Hearing is not reading!

[Karl Peters]

We have many ways to communicate with others. I can speak to a person. Or I can write to them. Or I can draw them a pictures. I can make a sign, or give them a signal. I could make a movie for them to watch. I could tell another person I want to talk to them. Yet my using my voice and them using their ears to hear from me personally with I use my voice is only one way!!!!!

I bring this up because in the Bible we find out that His sheep hear His voice, and that He leads them out with His voice, and we also find that there are those who with their ears they don't hear!!!

Yet in sooooooo many place (like in church or in Christian books) I have heard people saying that hearing God can mean any of the ways God might communicate with us. That of course is wrong and is a lie, and so where did they get that information from???

Now I know, and especially in these times, there is an emphasis on wanting to be 'inclusive'. That is to say that I/we want all people to be saved and go to heaven. Yet the problem is that God has determined that to get to heaven you have to believe in Jesus Christ, and it is written that faith comes from hearing!!! And specifically hearing a word from Christ/God. And His words are only obtained from the Holy Spirit. The Bible is not the Holy Spirit but is made of ink on pages, or perhaps you now have in on your phone, but your phone is not spirit either!

Jn 6: 63 “It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing; the words that I have spoken to you are spirit and are life.

Rom 10:17 So faith comes from hearing, and hearing by the word of Christ.

So you have to hear a WORD, of Jesus Christ via His Holy Spirit - period!!

Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon got a dream from God, but Daniel got the dream and the interpretation also. The dream was God communicating but the hearing the interpretation spoken indicated that Daniel was going to be saved!

Belshazzar the king and his noble men saw the writing on the wall, but again Daniel got the interpretation. So a vision or reading writing from God might be God communicating to men, but salvation comes from hearing a word from Christ via His Holy Spirit!

Too many times I see where we want to include someone in God's salvation so we make out anything; like a dream or vision or reading the Scriptures, or going to church, or even just being a good person as saving a person. Yet that is not ours to decide!!! And God decided that people are going to be saved by faith, and faith comes by hearing!! This is the reason Paul wrote:

Gal 3:2 This is the only thing I want to find out from you: did you receive the Spirit by the works of the Law, or by hearing with faith?

So there is only one thing that a person needs to do, and that is listening to Jesus Christ personally, and that takes faith because it is the Spirit of gives us the Words of God that belong to Jesus Christ!!


Jn 16: 13 -15 “But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come.
“He will glorify Me, for He will take of Mine and will disclose it to you.
“All things that the Father has are Mine; therefore I said that He takes of Mine and will disclose it to you.

This is a huge problem! I think that every church I have attended, has at some point, had someone behind the podium in front saying the Bible is the Word of God and explaining how people must read it.

People should read the Bible, but the Word of God we preach is found in our mouth and hearts!! How did they not read that before getting up in front of the God's people???? Didn't they get this explained in seminary???

It should at least be explained in Christian Formation & Apologetics - right???

And why did all seven churches written to in Revelation have to be reproved with this line of text:

Rev 2 & 3 (seven places) ‘He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.’

So people of Christian churches, how is your church not letting those who have an ear to hear, hear what the Spirit says to the churches???

Are you lifting up the Bible instead of using the Bible to lift up Jesus Christ meaning we need to listen to Him!!

Seeing the writing on the wall is not going to save you!!!!!!!!!

 

[Angelina]

That is to say that I/we want all people to be saved and go to heaven. Yet the problem is that God has determined that to get to heaven you have to believe in Jesus Christ, and it is written that faith comes from hearing!!! And specifically hearing a word from Christ/God. And His words are only obtained from the Holy Spirit. The Bible is not the Holy Spirit but is made of ink on pages

Rom 10:17 So faith comes from hearing, and hearing by the word of Christ.

So you have to hear a WORD, of Jesus Christ via His Holy Spirit - period!!

I respectfully disagree with you on this point brother. Faith comes from hearing what has been spoken and what is heard comes by the [preaching of the] message concerning Christ. AMP. However, although the word can be revealed to an unbeliever regarding the message of salvation. That message is stll passed on by the written word. It is true however that the unbeliever can only recieve this message by revelation given to them through the Holy Spirit...

 

[Karl Peters]

I respectfully disagree with you on this point brother. Faith comes from hearing what has been spoken and what is heard comes by the [preaching of the] message concerning Christ. AMP. However, although the word can be revealed to an unbeliever regarding the message of salvation. That message is stll passed on by the written word. It is true however that the unbeliever can only recieve this message by revelation given to them through the Holy Spirit...

