How Confidant Are You Being Saved?

[amigo de christo]

Let us be one , let us have one purse , an ecumiencal purse of abomation and fornication and total rejection of the one
true gospel .
THAT MY near and dear friends are what many are now sitting under . A LIE sent by a lying spirit .
A spirit that prophesys to them all , come let us be one , let us come to the table of
a well favored harlot . let us heed HER intefaith plan for world peace
FOR IT BE THE WAY to peace n safety . WE shall have peace in her plan .
NO , oh no ya wont .
YE SHALL HAVE THE SWORD OF GOD to fight against YOU on JESUS day
and thine own peace n safety ye did follow and hold to and beleive in ,
WILL BE TO YOUR OWN SUDDEN DESTRUCTION
by THE VERY GOD and HIS CHRIST , they thought THEY KNEW and served ,
YET had SOLD them all a lie , DENYING the dire need to repent and believe on JESUS , and rather saying
HEY we all serve the same GOD let us be one , let us cast HIS CORDS from off our backs
and let us wear the clothing of a diverse and well favored harlot .
WHAT has been said , has come as a warning for all . FLEE anything ecumenical
or prepare to be led to the lie , if ye have not already , and to be DESTROYED on the DAY of THE LORD .
GOD is full of mercy and compassion , and Desires only repentance , faith in Christ .
But woe unto he or unto she who rejects and continues to serve the agenda of a lie claoked as love
and a peace plan cliamed to be of GOD , yet be of the dark one . FLEEING TIME folks , and do not look back

 

[Wrangler]

I came to that conclusion years ago.

Unless God gives us some kind of confirming experience (and many will testify that He has), we'll just have to trust Jesus to save us. Either He will, or....He won't.

Isn't that what faith IS?

That's how I see it. You either have certain knowledge or you have faith.

 

[Armour of God]

That's how I see it. You either have certain knowledge or you have faith.

That's a good way to put it. I don't believe anyone has 100% certain knowledge, and the ones who claim to know everything are the ones I'm skeptical about the most.

And so I admit that I don't know everything, I don't understand everything, I just know that God exists and therefore I have faith in Him and His plan.

 

[amigo de christo]

That's how I see it. You either have certain knowledge or you have faith.

faith in what and in who is the question .
For we cannot beleive in both THE GOSPEL and unbelief .
Otherwise it was only unbelief we ever had .
So i am going to give us an example of UNBELIEF .
Oh i believe but .................
As they now include all religoins as serving God in different diverse ways .
THAT IS UNBELIEF .
THE GOSPEL IS VERY VERY CRYSTAL CLEAR , and I BELIEVE THE GOSPEL .
That if you WILL believe from the heart that GOD has rose HIM f rom the d ead
and CONFESS HIM by mouth , YE SHALL BE SAVED .
for with the heart man believes UNTO RIGHTEOUSNESS
and by confession is salvation .
YOO HOO , WHY are you all gathering with an ecumeincal harlot of intefaith .
IT DIDNT and IT DONT preach the gospel at all .
IT preaches A LIE .

 

[amigo de christo]

That's a good way to put it. I don't believe anyone has 100% certain knowledge, and the ones who claim to know everything are the ones I'm skeptical about the most.

And so I admit that I don't know everything, I don't understand everything, I just know that God exists and therefore I have faith in Him and His plan.

And what is HIS PLAN for peace .
THIS PLAN .
THE GOSPEL of ye must absolutely BELIEVE ON JESUS THE CHRIST
to be saved and reconciled to GOD and have PEACE WITH GOD .
Now , if ya see any peace plan and they say HEY ITS THE PEACE PLAN OF GOD
and yet ITS ECUMIENCAL INTEFAITH DIALOUE DENIES THE GOSPEL THAT YE MUST BELEIVE ,
as DID THIS HARLOTS plan . YOO hoo everyone, ITS PEACE BE NOT OF GOD
but rathe r of
Another one , who , i might add , shall destroy many through peace .
Someone and many someones are being led to A LIE of highly clever dragon
and his harlot by means of her ecumeincal intefaith peace plan .
And might i add , THOUGH it promises them this is the way to ATTAIN peace n saf ety of the world
NOPE . ITS PEACE PLAN DENIED the ONLY ONE who could save them .
AND BY HIM its gonna be SUDDEN DESTRUcTION rained down upon all who joined hands with that mess .

 

[amigo de christo]

That's a good way to put it. I don't believe anyone has 100% certain knowledge, and the ones who claim to know everything are the ones I'm skeptical about the most.

