I sometimes get concerned over how influential the church is over its members. My boyfriend is with one such powerful church. Although it's nominally my church too, I wonder about the extent of the hold it can have over people.David is very immersed in his church's teachings for over a year, and the change in him has been huge, most of it for the better. It is nominally my church too, although I'm not as heavily into it as he is. Yet the church leaders are very exacting and demanding, frowning on insubordinate women, or men who don't wear ties or have long-ish hair! And there are other things. People have pointed out to me that the extent of the influence and accountability go, in their view, too far. To my mind, there has to be a point at which accoutability ends, and the individual is free to do as he/she wishes.I don't want to discourage David, as he's a very popular and useful member of the church but I want to have a life outside the church too. Does that make me a rebel? David is certainly one no longer, and he has a purpose and direction. Yet that shouldn't mean, should it, that he has to obey his leaders in everything?
Boyfriend's heavy church involvement
- Thread starter Jules C
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(Jules C;60319)
I sometimes get concerned over how influential the church is over its members. My boyfriend is with one such powerful church. Although it's nominally my church too, I wonder about the extent of the hold it can have over people.David is very immersed in his church's teachings for over a year, and the change in him has been huge, most of it for the better. It is nominally my church too, although I'm not as heavily into it as he is. Yet the church leaders are very exacting and demanding, frowning on insubordinate women, or men who don't wear ties or have long-ish hair! And there are other things. People have pointed out to me that the extent of the influence and accountability go, in their view, too far. To my mind, there has to be a point at which accoutability ends, and the individual is free to do as he/she wishes.I don't want to discourage David, as he's a very popular and useful member of the church but I want to have a life outside the church too. Does that make me a rebel? David is certainly one no longer, and he has a purpose and direction. Yet that shouldn't mean, should it, that he has to obey his leaders in everything?
My only authority is Lord Jesus Christ. I hate going to church. Not because I went there. It's because if they don't preach Christ and the REAL Truth, then it's not His Church. I'm not interested in doctrines of men. Only God's Words.Not saying your church is one of them. All I'm saying is, you should check on what the bible says before you listen to what the Pastor says etc... Don't wan't to be astrayed there.
I sometimes get concerned over how influential the church is over its members. My boyfriend is with one such powerful church. Although it's nominally my church too, I wonder about the extent of the hold it can have over people.David is very immersed in his church's teachings for over a year, and the change in him has been huge, most of it for the better. It is nominally my church too, although I'm not as heavily into it as he is. Yet the church leaders are very exacting and demanding, frowning on insubordinate women, or men who don't wear ties or have long-ish hair! And there are other things. People have pointed out to me that the extent of the influence and accountability go, in their view, too far. To my mind, there has to be a point at which accoutability ends, and the individual is free to do as he/she wishes.I don't want to discourage David, as he's a very popular and useful member of the church but I want to have a life outside the church too. Does that make me a rebel? David is certainly one no longer, and he has a purpose and direction. Yet that shouldn't mean, should it, that he has to obey his leaders in everything?
My only authority is Lord Jesus Christ. I hate going to church. Not because I went there. It's because if they don't preach Christ and the REAL Truth, then it's not His Church. I'm not interested in doctrines of men. Only God's Words.Not saying your church is one of them. All I'm saying is, you should check on what the bible says before you listen to what the Pastor says etc... Don't wan't to be astrayed there.
Well, my boyfriend has made some really big changes in his life recently, on the say so of his pastor. It is all getting a bit much!
Hey Jules: If your boyfriend is being emotional, chances are he'll soon burn out and become a little more down-to-earth. I'm not clear on what you mean by too much influence.The examples you give just sound like a church trying to live up to biblical standards. Is it really so bad that the church frowns on "insubordinate women, or men who don't wear ties or have long-ish hair"? I think you meant to say that you disagree with their idea of women's roles, because no church preaches insubordination. But, so what? Are you wanting to be a leader in that church but they don't want you to be? It doesn't sound like it. They're not making you wear a tie, are they? Maybe you're just letting yourself get very irritated over small things. Maybe the real problem is that he wants to spend too much time with the church. If it makes him feel valuable, you should be happy for him.Maybe you don't have friends there, but friends elsewhere and your involvement in the church keeps you away from them?You tell me, I don't know.
