Differentiating between Heaven & the new Earth

[Patrick1966]

Is it important to distinguish between Heaven and the new Earth and, if so, why please? I believe it's important for our understanding because I understand them to be two different places and while everyone who ever existed will be in the new Earth, I believe it's POSSIBLE that not everyone will experience Heaven. Your thoughts?

 

[ScottA]

Is it important to distinguish between Heaven and the new Earth and, if so, why please? I believe it's important for our understanding because I understand them to be two different places and while everyone who ever existed will be in the new Earth, I believe it's POSSIBLE that not everyone will experience Heaven. Your thoughts?

Heaven is not so much a geographical location or place as we might consider the earth (new or old) to be, but is rather the presence of God.

As such, the "new" earth, unlike the old earth, is in the presence of God...wherein "all things are made new", including people. When we enter into His presence, whether in life (being born again of the spirit of God while remaining in the world) or in death (in leaving this world), we are are separated from our body of dust, which returns to the dust and is dissolved with the old earth elements, and are lifted up (metaphorically) in the spirit to forever be with the Lord.

 

[Aunty Jane]

Is it important to distinguish between Heaven and the new Earth and, if so, why please? I believe it's important for our understanding because I understand them to be two different places and while everyone who ever existed will be in the new Earth, I believe it's POSSIBLE that not everyone will experience Heaven. Your thoughts?

Yes, you are correct...there are two different destinations for two separate groups of Christians. Not all Christians are selected for rulership with Christ, but because it is God's choosing, we are happy for them to gain that privilege as they will be the best rulers our sad world has ever seen.
A "new heavens" (God's rulership) will reign over a "new earth" bringing back God's original purpose for us.

Jesus is the appointed King, and he will see to it that God's will is "done on earth as it is in heaven". That is the whole purpose of the Kingdom...to give us back the beautiful paradise home we lost. Independent human rulership has proven to be what God knew it would be....a complete disaster with bloodshed, pollution, immorality and hatred invading every corner of the world. As Jeremiah wrote at Jer 10:23.... "It does not belong to man...even to direct his step".....God created us to be guided and directed by him. That is what we will return to.

As Solomon said..."man dominates man to his injury".
Jesus came to "undo the works of the devil". (1 John 3:8) Soon now....

 

[ShineTheLight]

Is it important to distinguish between Heaven and the new Earth and, if so, why please? I believe it's important for our understanding because I understand them to be two different places and while everyone who ever existed will be in the new Earth, I believe it's POSSIBLE that not everyone will experience Heaven. Your thoughts?

There's a physical and spiritual realm. What we're beholding here in this world with our eyes is the physical world. The spiritual things are unseen. As you know, the flesh and the spirit war with each other.

Everyone who rejected God is going to be gone. Then there's people who did take communion with Christ, but don't make it; because something went wrong.

The earth, the other planets, and everything in the universe is going to be destroyed by an elemental fire. After everything with the events of the mark of the beast system and the Anti-Christ ruler is played out.

 

[Adam]

Is it important to distinguish between Heaven and the new Earth and, if so, why please? I believe it's important for our understanding because I understand them to be two different places and while everyone who ever existed will be in the new Earth, I believe it's POSSIBLE that not everyone will experience Heaven. Your thoughts?

My hypothesis is that there will always be a heaven and a physical world, and the physical will always be a reflection of the spiritual, and neither will any spirit remain formless forever, except the Father, but will return to the physical to experience it.

 

[Nancy]

So many Christians just assume it will be the third Heaven as the born again's final destination.
I cannot find any scripture saying we will be in Heaven with Father God, but Paradise IS used. I looked up the biblical meaning of the three different "paradise" meanings and they are pretty similar...a "garden" a "pleasure-ground" or "park" or a "king's garden".

All sounds like the original plan of God, like Aunty Jane said.

So, anybody else think this? Can anyone find the actual scripture saying we will be in the 3rd heaven for eternity?

 

[Patrick1966]

So many Christians just assume it will be the third Heaven as the born again's final destination.
I cannot find any scripture saying we will be in Heaven with Father God, but Paradise IS used. I looked up the biblical meaning of the three different "paradise" meanings and they are pretty similar...a "garden" a "pleasure-ground" or "park" or a "king's garden".

All sounds like the original plan of God, like Aunty Jane said.

So, anybody else think this? Can anyone find the actual scripture saying we will be in the 3rd heaven for eternity?