And so I admit that I don't know everything, I don't understand everything, I just know that God exists and therefore I have faith in Him and His plan.

the greatest wavering , oh i say , the greatest double talk
IS OCCURING right now
within even christendom it self .
For though they say HEY WE BELIEVE IN JESUS
they sure do say , HEY MUSLIMS AND ALL WE BEIEVE IN UNBELIEF
cause you all serving the same GOD we do . NO NEED TO REPENT and believe .
YA ever wonder why james wrote the DOUBLE MINDED man
be unstable IN ALL HIS WAYS . Ye cannot LOVE THE TRUTH AND A LIE .
A man cannot serve TWO MASTERS .
ITS ONE or the other we served my friend . IT simply cannot b e BOTH
one tried to embrace . And as for the sheep ,
WELL they dont heed the double talk voice of any s tranger .
FOR JESUS , HE HAS HIS SHEEP and they heed only
the voice of ONE .,,,
FOR THIS CAUSE came i INTO the WORLD and for this reason was i born
TO TESTIFY OF THE TRUTH . All who are OF THE TRUTH COME TO ME .
Not budda and satans world peace plan
not muhammed and satans world peace plan .
TO JESUS , WHO IS THE TRUTH and SPEAKETH ONLY THE TRUTH .
AMEN and may i add FOREVER AMEN . THE SHEEP will not HEED THE LIE .

 

[Scott Downey]

Let the scripture enlighten you on the inside about Christ and your salvation!
Christ is our great High Priest.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
22 by so much more was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.

23 And those priests truly were many, because they were not suffered to continue by reason of death;

24 but this Man, because He continueth forever, hath an unchangeable priesthood.

25 Therefore He is able also to save to the uttermost those who come unto God by Him, seeing He ever liveth to make intercession for them.

26 For such a High Priest who is befitting for us, holy, undisposed to harm, undefiled, separated from sinners, and made higher than the heavens,
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

As Christ saves you to the utmost because you came to God through Him, you can not be lost.
Becuause everyone who calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved, that is God's promise to you and me.

Bible Gateway passage: Hebrews 7 - 21st Century King James Version

For this Melchizedek, king of Salem, priest of the Most High God, met Abraham, who was returning from the slaughter of the kings, and blessed him. To him also Abraham gave a tenth part of all, Melchizedek first being by interpretation "king of righteousness," and after that also king of Salem...

www.biblegateway.com

For this Melchizedek, king of Salem, priest of the Most High God, met Abraham, who was returning from the slaughter of the kings, and blessed him.

2 To him also Abraham gave a tenth part of all, Melchizedek first being by interpretation “king of righteousness,” and after that also king of Salem, which means “king of peace.”

3 Without father, without mother and without descent, having neither beginning of days nor end of life, but made like unto the Son of God, he abideth a priest continually.

4 Now consider how great this man was, unto whom even the patriarch Abraham gave a tenth of the spoils.

5 And verily, those who are of the sons of Levi, who receive the office of the priesthood, have a commandment to take tithes from the people according to the law — that is, from their brethren — though they come out of the loins of Abraham.

6 But Melchizedek, whose descent is not counted from them, received tithes from Abraham and blessed him that had the promises.

7 And beyond all contradiction, the lesser is blessed by the greater.

8 And here men who die receive tithes; but there he receiveth them, of whom it is witnessed that he liveth.

9 And, as I may so say, Levi also, who receiveth tithes, paid tithes through Abraham,

10 for he was yet in the loins of his father when Melchizedek met Abraham.

11 If therefore perfection were through the Levitical priesthood (for under it the people received the law), what further need was there that another priest should rise according to the order of Melchizedek, and not be called according to the order of Aaron?

12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.

13 For He of whom these things are spoken pertaineth to another tribe, of which no man gave attendance at the altar.

14 For it is evident that our Lord sprang out of Judah, of which tribe Moses spoke nothing concerning priesthood.

15 And this is yet far more evident when there ariseth another priest according to the similitude of Melchizedek,

16 who is made not according to the law of a carnal commandment, but according to the power of an endless life.

17 For He testifieth: “Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchizedek.”

18 For there is verily an annulling of the former commandment because of the weakness and unprofitableness thereof.

19 For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did, by which we draw nigh unto God.

20 And inasmuch as it was not without an oath that He was made priest

21 (for those priests were made without an oath, but He with an oath by Him who said unto Him: “The Lord swore and will not repent, ‘Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchizedek.’”),

22 by so much more was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.

23 And those priests truly were many, because they were not suffered to continue by reason of death;

24 but this Man, because He continueth forever, hath an unchangeable priesthood.