I am simply not as immersed in its teachings or authority as he is.He wants to obey in everything. Work, career, hobbies. And accountability is very important.
(Jules C;60328)
I am simply not as immersed in its teachings or authority as he is.He wants to obey in everything. Work, career, hobbies. And accountability is very important.
Ugh, feels like mind controlling. Anyways it's his decision, but I will say this. We are NOT accountable unto men, but God. This goes back to my first post... If a church does not preach Christ and His Truth, then it's not His Church...We ought to obey God rather than men. (Acts 5:29) However, Those who accepts Him are saved by grace. (John 3:16, Ephesians 2:8-9)II Timothy 2:15 - Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
I am simply not as immersed in its teachings or authority as he is.He wants to obey in everything. Work, career, hobbies. And accountability is very important.
Ugh, feels like mind controlling. Anyways it's his decision, but I will say this. We are NOT accountable unto men, but God. This goes back to my first post... If a church does not preach Christ and His Truth, then it's not His Church...We ought to obey God rather than men. (Acts 5:29) However, Those who accepts Him are saved by grace. (John 3:16, Ephesians 2:8-9)II Timothy 2:15 - Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
Yes. there are so many different opinions on this, though. David has become like a different person since he has been so heavily involved there. It's sort of "right wing". But I shouldn't say too much because it's my church too.
(Jules C;60334)
Yes. there are so many different opinions on this, though. David has become like a different person since he has been so heavily involved there. It's sort of "right wing". But I shouldn't say too much because it's my church too.
Well, don't be afraid to say everything. I've been to three churches and I can't go back to any of them, because they love not the Truth of Christ, they preached so many lies, one of them told me NOT to bring my bible. Two out of three didn't bring their bible. They preached traditions of men...well What did God words say about that? (Colossians 2:8, Mark 7:7-9)Sorry if I may rant a little. I can't help, but needed to say what needs to be told. Not everything in God's Words are meant to be taken 100% literal, because God Himself explains His own symbolic... Just wanted to make sure you know that part...As for the long hair, short hair thing, My first opinion would assume to be taken literally, but I'm not so sure anymore.
Yes. there are so many different opinions on this, though. David has become like a different person since he has been so heavily involved there. It's sort of "right wing". But I shouldn't say too much because it's my church too.
Well, don't be afraid to say everything. I've been to three churches and I can't go back to any of them, because they love not the Truth of Christ, they preached so many lies, one of them told me NOT to bring my bible. Two out of three didn't bring their bible. They preached traditions of men...well What did God words say about that? (Colossians 2:8, Mark 7:7-9)Sorry if I may rant a little. I can't help, but needed to say what needs to be told. Not everything in God's Words are meant to be taken 100% literal, because God Himself explains His own symbolic... Just wanted to make sure you know that part...As for the long hair, short hair thing, My first opinion would assume to be taken literally, but I'm not so sure anymore.
I don't want to discourage David, as he's a very popular and useful member of the church but I want to have a life outside the church too. Does that make me a rebel? David is certainly one no longer, and he has a purpose and direction. Yet that shouldn't mean, should it, that he has to obey his leaders in everything?
Matthew 16:18
And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
Both Peter and his Aramaic name, Cephas, mean rock. However, it is in the sense of a movable rock. The rock that our Lord was speaking about was him. Ultimately authority exists with Jesus the Christ. However, he's not always right on hand to give you a clear answer because most of what we ask is already there in his Word.If these folks have helped your boyfriend, that in itself is obviously a positive influence! There's nothing wrong with a good church! That being said at the outset, if this church is trying to get David to do something that he doesn't want, or make him feel one way or another, it's not necessarily a bad thing unless it's not taught in the Bible. For instance, God never rails against "long-ish" hair, despite the repeated attempt to make it sound this way.Encourage him in his faith, but remind him where the ultimate authority exists, and that he needs to be more concerned with submitting to that than to any man or institution of man.A man needs a good, faithful woman by his side. The Bible repeatedly speaks to that when she is versed in the Word. Help him out, remind him of the above, and remind him to go to the Word when something seems a bit much.
