Back again.

[Hepzibah]

Hello again to anyone who remembers me from back in 2012. Hi @Episkopos I don't remember how we lost touch but good to see you here!

Hope there are still preachers of holiness around. This month, on the 23rd I will have been a believer for 50 years. The first 17 or so of which I was carnal, I mean, walking in the flesh and not knowing how to walk in the Spirit also holding to Calvinism, till I came across Oswald Chambers and began to discover Higher Life teaching.

I went on to read holiness preachers from the Holiness Movement and then on to reading Wesleyan theology. In the meantime I was blessed with the second blessing. It has been a roller coaster, but eventually I came to discover the early church fathers where I gained a much better understanding of entire sanctification or theosis as it was known to them.

I read a lot of church history especially concerning where Augustine moved away from the teachings of the early church and was instrumental of bringing in much error to the west. One of the things the early church writings helped me with was why I kept on losing the blessing and then it was clear why. I am in the Light now being only restored a couple of weeks ago and believe that the Lord has brought me back here so looking forward to discussions. Thank you.

 

[Behold]

God is good all the time.

 

[Episkopos]

Hello again to anyone who remembers me from back in 2012. Hi @Episkopos I don't remember how we lost touch but good to see you here!

Hope there are still preachers of holiness around. This month, on the 23rd I will have been a believer for 50 years. The first 17 or so of which I was carnal, I mean, walking in the flesh and not knowing how to walk in the Spirit also holding to Calvinism, till I came across Oswald Chambers and began to discover Higher Life teaching.

I went on to read holiness preachers from the Holiness Movement and then on to reading Wesleyan theology. In the meantime I was blessed with the second blessing. It has been a roller coaster, but eventually I came to discover the early church fathers where I gained a much better understanding of entire sanctification or theosis as it was known to them.

I read a lot of church history especially concerning where Augustine moved away from the teachings of the early church and was instrumental of bringing in much error to the west. One of the things the early church writings helped me with was why I kept on losing the blessing and then it was clear why. I am in the Light now being only restored a couple of weeks ago and believe that the Lord has brought me back here so looking forward to discussions. Thank you.

Hey Hep. Sure I remember you. Good to have you back sister! Hope to see you on the threads. And great to hear about you being in the Light. Not many here believe there is even such a thing as the higher walk.

 

[Hepzibah]

Hey Epi how are you brother?

 

[Hepzibah]

Not many here believe there is even such a thing as the higher walk.

Well I wouldn't put it like that anymore. I would say there is only one walk - a walk in the Light, the rest is darkness. In the Light, we see Christ and with Him there is no sin. We cannot have fellowship with Him if we are not in the Light though there are stages beforehand according to the early church and are: Purification, Illumination and Union.

The holiness teaching in the west mainly says two stages: justification and sanctification. I have changed my views on a number of things after studying what the early saints taught.

 

[Episkopos]

Not many here believe there is even such a thing as the higher walk.

Well I wouldn't put it like that anymore. I would say there is only one walk - a walk in the Light, the rest is darkness. In the Light, we see Christ and with Him there is no sin. We cannot have fellowship with Him if we are not in the Light though there are stages beforehand according to the early church and are: Purification, Illumination and Union.

The holiness teaching in the west mainly says two stages: justification and sanctification. I have changed my views on a number of things after studying what the early saints taught.

Justification is based on righteousness. Holiness based on sanctification. But the modern gospel pits one against the other and ends up having neither one.

 

[Episkopos]

Hey Epi how are you brother?

Doing well. thank you! I wrote a book (The Sum of All Possibilities in Christ) and am now doing some podcasts on a channel entitled "Spiritual Christianity". Finished a jazz album too!

 

[Hepzibah]

"Spiritual Christianity"

Links please!

 

[Episkopos]

Links please!

Here's a link to the latest one...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qDZud-3Kd_s

I also have some quick vids up on the forum.

