Divisions

  • Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.

    You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Marymog

Well-Known Member
Mar 7, 2017
11,420
1,681
113
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Actually, there is only ONE type of Christian and that is a person who has repented, been baptised (by immersion) and received the gift of the Holy Spirit.

If this has not happened to you then you are not a Christian regardless of what denomination or outfit you claim to be part of.
HI Marksman.

Can you show me a verse in Scripture that says we have to be immersed in water to have a proper/biblical baptism? I am not familiar with any verse.

Thank you.

Bible study Mary
 

Marymog

Well-Known Member
Mar 7, 2017
11,420
1,681
113
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
True Catholics say they are the only church.

Other saying there are Protestants and Catholics


I am of the group that says there are Protestants, Catholics and nondenominational.

I am nondenominational.

Strange thing is Catholics say they don't have divisions, just some difference in the rites the practice. Which is baloney. No one can say that Roman Catholicism and Orthodox have more differences than that.

In fact, the divisions in Catholicism go even deeper. And to say those differences do not meet the definition of denominations is not being honest.

View attachment 4840
I think I see what you are saying or trying to say but nondenominationalism is Protestantism. Historically the reason everyone teaches that is to maintain the continuity of Christian history and it is a common language.

Only the people who attend “nondenominational” meetings call themselves that because they think it makes them better than all the “other” Christians who go to a Church.

BTW....For doctrinal purposes there are no divisions in the CC. All the doctrines are different in the Protestant Churches and have continued to change for the last 500 years to the point of Gay marriage and Protestant Clergy members going to an abortion clinic to bless the clinic. At least the CC hasn’t changed for the last 2,000 years.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...ethesda/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.1b8e8802abbd
 

CoreIssue

Well-Known Member
Oct 15, 2018
10,032
2,023
113
USA
christiantalkzone.net
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
I think I see what you are saying or trying to say but nondenominationalism is Protestantism. Historically the reason everyone teaches that is to maintain the continuity of Christian history and it is a common language.

Only the people who attend “nondenominational” meetings call themselves that because they think it makes them better than all the “other” Christians who go to a Church.

BTW....For doctrinal purposes there are no divisions in the CC. All the doctrines are different in the Protestant Churches and have continued to change for the last 500 years to the point of Gay marriage and Protestant Clergy members going to an abortion clinic to bless the clinic. At least the CC hasn’t changed for the last 2,000 years.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...ethesda/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.1b8e8802abbd


Catholicism has changed a lot of doctrine.

Nondenominational is not Protestant or Catholic. We don't belong to any denomination.
 

tabletalk

Well-Known Member
Feb 6, 2017
847
384
63
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Actually, there is only ONE type of Christian and that is a person who has repented, been baptised (by immersion) and received the gift of the Holy Spirit.

If this has not happened to you then you are not a Christian regardless of what denomination or outfit you claim to be part of.

Was the thief on the cross a Christian?
 

marksman

My eldest granddaughter showing the result of her
Feb 27, 2008
5,578
2,446
113
82
Melbourne Australia
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
HI Marksman.

Can you show me a verse in Scripture that says we have to be immersed in water to have a proper/biblical baptism? I am not familiar with any verse.

Thank you.

Bible study Mary

The word baptised in the Greek means to be immersed.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jane_Doe22

Waiting on him

Well-Known Member
Dec 21, 2018
11,674
6,096
113
56
North America
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Of course there are.
However - we are talking about CHRISTIANS.

There are ONLY 3 types of Christians:
- Catholics
- Orthodox
- Protestants


ALL others are quasi-Christian sects - Mormons, Jehovah's Witnesses, Oneness Pentecostals, Unitarians, etc.

A Christian by definition is a Trinitarian.
I didn't make up that rule - CHRIST did (Matt. 28:19).
James 1:27 KJV
[27] Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.

Tecarta BibleThere’s a fourth he keeps himself unspotted
 

marksman

My eldest granddaughter showing the result of her
Feb 27, 2008
5,578
2,446
113
82
Melbourne Australia
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
While Full immersion Baptism was the preferred method of Baptism in the Early Church, Scripture is completely SILENT on this matter. There is not ONE verse that describes an actual Baptism. We learn about the details of Baptism from Apostolic Tradition.

My bible is not silent. The original Greek makes it clear that the word baptised means immersion.
 

Marymog

Well-Known Member
Mar 7, 2017
11,420
1,681
113
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Catholicism has changed a lot of doctrine.

Nondenominational is not Protestant or Catholic. We don't belong to any denomination.
Name doctrines that have been changed and provide your evidence.

definition of denomination: a recognized autonomous branch of the Christian Church

Are you admitting that the rest of Christianity does not recognize you and your ilk?

Mary
 

Marymog

Well-Known Member
Mar 7, 2017
11,420
1,681
113
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Well every time you see the word baptism in the Bible it means immersion. Now how tough was that?
Thanks for joining the convo. It must have been pretty tough because you didn't provide any evidence.....;)

You can't provide any evidence from Scripture
that people were immersed. I don't have any evidence from Scripture that says dipping, making clean with water or sprinkling is how we MUST baptize.

