Eternal Security? What's your take?

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Jordan

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Apr 6, 2007
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(Red_Letters;35077)
(thesuperjag;35035)
Once Saved Always Saved is 100% unbiblical.John 14:15 - If ye love me, keep my commandments.I John 2:4 - He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.Matthew 12:50 - For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
Jag, Im not one to change my mind quickly, or accept new ideas that are shady....But you just gave me what Ive been trying to find.I still think if one truly finds the Lord, Why would he ever want to turn.Thanks for your input, its settled so much in me on this subject.Once Saved Always Saved is still 100% unbiblical even though you don't like it.Here, read my very old post below...(thesuperjag;10034)
Writer the OSAS doctrine is so deceiving and it is made by man. And I don't need a scripture to support this common sense. For ensample, When I accepted Jesus into my heart, I became saved... Now if I turn my back on my Saviour and I became a wiccan (an example) and never want Him again...then I am going to say that I was never truly saved at all...therefore the OSAS doctrine needs to be discarded.
JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
 

forgivenWretch

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I find it so amazing when people dispute God and His word. I would not want to be in your shoes...Since when is God's Word not biblical? How can you be so callus to call God a liar?
 

Jordan

Active Member
Apr 6, 2007
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(forgivenWretch;35082)
I find it so amazing when people dispute God and His word. I would not want to be in your shoes...Since when is God's Word not biblical? How can you be so callus to call God a liar?
I'm not interested in going against God and God's Living Word.Do you really believe that I am still saved by the saving grace of God by Christ's blood if I reject my Saviour for becoming a Satanist? (For which I had no desire to do so anyway)JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
 

forgivenWretch

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(thesuperjag;35091)
I'm not interested in going against God and God's Living Word.Do you really believe that I am still saved by the saving grace of God by Christ's blood if I reject my Saviour for becoming a Satanist? (For which I had no desire to do so anyway)JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
If it is not in your interest then why do you continue to do so?If one is truly saved to begin with then yes absolutely you are still saved.Two young men...1st...SAVED at the age of 10, serves God faithfully for the next ten years, then falls away for the next ten, and dies.2nd...SAVED at the age of 20, serves God faithfully for the next 10 years, then dies.According to everything that you have said...the 1st young man is doomed for Hell, and that my friend is so sad and a total disbelief in God and His Word. Again John 3:16...16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son,[a] that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.Footnotes:[list type=decimal][*][url="http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John%203:16;&version=31;#en-NIV-26127]John 3:16[/url] Or his only begotten Son[/list]
 

Jordan

Active Member
Apr 6, 2007
4,875
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(forgivenWretch;35093)
(thesuperjag;35091)
I'm not interested in going against God and God's Living Word.Do you really believe that I am still saved by the saving grace of God by Christ's blood if I reject my Saviour for becoming a Satanist? (For which I had no desire to do so anyway)JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
If it is not in your interest then why do you continue to do so?If one is truly saved to begin with then yes absolutely you are still saved.Two young men...1st...SAVED at the age of 10, serves God faithfully for the next ten years, then falls away for the next ten, and dies.2nd...SAVED at the age of 20, serves God faithfully for the next 10 years, then dies.According to everything that you have said...the 1st young man is doomed for Hell, and that my friend is so sad and a total disbelief in God and His Word. Again John 3:16...16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son,[a] that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.Footnotes:[list type=decimal][*][url="http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John%203:16;&version=31;#en-NIV-26127]John 3:16[/url] Or his only begotten Son[/list]You clearly misinterpret my words...Matthew 7:21-23 - Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
 

forgivenWretch

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(thesuperjag;35098)
You clearly misinterpret my words...Matthew 7:21-23 - Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
No, your words are quite clear! You only attempt to use God's word only when it benefits your beliefs, and you also attempt using them to dispute His Word with His Word. God's Word is not self contradicting, and it is not yours to judge me or anyone else as to our salvation.
 

Jordan

Active Member
Apr 6, 2007
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(forgivenWretch;35101)
(thesuperjag;35098)
You clearly misinterpret my words...Matthew 7:21-23 - Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
No, your words are quite clear! You only attempt to use God's word only when it benefits your beliefs, and you also attempt using them to dispute His Word with His Word. God's Word is not self contradicting, and it is not yours to judge me or anyone else as to our salvation.Judging you? Eh, no, but I do have a right to attack Satan's doctrine's (doctrine of men) that leads His soul astray... Satan is the master of twisting God's Words as he is wiser than all of us.I John 4:1 - Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
 