 

[Hepzibah]

Very interesting John. I will think about it. Could not buy your book on kindle btw

 

[GRACE ambassador]

Hello again to anyone who remembers me from back in 2012. Hi

Precious friend, A Very Warm Welcome Back to the Board.

Please Be Very Richly Encouraged And Edified In The
Lord Jesus Christ And In His Word Of Truth, Rightly
Divided ( I and II ). PG rated "Approved" *

Grace, Peace, Mercy And Love

* PG = Perfect God / Parental Guidance

 

[Episkopos]

Very interesting John. I will think about it. Could not buy your book on kindle btw

II don't know why not.... Hmmm... Has Amazon given up on me?

 

[amigo de christo]

Now you asked the right question my friend . What is faith . And that you have seen many christains who claim to hve faith in JESUS
and yet .....................
Allow me some parting words .
There once was a man who lived in the hills . One day he woke up and went to turn on his shower
and NOt a drop of water came out .
He goes outside to water his animals , again not a drop of water comes out .
A traveling man comes along about noon . He knocks upon the door of the man .
The man opens his door and says how may i help you .
To which the stranger says Could you spare me a glass of water .
The man then says , OH my dear friend i would give you water only i have no water .
I turned on my shower and nothing and i went outside to water my animals and nothing .
TOwhich the stranger says , YOU have a serious plumbing problem .
The man says yes i do . Sir do you know of a plumber .
The stranger says alas i do . His name is Ricardo Fredrico Lopez . This man can fix any plumbing problem you have dear sir .
So the man thanks the stranger . HE goes back into his house and opens the phone book .
He finds Ricardo Fredrico Lopez , but before he dials he realizes what a minute . There is another Ricardo Fredrico lopez
in this phone book . Then he says another name , same name and another same name .
THEN the man asks himself the GOLDEN question . WHICH ONE IS THE RIGHT ONE i mean they all have the same name .
TIME FOR THE CHURCHES TO DO THE SAME THING .
CAUSE far too many been preaching THE NAME OF JESUS CHRIST , ONLY its another jesus they sure seem to be following
obeying and believing in .
THUS HOW WE GONNA KNOW WHICH ONE IS THE RIGHT JESUS CHRIST .
OPEN THE BIBLE AND GET BUSY LEARNING THAT ONE . cause if any cometh and preaches another JESUS
i got real bad news . IT AINT GONNA SAVE THEM . NAME ONLY . BIBLE TIME . Yes , BIBLE TIME .
LET us learn THAT DOCTRINE , that JESUS , the apostels doctrine . HURRY , cause times RUNNING OUT .

 

[Hepzibah]

II don't know why not.... Hmmm... Has Amazon given up on me?

They said it was unavailable. No worries I am listening to your podcasts

 

[BlessedPeace]

Welcome back.

 

[Hepzibah]

@amigo de christo

You bring up a very important question: wherein lies authority? Evangelicals say 'scripture' but it is impossible to read scripture without a lens unless one has 'graduated' in the school of discernment.

This graduation is spoken of a great deal in the early church, and it is known as theosis or union with Christ, and is the completion of the process from first coming to Christ. In the introduction to The Study of Holiness from the Early Church Fathers by J. B. Galloway(Wipf and Stock Publishers, 2014), we read: “If the teachings of the modern holiness movement are correct concerning the doctrine of holiness and the baptism with the Holy Ghost as an experience for the saints of God today, perfecting them in Christian love and freeing them form carnal sin, it seems that we should find some evidences of this faith and teachings in the period of the history of the Church where it was the closest to the days of Christ”

In the early church, no-one was allowed to be a bishop unless one had attained this level. Instead of seeing salvation as a legal issue, as todays church does, the church was considered to be a hospital for sick fallen souls who would eventually be healed in union with Christ.

