.

The infiltration of "social justice" in churches, is magnified by its intrusion into schools and children's clubs. DEI means there are now few moral standards that are absolute and universal.

We have been warned: This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. (2 Timothy 3:1)

 

[Ziggy]

I think it's more sinister.
A lot of things changed when covid hit.
People were told to stay indoors. Kids couldn't go out and play. And then when they could go back to school they were isolated in these cubicles. Masked, some kids saw their parents lose their jobs because they wouldn't take the "vaccine" .
Grandparents couldn't be visited even if dying in the hospital. Or having to watch the family go through health issues because they claimed the hospitals were over run with covid patients.
That's the mental abuse. Sometimes families need time apart specially during stressful times. But no one could go anywhere, and some parents are more patient than others.
That's on top of the medications they been giving children in school to keep them calm or hype them up.
We really don't know to what extent all that was doing. Plus you had a whole new set of people teaching that probably didn't qualify for the job. 2 years is a long time for a child. Parents getting divorced because one chooses this and the other that.

Sometimes I watch live streams of the protests. Day time isn't so bad, but as it turns to night, it gets dangerous.
And some of these kids, I don't think they even know why their there. A friend is going somewhere I guess I'll go to, Hey this is exciting. And I can do anything and get away with it. rebellion, anarchy, depression, mental health issues from everything covid.
I remember for a long time you didn't see any children outside playing. And this was even before covid. Technology got a hold of them first.
Atari, PlayStation, Computers, laptops, cellphones, 24/7 internet access to hang out with your friends online.
The social disconnect. There is almost 3 generations brought up with noise.
Everybody seeing a psychiatrist because they think something is wrong with them, when it's usually the psychiatrist prescribing drugs to keep them coming back. They make a lot of money, specially if they are government funded.
Children really have it bad today. 8 runaway children were just rescued by thugs that were trafficking them. Some Parents so messed up on drugs they don't even care where they are.
And then you have the Activists that are out there recruiting them to be good little protesters and gang members.

Some you can't reach. I go on the live chats and try to draw them away from that but, they are convinced they are doing whatever they are doing for a just cause, even if it isn't.

First you have to find their spirit and try to push some life into it. Its like they already been drained.
What they need is a quiet place, not isolated but not noise. It is hard to pray when there is so much noise in your head.
and the noise is what they know.

DEI is like a side effect of covid. No social skills, no proper education, conflict in the home , medications.
DEI Didn't Earn It.
Because some were just being led into industries with no training, you may have had college degrees but no skills.
Book knowledge doesn't hold a candle to street knowledge or hands on training. You have to get your hands dirty.

How to break that barrier with all those bricks in the wall.
Then you have thousands that are being healed. I watch rivers and beaches where people are lining up getting baptized and trying to start again.

I think there will be some that the Lord himself is going to have to touch them somehow.
Like the man that was bound and lived among the catacombs. And everyone was afraid of him.
But Jesus came and calmed him and clothed him and helped him break free from... the noise in his head.

From where I am and the only thing I can do is pray for them. Try to talk to them in chat, sometimes just listening and letting them get the noise out. And then when there is a place of quiet as them if they want to pray. If they just want someone to listen.

It is spiritual warfare, but sometimes it's not so much good vs evil, but rather empty vs full.
If that makes sense?
No hope, no faith, no reason, no purpose, just empty.
What is moral if you have no principles?
moral:
concerned with the principles of right and wrong behavior:

And principles need to be taught. But no one is teaching.
We really need to pray that the Lord will bring healing soon.

Just my thoughts
Hugs

 

[Wrangler]

The moral relativists experiment has been allowed to flourish and its now found wanting. But rather than acknowledge there is moral truths and a truth giver. It seems the relativist is doubling down. Taking a side.

Because this is fundementally about who is god of this world. The Self or God. Has it now come to the point where each side has declared their positions and its game on ?

Its now a case of taking sides in a spiritual battle. Not one of social reform or human rights. But a spiritual battle for souls.

Great post. As a student of history, one can observe social mores oscillate. During Roman times, they were lose. Victorian England, tight. '60's America, lose again. When I grew up in the '80's they were tightening again.

You are right in saying "this is fundamentally about who is god of this world. The Self or God." And I should add, Satan. And this battle has raged since the garden. I personally enjoy debating moral relativists as they quickly expose their mental gymnastics in denying their own ideas in practice.