I appreciate being respectful, and a message can still be passed on by a person writing or even coming and personally telling you something they heard from someone else, like God. Never-the-less, hearing the other person tell you what they heard from God, whether they tell you by speaking to you or my writing to you, is NOT the same thing as hearing God for yourself!!!

And the difference between the two (getting a message from another person, and actually hearing God) is the difference between you knowing God or not!!!

For example: Even if you read a book that someone wrote, can you now go to that author's home and be let in? Or will he not tell you "I never knew you."?

So reading something someone had written has nothing to do with actually knowing them! And we find in the Bible this verse:

Mat 7:23 “And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.'

Is not the great commandment in the Law "“You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your might."?

Mat 22 :35-37 One of them, a lawyer, asked Him a question, testing Him, “Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?”
And He said to him, “ ‘YOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART, AND WITH ALL YOUR SOUL, AND WITH ALL YOUR MIND.’

Yet how are we to fulfill that great command in the Law?

Is that not done by actually getting to know the Lord so that we come to love Him?!!

So there is a commandment, even the foremost commandment, which is not in the Law but by which we fulfill the Law!!

And that command is "Hear, O Israel!"

Mat 12: 28 -30 One of the scribes came and heard them arguing, and recognizing that He had answered them well, asked Him, “What commandment is the foremost of all?”
Jesus answered, “The foremost is, ‘HEAR, O ISRAEL! THE LORD OUR GOD IS ONE LORD;
AND YOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART, AND WITH ALL YOUR SOUL, AND WITH ALL YOUR MIND, AND WITH ALL YOUR STRENGTH.’

Note and compare carefully the two sections of Matthew!!

In the first I quoted, a "lawyer" comes up and asks Jesus about the Law, and Jesus answers correctly pointing to the great commandment in the Law.
Yet in the second a Scribe comes up and asks Jesus about the foremost commandment period! And Jesus starts by saying 'HEAR, O ISRAEL!'

'HEAR, O ISRAEL!' is a commandment, just not a commandment in the Law, It was also a command that came through Moses! Now if you do hear from God personally, will you not realize that you serve One God and He is the Lord? And if you do hear from that One Lord God, then will you not come to love Him and talk back and forth with Him more and more?

If a young man wants to get to know the girl next door, does he not want to take her out for dinner and talk to her? Yes, that young man might send a mutual friend to tell her of his desire to get to know her, but that message being passed on does not mean they have yet meet and have come to love each other!!

So why are we saying that reading about Him means we know Him and love Him? But if you do listen to Him, then will you not come to love Him, and if you don't listen to Him who is always with you, how do you say you love Him who you have not meet and come to know? So you did not keep the great commandment in the Law if you did not even come to know Him who wants to talk to you Today, be personally listening to Him.

I don't want to be disrespectful either, but I do want to hook people up with Him who does have a voice, that small voice that we can pick up in words. I don't just want them to know about Him, I want them personally!! Personally listening to Him is how they will come to love Him, know Him, follow Him, and appreciate who He really is. Moses knew this, because he knew Him and listened to Him personally, and the good news is that anyone can now get to know Him personally!! And that does not come from reading about Him, nor does that even come from someone giving you the message that He wants to personally get to know you!!

Therefore I write, and preach Him (Jesus Christ) as the Word of God instead of the Scriptures. The Scriptures are simply other people who also know Him also preaching and telling you about Him!! So they wrote things like:

Deut 6: 3-9“O Israel, you should listen and be careful to do it, that it may be well with you and that you may multiply greatly, just as the LORD, the God of your fathers, has promised you, in a land flowing with milk and honey.
“Hear, O Israel! The LORD is our God, the LORD is one!
“You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your might.
“These words, which I am commanding you today, shall be on your heart.
“You shall teach them diligently to your sons and shall talk of them when you sit in your house and when you walk by the way and when you lie down and when you rise up.
“You shall bind them as a sign on your hand and they shall be as frontals on your forehead.
“You shall write them on the doorposts of your house and on your gates.

 

[Angelina]

I appreciate being respectful, and a message can still be passed on by a person writing or even coming and personally telling you something they heard from someone else, like God. Never-the-less, hearing the other person tell you what they heard from God, whether they tell you by speaking to you or my writing to you, is NOT the same thing as hearing God for yourself!!!

And the difference between the two (getting a message from another person, and actually hearing God) is the difference between you knowing God or not!!!