As you know (at least I believe you do) the translation of the word has more than one meaning therefor you can only ASSUME that when it was translated they meant "immersion". On the flip side it also allows us to assume that they didn't mean immersion so we are at a stalemate on that point.

What evidence do you have that anyone in the 1st Century were ONLY immersed or submerged when getting baptized?

Strong's Greek: 907. βαπτίζω (baptizó) -- to dip, sink

Bible Study Mary
 

Marymog

Well-Known Member
Mar 7, 2017
11,420
1,681
113
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
The word baptised in the Greek means to be immersed.
It has more than one meaning. You have chosen the ONE meaning that fits your theory: Strong's Greek: 907. βαπτίζω (baptizó) -- to dip, sink

You can't provide any evidence from Scripture that people were immersed ONLY. I don't have any evidence from Scripture that says dipping, making clean with water or sprinkling is how we MUST baptize.

As you know (at least I believe you do) the translation of the word has more than one meaning therefor you can only ASSUME that when it was translated they meant "immersion". On the flip side it also allows us to assume that they didn't mean immersion so we are at a stalemate on that point.

What evidence do you have that anyone in the 1st Century were ONLY immersed or submerged when getting baptized?


Maybe @Jane_Doe22 can help you out with this one

Bible Study Mary
 

Enoch111

Well-Known Member
May 27, 2018
17,688
15,996
113
Alberta
Faith
Christian
Country
Canada
Thanks for joining the convo. It must have been pretty tough because you didn't provide any evidence....
Why didn't you check out the meaning of baptism and find out for yourself that each time that word is used in the New Testament, it means immersion or submersion.

Strong's Concordance
baptizó: to dip, sink
Original Word: βαπτίζω

Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: baptizó
Phonetic Spelling: (bap-tid'-zo)
Definition: to dip, sink
Usage: lit: I dip, submerge, but specifically of ceremonial dipping; I baptize.

Do you now see why Catholic baptism is phony?
 

Jane_Doe22

Well-Known Member
Jul 29, 2018
5,247
3,444
113
116
Mid-west USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
It has more than one meaning. You have chosen the ONE meaning that fits your theory: Strong's Greek: 907. βαπτίζω (baptizó) -- to dip, sink

You can't provide any evidence from Scripture that people were immersed ONLY. I don't have any evidence from Scripture that says dipping, making clean with water or sprinkling is how we MUST baptize.

As you know (at least I believe you do) the translation of the word has more than one meaning therefor you can only ASSUME that when it was translated they meant "immersion". On the flip side it also allows us to assume that they didn't mean immersion so we are at a stalemate on that point.

What evidence do you have that anyone in the 1st Century were ONLY immersed or submerged when getting baptized?


Maybe @Jane_Doe22 can help you out with this one

Bible Study Mary
I'm interested in the Bible and respecting other people's beliefs.
I'm not interested in being proselytized at, which is Mary's only intent.
 

VictoryinJesus

Well-Known Member
Jan 26, 2017
9,669
7,923
113
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
It has more than one meaning. You have chosen the ONE meaning that fits your theory: Strong's Greek: 907. βαπτίζω (baptizó) -- to dip, sink

You can't provide any evidence from Scripture that people were immersed ONLY. I don't have any evidence from Scripture that says dipping, making clean with water or sprinkling is how we MUST baptize.

As you know (at least I believe you do) the translation of the word has more than one meaning therefor you can only ASSUME that when it was translated they meant "immersion". On the flip side it also allows us to assume that they didn't mean immersion so we are at a stalemate on that point.

What evidence do you have that anyone in the 1st Century were ONLY immersed or submerged when getting baptized?


Maybe @Jane_Doe22 can help you out with this one

Bible Study Mary

Just a few points in asking are we fully immersed into His death...or sprinkled. Does it matter? Acts 19:2-5
[2] He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost. [3] And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism. [4] Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus. [5] When they heard this , they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.

Unto what then were you baptized? And they said, Unto John’s baptism. —which is of men. The baptism from above is of God and is through the Son.(HIS death and resurrection.) They were baptized in the name of John’s baptism and had not received the Holy Spirit. THEN they were baptized in the name of the Lord and not in the name of John. “When they heard this , they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.” And received the Holy Spirit.

Matthew 3:11-12
[11] I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire: [12] Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the garner; but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.

“...He shall baptize you with the Holy Spirit, and with Fire.”

Romans 6:4
[4] Therefore we are buried(immersed fully) with him by baptism into death(water): that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life(Spirit-Fire).

