At what age are we to condemn people of other religions to hell?

[Ronald Nolette]

How do you interpret the "death" part of "second death?"

The same way Scripture does- physically and spiritually separated from God.

There are numerous verses that say that living man is dead! Death does not always mean the end of physcial existence. When one dies physically, they do not go into nothingness but their souls live on. Either in torments or in heaven.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

An example; A&E thought and felt separated from God, they feared and hid. God on the other hand was proactive, he knew what the score was yet he went looking for them and provided them better clothes and promises....God was not separated from them.

Another example; Jesus, who lives in light and love and joy and the adoration of billions of heavenly beings divested himself of all this glory and condescended to have his backside wiped as a helpless infant; to be badgered all his life as to who his Father was; to be maligned and hated, abandoned and murdered because he showed humanity his Father in a way none of the Prophets did. He identified with flesh and blood .....and the kicker is, that for eternity....that needs to be put in our pipe and smoked so to speak. That puts 'sacrifice' in a whole different light. You can be assured he was not separated from us but that we separated him......yes, we are separated from God, not God from us.

Matthew 7:23

King James Version

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23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

God is separated from these people! Unbelievers never have a relationship with god- HIs wrath abides on them. JOhn 3:36.

 

[BarneyFife]

The same way Scripture does- physically and spiritually separated from God.

There are numerous verses that say that living man is dead! Death does not always mean the end of physcial existence. When one dies physically, they do not go into nothingness but their souls live on. Either in torments or in heaven.

Gen 3:4 KJV And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:

 

[BarneyFife]

Matthew 7:23​

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King James Version​

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23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

God is separated from these people! Unbelievers never have a relationship with god- HIs wrath abides on them. JOhn 3:36.

Psa 139:1-16 KJV 1 To the chief Musician, A Psalm of David. O LORD, thou hast searched me, and known me. 2 Thou knowest my downsitting and mine uprising, thou understandest my thought afar off. 3 Thou compassest my path and my lying down, and art acquainted with all my ways. 4 For there is not a word in my tongue, but, lo, O LORD, thou knowest it altogether. 5 Thou hast beset me behind and before, and laid thine hand upon me. 6 Such knowledge is too wonderful for me; it is high, I cannot attain unto it. 7 Whither shall I go from thy spirit? or whither shall I flee from thy presence? 8 If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there. 9 If I take the wings of the morning, and dwell in the uttermost parts of the sea; 10 Even there shall thy hand lead me, and thy right hand shall hold me. 11 If I say, Surely the darkness shall cover me; even the night shall be light about me. 12 Yea, the darkness hideth not from thee; but the night shineth as the day: the darkness and the light are both alike to thee. 13 For thou hast possessed my reins: thou hast covered me in my mother's womb. 14 I will praise thee; for I am fearfully and wonderfully made: marvellous are thy works; and that my soul knoweth right well. 15 My substance was not hid from thee, when I was made in secret, and curiously wrought in the lowest parts of the earth. 16 Thine eyes did see my substance, yet being unperfect; and in thy book all my members were written, which in continuance were fashioned, when as yet there was none of them.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Gen 3:4 KJV And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:

But they did and the Serpent lied. they did not die physically, but spiritually. Paul confirms that truth of all humanity in ephesians 2. we are all born spiritually dead.

But God said this: the day you eat of it, in dying you will die.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Psa 139:1-16 KJV 1 To the chief Musician, A Psalm of David. O LORD, thou hast searched me, and known me. 2 Thou knowest my downsitting and mine uprising, thou understandest my thought afar off. 3 Thou compassest my path and my lying down, and art acquainted with all my ways. 4 For there is not a word in my tongue, but, lo, O LORD, thou knowest it altogether. 5 Thou hast beset me behind and before, and laid thine hand upon me. 6 Such knowledge is too wonderful for me; it is high, I cannot attain unto it. 7 Whither shall I go from thy spirit? or whither shall I flee from thy presence? 8 If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there. 9 If I take the wings of the morning, and dwell in the uttermost parts of the sea; 10 Even there shall thy hand lead me, and thy right hand shall hold me. 11 If I say, Surely the darkness shall cover me; even the night shall be light about me. 12 Yea, the darkness hideth not from thee; but the night shineth as the day: the darkness and the light are both alike to thee. 13 For thou hast possessed my reins: thou hast covered me in my mother's womb. 14 I will praise thee; for I am fearfully and wonderfully made: marvellous are thy works; and that my soul knoweth right well. 15 My substance was not hid from thee, when I was made in secret, and curiously wrought in the lowest parts of the earth. 16 Thine eyes did see my substance, yet being unperfect; and in thy book all my members were written, which in continuance were fashioned, when as yet there was none of them.

And David was a child of god. we are talking about the unsaved. god has never had a relationship with unbelievers.

 

[BarneyFife]

But they did and the Serpent lied. they did not die physically, but spiritually. Paul confirms that truth of all humanity in ephesians 2. we are all born spiritually dead.

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I personally don't subscribe to Greek, dualist interpretations of the nature of man. But I bear no ill will toward those who do.
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But God said this: the day you eat of it, in dying you will die.

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I am familiar with this theory (it's actually held by some within my own communion of faith) but I'm afraid I don't hold to interpretations that require an extraordinary understanding of the original texts. It seems to me to be inconsistent with the idea that the Bible was written with the common man in mind.

Again, I have nothing against those who find it reasonable, but I try to make it a habit never to apply aberrant meanings to passages of Scripture I don't fully understand. I'm content to rely on other passages to support my overall understanding of topics.
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And David was a child of god. we are talking about the unsaved. god has never had a relationship with unbelievers.