forgivenWretch

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John 3:15-18[url="http://www.allaboutgod.com/truth/john-10.htm#28]John 10:28-30[/url][url="http://www.allaboutgod.com/truth/romans-8-2.htm#38]Romans 8:38-39[/url], Ephesians 4:30, and Jude 24[url="http://www.allaboutgod.com/truth/hebrews-6.htm#4]Hebrews 6:4-6[/url] is an often misunderstood passage, which strongly supports the doctrine of eternal security in two ways: it implies that Christ’s sacrifice must be sufficient for all sins, and states that if it were possible for a person to lose their salvation, it would be forever lost. According to this passage, if a person could do something that cost them their salvation (which they cannot), then it would be “impossible” for them to be re-redeemed. Once Saved, Always Saved – The New CreationCritics of the “once saved, always saved” doctrine claim that it gives Christians a license to sin. They presume that those who believe in eternal security intend to accept salvation, and then continue to willingly sin. This is inaccurate, because anyone who has been truly saved is a new creature (2 Corinthians 5:17), has the conviction of the Holy Spirit (John 14:26; 1 Thessalonians 4:8), and now wants to live for Christ. Someone who continues to willingly and blatantly live in sin has not truly accepted Christ (1 John 2:19; 1 John 3:6; James 1:26). While this false belief may be held by some, it is not a part of the teachings of any true Christian church (Romans 3:8). A person who willingly, humbly, repents of sin and turns towards the cross, trusting Christ as their Savior, will be saved (Acts 16:31; John 6:37; John 14:6). That salvation is once and for all, eternal, and secure. Those who truly trust in Christ are saved once, and saved always. Learn More!
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Here are 16 passages that prove OSAS (and are biblical) but of course I'm very confident that you will say these are un-biblical for the umpteenth time and then offer others of the same book which do and cannot dispute the other.
 

Jordan

Active Member
Apr 6, 2007
4,875
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(forgivenWretch;35104)
John 3:15-18[url="http://www.allaboutgod.com/truth/john-10.htm#28]John 10:28-30[/url][url="http://www.allaboutgod.com/truth/romans-8-2.htm#38]Romans 8:38-39[/url], Ephesians 4:30, and Jude 24[url="http://www.allaboutgod.com/truth/hebrews-6.htm#4]Hebrews 6:4-6[/url] is an often misunderstood passage, which strongly supports the doctrine of eternal security in two ways: it implies that Christ’s sacrifice must be sufficient for all sins, and states that if it were possible for a person to lose their salvation, it would be forever lost. According to this passage, if a person could do something that cost them their salvation (which they cannot), then it would be “impossible” for them to be re-redeemed. Once Saved, Always Saved – The New CreationCritics of the “once saved, always saved” doctrine claim that it gives Christians a license to sin. They presume that those who believe in eternal security intend to accept salvation, and then continue to willingly sin. This is inaccurate, because anyone who has been truly saved is a new creature (2 Corinthians 5:17), has the conviction of the Holy Spirit (John 14:26; 1 Thessalonians 4:8), and now wants to live for Christ. Someone who continues to willingly and blatantly live in sin has not truly accepted Christ (1 John 2:19; 1 John 3:6; James 1:26). While this false belief may be held by some, it is not a part of the teachings of any true Christian church (Romans 3:8). A person who willingly, humbly, repents of sin and turns towards the cross, trusting Christ as their Savior, will be saved (Acts 16:31; John 6:37; John 14:6). That salvation is once and for all, eternal, and secure. Those who truly trust in Christ are saved once, and saved always. Learn More!
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Here are 16 passages that prove OSAS (and are biblical) but of course I'm very confident that you will say these are un-biblical for the umpteenth time and then offer others of the same book which do and cannot dispute the other.
And of course, if you want to go down that, that is your choice, but I'm not interested in the Alexandrian Texts that attacks Christ and His Word. It's so sad.JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
 

forgivenWretch

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(thesuperjag;35106)
And of course, if you want to go down that, that is your choice, but I'm not interested in the Alexandrian Texts that attacks Christ and His Word. It's so sad.JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
The Bible is God's Word and DOES NOT attack Christ....seems you be attacked though. Also seems you are not interested in God's Word, like I have already stated, unless you feel it it saying what you want it to say.I am so sorry that you have issues with God and His Word, I pray Dear God that you will lift these uncertainties and let your Light shine through and allow those who do not believe your Word to find the everlasting and eternal peace, that is theirs, merely for the asking.
 