I guess my understanding and belief is that most people go to Heaven immediately upon dying and that they return with Jesus and are transformed into perfect, physical bodies. Thereafter they (we) rule with Christ on Earth until the second resurrection (the baddies) and the Great White Throne Judgment. At some point thereafter, after ALL people turn to Christ (1 Corinthians 15), we will ALL enter God's kingdom on a new Earth.

Therefore, I believe it's quite possible that some people, faithful or otherwise, will never see Heaven but will be in God's kingdom on the new Earth. For instance, a faithful follower of Christ still living when Christ returns will not, I presume, enter Heaven. I believe that Heaven is a great place but, ultimately, a temporary place for God's faithful to reside until they return to Earth with Jesus.

That's my guess, but I won't swear my soul on it.

 

[Nancy]

I guess my understanding and belief is that most people go to Heaven immediately upon dying and that they return with Jesus and are transformed into perfect, physical bodies. Thereafter they (we) rule with Christ on Earth until the second resurrection (the baddies) and the Great White Throne Judgment. At some point thereafter, after ALL people turn to Christ (1 Corinthians 15), we will ALL enter God's kingdom on a new Earth.

Therefore, I believe it's quite possible that some people, faithful or otherwise, will never see Heaven but will be in God's kingdom on the new Earth. For instance, a faithful follower of Christ still living when Christ returns will not, I presume, enter Heaven. I believe that Heaven is a great place but, ultimately, a temporary place for God's faithful to reside until they return to Earth with Jesus.

That's my guess, but I won't swear my soul on it.

I agree with everything you said! Except for the "ALL"... I would love to believe that but, there are too many scriptures that make me think otherwise.
We all believe what we see in the bible, yet so much of it can be taken wrong...I am not bashing you, ever, just not a Universalist.
Thank you for the reply, Patrick!

 

[Aunty Jane]

So many Christians just assume it will be the third Heaven as the born again's final destination.
I cannot find any scripture saying we will be in Heaven with Father God, but Paradise IS used. I looked up the biblical meaning of the three different "paradise" meanings and they are pretty similar...a "garden" a "pleasure-ground" or "park" or a "king's garden".

All sounds like the original plan of God, like Aunty Jane said.

So, anybody else think this? Can anyone find the actual scripture saying we will be in the 3rd heaven for eternity?

People often complicate a relatively simple scenario.....the paradise we lost was God’s first purpose...to have a perfect race of mortal humans to take care of all creation, unhindered by the things that spoil life in this world. Can God’s purpose ever fail? (Isa 55:11)

So why did God allow those things to spoil our enjoyment of life? Because someone originally abused his free will and tempted others to follow his example.....we have been in this disaster of our own making ever since, because God allowed it all to play out as he knew it would. He had to show us where it would take us.

God designed man to follow his guidance and direction, but the devil stepped out of his place and into a place occupied by God. God then stepped out and challenged this rebel to be a better ruler. We can all see where that has led us.

God will step back in when the time is right, and take us back to paradise, with all the lessons about the abuse of free will learned by those who understand why we are in this mess....and how Jesus Christ has bailed us out of it.

Revelation 21:2-4 tells us what the outcome will be.....
“I also saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God and prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. 3 With that I heard a loud voice from the throne say: “Look! The tent of God is with mankind, and he will reside with them, and they will be his people. And God himself will be with them. 4 And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The former things have passed away.”

The “former things” orchestrated by the devil, will be removed along with all those who supported his evil rulership. Christ and his bride will rule over us on earth and we, as “the meek shall inherit the earth”...which is where God put us in the first place.

Those fixated on going to heaven usually have no idea what they will do there, but the genuinely elected have no doubt. (Rev 20:6) Their role is to take us back to God by eliminating sin and all the tragedy it brings with it.

Have we learned the lessons yet?.....if not we will have no clue on judgment day as to why Jesus tells us that he “never knew” us. (Matt 7:21-23) There are only “sheep and goats” on earth when that judgment comes....all of us will be found in either one camp or the other.....there is no fence to sit on.

 

[thelord's_pearl]

I had the idea that what Heaven is right now is related to the height, the level, that it is right now very high "up", lol, and that feels so great and different but anyway, the bible says it will be changed to a New "Earth" and just being in the presence of God in love, joy and peace, wherever He is, is the most important and the best place to be.
there will also be those who will be great in the kingdom of Heaven though and those who will be least in the kingdom of Heaven so at least those who will be least in the kingdom of Heaven still made it to Heaven but I think the ones who are great in the kingdom of Heaven did much better and will enjoy more things. I wouldn't look down on the ones who will be least in the kingdom of heaven though because I know it's hard to be a worker. The anti-psychotic medication I'm still on and not getting off of until later from having extraordinary anxiety from worrying in the past has caused me to have a lack of motivation so that I'm just not so motivated to do things I used to be motivated and able to do but God might not judge me for that even though it has been a long time and I've been useless for a big part, not completely useless though, perhaps I've received God's judgment and I'm going through that phase and the timing hasn't passed yet but that God understands the reason why I'm useless for a big part anyway.

