Can you know for sure?

[Pearl]

well, but salvation from what?
assurance of what?

without getting into it, imo test what you are being told you have salvation from, and assurance of...and if they are singing When We All Get to Heaven well then there ya go eh

I believe that Salvation is from the consequences of Sin. And our Assurance is of that Salvation and a place in God's family forever. Starting when we are born again.

 

[ChristisGod]

but "eternal" does not mean Forever, and never has, as plainly outlined in Scripture, many places
wadr

So God is not Eternal ?

 

[farouk]

The First Epistle of John is highly assuring to the believer. It's short but very pithy and encouraging and searching.

 

[bbyrd009]

suppose you tell what eternal means?

well i have been for going on years now, ezra, but, from the Horse's mouth,
Matthew 25:46 Lexicon: "These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life."
Strong's Greek: 166. αἰώνιος (aiónios) -- agelong, eternal
Strong's Greek: 165. αἰών (aión) -- a space of time, an age

 

[bbyrd009]

So God is not Eternal ?

Yah is Immortal, right
from eternity to eternity
so also Eternal, yes; Yah will Be throughout your entire eternity, space of time, age
but you are asking a (trick) Q about Yah, when the Q is about "eternal," so ill say that "eternal" to us is likely not eternal to Yah? Yah's "age" becomes irrelevant imo, as He is also Immortal iow

 

[ChristisGod]

Yah is Immortal, right
from eternity to eternity
so also Eternal, yes; Yah will Be throughout your entire eternity, space of time, age
but you are asking a (trick) Q about Yah, when the Q is about "eternal," so ill say that "eternal" to us is likely not eternal to Yah? Yah's "age" becomes irrelevant imo, as He is also Immortal iow

You proved my point thanks.

 

[bbyrd009]

I believe that Salvation is from the consequences of Sin. And our Assurance is of that Salvation and a place in God's family forever. Starting when we are born again.

so whats wrong with that? You wont be judged for your beliefs anyway, at least near as i can tell, and if "forever" turns out to be untrue, your beliefs will not have hurt anyone, will they?

You are basically who i aspire to be Pearl, and wadr i wouldnt get too worried about what might happen tomorrow; tbh tho i have no idea myself, ok,
we do not yet know what we will become

So, if you and your sons will be here with me (Samuel--accepted--to King Saul--rejected), No one has ever gone up to heaven, There is only One Immortal, etc lead you to believe that you, your ego, your life/soul, will live forever, isnt that what the vast majority of Christians believe?

Esau was not condemned for eating Red Stew, so i have no opinion on the matter myself, and you can believe that "you" will live forever as long as you like i guess!

My guess is that the spirit goes back to Yah, Who gave it will pretty much moot any...disappointment? anyway, but after all, Samuel said Who is it that disturbs my rest? And i mean he didnt sound bitter or anything

 

[bbyrd009]

You proved my point thanks.

hey, the heavens are "eternal" too, but one day they will be "rolled up like a scroll" right
so im not sure what your point supposedly was, and wadr i doubt i proved it either

Yah is said to be "eternal" bc He is "eternal" according to our "spaces of time, ages," and shoe-horning a definition of "forever" into Eternal is done at your own risk, at least imo; forever as far as we are concerned, maybe

 

[ChristisGod]

hey, the heavens are "eternal" too, but one day they will be "rolled up like a scroll" right
so im not sure what your point supposedly was, and wadr i doubt i proved it either

Yah is said to be "eternal" bc He is "eternal" according to our "spaces of time, ages," and shoe-horning a definition of "forever" into Eternal is done at your own risk, at least imo; forever as far as we are concerned, maybe

is there an end to eternal life ?

 

[bbyrd009]

is there an end to eternal life ?

i think we establish our egos so early that we forget the process, basically, and then at some point we come to believe that our egos are who we are, our "self." And while i dont know for sure it strikes me as rather disingenuous for us to say that we have been buried with Him in death, and raised to Eternal Life in Him, all the while expecting the part that we have constructed, the ego, to survive?