Jordan

Active Member
Apr 6, 2007
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(forgivenWretch)
(thesuperjag;35106)
And of course, if you want to go down that, that is your choice, but I'm not interested in the Alexandrian Texts that attacks Christ and His Word. It's so sad.JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
The Bible is God's Word and DOES NOT attack Christ....seems you be attacked though. Also seems you are not interested in God's Word, like I have already stated, unless you feel it it saying what you want it to say.I am so sorry that you have issues with God and His Word,I pray Dear God that you will lift these uncertainties and let your Light shine through and allow those who do not believe your Word to find the everlasting and eternal peace, that is theirs, merely for the asking.Shows that you lack wisdom in the eyes of God, concerning the Byzantine Texts and the Alexandrian Texts.Care to look at my topic under my sig, anyway, I highly doubt you will see it with your eyes. I have no feelings for the doctrine of men. What I feel is what my Father feels.II Corinthians 11:4 - For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him.JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
 

AusDisciple

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QUOTE (SealedEternal;30021)
It is indesputable that eternal security is Biblical as I could list off twenty or thirty verses that say no one can snatch us out of His hands, and we can know that we have eternal life and have passed out of death into life etc. The problem is that most people who teach it also incorporate it into easy believism and create a false gospel. While it is true that those who have eternal life do have it and can never lose it, unfortunately most who think they do don't.Salvation is a process that you do have to work out with fear and trembling. There is a narrow way described by Jesus that you must travel through before you have eternal life, and He said that few are able to find it. He that overcomes will inherit the promises of God, while the many who call Him Lord, Lord have never known Him. So what is the fundamental key of the Gospel that most people never realize because they found a religion that attempts to bypass it with clever Theology? It is the heart. You must have your heart regenerated and God's Law written on it by His Spirit, so that He can sanctify you and reconcile you to God. Read Romans 6, it explains how God saves us from our enslavement to sin so that we may walk in newness of life. Or Chapter 8 that explains how we may put to death the deeds of the flesh and become sons of God through the work of His Spirit. That's why the apostle John warns repeatedly that no one who has been born of God can practice sin, and those that do are children of the devil and if they claim to know Him they are a liar.These things don't happen immediately when you believe some facts about Christ. That is the first step before making Him your Lord (think about what that really means) and walking by His Spirit so that He may renew your heart and mind and write God's Laws upon them. You must work through this process with fear and trembling, and with His work in you along with your willingness, you may travel the narrow way to eternal life, and then no one will snatch you out of His hands.Unfortunately most people who preach eternal security are still on the wide path themselves, and have never known Christ because they never had the courage to work out their salvation and overcome the evil one within by walking by God's Spirit. You will know by your fruits if you have completed the path or not. Judge yourself with righteous judgment and ask yourself if you're really sanctified and regenerated to the extent that you no longer practice sin. If not then you have not become a child of God and an heir to His Kingdom according to His definition.SealedEternal
This is exactly what happened to me. 17 years ago I said the magical prayer accepting Christ as my saviour and I even lived as a Christian for a year, preaching with passion the gospel but I WAS NOT SAVED!!... even though I thought I was and was told I was!My heart was not transformed and I had not been made a new person by the power of the Holy Spirit. It was all head knowledge and human excitement rather than complete transformation through Christ. In fact, some who saw me slip from what might have seemed true faith to a life of flat out rejection of Christ (I even painted a Satanic symbol on the driveway of the Christian house I used to live in with napalm and set it alight!!!) would say I had lost my salvation!The next 17 years were spent in pure sin. I did everything from becoming a Dominatrix to female bodybuilding and the associated debauchery of muscle worship sessions and prostitution!! I used just about every drug you could possibly think of (it would be easier for me to list the few I didn't use!) and I worked in the music industry, living the 'rock star' lifestyle of sex, drugs and partying. Some of the gigs I did included working with motorcycle clubs the likes of the Hells Angels, the Rebels and the Satans Sinners (yes, there is a club with that name!) and I worked with international musicians who are still worshipped like Gods! Believe it or not, that lifestyle was once a childhood dream for me!...and yet, when I cried out to God to come into my life last November, He heard my cries and has totally transformed me into a new creature. One that is truly changed and on fire for God!! There is no way I could ever contemplate even considering the life I used to live now. It just would not be possible. I KNOW now for a fact that I was never saved 17 years ago or I would NEVER have lived the past 17 years the way I did!!I would have to say that 'once saved, always saved' makes both biblical sense as I read scripture and it makes living sense because the word of God is also written on my heart.It is unlikely that any human will convince me otherwise at this point. I trust what God has written in scripture and on my heart above all.
 

Jordan

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Apr 6, 2007
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(AusDisciple;67071)
... I would have to say that 'once saved, always saved' makes both biblical sense as I read scripture and it makes living sense because the word of God is also written on my heart ...
Once Saved, Always Saved, is both biblical and nonbiblical... depending on which context of their description in which people says...But most of the time, it goes on the list of being non-biblical.