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It seems implausible to me to take unqualified statements like this as authoritative. The last sentence, especially, is little more than a sweeping generalization that is just illogical, at best. What constitutes a relationship? God is involved in the affairs of all men. He even has a relationship with the devil, albeit a very bad one. As a Calvinist, you might reasonably be expected to know better.
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[Ronald Nolette]

I personally don't subscribe to Greek, dualist interpretations of the nature of man. But I bear no ill will toward those who do.

Well it is not Greek but Scripture.

I am familiar with this theory (it's actually held by some within my own communion of faith) but I'm afraid I don't hold to interpretations that require an extraordinary understanding of the original texts. It seems to me to be inconsistent with the idea that the Bible was written with the common man in mind.

Again, I have nothing against those who find it reasonable, but I try to make it a habit never to apply aberrant meanings to passages of Scripture I don't fully understand. I'm content to rely on other passages to support my overall understanding of topics.

That is sad then! for the only inspired versions of Scripture are those extant autographs in the original languages. Everything else is a translation and is weakened because they use just a word or two when in the original languages to translate to English properly could require nearly a whole sentence. We say with words what the Hebrew and Greek say with construct. To ignore a study of the languages is to weaken ones faith IMNSHO.

Again, I have nothing against those who find it reasonable, but I try to make it a habit never to apply aberrant meanings to passages of Scripture I don't fully understand. I'm content to rely on other passages to support my overall understanding of topics.

Nor do I subscribe to aberrant meanings. That is why I look to the languages to see what the original means.

It seems implausible to me to take unqualified statements like this as authoritative. The last sentence, especially, is little more than a sweeping generalization that is just illogical, at best. What constitutes a relationship? God is involved in the affairs of all men. He even has a relationship with the devil, albeit a very bad one. As a Calvinist, you might reasonably be expected to know better.

It may seem illogical to you but it is very biblical.

Matt. 7:
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.


See what Jesus says? He said I NEVER knew you- He never had a relationship with the lost. He may know of them but He doe3sn't know them.

 

[Behold]

Gen 3:4 KJV And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:

That was the Devil twisting the word of God also by denying it.

That's how he preaches.

He twists and denies the word of God.

Here is how that sounds on a fourm..

"Every one is saved, you dont have to believe"

"you can lose your eternal life (salvation)..."

"God only chooses some for Hell, the rest he predestined for heaven"

"Water baptism is how you are saved"

"not all your sins are paid for by Christ on the Cross"

"Hell is not eternal, and its also not a place of torture"


See all those? and thats just a few of the Devil's lies, being preached, taught.
All those deny NT truth and change it.

That's how the devil preaches the bible on a Forum, and in a Pulpit, and on TV.

 

[Behold]

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Could there be a reason that God has willed that there are no original transcripts remaining today?
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God understands "end times".
So, He knows that the end time are the last 500 yrs.. before the Millennium starts.
He Knew this before He made the world.

So, God's Foreknowledge KNEW that ENGLISH......ENGLISH...........would be the universal language currency, during the end times.
Thats a fact, as its the ONE Language that is Universal., in these end times.

Hello? Anybody there? Anybody paying attention????

= So, God created ENGLISH VERSIONS, for the END TIMES, as "koine greek" is not really around much this last 1000 yrs.

But ENGLISH is everywhere you go in this world.

God is so smart.
He is always thinking ahead.....

 

[Lambano]

約 翰 福 音 3:16​

Chinese Union Version (Traditional)​

​16 「 神 愛 世 人 ， 甚 至 將 他 的 獨 生 子 賜 給 他 們 ， 叫 一 切 信 他 的 ， 不 至 滅 亡 ， 反 得 永 生 。

 

[BarneyFife]

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約 翰 福 音 3:16​

​

Chinese Union Version (Traditional)​

16 「 神 愛 世 人 ， 甚 至 將 他 的 獨 生 子 賜 給 他 們 ， 叫 一 切 信 他 的 ， 不 至 滅 亡 ， 反 得 永 生 。

I love this. English is the 1st language of only 1/5 of the world's population. Go to the head of the class!

 

[BarneyFife]

Cantonese, Hindi, and Spanish alone vastly outnumber us. We're so arrogant.

 

[Michiah-Imla]

Cantonese, Hindi, and Spanish alone vastly outnumber us. We're so arrogant.

English has become the leading language of international discourse and the lingua franca in many regions and professional contexts such as science, navigation, and law.

It is the most widely learned second language and is either the official language or one of the official languages in 59 sovereign states. There are more people who have learned English as a second language than there are native speakers.

 

[BarneyFife]

English has become the leading language of international discourse and the lingua franca in many regions and professional contexts such as science, navigation, and law.

It is the most widely learned second language and is either the official language or one of the official languages in 59 sovereign states. There are more people who have learned English as a second language than there are native speakers.

No doubt, and I'm not unaware of the advantage that English-speakers have in influencing the world. It's just too bad that our language proliferation isn't commensurate with our level of godliness.

 

[BarneyFife]

There are more people who have learned English as a second language than there are native speakers.

I don't think I read this part correctly the first time. Aside from being nearly impossible to verify (the 1st language speaker numbers would be hard enough), what could possibly be the standard for gaging this kind of thing?

There are all manner of degrees in fluency. It seems like it would take a level of investigation that no organization would be prepared to fund. Census-taking in many countries is either wildly corrupt or woefully inadequate/inaccurate.

I'm not reversing my being in agreement with you, in general, but come on...

Not that it matters too much - lol.

 

[Michiah-Imla]

@BarneyFife

I quoted that from a Google search.