I thought we were discussing faith that comes from hearing the word of God? If the word of God is preached to an unbeliever, that word is not powerless because it is written with paper and ink. It is powerless because although the unbeliever has grasped the revelation of that truth through the Holy Spirit, he or she has chosen not to accept it.

The bible tells us in 2 Timothy 2:9

19 Nevertheless, God’s solid foundation stands firm, having this inscription:

The Lord knows those who are His, and
Everyone who names the name of the Lord
must turn away from unrighteousness.

Also when John was preaching baptism and repentance. Many were coming to him in the Jordon river to confess their sins and to be baptised. The Pharisee and Sudducees also came and he said to them - "Brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the coming wrath? 8 Therefore produce fruit consistent with[c] repentance. 9 And don’t presume to say to yourselves, ‘We have Abraham as our father.’ For I tell you that God is able to raise up children for Abraham from these stones!" This is also echoed by Jesus in Matthew 23:23

So why are we saying that reading about Him means we know Him and love Him? But if you do listen to Him, then will you not come to love Him, and if you don't listen to Him who is always with you, how do you say you love Him who you have not meet and come to know? So you did not keep the great commandment in the Law if you did not even come to know Him who wants to talk to you Today, be personally listening to Him.

This is about something else and not about your original question brother. You need to be saved first before you are able to walk with him and have the Holy Spirit dwell in you so that you get to know him better. In my old home "New Believers Home group" when I was growing in Christ, we did get to know him through his word and grew and matured there.

 

[Karl Peters]

I thought we were discussing faith that comes from hearing the word of God? If the word of God is preached to an unbeliever, that word is not powerless because it is written with paper and ink. It is powerless because although the unbeliever has grasped the revelation of that truth through the Holy Spirit, he or she has chosen not to accept it.

The bible tells us in 2 Timothy 2:9

The problem with your conclusion is that you think the Bible is The Word of God we are preaching - where Jesus Christ is the Word of God we are preaching!!

Ink on paper has no power!!! Let us not just be silly - ink can not do anything, nor can paper do anything. At best you might be able to light the paper on fire. Yet God is powerful, and did we not read:

Jn 1:1-3In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
He was in the beginning with God.
All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being.

How did we miss the fact that the Word of God is a person, even Him who took on flesh and went to the cross! And through Him, the person we call Jesus Christ the Son of God who was in the beginning, was with God, and was God and through Him all things came into being, and apart from Him, The Word of God (The One we call Jesus Christ) nothing came into being. That is the power of God and the ink on paper didn't do any of that!!

Christians are not preaching Father, Son, Holy Spirit, and the Bible!! You are replacing Jesus Christ with the Bible! You are make a quad God. You are replacing Jesus Christ with the Scriptures, and that is a problem, because God had men write the Scriptures, and that to point people to the Son, Jesus Christ, who the Father gave all things to - including the words of God which the Holy Spirit brings to our spirit! So that the word of God we preach is found in our mouth and in our hearts, so not in the Bible!! Yet the Bible explains all this, so it is "profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness;" - but not for preaching!!

2 Tim 3:16 All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness;

Rom 10: 6-8 But the righteousness based on faith speaks as follows: “DO NOT SAY IN YOUR HEART, ‘WHO WILL ASCEND INTO HEAVEN?’ (that is, to bring Christ down),
or ‘WHO WILL DESCEND INTO THE ABYSS?’ (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead).”
But what does it say? “THE WORD IS NEAR YOU, IN YOUR MOUTH AND IN YOUR HEART”—that is, the word of faith which we are preaching,

Now let us take a look at the verse you refer to but did not show - it was 2 Tim 2:9 - and I will add a few verses around it so we might have some context:

2 Tim 2:7-10 Consider what I say, for the Lord will give you understanding in everything.
Remember Jesus Christ, risen from the dead, descendant of David, according to my gospel,
for which I suffer hardship even to imprisonment as a criminal; but the word of God is not imprisoned.
For this reason I endure all things for the sake of those who are chosen, so that they also may obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus and with it eternal glory.

The word of God that is not imprisoned is Jesus Christ!! He has risen from the dead, He is both a descendant of David and even the creator of all of us, according to the gospel, and so He is not imprisoned, but perhaps this has not yet been revealed to everyone?

Gal 3:22, 23 But the Scripture has shut up everyone under sin, so that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe. But before faith came, we were kept in custody under the law, being shut up to the faith which was later to be revealed.