Matthew 16:18
And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
Both Peter and his Aramaic name, Cephas, mean rock. However, it is in the sense of a movable rock. The rock that our Lord was speaking about was him. Ultimately authority exists with Jesus the Christ. However, he's not always right on hand to give you a clear answer because most of what we ask is already there in his Word.If these folks have helped your boyfriend, that in itself is obviously a positive influence! There's nothing wrong with a good church! That being said at the outset, if this church is trying to get David to do something that he doesn't want, or make him feel one way or another, it's not necessarily a bad thing unless it's not taught in the Bible. For instance, God never rails against "long-ish" hair, despite the repeated attempt to make it sound this way.Encourage him in his faith, but remind him where the ultimate authority exists, and that he needs to be more concerned with submitting to that than to any man or institution of man.A man needs a good, faithful woman by his side. The Bible repeatedly speaks to that when she is versed in the Word. Help him out, remind him of the above, and remind him to go to the Word when something seems a bit much.
(Jules C;60346)
Great words, sir, thank you. It's just when manipluation comes in that I feel uncomfortable!
Yea, to take advantage of someone is not so great... In fact I will / would the same way.
Great words, sir, thank you. It's just when manipluation comes in that I feel uncomfortable!
Yea, to take advantage of someone is not so great... In fact I will / would the same way.
Things must always be done from the heart - not under coercion or manipulation, or peer pressure. There's no future in that.
(Swamp Fox;60341)
Matthew 16:18Both Peter and his Aramaic name, Cephas, mean rock. However, it is in the sense of a movable rock. The rock that our Lord was speaking about was him. Ultimately authority exists with Jesus the Christ. However, he's not always right on hand to give you a clear answer because most of what we ask is already there in his Word.If these folks have helped your boyfriend, that in itself is obviously a positive influence! There's nothing wrong with a good church! That being said at the outset, if this church is trying to get David to do something that he doesn't want, or make him feel one way or another, it's not necessarily a bad thing unless it's not taught in the Bible. For instance, God never rails against "long-ish" hair, despite the repeated attempt to make it sound this way.Encourage him in his faith, but remind him where the ultimate authority exists, and that he needs to be more concerned with submitting to that than to any man or institution of man.A man needs a good, faithful woman by his side. The Bible repeatedly speaks to that when she is versed in the Word. Help him out, remind him of the above, and remind him to go to the Word when something seems a bit much.
Great post Swamp Fox. I agree. If you are in a good Bible-believeing church, then that is a good thing. Especially if it is helping him to be a better Christian like you stated. As long as they are preaching God's Word, then it is good that they help to push him in the right direction. Everyone needs that positive influence from time to time, and according to what you stated, it is helping him to live a less rebelious life, and to be more submissive to Gods will and what the Bible says a Christian should do. I think that the main problem here is that he has made a dedication to Christ to live and walk closely with Him, whereas you seem to still be split between what you like to do out in the World, and what God requires as a christian. So, it is probably causing conflict between you to. God talks about this alot through the Bible.
Amos 3:3Can two walk together, except they be agreed?
So, my advice is this. Either start trying to live and walk closely to God like he is(which will prove to be a wonderful relationship between you two), or find someone who more closely resembles your area in life, and let him go and continue in the path that he is going in. The last thing you want to do is to hinder him from doing God's Will in his life.
Matthew 16:18Both Peter and his Aramaic name, Cephas, mean rock. However, it is in the sense of a movable rock. The rock that our Lord was speaking about was him. Ultimately authority exists with Jesus the Christ. However, he's not always right on hand to give you a clear answer because most of what we ask is already there in his Word.If these folks have helped your boyfriend, that in itself is obviously a positive influence! There's nothing wrong with a good church! That being said at the outset, if this church is trying to get David to do something that he doesn't want, or make him feel one way or another, it's not necessarily a bad thing unless it's not taught in the Bible. For instance, God never rails against "long-ish" hair, despite the repeated attempt to make it sound this way.Encourage him in his faith, but remind him where the ultimate authority exists, and that he needs to be more concerned with submitting to that than to any man or institution of man.A man needs a good, faithful woman by his side. The Bible repeatedly speaks to that when she is versed in the Word. Help him out, remind him of the above, and remind him to go to the Word when something seems a bit much.