 

[Nancy]

People often complicate a relatively simple scenario.....the paradise we lost was God’s first purpose...to have a perfect race of mortal humans to take care of all creation, unhindered by the things that spoil life in this world. Can God’s purpose ever fail? (Isa 55:11)

So why did God allow those things to spoil our enjoyment of life? Because someone originally abused his free will and tempted others to follow his example.....we have been in this disaster of our own making ever since, because God allowed it all to play out as he knew it would. He had to show us where it would take us.

God designed man to follow his guidance and direction, but the devil stepped out of his place and into a place occupied by God. God then stepped out and challenged this rebel to be a better ruler. We can all see where that has led us.

God will step back in when the time is right, and take us back to paradise, with all the lessons about the abuse of free will learned by those who understand why we are in this mess....and how Jesus Christ has bailed us out of it.

Revelation 21:2-4 tells us what the outcome will be.....
“I also saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God and prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. 3 With that I heard a loud voice from the throne say: “Look! The tent of God is with mankind, and he will reside with them, and they will be his people. And God himself will be with them. 4 And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The former things have passed away.”

The “former things” orchestrated by the devil, will be removed along with all those who supported his evil rulership. Christ and his bride will rule over us on earth and we, as “the meek shall inherit the earth”...which is where God put us in the first place.

Those fixated on going to heaven usually have no idea what they will do there, but the genuinely elected have no doubt. (Rev 20:6) Their role is to take us back to God by eliminating sin and all the tragedy it brings with it.

Have we learned the lessons yet?.....if not we will have no clue on judgment day as to why Jesus tells us that he “never knew” us. (Matt 7:21-23) There are only “sheep and goats” on earth when that judgment comes....all of us will be found in either one camp or the other.....there is no fence to sit on.

Yes, it is quite simple and straightforward. Amen, His word never returns to Him void.
It's going to be fantastic!

 

[Nancy]

Hi Nancy..I found this scripture..I don’t understand it..posted it for your information.

2 Corinthians​

Pagination​

Pppppp1I* must boast; not that it is profitable, but I will go on to visions and revelations of the Lord.
2I know someone in Christ who, fourteen years ago (whether in the body or out of the body I do not know, God knows), was caught up to the third heaven.
3And I know that this person (whether in the body or out of the body I do not know, God knows)
4was caught up into Paradise and heard ineffable things, which no one may utter.a
5About this person* I will boast, but about myself I will not boast, except about my weaknesses.
6Although if I should wish to boast, I would not be foolish, for I would be telling the truth. But I refrain, so that no one may think more of me than what he sees in me or hears from me
7because of the abundance of the revelations. Therefore, that I might not become too elated,* a thorn in the flesh was given to me, an angel of Satan, to beat me, to keep me from being too elated.b
8Three times* I begged the Lord about this, that it might leave me,c
9* but he said to me, “My grace is sufficient for you, for power is made perfect in weakness.” I will rather boast most gladly of my weaknesses,* in order that the power of Christ may dwell with me.d
10Therefore, I am content with weaknesses, insults, hardships, persecutions, and constraints, for the sake of Christ;e for when I am weak, then I am st

Hello R,
This is about Paul's vision and his thorn in the side, which kept him humble about his stance and visions from God. Lot's of speculation over just what that thorn was, I believe it was physical, some believe spiritual...either way, it worked, lol.

Was there something specific you were looking for?

 

[Ritajanice]

Hello R,
This is about Paul's vision and his thorn in the side, which kept him humble about his stance and visions from God. Lot's of speculation over just what that thorn was, I believe it was physical, some believe spiritual...either way, it worked, lol.

Was there something specific you were looking for?

Nancy, I tried to delete my post....as it had nothing to do with what you were asking,LOL

That will teach me not to skim read,LOL

 

[Ritajanice]

Hello R,
This is about Paul's vision and his thorn in the side, which kept him humble about his stance and visions from God

Oh to be humble, Nancy..I pray the Lord to humble me more and more...

 

[Nancy]

Oh to be humble, Nancy..I pray the Lord to humble me more and more...

Same here my sister, same here. Kinda hard when "you're perfect in every way" LOL...j/k, of course...couldn't resist the old country song lyric