And in the book Revelation we find this revelation:

Rev 19:13 He is clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God.

The Christ, who is called Jesus which means God's salvation and He is God's salvation, has always been called The Word of God - or you might read 'word of the Lord' - because He was given the words of God (along with all else by His Father)

Jn 16:13-15“But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come.
“He will glorify Me, for He will take of Mine and will disclose it to you.
“All things that the Father has are Mine; therefore I said that He takes of Mine and will disclose it to you

So the Holy Spirit does not speak on His own, but He takes words of God from Jesus Christ, and Jesus Christ's words (the words of God) to each of us personally. Which explains why the Word we preach is near us, and found in our mouth and hearts, and why Jesus is recorded as being saying:

Jn 6:63 “It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing; the words that I have spoken to you are spirit and are life.

Note that is read "the words that I have spoken to you" - so He, The Word of God (Jesus Christ) speaks personally "to you" - and to me too! Where as the Scriptures are written to all people and are not personal to us!! But again are worth learning and good for reproof!

Still many have read the Scriptures and still don't know Jesus Christ personally, because they are, as Jesus explained to the Jews in person:

Jn 5: 38 - 41“You do not have His word abiding in you, for you do not believe Him whom He sent.
You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; it is these that testify about Me;
and you are unwilling to come to Me so that you may have life.
“I do not receive glory from men;

and also:

Jn 5:46,47 “For if you believed Moses, you would believe Me, for he wrote about Me.
“But if you do not believe his writings, how will you believe My words?”

So according to Jesus Christ, The Word of God, the writings of Moses (the first five books in the Bible) are not Jesus Christ's words!!!!!

 

[Karl Peters]

I went though a number of Scriptures in the prior post to really go over how the Scriptures are not the Word of God we are preaching, and that Jesus Christ is!

That does not mean God has not used the Scriptures to communicate to us, but only that means of communication is not God speaking to us!! The Bible is not His voice - it was God getting/inspiriting people in the past who did hear from Him, to write telling others about Him, and He - God - has kept those writings available to us to this day! So we can all read them Today - and I emphasize "Today", but "Today" is the day we should hear His voice, but the Bible is not His voice, but the sacred writings!!

Now hearing His voice (what we usually call the 'small voice') that is the Word of God/Jesus Christ speaking to us though His Holy Spirit- and that gives us faith. And so it is that hearing by faith which gives us salvation - but reading the Scriptures do not give us salvation.

It is not knowing about God that saves us, but actually knowing Him (Jesus Christ who is the Word of God and God - Jn 1:1) that results in salvation. To know Him, like knowing other people in your life, you have to hear from Him and talk to Him!!

That is why these four verses are good examples of what I am explaining:

Jn 5: 39,49You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; it is these that testify about Me;
and you are unwilling to come to Me so that you may have life.

and

Rev 3:19, 20 ‘Those whom I love, I reprove and discipline; therefore be zealous and repent. ‘Behold, I stand at the door and knock; if anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and will dine with him, and he with Me.

In John 5 we find a people who searched the Scriptures, studied them, and got to know the Scriptures, but though they had read all about the Christ they did not actually know Him, because they did not actually seek Him! Instead, they were searching the Scriptures instead of coming to Him!

Yes God had given them the Sacred Writings, and which should have gotten them to seek Him, but they didn't! They knew the writings, but not Him!! And we still have the Sacred Writing and even more writings by John, Paul, and others, to explain this further. Still, people will be people, and if anyone posting on this forum are searching the Scriptures instead of actually seek Jesus Christ and hearing by He has to say so them personally, then that needs to change!! Jesus Christ is the Word of God we are preaching, and that to mean that He will and wants to talk back and forth with you!!

Which brings us to the next couple of verse above. He, Jesus Christ, is standing there speaking at the door to your heart. If ANYONE (even those people who search the Scriptures but don't come to Him) decides to hear His voice and open the door He will come into them and eat with them and them with Him. Which is to say the you and Him can and will becomes friends. He then will count you as His son or daughter. He will give you wisdom, and teach you, and go over the verses in the Bible with you personally!! And not just that, but He will go over all the parts of your life as you let Him!!

If you don't know Him personally, seek Him, believe He is there to speak to you, and you will find Him!!!!!

As for the religious leaders who are telling others that He is not around Today to hear from, you too can seek Him and find Him, but will you?? How are you going to change, since you have been making yourself little gods, pretending you are the experts about God, so that you try to collect disciples for yourself, instead of telling other to seek Him who is the Word of God and is the Christ, and is God's salvation!!

