Eternal Security Promised

[Tong2020]

That choice is still predominant. Yes any believer can encourage another really depends on the individual…

The individual and their own relationship with God.

If you still have the mind that the true believer, the called of God, have the power of his will, to separate himself from Christ who died for him, by unbelief, because of hardships and sufferings of life, let me share another scriptures:

Paul said, “all things work together for good to those who love God, to those who are the called according to His purpose. For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren. Moreover whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whom He justified, these He also glorified.”

To those then whom Paul referred to, a relationship exist between them and God, a relationship where all things, pleasant or not, easy or difficult, happy or not, work out together for good.

Tong
R4297

 

[Tong2020]

No one can have a relationship with God for other people… (you can pray on their behalf) It is a choice is made by the person to start having a relationship with God.

To think a person can not walk away when the Bible suggest for us to not walk away and become hard hearted.

People believe all kinds of things when it comes to the Bible. The thing is choice is something God have to human beings since the creation of Adam and Eve.

My suggestion is God did not know if they would disobey or not.

If someone is a deterministic in their thinking they would say God knew they were gonna disobey but is that really true?

God could have created them then let himself not know what they would do and let them choose for themselves whatever it is they may do… Though he knew what he would do if they did disobey.

Either walk in faith or walk away from faith.
Walk in faith; even in failure of the flesh, to love God and love others.

<<<No one can have a relationship with God for other people… (you can pray on their behalf) It is a choice is made by the person to start having a relationship with God.>>>

Yes, no one can have a relationship with God for other people. However, it is God who is first, not the person. For the natural man is fallen and separated from God. He cannot know the things of the Spirit of God, and so are foolishness to him. As such, his choice is obvious.

<<<To think a person can not walk away when the Bible suggest for us to not walk away and become hard hearted.>>>

I do not make my own mind and thinking anymore as pertains to the things of the Spirit of God. I let my mind grow, be trained, and molded, by God, by what Spirit says and teaches me in and through the scriptures.

<<<People believe all kinds of things when it comes to the Bible. The thing is choice is something God have to human beings since the creation of Adam and Eve.>>>

Yes, choice is something God gave to man since the creation of Adam. Adam had that. But Adam somehow had done a wrong, that rendered the human kind, separated from God. A thing that resulted to the natural man as fallen beings, who cannot know the things of the Spirit of God. To him, they are foolishness. Now, that tells us what became of man’s will, that is, of the matter of choice.

<<<My suggestion is God did not know if they would disobey or not.>>>

Sorry, but that goes against the very nature of God as revealed in Scriptures.

<<<If someone is a deterministic in their thinking they would say God knew they were gonna disobey but is that really true?>>>

God is eternally omniscient, all knowing, of past, present, future events and actions. He knows the heart of all man, at all times. That is what scriptures teach me. And so I believe as so.

<<<God could have created them then let himself not know what they would do and let them choose for themselves whatever it is they may do… Though he knew what he would do if they did disobey.>>>

Interesting. But that is just a thought.

<<<Either walk in faith or walk away from faith.>>>

If it is possible that those given by the Father to the Son to raise up at the last day, can actually separate from God, and if it is possible that Jesus Christ would fail to do the will of the Father and lose one, some, or even all, then that would make sense.

As it is, that exhortation would make sense and applicable to those who needed to test themselves whether they are in the faith or not. Paul said “Examine yourselves as to whether you are in the faith. Test yourselves. Do you not know yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you?—unless indeed you are disqualified.”

<<<Walk in faith; even in failure of the flesh, to love God and love others.>>>

That is a good reminder. Thanks.

Tong
R4298

 

[MatthewG]

Thank you for your response Tong.

 

[Tong2020]

Thank you for your response Tong.

Thank you as well Matthew for a good and honest exchange.

Tong
R4301

 

[Desire Of All Nations]

Consider, regarding salvation unto eternal life, what we read in scriptures.

Jesus said “All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will by no means cast out. ”

Jesus said “He who comes to Me shall never hunger, and he who believes in Me shall never thirst.”