So, to attempt a reply i would have to ask you a Q first, which i hate, but is there an end to us wanting the part that we supposedly buried at baptism to become immortal? Yes, i am aware of the "never die" passages, and fwiw i suggest that a preoccupation with this concept kind of indicates the state that one is likely in at that point? Fear, iow, basically?

which i dont mean "bad" ok, it is surely not a bad thing to wonder what might happen to self after literal death, and even to want to "go to" heaven imo, i mean i am hardly immune from these desires myself.

My current guess is that the spirit goes back to Yah right, so i would suggest detachment from the ego, and more identification with spirit, little s, which is imo poorly defined at best, the point being to maybe get more attuned to Spirit capital S. It wouldnt surprise me much if we are left the choice, to identify with our egos (and suffer), or our spirits, and mend. But while it is easy to recognize others spirits, in ourselves not so much imo, or maybe that is just a personal blind spot, dunno

so, imo the way you mean it, yes, there is an end, but the way it is meant to be understood, no, bc that one who "believes in" Him ("has faith" really, imo, but whatevs) will have more or less completely emptied himself, like the rich man could not do?

 

[marks]

Do you know for sure you are saved?

Is saved a thought?

It would do you all good to do a deep study on what Faith is.
What is it's source?
What does it do?
Do a comparison of Faith in the OT and in the NT.
What is the difference?
What did Christ say about Faith.
This will answer your questions.

Hi Grailhunter, I just saw this . . .

These are excellent questions!

For myself, the most immediate example of faith for me is Jesus and Peter on the waves. Peter obeys, knowing that if Jesus tells him even to walk on water, he can do it. And he does it! And when he looks at the waves, that is, when he starts to think that Jesus maybe can't cause Peter to walk on water, he begins to sink. God's power in us to effect the result of obedience following our choice to obey, I think is faith.

Much love!

 

[Grailhunter]

Hi Grailhunter, I just saw this . . .

These are excellent questions!

For myself, the most immediate example of faith for me is Jesus and Peter on the waves. Peter obeys, knowing that if Jesus tells him even to walk on water, he can do it. And he does it! And when he looks at the waves, that is, when he starts to think that Jesus maybe can't cause Peter to walk on water, he begins to sink. God's power in us to effect the result of obedience following our choice to obey, I think is faith.

Much love!

The theological study is pretty in depth and very thought provoking.
The conclusion can be so starting that it is hard to believe. So it is good for you to ask the questions and research it.
But I will give you some hints.
You are not going to find a scripture that says our salvation is due to God's faith in us.
Is faith a power?
Is the concept of faith in the OT the same as the NT?
Where does it originate?

 

[marks]

Do you know for sure you are saved?

Is saved a thought?

It would do you all good to do a deep study on what Faith is.
What is it's source?
What does it do?
Do a comparison of Faith in the OT and in the NT.
What is the difference?
What did Christ say about Faith.
This will answer your questions.

Can you know for certain that you are saved?

Much love!

 

[marks]

If God said we can have assurance, then why do some say we cannot? If we didn't have assurance of our salvation, we'd be in doubt all the time, no certainty. And, our minds, heart, and conscience's would be tormented continually.

So, can we or can we not rest in Him once and for all?? Have that "peace that surpasses all understanding"? Not being sure that He loves us and will never leave us or forsake us is not a peaceful existence. It's bad enough that we allow our own doubts to creep in, but satan is always whispering doubts in our ears as well.

jm2c

This is really just an extension of my "rejoicing always" thread, it's all founded upon our assurance in Christ.

Much love!

 

[Grailhunter]

Can you know for certain that you are saved?

Much love!

Serious question...
Seriously, is this a question that haunts you?

 

[marks]

Serious question...
Seriously, is this a question that haunts you?

No.

But a failure to understand the correct answer to this question is a problem for many believers, in my experience.

Much love!

 

[Grailhunter]

No.

But a failure to understand the correct answer to this question is a problem for many believers, in my experience.

Much love!

Kool