And don't think for a second that I am trying to put others down!!! I am trying to get them lifted up to Jesus Christ and His Kingdom!!

But honestly, He once had me open to Ezekiel 3 and had me read, and as I read He started talking to me personally, so I could both read and hear Him speaking to me personally. He what He said was similar to what I was reading, but what He told me was personalized to me, so it was not quite the same. He was telling me that He was not sending me to people who spoke another language, but to those who should listen to Him. But He also said that they would not be willing to listen to me, since they were not willing to listen to Him. Never-the-less, He also told me that He had made me hardheaded, because they who I was being sent to were hardheaded and stubborn.

His work, the word of God, is that all should come to know Him, but how do you get through to a hardheaded stubborn group of people who of all the peoples of this world, should listen to Him because they have the Bible which tells them to do that, but are still unwilling to get to know Him!! So hardheaded and stubborn that they call the Scriptures (graphe in Greek) the Word of God, when graphe is not even translated as "word" in their Bibles! They are making an idol out of their Bibles!!

The Bible is good for teaching, for reproof, and for training, but the Word of God we preach is Jesus Christ!!!!

 

[Angelina]

The problem with your conclusion is that you think the Bible is The Word of God we are preaching - where Jesus Christ is the Word of God we are preaching!!

Jesus is God and a continued story of the promises made to Abraham...

 

[Karl Peters]

Jesus is God and a continued story of the promises made to Abraham...

Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes:

And like Abraham, we can hear from Him - Today. And Today is the day we need to be hearing from Him, and encouraging others to do the same.

If we do that then He will help us with all the things in our lives!!!

That includes our study of the Bible, but we don't spend most of our lives studying the Bible. There is waking, walking, cleaning, eating, and going to the left and to the right to get where we need to go where we need to go. So it is that Isaiah wrote:

Is 30:21,22 Although the Lord has given you bread of privation and water of oppression, He, your Teacher will no longer hide Himself, but your eyes will behold your Teacher.
Your ears will hear a word behind you, “This is the way, walk in it,” whenever you turn to the right or to the left.

Yet the unbeliever does not know about the Holy Spirit, and so the questions:

Rom 10:14 How then will they call on Him in whom they have not believed? How will they believe in Him whom they have not heard? And how will they hear without a preacher?

So it is that believers are called on to preach the Word of God, but that does not mean the Bible, but that the Holy Spirit is sent with the words of God for us personally, that the Holy Spirit gets from Jesus Christ who was given to Him by His Father.

So God has many ways to communicate with people, but we preach the Word of God, meaning the we can talk to Jesus Christ via His Holy Spirit. And that is what Abram did also:

Gen 15:1 After these things the word of the LORD came to Abram in a vision, saying,
“Do not fear, Abram,
I am a shield to you;
Your reward shall be very great.”

So Yes, the word of the LORD (Word of God) was the One who appeared to Abram in a vision, saying "..." And it is Him that we preach, and we can, and probably should, use the Sacred Writings to back up what we are preaching Him as the Word of God, right? And that He is standing there speaking now, so that if anyone would open up to Him He will come into them with His Holy Spirt and so we can talk back and forth in words (found in our spirit from the Holy Spirit).

We can talk to Him about a vision if we get one, or we can talk to Him about the Bible if we have one, and we can talk to Him about when to turn to the left or to the right, which is obviously more common than getting visions and reading the Bible. Indeed, it is unclear whether Enoch had a vision, and he certainly did not have a Bible, but he walked with God.

Gen 5:24 Enoch walked with God; and he was not, for God took him.

 

[Wrangler]

I have heard people saying that hearing God can mean any of the ways God might communicate with us. That of course is wrong and is a lie

I too disagree with you brother. You're being overly literal.

When the Holy Spirit has reached out to me, it is more like telepathy not a literal voice.

Beyond that is the fact that God most often communicates indirectly. For instance, when doors don't open for a path one is pursuing, that is said to be God's way of saying he wants you to go down aother path. Another example is the recent eclipse is considered "a sign." He's communicating. Are you open or closed to the message of God? The expression "eyes to see and ears to hear" is not a literal statement but one who is closed-minded and hard-hearted. Ironic that you start off the thread in the negative. Sad also but predictable.

