Eternal Life in Jesus the Christ

[Webers_Home]

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When did Jesus become born again?

The Lord was given a really big head start. He underwent his own birth from above
at the moment of his conception. (Mtt 1:18-20, Luke 1:30-35).

So Jesus exited his mother's womb with human life and eternal life both at the same time;
in other words: with human nature right alongside divine nature. Since God is the one
who manufactured human nature, then He was easily able to overpower it and prevent
it from causing Jesus to commit a sin-- which He did; and here's how:

†. John 3:34 . . God's Spirit is upon him without measure or limit

In other words: Jesus wasn't just filled with God's Spirit, he was maxed out with
God's Spirit-- all of God's Spirit: not just a percentage of God's Spirit.

†. Col 1:18-19 . . God in all His fullness was pleased to live in Christ

Not even the Devil himself would be able to commit a sin while maxed out with all
the fullness of God.

I've had atheists complain that Jesus had an unfair advantage over the rest of us;
but they usually calm down when I explain to them that Christ was destined to be
the lamb of God that takes away the sin of the world-- not just some of the world,
but the whole world from the creation of Adam to the final child born on earth. It
wouldn't have been prudent of God to leave it up to a man born with human nature
to make it to the cross on his own. Sooner or later, left to himself, Jesus would
have tripped up and committed a sin somewhere along the line and thus blown the
plan of salvation to smithereens. No, too much was riding on Jesus. No way could
he be left to himself on such an important mission. God micro-managed Christ
every step of the way from birth to death. He was truly a possessed man in every
sense of the word-- in a good way of course.

Buen Camino
/

 

[Ekul7291]

So when exactly did Jesus enter into the Kingdom of God? When he was born again?

 

[Stan]

They, who have been born of water and Spirit. Never ever tell another lie, or commit any sin ever again. This is the evidence and fruit of the gift of the Holy Ghost. That is Eternal Life in Jesus the Christ. This cannot be counterfeited by the devil or his children.

You are in error my friend, about sin and counterfeit lifestyle.

1 John 2:1 (NIV) and 2 Cor 11:12-15 (NIV)

 

[Webers_Home]

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So when exactly did Jesus enter into the Kingdom of God? When he was
born again?

I'm probably going to get hammered by the Trinitarians for saying this: but
my answer is yes; because although the Word of John 1:1 pre-existed as
God, the Word of John 1:1 did not pre-exist as the flesh of John 1:14. What
I'm saying is: the Bible's Jesus is an honest to gosh earth-born human being
who can trace his ancestry clear on back to Adam. So, since Jesus was
Adam's progeny, then John 3:3-8 applies to him just the same as everybody
else; especially since the grammar and syntax of the Lord's statements in
that passage permit no exceptions to the rule.

Buen Camino
/

 

[Stan]

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I'm probably going to get hammered by the Trinitarians for saying this: but
my answer is yes; because although the Word of John 1:1 pre-existed as
God, the Word of John 1:1 did not pre-exist as the flesh of John 1:14. What
I'm saying is: the Bible's Jesus is an honest to gosh earth-born human being
who can trace his ancestry clear on back to Adam. So, since Jesus was
Adam's progeny, then John 3:3-8 applies to him just the same as everybody
else; especially since the grammar and syntax of the Lord's statements in
that passage permit no exceptions to the rule.

Buen Camino
/

I suggest you read Colossians 2:9 (NIV)

 

[Webers_Home]

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I suggest you read Colossians 2:9 (NIV)

Thank you; but I don't see how Col 2:9 is any different than Col 1:19

Buen Camino
/

 

[Stan]

Thank you; but I don't see how Col 2:9 is any different than Col 1:19

I didn't say it wasn't. In case you missed it, I was responding to your post #44, dated 17 September 2012 - 09:27 PM.
Jesus was NOT a result of human coupling. It was a miraculous conception, instigated by the Holy Spirit. He is from the House of David on Mary's side, but He is not from the seed of David. He is from the seed of the Holy Spirit. Jesus existed with God as depicted in Gen 1. He also existed as flesh in Genesis 32:22-30, and Daniel 3:25. Being born and being, are two different things. Jesus existed with God before Gen 1:1, existed as God's physical representation throughout the OT, and became God incarnate as indicated in the Gospels. If you find Jesus "the same as everybody else", then you are not seeing the Jesus of the Bible, the Jesus that Paul preached, the Jesus that saved my soul.