Great post Swamp Fox. I agree. If you are in a good Bible-believeing church, then that is a good thing. Especially if it is helping him to be a better Christian like you stated. As long as they are preaching God's Word, then it is good that they help to push him in the right direction. Everyone needs that positive influence from time to time, and according to what you stated, it is helping him to live a less rebelious life, and to be more submissive to Gods will and what the Bible says a Christian should do. I think that the main problem here is that he has made a dedication to Christ to live and walk closely with Him, whereas you seem to still be split between what you like to do out in the World, and what God requires as a christian. So, it is probably causing conflict between you to. God talks about this alot through the Bible.
Amos 3:3Can two walk together, except they be agreed?
So, my advice is this. Either start trying to live and walk closely to God like he is(which will prove to be a wonderful relationship between you two), or find someone who more closely resembles your area in life, and let him go and continue in the path that he is going in. The last thing you want to do is to hinder him from doing God's Will in his life.
Ah, but is it always what God requires from a Christian, or what people think He requires of a Christian?
(Jules C;60472)
Ah, but is it always what God requires from a Christian, or what people think He requires of a Christian?
Well nothing you have said that they are requiring contradicts what God requires, so as it stands there is no reason to think that they are wrong for what they are teaching him. Now if you want to be more detailed and give us some verses as to what they are telling him to do is wrong then I will be open to disscussing that with you. However, you don't seem to be looking at what the Bible says about the situation, rather what sympathy you can get.The Bible is the final authority, so why don't you look and see if it agrees with, or contradicts what they are advising him to do.
Ah, but is it always what God requires from a Christian, or what people think He requires of a Christian?
Well nothing you have said that they are requiring contradicts what God requires, so as it stands there is no reason to think that they are wrong for what they are teaching him. Now if you want to be more detailed and give us some verses as to what they are telling him to do is wrong then I will be open to disscussing that with you. However, you don't seem to be looking at what the Bible says about the situation, rather what sympathy you can get.The Bible is the final authority, so why don't you look and see if it agrees with, or contradicts what they are advising him to do.
I use to be head over a youth drama team that traveled to other states, taught 5th-6th grade Sunday school, in the ladies group that interceded in prayer for the church and worked in the nursery once a month. All of my attention, extra time and energy were spent on the church, and none of it was focused on reaching out to the lost, on the one on one bases. It doesn’t matter what they teach, if you are not doing the works of Jesus then you’re wasting your time. You have to have balance in your life. There are other people that can step up and do some of those things. Surrounding yourself with nothing but other Christians is fine for a season, but, God will and always moves you on once you are built up. You can't stay in a fairytail world forever, you will have to step out sooner or later.
(Jules C;60319)
I sometimes get concerned over how influential the church is over its members. My boyfriend is with one such powerful church. Although it's nominally my church too, I wonder about the extent of the hold it can have over people.David is very immersed in his church's teachings for over a year, and the change in him has been huge, most of it for the better. It is nominally my church too, although I'm not as heavily into it as he is. Yet the church leaders are very exacting and demanding, frowning on insubordinate women, or men who don't wear ties or have long-ish hair! And there are other things. People have pointed out to me that the extent of the influence and accountability go, in their view, too far. To my mind, there has to be a point at which accoutability ends, and the individual is free to do as he/she wishes.I don't want to discourage David, as he's a very popular and useful member of the church but I want to have a life outside the church too. Does that make me a rebel? David is certainly one no longer, and he has a purpose and direction. Yet that shouldn't mean, should it, that he has to obey his leaders in everything?
Jules, it sounds to me like your boyfriend has gotten drawn into a very controlling church. I'm in my 3rd decade of being a pastor, and I've never told anybody how to dress, how to cut their hair (except my two sons), or tried to dictate anybody's daily schedule. That's what cult leaders do.You cannot make your boyfriend do this, but what you both need badly to do is study to see whether many of these things he's being told to do are even Biblical. If you find that what he's being taught is actually solid, Bible teaching, then it's you who needs to examine your heart and priorities. But if there's no clear Biblical teaching behind the demands of this church, its up to you if you're going to follow it.