 

[MA2444]

We have many ways to communicate with others. I can speak to a person. Or I can write to them. Or I can draw them a pictures. I can make a sign, or give them a signal. I could make a movie for them to watch. I could tell another person I want to talk to them. Yet my using my voice and them using their ears to hear from me personally with I use my voice is only one way!!!!!

I bring this up because in the Bible we find out that His sheep hear His voice, and that He leads them out with His voice, and we also find that there are those who with their ears they don't hear!!!

Yet in sooooooo many place (like in church or in Christian books) I have heard people saying that hearing God can mean any of the ways God might communicate with us. That of course is wrong and is a lie, and so where did they get that information from???

Now I know, and especially in these times, there is an emphasis on wanting to be 'inclusive'. That is to say that I/we want all people to be saved and go to heaven. Yet the problem is that God has determined that to get to heaven you have to believe in Jesus Christ, and it is written that faith comes from hearing!!! And specifically hearing a word from Christ/God. And His words are only obtained from the Holy Spirit. The Bible is not the Holy Spirit but is made of ink on pages, or perhaps you now have in on your phone, but your phone is not spirit either!

Jn 6: 63 “It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing; the words that I have spoken to you are spirit and are life.

Rom 10:17 So faith comes from hearing, and hearing by the word of Christ.

So you have to hear a WORD, of Jesus Christ via His Holy Spirit - period!!

Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon got a dream from God, but Daniel got the dream and the interpretation also. The dream was God communicating but the hearing the interpretation spoken indicated that Daniel was going to be saved!

Belshazzar the king and his noble men saw the writing on the wall, but again Daniel got the interpretation. So a vision or reading writing from God might be God communicating to men, but salvation comes from hearing a word from Christ via His Holy Spirit!

Too many times I see where we want to include someone in God's salvation so we make out anything; like a dream or vision or reading the Scriptures, or going to church, or even just being a good person as saving a person. Yet that is not ours to decide!!! And God decided that people are going to be saved by faith, and faith comes by hearing!! This is the reason Paul wrote:

Gal 3:2 This is the only thing I want to find out from you: did you receive the Spirit by the works of the Law, or by hearing with faith?

So there is only one thing that a person needs to do, and that is listening to Jesus Christ personally, and that takes faith because it is the Spirit of gives us the Words of God that belong to Jesus Christ!!


Jn 16: 13 -15 “But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come.
“He will glorify Me, for He will take of Mine and will disclose it to you.
“All things that the Father has are Mine; therefore I said that He takes of Mine and will disclose it to you.

This is a huge problem! I think that every church I have attended, has at some point, had someone behind the podium in front saying the Bible is the Word of God and explaining how people must read it.

People should read the Bible, but the Word of God we preach is found in our mouth and hearts!! How did they not read that before getting up in front of the God's people???? Didn't they get this explained in seminary???

It should at least be explained in Christian Formation & Apologetics - right???

And why did all seven churches written to in Revelation have to be reproved with this line of text:

Rev 2 & 3 (seven places) ‘He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.’

So people of Christian churches, how is your church not letting those who have an ear to hear, hear what the Spirit says to the churches???

Are you lifting up the Bible instead of using the Bible to lift up Jesus Christ meaning we need to listen to Him!!

Seeing the writing on the wall is not going to save you!!!!!!!!!

I hear what you're saying and it's a good topic. Oh wait you used a keyboard, but I still heard what you are saying.. Maybe you used a keyboard and said something but there was no spoken word and I still heard you. So hearing is a term that is loosely used to not just mean audible, but also I read what you wrote and am cognizant of what you were saying, so I said, I hear you.

Same ting with scripture and the term Word. You have to be careful when reading the Word and it uses the term word as regarding is it the Logos or Rhema that it means? Word is used both ways. Logos is the written word and Rhema is the spoken word.

When we pick up our Bible and begin to read the text therein, the Holy Spirit comes and begins speaking Rhema's to you. And you see yourself in scripture. You're reading and a particular verse or passage will almost jump up off the page to you because it speaks to you directly. That is receiving a Rhema from the Holy Spirit.

One time in my life (that I can remember!) I heard the audible voice of the Lord. He came into my room and the atmosphere in the room changed, it was like electrified and full of power. I could not see Him and He spoke to me audibly. When He spoke to me, I immediately (Marveled!) realized that I recognize His voice! This is Jesus talking! I thought, Wow!

I cant remember ever hearing the Lord before to be able to recognize His voice! On the other hand though, Scripture does say that He knew us before we were in the womb. So take that as you will. Maybe we stood and talked with Him before being born here (and having our memories erased!). ??