Jesus said “No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up at the last day. ”

Jesus said “Most assuredly, I say to you, he who believes in Me has everlasting life. ”

What can you say about that?

Also @Michiah-ImlaLook at Jhn 15:6 where Christ explicitly put the responsibility on the Christian to remain faithful by saying whoever doesn't abide in Him will be cast into the fire like a worthless branch. The last statement you posted further disproves eternal security. Look at how Christ says a person has to believe in Him to have everlasting life. That's a continual process Christ is referring to there, not a singular moment in time. To put it in terms anyone can understand, an electrical appliance can't continually receive power if it's not plugged into an outlet. Christianity works the same way. If a Christian isn't "plugged in" to Christ, they're not receiving anything. As Christ said in Jhn 15, a branch can only bear fruit if it's connected to the vine, and a Christian has to bear fruit to receive eternal life.
Tong
R4250

IF, it is common sense you hang your hat on....then Learn the DIFFERENCE BETWEEN....the words;
WITH.....and......IN.

Your lack of KNOWING "the WAY" (according to Gods Word) of HOW TO obtain "ETERNAL Security"....is to your own detriment.
Your (bunk) Preaching ...IS NOT Scriptural.

The WARNING, was to men, WITH God, who Departed being "WITH" God, and God Departed being "WITH THEM"....
The CALL to men TO RETURN to Being WITH...and learning THE WAY TO be "IN" God....was to THEM.

Does the Bible show that my "bunk preaching" is unbiblical?

“Remember therefore from where you have fallen; repent and do the first works, or else I will come to you quickly and remove your lampstand from its place—unless you repent." - Rev. 2:5

“Do not fear any of those things which you are about to suffer. Indeed, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison, that you may be tested, and you will have tribulation ten days. Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life." -Rev. 2:10

“Repent, or else I will come to you quickly and will fight against them with the sword of My mouth." - Rev. 2:16

“I know your works, love, service, faith, and your patience; and as for your works, the last are more than the first." - Rev. 2:19

“Now to you I say, and to the rest in Thyatira, as many as do not have this doctrine, who have not known the depths of Satan, as they say, I will put on you no other burden. But hold fast what you have till I come. And he who overcomes, and keeps My works until the end, to him I will give power over the nations-" - Rev. 2:24-26

“Remember therefore how you have received and heard; hold fast and repent. Therefore if you will not watch, I will come upon you as a thief, and you will not know what hour I will come upon you.You have a few names even in Sardis who have not defiled their garments; and they shall walk with Me in white, for they are worthy. " - Rev. 3:3-4

“He who overcomes, I will make him a pillar in the temple of My God, and he shall go out no more. I will write on him the name of My God and the name of the city of My God, the New Jerusalem, which comes down out of heaven from My God. And I will write on him My new name. " - Rev. 3:12

“As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten. Therefore be zealous and repent." - Rev. 3:19

Everything i argued came straight from Christ's own mouth. Interestingly enough, there isn't a single biblical passage in your counterargument that supports your opinion of me or what i said. So who is the one preaching bunk and lacking knowledge? Christ can clearly be seen telling people throughout all of the Church eras that their salvation wasn't guaranteed unless they stayed on course and remained faithful. It just doesn't get any clear than Christ telling the Christians of the Smyrna era to stay faithful for the rest of their lives if they wanted to receive eternal life.

 

[Taken]

Does the Bible show that my "bunk preaching" is unbiblical?

“Remember therefore from where you have fallen; repent and do the first works, or else I will come to you quickly and remove your lampstand from its place—unless you repent." - Rev. 2:5

“Do not fear any of those things which you are about to suffer. Indeed, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison, that you may be tested, and you will have tribulation ten days. Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life." -Rev. 2:10

“Repent, or else I will come to you quickly and will fight against them with the sword of My mouth." - Rev. 2:16

“I know your works, love, service, faith, and your patience; and as for your works, the last are more than the first." - Rev. 2:19