I sometimes get concerned over how influential the church is over its members. My boyfriend is with one such powerful church. Although it's nominally my church too, I wonder about the extent of the hold it can have over people.David is very immersed in his church's teachings for over a year, and the change in him has been huge, most of it for the better. It is nominally my church too, although I'm not as heavily into it as he is. Yet the church leaders are very exacting and demanding, frowning on insubordinate women, or men who don't wear ties or have long-ish hair! And there are other things. People have pointed out to me that the extent of the influence and accountability go, in their view, too far. To my mind, there has to be a point at which accoutability ends, and the individual is free to do as he/she wishes.I don't want to discourage David, as he's a very popular and useful member of the church but I want to have a life outside the church too. Does that make me a rebel? David is certainly one no longer, and he has a purpose and direction. Yet that shouldn't mean, should it, that he has to obey his leaders in everything?
Jules, it sounds to me like your boyfriend has gotten drawn into a very controlling church. I'm in my 3rd decade of being a pastor, and I've never told anybody how to dress, how to cut their hair (except my two sons), or tried to dictate anybody's daily schedule. That's what cult leaders do.You cannot make your boyfriend do this, but what you both need badly to do is study to see whether many of these things he's being told to do are even Biblical. If you find that what he's being taught is actually solid, Bible teaching, then it's you who needs to examine your heart and priorities. But if there's no clear Biblical teaching behind the demands of this church, its up to you if you're going to follow it.
(ffbruce;62322)
I'm in my 3rd decade of being a pastor, and I've never told anybody how to dress, how to cut their hair (except my two sons), or tried to dictate anybody's daily schedule. That's what cult leaders do.
Why would you not recommend to someone else what you insist upon for your own family? Who in town hires people without some sort of dress code? So, what's wrong with a church having some sort of dress standards for people working for the church? You might have a point if the church were insisting on white suites and shaved heads. But, a kid being groomed to play a more important role in the church that is simply asked to get a regular haircut?It's usually the cults who toss dress standards. Have you seen photos of people serving Jim Jones or David Koresh? Traditionally, Christian churches have had dress standards. Casual dress for church is a modern innovation, along with mega-churches, homosexual marriage, and declining church attendance (in the last 20 years, the percentage of people who don't go to church has doubled).
I'm in my 3rd decade of being a pastor, and I've never told anybody how to dress, how to cut their hair (except my two sons), or tried to dictate anybody's daily schedule. That's what cult leaders do.
Why would you not recommend to someone else what you insist upon for your own family? Who in town hires people without some sort of dress code? So, what's wrong with a church having some sort of dress standards for people working for the church? You might have a point if the church were insisting on white suites and shaved heads. But, a kid being groomed to play a more important role in the church that is simply asked to get a regular haircut?It's usually the cults who toss dress standards. Have you seen photos of people serving Jim Jones or David Koresh? Traditionally, Christian churches have had dress standards. Casual dress for church is a modern innovation, along with mega-churches, homosexual marriage, and declining church attendance (in the last 20 years, the percentage of people who don't go to church has doubled).
(Follower;62336)
Why would you not recommend to someone else what you insist upon for your own family? Who in town hires people without some sort of dress code? So, what's wrong with a church having some sort of dress standards for people working for the church? You might have a point if the church were insisting on white suites and shaved heads. But, a kid being groomed to play a more important role in the church that is simply asked to get a regular haircut?It's usually the cults who toss dress standards. Have you seen photos of people serving Jim Jones or David Koresh? Traditionally, Christian churches have had dress standards. Casual dress for church is a modern innovation, along with mega-churches, homosexual marriage, and declining church attendance (in the last 20 years, the percentage of people who don't go to church has doubled).
Why are you coming unglued on me?Also, you're throwing all manner of unrelated things into the same mix. For instance, a certain style of hair-cut cannot be equated to homosexual marriage.And no, it's not "usually the cults who toss dress standards." The cults are actually far more apt to impose certain dress standards.In regards to haircuts, should I - as a pastor - forbid young men from having closely cropped/shaved hair, because it too closely resembles the look of Neo-Nazi Skinheads? Whose "haircut standards" are we trying to up hold here? (And by the way, though I didn't make it crystal clear, I did not INSIST on a certain haircut style for either of my sons.)The question that needs to be asked is this: Is her boyfriend's church leading people to a right walk with Jesus, or just making little clones of the pastor? The former is right, the latter is wrong.