It definitely felt just a bit Twilight Zone to recognize His voice. But ultimately, when Jesus walks into the room with all of His power and Love radiating into the room...there's no mistake who it is! I think I knew it before He spoke.

Scripture says we will know His voice so that's true for sure!

But the Lord wants us to learn how to hear His still small voice inside of us. The still small voice (SSV) is not audible so it technically cant be heard but it can be heard even though we dont hear it with our ears. I learned myself (??!!) to be able to hear His SSV. I just talked His ear off all day long by inviting Him to go with me everywhere. I would talk and then pause and listen. I had to become like a little child and make a game of it at first, but I figured that was ok. And after I asked a question, the very first thing to pop into my head, I considered His answer. Sometimes a thought, sometimes a scripture would come to me, other times, crickets, lol. After awhile it turned into a regular coversation. and I just wouldt leave Him alone, lol! Now He wont leave me alone! (PTL!) He told me that He wants everyone to be able to hear His SSV and instantly obey. Most Christians when they have an incident where they hear God's voice, it is a big thing and they tend to automaticcally expect a miracle of some sort, some sort of sign. And that's natural I guess but He said He likes to save the Miracles to do in front of crowds of people so there is many more conversions, but on a personal oe on one communication, we shouldnt require a sign or miracle...Hear His SSV and instantly obey.

That's deep if you think about it. I'm slowly catching on!

 

[Wrangler]

I hear what you're saying and it's a good topic. Oh wait you used a keyboard, but I still heard what you are saying.. Maybe you used a keyboard and said something but there was no spoken word and I still heard you. So hearing is a term that is loosely used to not just mean audible, but also I read what you wrote and am cognizant of what you were saying, so I said, I hear you.

You're being overly literal.

Worse than being overly literal, denying other senses of the word as @MA2444 alluded to. From Definition of HEAR intransitive verb senses: To gain information and entertain an idea.

transitive verb

1: to perceive or become aware of by the ear
didn't hear what she said
thought I heard them leave
2 : to gain knowledge of by hearing
heard that you were ill
3 a: to listen to with attention : heed
would not hear my side of the story
b : attend
hear mass
4 a law : to give a listening to legal arguments in : to give a legal hearing to
hear a case
b law : to take testimony from
hear witnesses

intransitive verb

1: to have the capacity of perceiving sound : to be able to become aware of sound
He doesn't hear well.
2 a: to gain information : learn
tired of hearing about his problems
b: to receive communication
haven't heard from her lately
3: to entertain the idea —used in the negative
wouldn't hear of it
4 —often used in the expression Hear! Hear! to express approval (as during a speech)

 

[Karl Peters]

Worse than being overly literal, denying other senses of the word as @MA2444 alluded to. From Definition of HEAR intransitive verb senses: To gain information and entertain an idea.

transitive verb

1: to perceive or become aware of by the ear
didn't hear what she said
thought I heard them leave
2 : to gain knowledge of by hearing
heard that you were ill
3 a: to listen to with attention : heed
would not hear my side of the story
b : attend
hear mass
4 a law : to give a listening to legal arguments in : to give a legal hearing to
hear a case
b law : to take testimony from
hear witnesses

intransitive verb

1: to have the capacity of perceiving sound : to be able to become aware of sound
He doesn't hear well.
2 a: to gain information : learn
tired of hearing about his problems
b: to receive communication
haven't heard from her lately
3: to entertain the idea —used in the negative
wouldn't hear of it
4 —often used in the expression Hear! Hear! to express approval (as during a speech)

It's the Holy Spirit that brings us the Lord's words to our spirit. We often tend to call that the small voice.

Yet because God is spirit we don't pick those words up with our physical ears but rather out spiritual ears. So we have to you our spiritual ears (sense of hearing) to hear those words.

Now a couple of things can cause our spiritual hearing to not be good:

One of those things that happen which cause our spiritual ears to not pick up things like they should is our faith.
Another thing is out not paying attention with our spiritual ears.
And another thing is our failure to practice using our spiritual senses.

All the above things make is difficult to pick up what our Lord Jesus is saying to us via His Holy Spirit!

And frankly, we all have this issued to some extent of another! I include myself in that statement!!

So we find in the Scriptures where some don't hear, some barely hear, some have dull hearing, and even John that Baptist who was said by Jesus to be the greatest born of woman was also compared to a reed blowing in the wind - and the least in heaven.