“Now to you I say, and to the rest in Thyatira, as many as do not have this doctrine, who have not known the depths of Satan, as they say, I will put on you no other burden. But hold fast what you have till I come. And he who overcomes, and keeps My works until the end, to him I will give power over the nations-" - Rev. 2:24-26

“Remember therefore how you have received and heard; hold fast and repent. Therefore if you will not watch, I will come upon you as a thief, and you will not know what hour I will come upon you.You have a few names even in Sardis who have not defiled their garments; and they shall walk with Me in white, for they are worthy. " - Rev. 3:3-4

“He who overcomes, I will make him a pillar in the temple of My God, and he shall go out no more. I will write on him the name of My God and the name of the city of My God, the New Jerusalem, which comes down out of heaven from My God. And I will write on him My new name. " - Rev. 3:12

“As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten. Therefore be zealous and repent." - Rev. 3:19

Everything i argued came straight from Christ's own mouth. Interestingly enough, there isn't a single biblical passage in your counterargument that supports your opinion of me or what i said. So who is the one preaching bunk and lacking knowledge? Christ can clearly be seen telling people throughout all of the Church eras that their salvation wasn't guaranteed unless they stayed on course and remained faithful. It just doesn't get any clear than Christ telling the Christians of the Smyrna era to stay faithful for the rest of their lives if they wanted to receive eternal life.

I expressly spoke of the difference between....
ONLY...with the Lord.
And ....in the Lord.

When you understand THE DIFFERENCE...
Which Scriptures BECOME Applicable becomes Understood.

 

[Tong2020]

Tong2020 said: ↑
Consider, regarding salvation unto eternal life, what we read in scriptures.

Jesus said “All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will by no means cast out. ”

Jesus said “He who comes to Me shall never hunger, and he who believes in Me shall never thirst.”

Jesus said “No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up at the last day. ”

Jesus said “Most assuredly, I say to you, he who believes in Me has everlasting life. ”

What can you say about that?

Also @Michiah-Imla

Does the Bible show that my "bunk preaching" is unbiblical?

“Remember therefore from where you have fallen; repent and do the first works, or else I will come to you quickly and remove your lampstand from its place—unless you repent." - Rev. 2:5

“Do not fear any of those things which you are about to suffer. Indeed, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison, that you may be tested, and you will have tribulation ten days. Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life." -Rev. 2:10

“Repent, or else I will come to you quickly and will fight against them with the sword of My mouth." - Rev. 2:16

“I know your works, love, service, faith, and your patience; and as for your works, the last are more than the first." - Rev. 2:19

“Now to you I say, and to the rest in Thyatira, as many as do not have this doctrine, who have not known the depths of Satan, as they say, I will put on you no other burden. But hold fast what you have till I come. And he who overcomes, and keeps My works until the end, to him I will give power over the nations-" - Rev. 2:24-26

“Remember therefore how you have received and heard; hold fast and repent. Therefore if you will not watch, I will come upon you as a thief, and you will not know what hour I will come upon you.You have a few names even in Sardis who have not defiled their garments; and they shall walk with Me in white, for they are worthy. " - Rev. 3:3-4

“He who overcomes, I will make him a pillar in the temple of My God, and he shall go out no more. I will write on him the name of My God and the name of the city of My God, the New Jerusalem, which comes down out of heaven from My God. And I will write on him My new name. " - Rev. 3:12

“As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten. Therefore be zealous and repent." - Rev. 3:19

Everything i argued came straight from Christ's own mouth. Interestingly enough, there isn't a single biblical passage in your counterargument that supports your opinion of me or what i said. So who is the one preaching bunk and lacking knowledge? Christ can clearly be seen telling people throughout all of the Church eras that their salvation wasn't guaranteed unless they stayed on course and remained faithful. It just doesn't get any clear than Christ telling the Christians of the Smyrna era to stay faithful for the rest of their lives if they wanted to receive eternal life.

<<<Interestingly enough, there isn't a single biblical passage in your counterargument that supports your opinion of me or what i said. >>>

Are you referring to my post which you quoted? I think not. But an affirmation would be appreciated.

Tong
R4343