25 Therefore He is able also to save to the uttermost those who come unto God by Him, seeing He ever liveth to make intercession for them.

26 For such a High Priest who is befitting for us, holy, undisposed to harm, undefiled, separated from sinners, and made higher than the heavens,

27 who needeth not, as those high priests, to offer up sacrifice daily first for His own sins and then for the people’s; for this He did once when He offered up Himself.

28 For the law maketh men high priests who have infirmity; but the word of the oath, which came since the law, maketh the Son, who is consecrated for evermore.

 

[Scott Downey]

Bible Gateway passage: Romans 10 - 21st Century King James Version

Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is that they might be saved. For I bear them record that they have a zeal for God, but not according to knowledge. For they, being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted...

www.biblegateway.com

Brethren, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for Israel is that they might be saved.

2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal for God, but not according to knowledge.

3 For they, being ignorant of God’s righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone that believeth.

5 For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law: that “the man who doeth those things shall live by them.”

6 But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh in this manner: “Say not in thine heart, ‘Who shall ascend into Heaven?’” (that is, to bring Christ down from above)

7 or, “‘Who shall descend into the deep?’” (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead).

8 But what saith it? “The Word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth and in thy heart,” that is, the word of faith which we preach:

9 that if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised Him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

11 For the Scripture saith, “Whosoever believeth in Him shall not be ashamed.”

12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek, for the same Lord over all is rich unto all who call upon Him.

13 For “whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.”

 

[amigo de christo]

Let the scripture enlighten you on the inside about Christ and your salvation!
Christ is our great High Priest.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
22 by so much more was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.

23 And those priests truly were many, because they were not suffered to continue by reason of death;

24 but this Man, because He continueth forever, hath an unchangeable priesthood.

25 Therefore He is able also to save to the uttermost those who come unto God by Him, seeing He ever liveth to make intercession for them.

26 For such a High Priest who is befitting for us, holy, undisposed to harm, undefiled, separated from sinners, and made higher than the heavens,
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Bible Gateway passage: Hebrews 7 - 21st Century King James Version

For this Melchizedek, king of Salem, priest of the Most High God, met Abraham, who was returning from the slaughter of the kings, and blessed him. To him also Abraham gave a tenth part of all, Melchizedek first being by interpretation "king of righteousness," and after that also king of Salem...

www.biblegateway.com

For this Melchizedek, king of Salem, priest of the Most High God, met Abraham, who was returning from the slaughter of the kings, and blessed him.

2 To him also Abraham gave a tenth part of all, Melchizedek first being by interpretation “king of righteousness,” and after that also king of Salem, which means “king of peace.”

3 Without father, without mother and without descent, having neither beginning of days nor end of life, but made like unto the Son of God, he abideth a priest continually.

4 Now consider how great this man was, unto whom even the patriarch Abraham gave a tenth of the spoils.

5 And verily, those who are of the sons of Levi, who receive the office of the priesthood, have a commandment to take tithes from the people according to the law — that is, from their brethren — though they come out of the loins of Abraham.

6 But Melchizedek, whose descent is not counted from them, received tithes from Abraham and blessed him that had the promises.

7 And beyond all contradiction, the lesser is blessed by the greater.

8 And here men who die receive tithes; but there he receiveth them, of whom it is witnessed that he liveth.

9 And, as I may so say, Levi also, who receiveth tithes, paid tithes through Abraham,

10 for he was yet in the loins of his father when Melchizedek met Abraham.

11 If therefore perfection were through the Levitical priesthood (for under it the people received the law), what further need was there that another priest should rise according to the order of Melchizedek, and not be called according to the order of Aaron?

12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.

13 For He of whom these things are spoken pertaineth to another tribe, of which no man gave attendance at the altar.

14 For it is evident that our Lord sprang out of Judah, of which tribe Moses spoke nothing concerning priesthood.

15 And this is yet far more evident when there ariseth another priest according to the similitude of Melchizedek,

16 who is made not according to the law of a carnal commandment, but according to the power of an endless life.

17 For He testifieth: “Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchizedek.”

18 For there is verily an annulling of the former commandment because of the weakness and unprofitableness thereof.

19 For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did, by which we draw nigh unto God.

20 And inasmuch as it was not without an oath that He was made priest

21 (for those priests were made without an oath, but He with an oath by Him who said unto Him: “The Lord swore and will not repent, ‘Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchizedek.’”),

22 by so much more was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.

23 And those priests truly were many, because they were not suffered to continue by reason of death;

24 but this Man, because He continueth forever, hath an unchangeable priesthood.

25 Therefore He is able also to save to the uttermost those who come unto God by Him, seeing He ever liveth to make intercession for them.