Ephesians 4:4-6
[4] There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling; [5] One Lord, one faith, one baptism, [6] One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

One baptism: buried(immersed fully) ...with him into death(water): that like as Christ was raised up from the dead...even so we also should walk in newness of life(Spirit-Fire). One baptism in the Lord’s name (His death unto Life)and this one baptism into death and raised unto life, being in His name from One God and Father of all. Since this one baptism comes from God in the Lord’s name and is complete...debating ‘dip’ ‘sprinkle’ or ‘submerge’ is pointless.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: tabletalk

Marymog

Well-Known Member
Mar 7, 2017
11,420
1,681
113
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Why didn't you check out the meaning of baptism and find out for yourself that each time that word is used in the New Testament, it means immersion or submersion.

Strong's Concordance
baptizó: to dip, sink
Original Word: βαπτίζω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: baptizó
Phonetic Spelling: (bap-tid'-zo)
Definition: to dip, sink

Usage: lit: I dip, submerge, but specifically of ceremonial dipping; I baptize.

Do you now see why Catholic baptism is phony?
Hi Enoch,

Dip is not the same as submerging. One can "dip" something and NOT submerge it.

Here are other uses of the word of which you FAILED to quote: to wash, to make clean with water

Neither of those (wash, clean w/water) mean submerge.....soooo we are back to square one. Neither of us have evidence from scripture to support our belief!!

You dodged this question:
What evidence do you have that anyone in the 1st Century were ONLY immersed or submerged when getting baptized?

Patient Mary
 

Marymog

Well-Known Member
Mar 7, 2017
11,420
1,681
113
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
I'm interested in the Bible and respecting other people's beliefs.
I'm not interested in being proselytized at, which is Mary's only intent.
I am interested in the bible also. The bible doesn't say immersion or submerged is the ONLY form of baptism although for 2,000 years it is the PREFERRED method. It is sad you don't respect other peoples belief, especially when they back up their belief with Scripture.

It is God's intent to reveal the Truth. I am only a mere instrument of God.

BTW....you should be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you.

Mary
 

Marymog

Well-Known Member
Mar 7, 2017
11,420
1,681
113
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Just a few points in asking are we fully immersed into His death...or sprinkled. Does it matter? Acts 19:2-5
[2] He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost. [3] And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism. [4] Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus. [5] When they heard this , they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.

Unto what then were you baptized? And they said, Unto John’s baptism. —which is of men. The baptism from above is of God and is through the Son.(HIS death and resurrection.) They were baptized in the name of John’s baptism and had not received the Holy Spirit. THEN they were baptized in the name of the Lord and not in the name of John. “When they heard this , they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.” And received the Holy Spirit.

Matthew 3:11-12
[11] I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire: [12] Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the garner; but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.

“...He shall baptize you with the Holy Spirit, and with Fire.”

Romans 6:4
[4] Therefore we are buried(immersed fully) with him by baptism into death(water): that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life(Spirit-Fire).

Ephesians 4:4-6
[4] There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling; [5] One Lord, one faith, one baptism, [6] One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

One baptism: buried(immersed fully) ...with him into death(water): that like as Christ was raised up from the dead...even so we also should walk in newness of life(Spirit-Fire). One baptism in the Lord’s name (His death unto Life)and this one baptism into death and raised unto life, being in His name from One God and Father of all. Since this one baptism comes from God in the Lord’s name and is complete...debating ‘dip’ ‘sprinkle’ or ‘submerge’ is pointless.
hi VIJ,

Scripture doesn't make it clear if one has to be dipped, sprinkled or submerged to recieve a proper baptism HOWEVER submerged is the preferred method.

The practice of the 1st Century Christians who walked and talked with the Apostles make it clear what they believed/practiced:

How Should We View Baptism in the Didache? - Truediscipleship

Historical Mary
 

Jane_Doe22

Well-Known Member
Jul 29, 2018
5,247
3,444
113
116
Mid-west USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
I am interested in the bible also. The bible doesn't say immersion or submerged is the ONLY form of baptism although for 2,000 years it is the PREFERRED method. It is sad you don't respect other peoples belief, especially when they back up their belief with Scripture.

It is God's intent to reveal the Truth. I am only a mere instrument of God.

BTW....you should be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you.

Mary
Mary, you're not interested in answers, other people, or their views. You're only interested in proselytizing Catholicism.
 

VictoryinJesus

Well-Known Member
Jan 26, 2017
9,669
7,923
113
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
hi VIJ,

Scripture doesn't make it clear if one has to be dipped, sprinkled or submerged to recieve a proper baptism HOWEVER submerged is the preferred method.

The practice of the 1st Century Christians who walked and talked with the Apostles make it clear what they believed/practiced:

How Should We View Baptism in the Didache? - Truediscipleship

Historical Mary

But God did show us in that His death was not partial but fully. As His resurrection was also not partial, but fully complete. Same as our death in Him is not partial; neither is our resurrection unto Life in Him partial.

Luke 12:49-50
[49] I am come to send fire on the earth; and what will I, if it be already kindled? [50] But I have a baptism to be baptized with; and how am I straitened till it be accomplished!

The focus is not John’s baptism but the one baptism that is shown in His death and resurrection...completely and fully.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jane_Doe22