 

[Webers_Home]

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Jesus was NOT a result of human coupling.

The Bible's Jesus is the result of numerous human couplings beginning with
his mother's parents and going all the way back to Adam and Eve.

He is not from the seed of David.

†. Rom 1:3 . . Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David

I'm going to stop right here and draw attention to an elephant in the middle
of the room that no doubt everybody would just as soon I ignore.

Eve wasn't created from dust as her husband was. She was made from
already-existing human tissue amputated from her husband's side. In other
words: Eve was just as much as Adam as he was. So then, even a virgin's
children are just as much Adam as he was because all women are Adam just
as Eve was Adam.

†. Gen 5:2 . . Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and
called their name Adam

He called "their" name Adam because they were both made of Adam. So then,
even though Mary didn't sleep with anybody to conceive Jesus, she still
produced a little baby Adam because she herself was Adam.

It just amazes me the number of people wearing the Christian label, and
passing themselves off as the Lord's followers, who are hell-bent to remove
him from the list of Adam's biological progeny when the Bible has gone to
such extreme lengths, with page after page of genealogies, to make sure
nobody gets Messiah's origin wrong; but they still do anyway. Astonishing!

BTW: you know where I got Col 1:19? From post #41; which apparently
you missed.

Buen Camino
/

 

[Stan]

The Bible's Jesus is the result of numerous human couplings beginning with
his mother's parents and going all the way back to Adam and Eve.

A. Luke 1:34
B. Matthew 1:20
I don't know what Bible you're reading, but the real Bible refutes that.

Rom 1:3 . . Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David

Romans 1:3 says; the gospel concerning his Son, who was descended from David according to the flesh.
Mary was of David's bloodline but Jesus was from the seed of the Holy Spirit.

I'm going to stop right here and draw attention to an elephant in the middle
of the room that no doubt everybody would just as soon I ignore.
Eve wasn't created from dust as her husband was. She was made from
already-existing human tissue amputated from her husband's side. In other
words: Eve was just as much as Adam as he was. So then, even a virgin's
children are just as much Adam as he was because all women are Adam just
as Eve was Adam.

Do you also believe that men have one less rib because of this? I also hate to burst your current bubble, but Eve was made from a rib. Now either way you slice it, this does not produce offspring. Something anyone should know with an elementary school education in biology. Seed is seed and lineage is tracked from the male. What is unique about Mary is that she was from David's lineage as described in Luke 3, and Joseph was from David's lineage as described on Matthew 1.

Gen 5:2 . . Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and
called their name Adam
He called "their" name Adam because they were both made of Adam. So then,
even though Mary didn't sleep with anybody to conceive Jesus, she still
produced a little baby Adam because she herself was Adam.

I guess if you stick with a 400+ year old Bible, you will develop 400+ year old doctrine.
Genesis 5:2 actually reads; He created them male and female and blessed them. And he named them “Mankind” when they were created.

It just amazes me the number of people wearing the Christian label, and
passing themselves off as the Lord's followers, who are hell-bent to remove
him from the list of Adam's biological progeny when the Bible has gone to
such extreme lengths, with page after page of genealogies, to make sure
nobody gets Messiah's origin wrong; but they still do anyway. Astonishing!

The ONLY one I see messing around with Christ's geneology is you. Making assumptions based on improperly interpreted scripture and then totally discounting that the Holy Spirit caused the conception in Mary is quite astonishing in my view. It could be considered downright heretical by some. Is it you do not believe that Jesus is GOD?

BTW: you know where I got Col 1:19? From post #41; which apparently
you missed.

Not sure what you're on about here, I said post 44 is what I responded to. You seem a little mized up.

 

[Webers_Home]

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Eve wasn't created from dust as her husband was. She was made from
already existing human tissue amputated from her husband's side. In other
words: Eve was just as much as Adam as he was. So then, even a virgin's
children are just as much Adam as he was because all women are Adam just
as Eve was Adam . . . So then, even though Mary didn't sleep with anybody to
conceive Jesus, she still produced a little baby Adam because she herself was
Adam.

That always gets the die-hard Trinitarians huffing and puffing, and turning
red in the face because while most of them readily mouth that they believe
the Bible's Jesus is fully God and fully Human; in reality they actually believe
he's fully God and somewhat less than Human. To them he looked like a
human, walked like a human, drank wine like a human, slept like a human,
got thirsty like a human, talked like a human, dined like a human, and died
like a human; but underneath it all; he was a bastard being from another
world and no more a real earthling than Jeff Bridges' character in the movie
Starman.