26 For such a High Priest who is befitting for us, holy, undisposed to harm, undefiled, separated from sinners, and made higher than the heavens,

27 who needeth not, as those high priests, to offer up sacrifice daily first for His own sins and then for the people’s; for this He did once when He offered up Himself.

28 For the law maketh men high priests who have infirmity; but the word of the oath, which came since the law, maketh the Son, who is consecrated for evermore.

and just what DID THIS SAVOIR preach about concerning savlation and how ONE attains it .
A hint
sirs what must we do to be saved . BELIEVE with a capital B E L I E VE ON JESUS THE CHRIST .
Scott . By now you do realize
we cannot both love and serve THE TRUTH AND A LIE . for if one cometh and says HEY i BELEIVE THE GOSPEL
and yet beleives this ecumeincal intefaith LIE , i tell us all they only believed THE LIE that it was just not nessary
to have to BELIEVE ON JESUS THE CHRIST .
YE cannot serve two masters . WE cannot serve both GOD and SATAN
we cannot serve both CHRIST and that which is of anti christ
WE simply cannot beleive the TRUTH AND A LIE .
SO lets all say bueno bye and adios to that ecmeincal harlot of intefaith and her anti christ plan for peace .
For by its peace plan IT DO SELL A LIE to all religoins and to christendom .
WE gots us a choice to make today scott .
Now as for me , ITS THE TRUTH , ITS GOD , HIS Christ , HIS gospel i shall beleive and serve .

 

[amigo de christo]

Bible Gateway passage: Romans 10 - 21st Century King James Version

Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is that they might be saved. For I bear them record that they have a zeal for God, but not according to knowledge. For they, being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted...

www.biblegateway.com

Brethren, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for Israel is that they might be saved.

2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal for God, but not according to knowledge.

3 For they, being ignorant of God’s righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone that believeth.

5 For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law: that “the man who doeth those things shall live by them.”

6 But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh in this manner: “Say not in thine heart, ‘Who shall ascend into Heaven?’” (that is, to bring Christ down from above)

7 or, “‘Who shall descend into the deep?’” (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead).

8 But what saith it? “The Word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth and in thy heart,” that is, the word of faith which we preach:

9 that if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised Him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

11 For the Scripture saith, “Whosoever believeth in Him shall not be ashamed.”

12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek, for the same Lord over all is rich unto all who call upon Him.

13 For “whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.”

well as you can see if even the peoples of GOD , aka the jews could not attain it b y their own works
WHAT on GREEN EARTH makes anyone t hink THEY CAN and all false religoins can .
OH YES SCOTT , we are being lied to by this ecumencal harpie and her anti christ intefaith interrelgious dialoue
for world peace .
NOW seeing we both know the ONLY WAY one can attain PEACE WITH GOD IS BY JESUS CHRIST ,
Might i suggest , even warn direly for all to get THE HECK away from anyone or even anything or even any spirit
THAT has anything do with ecumeincalism intefaith and fast too .

 

[Linda]

This is a question I hate. Advocates say you should be 100% confidant but that doesn't seem humble to me.

How confidant are you? What does that say about your humility?

Heres your answer - straight out of the
Bible.. 2 nd corinthians 5:10

For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.

This reminds us that God is our only
Judge, and Only at the time of our death
Will we know.

The bible outlines what it takes to be
Saved, etc, as well as various Christian
Denominations proclaimed they already
Know, but for anyone to say they know
They would have had to judge themselves,
And thats not what the bible teaches we
Should do.

One of the main reasons we shouldnt
Ever assume to judge ourselves can
Come from our pride, when Jesus
Tells us to remain humble and
Live humbly.

Thats why Jesus said

“ the proud, i despise,
But i give grace to the humble”


• James 4:6

“God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.” (KJV

 

[Scott Downey]

Heres your answer - straight out of the
Bible.. 2 nd corinthians 5:10

For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.

This reminds us that God is our only
Judge, and Only at the time of our death
Will we know.

The bible outlines what it takes to be
Saved, etc, as well as various Christian
Denominations proclaimed they already
Know, but for anyone to say they know
They would have had to judge themselves,
And thats not what the bible teaches we
Should do.

One of the main reasons we shouldnt
Ever assume to judge ourselves can
Come from our pride, when Jesus
Tells us to remain humble and
Live humbly.

Thats why Jesus said

“ the proud, i despise,
But i give grace to the humble”


• James 4:6

“God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.” (KJV

Good things to think on for sure.

