Hi Bible Gazer.Bible_Gazer said:I think Stephen is alive now not dead, that would defeat the purpose of Christ coming to giveeternal life. This was the great change from to the old(OT) to the new(NT).Stephen got the heavenly body as Paul talks about in 2Cor.5:1-3.Jesus came to destroy death of the soul - that is for the believers.
I was curious to know how it defeats Christ's gift of eternal life for Steven to be in the grave now? Also, what do you think eternal life is? Is it only our spirits that recieve eternal life, what happens to our bodies? If our bodies and spirits receive eternal life at the same time, then how does any true believer experience sickness, and death? There are specific gifts for specific times. As Christians we get to experience the gift of physical intimacy only after we have married our spouse. Isn't it possible that the application of the gift of eternal life has a specific time? Right now you and I have the hope that we will receive the promised gift (Ephesians 1:14), but unless Christ returns during our lifetime, you and I will die, so we know that our physical bodies have not been granted the gift of eternal life yet.
Hi Angelina,Angelina said:Well said Bible_Gazer,
John 14:2
2 In My Father’s house are many dwelling places; if not, I would have told you. I am going away to prepare a place for you.
Then he said, “Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom. Jesus answered him, “Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise.” Luke 23:42
There are a multitude of believers already in heaven...and more to come.
Revelation 69 When He opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the testimony which they held. 10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, “How long, O Lord, holy and true, until You judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?” 11 Then a white robe was given to each of them; and it was said to them that they should rest a little while longer, until both the number of their fellow servants and their brethren, who would be killed as they were, was completed.
Note that these ones were slain for the word of God and the testimony they held, awaiting the number of their fellow servants and brethren to be killed as they were...had been completed. :huh:Revelation 79 After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, with palm branches in their hands, 10 and crying out with a loud voice, saying, “Salvation belongs to our God who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb!
13 Then one of the elders answered, saying to me, “Who are these arrayed in white robes, and where did they come from?”
14 And I said to him, “Sir, you know.”
So he said to me, “These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. 15 Therefore they are before the throne of God, and serve Him day and night in His temple. And He who sits on the throne will dwell among them.
These ones come out of the great tribulation.
Just a few comment about the first two texts you quoted as proof that people are in heaven right now.
Jesus said that there are many dwellings in His Father's house, but He did not say that there were people dwelling in them. Actually Jesus is refering to a future dwelling in this passage.
You also mention Jesus' promise to the man on the cross. If Jesus intended for that man to go directly to a heavenly realm immediately after he closed his eyes in death, to be with Jesus, wouldn't Jesus have lied to Him? Jesus did not go to heaven until nearly 50 days later? The same day of His resurrection He tells Mary not to cling to Him because He had not ascended (John 20:17). Which Jesus was the theif with in Heaven?