So Christians have various ability to pick up His voice in words - which of course is what a voice says. And thus I have Christians tell me that to them the Lord's voice comes across like and 'unction or feeling'. But that is of course being "dull of hearing", and according to the Scriptures, that person is not qualified to teach!!! That doesn't mean they are not a Christian, but that they need to practice hearing the Lord more!!
Consider the following vereses:

Heb 5: 11-14 Concerning him we have much to say, and it is hard to explain, since you have become dull of hearing
For though by this time you ought to be teachers, you have need again for someone to teach you the elementary principles of the oracles of God, and you have come to need milk and not solid food.
For everyone who partakes only of milk is not accustomed to the word of righteousness, for he is an infant.
But solid food is for the mature, who because of practice have their senses trained to discern good and evil.

Now to say that to an individual might seem offensive to them, and people don't like 'reproof': never the less it is in the Scriptures and good for talking to the Lord about! Yet if a person is dull of hearing, then how is the Lord going to make it clear to them if they do have that issue?

Of course the answer to that question is also in the same verses - " you have need again for someone to teach you the elementary principles of the oracles of God,"

Anyone truly speaking on God behalf has to hear from God and good enough to pass on what is being said. So the principle of that oracles would be hearing what God says in words so you can pass on those words. Jesus Christ, whose name is called the Word of God, is our Oracle, and so His principle is that we hear His words with come through His Holy Spirit!! And since He said:


Jn 6:63 “It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing; the words that I have spoken to you are spirit and are life.

and

Jn 6:64 “But there are some of you who do not believe.” For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were who did not believe, and who it was that would betray Him.

would it not be wise for a person to seek His "words" that come through the Holy Spirit by faith?????

And indeed, if we are telling people that His words can mean most anything, and not just 'words' then who is the non-believer that is betraying Him??

Are we not told to preach The Word? Why does it not say preach the "unction", or the 'feeling' of God? What do we get from a voice, if not words?

Luke 8:21 But He answered and said to them, “My mother and My brothers are these who hear the word of God and do it.”

Maybe an unction can get you to do something, but how do you know that unction or feeling really came from Him. How good are you doing to be at discerning good from evil? Can you even use the test provided in the Scriptures (1 Jn 4:1-3) to see if a spirit coming from the Holy Spirit or not if you can actually hear what is being said but just kind of have a feeling or unction? And considering that 'life' eternal is based on this understanding of ours, shouldn't we take what the Lord literal, in case it is? Should we practice hearing the Lord on those days called "Today?"

Heb 3:7 - 11 Therefore, just as the Holy Spirit says,
“TODAY IF YOU HEAR HIS VOICE,
DO NOT HARDEN YOUR HEARTS AS WHEN THEY PROVOKED ME,
AS IN THE DAY OF TRIAL IN THE WILDERNESS,
WHERE YOUR FATHERS TRIED Me BY TESTING Me,
AND SAW MY WORKS FOR FORTY YEARS.
“THEREFORE I WAS ANGRY WITH THIS GENERATION,
AND SAID, ‘THEY ALWAYS GO ASTRAY IN THEIR HEART,
AND THEY DID NOT KNOW MY WAYS’;
AS I SWORE IN MY WRATH,
‘THEY SHALL NOT ENTER MY REST.’”

Now as for me, I don't think much of me as a believer. I only hear from the Lord about a dozen times a day, but I do hear from Him in words on those days that I call "Today". But I also get busy and don't hear Him like I should. I also have trouble believing Him when He tells me something. And I so I don't think I practice hearing from Him like I should either. Never-the-less, I hear that small voice of the Lord's talking to me in words everyday, and have for over twenty years now, since I first started hearing from Him. And so I have lots of interesting sayings, parables, teachings, and testimonies that came from hearing Him.

For example: Yesterday He was telling me that my son's soccer team was going to win it's game last night. Indeed, He had kept telling me over and over and over, but his team has lots of new players, and for that and another reason, it seemed very unlikely that they were going to win that game. The other team looked braver and bolder and bigger and faster, and the game was tied with less than 2 minutes to when we had a great chance and hit the cross bar and didn't score. At that point I got upset and told the Lord something about Him lying to me, but then they fouled us, and we got a penalty kick and won the game.

Now I am embarrassed with myself. He had told me, and told me, and told me, but when even the last chance seemed to pass us by I got upset that He even told me, and I doubted Him. Still, what He said came to pass again. Yet can a person even learn that about themselves unless they start hearing from Him in word at least sometime on that day called Today?