Jesus labeled himself the son of man on numerous occasions. That title was
neither new nor unique in his day. God addressed the prophet Ezekiel as
"son of man" on at least 93 occasions; and in every case, the Hebrew word
for "man" is 'adam (aw-dawm') which is the proper name of the human race
God created in the beginning (Gen 1:26-27, Gen 3:9, Gen 5:2). In point of
fact, Jesus was labeled son of 'adam even before he was born.

†. Dan 7:13-14 . . As my vision continued that night, I saw someone who
looked like a son of man coming with the clouds of heaven. He approached
the Ancient One and was escorted into His presence. He was given authority,
honor, and royal power over all the nations of the world, so that people of
every race and nation and language would obey him. His rule is eternal; it
will never end. His kingdom is the one that will never be destroyed.

What Daniel witnessed was Christ's promotion to the rank of God.

†. Php 2:9-11 . .Therefore God exalted him to the highest place and gave
him the name that is above every name, that at the name of Jesus every
knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and every
tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Sovereign, to the glory of God the
Father.

The name that's above every name is Yhvh; so that from now on Christ has
the right to use God's name as his own. David spoke of Christ with God's
own name many years prior to the coronation scene in depicted in Daniel.

†. Ps 45:6-7 . .Your throne, O God, is forever and ever; a scepter of
uprightness is the scepter of your kingdom. You have loved righteousness,
and hated wickedness; therefore God, your God, has anointed you with the
oil of joy above your fellows.

Christ's rank as God is the very reason why David respected his own progeny
superior to himself.

†. Ps 110:1 . .Yhvh said to my master: Sit at My right hand, till I make your
enemies your footstool.

Jesus once asked his opponents how it is that David could defer to one of his
own progeny. Well; normally David is the ranking king in his own dynasty;
and in point of fact ranking king regardless of the dynasty (Ps 89:20-27).
But he foresaw his progeny with the rank of God; and of course no king, not
even David, outranks that level of authority.

Buen Camino
/

 

[Stan]

You seem to be talking to yourself now WH.

 

[Love_4_Jesus]

They, who have been born of water and Spirit. Never ever tell another lie, or commit any sin ever again. This is the evidence and fruit of the gift of the Holy Ghost. That is Eternal Life in Jesus the Christ. This cannot be counterfeited by the devil or his children.

They, who have been born of water and Spirit. Never ever tell another lie, or WILLFULLY commit any sin ever again. This is the evidence and fruit of the gift of the Holy Ghost. That is Eternal Life in Jesus the Christ. This cannot be counterfeited by the devil or his children.

I lowered the bar for them.

 

[Muse]

Ekul7291
Well this is my opinion:
John speaks of two kinds of sin, a sin unto death, and a sin not unto death 1John 5:16-17 :
16 If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it.
17 All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death.
18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.
Paul addresses the same in Heb 6 and Heb 10 (the sin unto death)
So which sin are you addressing here, for a brother can be overtaken and sin a sin not unto death, and for that he can be forgiven, for the bible teaches Christians to confess their sins one to another and pray for one another. Christianity is progressing towards perfection, "when I was a child I spoke like a child.... but when I became a man I put away Childish things" the fulness is yet to be imparted in us when Christ appears, but now we only have the earnest of all that pertain to salvation.

Yes, I agree with you perfectly that eternal life can't and will never sin. But now our bodies are not yet Redeemed, Rom 8, and a complete birth must involve our bodies also, yet we are yet to receive the gloried bodies in which we can't commit any sin anymore. We Have eternal life in our Souls by Faith in the Son of God, but our bodies are vile
Rom 8:22-23
For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.
And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.
Phil 3:20-21
20 For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ:
21 Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.
1 John 2
1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for our's only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
I am advocating for people who take Christianity carelessly as they pretend to hold on Grace. No! I am only presenting facts. if you build on only one scripture you risk ending up with a superficial claim. But bring in more scriptural evidence and especially those which give a practical example. Paul withstood Peter for not walking orderly and corrected his error.
Phil 3:12-13
Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.
Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before,
Yes we must press towards perfection through Jesus Christ our redeemer!

 

[Arnie Manitoba]

Muse ... read the dates on this thread .... and then notice that most of the participants have their accounts disabled and are long gone .... it is a waste of time.