Why would you not recommend to someone else what you insist upon for your own family? Who in town hires people without some sort of dress code? So, what's wrong with a church having some sort of dress standards for people working for the church? You might have a point if the church were insisting on white suites and shaved heads. But, a kid being groomed to play a more important role in the church that is simply asked to get a regular haircut?It's usually the cults who toss dress standards. Have you seen photos of people serving Jim Jones or David Koresh? Traditionally, Christian churches have had dress standards. Casual dress for church is a modern innovation, along with mega-churches, homosexual marriage, and declining church attendance (in the last 20 years, the percentage of people who don't go to church has doubled).
Why are you coming unglued on me?Also, you're throwing all manner of unrelated things into the same mix. For instance, a certain style of hair-cut cannot be equated to homosexual marriage.And no, it's not "usually the cults who toss dress standards." The cults are actually far more apt to impose certain dress standards.In regards to haircuts, should I - as a pastor - forbid young men from having closely cropped/shaved hair, because it too closely resembles the look of Neo-Nazi Skinheads? Whose "haircut standards" are we trying to up hold here? (And by the way, though I didn't make it crystal clear, I did not INSIST on a certain haircut style for either of my sons.)The question that needs to be asked is this: Is her boyfriend's church leading people to a right walk with Jesus, or just making little clones of the pastor? The former is right, the latter is wrong.
(ffbruce;62339)
Why are you coming unglued on me?Also, you're throwing all manner of unrelated things into the same mix. For instance, a certain style of hair-cut cannot be equated to homosexual marriage.
They're both products of the modern, more "tolerant" church that is in popular decline. You might not see a connection, but where there's correlation, there's something to investigate.
In regards to haircuts, should I - as a pastor - forbid young men from having closely cropped/shaved hair, because it too closely resembles the look of Neo-Nazi Skinheads? Whose "haircut standards" are we trying to up hold here? (And by the way, though I didn't make it crystal clear, I did not INSIST on a certain haircut style for either of my sons.)
Let's not quibble. The question still stands, why do you refuse to recommend for others what you think is good for your own family, your boys or yourself?I don't equate baldness with skinhead neonazis. That would require some offensive tattoos, grunginess, and such. Suppose a couple of nice kids who looked like skinhead neonazis started regularly attending your church and wanted to serve some function in the church, would you not say something about their appearance to them? Rather, let me ask this, just a simple yes or no, have you ever been in this situation and not said anything?The thing about teenagers, and I was not an exception, is that they're really ignorant. Some of them have lousy parents, which doesn't help. These kids might not know any better than some of the things they do. It's not that they've chosen these things, they just don't know better. Most of the time, our parents do a good job of guiding us, but not all the time. So, would't it be nice if more adults were willing to be more helpful to the children in their association?
The question that needs to be asked is this: Is her boyfriend's church leading people to a right walk with Jesus, or just making little clones of the pastor? The former is right, the latter is wrong.
This has nothing to do with what the pastor looks like.
Why are you coming unglued on me?Also, you're throwing all manner of unrelated things into the same mix. For instance, a certain style of hair-cut cannot be equated to homosexual marriage.
They're both products of the modern, more "tolerant" church that is in popular decline. You might not see a connection, but where there's correlation, there's something to investigate.
In regards to haircuts, should I - as a pastor - forbid young men from having closely cropped/shaved hair, because it too closely resembles the look of Neo-Nazi Skinheads? Whose "haircut standards" are we trying to up hold here? (And by the way, though I didn't make it crystal clear, I did not INSIST on a certain haircut style for either of my sons.)
Let's not quibble. The question still stands, why do you refuse to recommend for others what you think is good for your own family, your boys or yourself?I don't equate baldness with skinhead neonazis. That would require some offensive tattoos, grunginess, and such. Suppose a couple of nice kids who looked like skinhead neonazis started regularly attending your church and wanted to serve some function in the church, would you not say something about their appearance to them? Rather, let me ask this, just a simple yes or no, have you ever been in this situation and not said anything?The thing about teenagers, and I was not an exception, is that they're really ignorant. Some of them have lousy parents, which doesn't help. These kids might not know any better than some of the things they do. It's not that they've chosen these things, they just don't know better. Most of the time, our parents do a good job of guiding us, but not all the time. So, would't it be nice if more adults were willing to be more helpful to the children in their association?
The question that needs to be asked is this: Is her boyfriend's church leading people to a right walk with Jesus, or just making little clones of the pastor? The former is right, the latter is wrong.
This has nothing to do with what the pastor looks like.
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