A person in the Light, freed from demonic bondage, has access to the Truth in fullness. Well, their designated portion of it as we were not made to live the Christian life independent of each other. But we were made to be holy as He is holy and walk without sin. Only they can discern the deep spiritual truths of the scriptures which were written by men who also were in union with Christ. Neither theology school, or the papacy are the qualifications required, unless that pope was at this level, and I am not aware of any who were after the Great Schism of 1054.

thank you @BlessedPeace

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Justification is based on righteousness. Holiness based on sanctification. But the modern gospel pits one against the other and ends up having neither one.

Jutification is a legal term. Where one is declaired righteous.

No one is truly righteous if we look at gods standard.

Holiness means set apart or walking in an upright manner. We call it seeking after the things of the spirit or walking in the law of Love

 

[Eternally Grateful]

@amigo de christo

You bring up a very important question: wherein lies authority? Evangelicals say 'scripture' but it is impossible to read scripture without a lens unless one has 'graduated' in the school of discernment.

This graduation is spoken of a great deal in the early church, and it is known as theosis or union with Christ, and is the completion of the process from first coming to Christ. In the introduction to The Study of Holiness from the Early Church Fathers by J. B. Galloway(Wipf and Stock Publishers, 2014), we read: “If the teachings of the modern holiness movement are correct concerning the doctrine of holiness and the baptism with the Holy Ghost as an experience for the saints of God today, perfecting them in Christian love and freeing them form carnal sin, it seems that we should find some evidences of this faith and teachings in the period of the history of the Church where it was the closest to the days of Christ”

In the early church, no-one was allowed to be a bishop unless one had attained this level. Instead of seeing salvation as a legal issue, as todays church does, the church was considered to be a hospital for sick fallen souls who would eventually be healed in union with Christ.

A person in the Light, freed from demonic bondage, has access to the Truth in fullness. Well, their designated portion of it as we were not made to live the Christian life independent of each other. But we were made to be holy as He is holy and walk without sin. Only they can discern the deep spiritual truths of the scriptures which were written by men who also were in union with Christ. Neither theology school, or the papacy are the qualifications required, unless that pope was at this level, and I am not aware of any who were after the Great Schism of 1054.

thank you @BlessedPeace

The word says

2 Timothy 3:16
All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness

So when people say we can not understand the Bible. That to me immediately brings about a red flag. What are they trying to hide that they do not want you to study to shew yourself approved a workman who needs not be ashamed rightly deviding the word of truth?

The catabolic are big at this.. Cult leaders are also very big at this. They use this scare tactic to get people not to study.

 

[Hepzibah]

The word says

2 Timothy 3:16
All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness

So when people say we can not understand the Bible. That to me immediately brings about a red flag. What are they trying to hide that they do not want you to study to shew yourself approved a workman who needs not be ashamed rightly deviding the word of truth?

The catabolic are big at this.. Cult leaders are also very big at this. They use this scare tactic to get people not to study.

I did not mean it like that. All believers are given a measure of understanding but as there is much that is not simple to understand, and the deeper spiritual meaning, the purity of spiritual leaders is needed and note I said purity, or those with a single eye, not the double minded. These are those who are not led entirely by the Holy Spirit but also by their fleshy mind. They can settle disputes together. We are not meant to follow one mans understanding. .

Protestantism however, has a view for each person hence the many thousand of denominations

 

[amigo de christo]

Jutification is a legal term. Where one is declaired righteous.

No one is truly righteous if we look at gods standard.

Holiness means set apart or walking in an upright manner. We call it seeking after the things of the spirit or walking in the law of Love

Yeah how true this is . AND YET i have a question for us all , HOW ON EARTH is any of this attainable IF WE DONT BELIEVE IN JESUS CHRIST .
LONG ANSWER , IT AINT POSSIBLE
short answer , IT AINT
Any love or idea of love , any truth or idea of truth , that negates the fact ONE MUST BELIEVE IN JESUS
AINT LOVE and it aint TRUTH .
SO , i bring us back again to the original life saving and life CHANGING GOSPEL whereby we CAN LOVE

DRUM ROLL .............................YA GOTTA FIRST BELIEVE YE IN JESUS CHRIST . all else wont be saving squat