Believers in Christ receive both mercy and judgment to be saved, whereas the celestial beings who left their proper abode, do not.
" But when we are judged, we are chastened by the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world."
" for whom the Lord loveth He chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom He receiveth.”

God fuflils His word to all His people, and His command is eternal life.

John 12
49 For I have not spoken on My own authority; but the Father who sent Me gave Me a command, what I should say and what I should speak.

50 And I know that His command is everlasting life. Therefore, whatever I speak, just as the Father has told Me, so I speak.”

Acts 4:12
Nor is there salvation in any other, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved.”

God's command is eternal life to the sheep of Christ. So everything God does in your life is for your good, to save you and bring you to Himself. I am speaking only of the sheep of Christ whom God foreknows as His people, before your birth, God called you and knew you as His own, as in belonging to Him.

Bible Gateway passage: 2 Timothy 1 - New King James Version

Greeting - Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, according to the promise of life which is in Christ Jesus, To Timothy, a beloved son: Grace, mercy, and peace from God the Father and Christ Jesus our Lord. Timothy’s Faith and Heritage - I thank God, whom I serve with a pure...

www.biblegateway.com

8 Therefore do not be ashamed of the testimony of our Lord, nor of me His prisoner, but share with me in the sufferings for the gospel according to the power of God,

9 who has saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to His own purpose and grace which was given to us in Christ Jesus before time began,

10 but has now been revealed by the appearing of our Savior Jesus Christ, who has abolished death and brought life and immortality to light through the gospel,

11 to which I was appointed a preacher, an apostle, and a teacher [c]of the Gentiles. 12 For this reason I also suffer these things; nevertheless I am not ashamed, for I know whom I have believed and am persuaded that He is able to keep what I have committed to Him until that Day.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Bible Gateway passage: 1 Corinthians 11 - 21st Century King James Version

Be ye followers of me, even as I also am of Christ. Now I praise you, brethren, that ye remember me in all things and keep the ordinances as I have delivered them to you. But I would have you know that the head of every man is Christ, and the head of the woman is the man, and the head of Christ...

www.biblegateway.com

27 Therefore whosoever shall eat this bread and drink this cup of the Lord unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord.

28 But let a man examine himself, and then let him eat of that bread and drink of that cup.

29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord’s body.

30 For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.

31 For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged.

32 But when we are judged, we are chastened by the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world.

33 Therefore, my brethren, when ye come together to eat, tarry one for another.

34 And if any man hunger, let him eat at home, that ye come not together unto condemnation. And the rest will I set in order when I come.

Bible Gateway passage: Hebrews 12 - 21st Century King James Version

Therefore, seeing we also are compassed about by so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us, looking unto Jesus, the author and finisher of our faith, who for the joy that...

www.biblegateway.com

Therefore, seeing we also are compassed about by so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us,

2 looking unto Jesus, the author and finisher of our faith, who for the joy that was set before Him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

3 For consider Him that endured such contradiction from sinners against Himself, lest ye be wearied and faint in your minds.

4 In striving against sin, ye have not yet resisted unto bloodshed.

5 And ye have forgotten the exhortation which speaketh unto you as unto children: “My son, despise not thou the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when thou art rebuked by Him;

6 for whom the Lord loveth He chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom He receiveth.”

7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?

8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all arepartakers, then ye are bastards and not sons.

9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh who corrected us, and we gave them reverence. Shall we not far rather be in subjection unto the Father of Spirits, and live?

10 For verily they chastened us for a few days according to their own pleasure, but He for our profit, that we might be partakers of His holiness.

11 Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous; nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto those who are exercised thereby.

12 Therefore, lift up the hands which hang down and the feeble knees,

13 and make straight paths for your feet, lest that which is lame be turned out of the way, but let it rather be healed.

14 Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord,

15 looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness spring up to trouble you, and thereby many be defiled;

16 lest there be any fornicator or profane person as Esau, who for one morsel of meat sold his birthright.

17 For ye know how afterward, when he would have inherited the blessing, he was rejected; for he found no place of repentance, though he sought it diligently with tears.

 

[bdavidc]

What is Paul saying?
"I, myself, should be castaway".
That is not just "a disappointed servant" my friend.

Paul saying, “lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway” does not prove Matthew 25 is only about loss of reward.

The word “castaway” in 1 Corinthians 9:27 means rejected or disapproved. Paul is speaking with sober seriousness, not playing games with a light reward issue. But the context matters. He is using the language of running a race, striving for the mastery, keeping his body under subjection, and not being disqualified after preaching to others.

That still does not make Matthew 25:30 mean a saved man loses only a kingdom reward. Jesus did not say the unprofitable servant lost a crown. He said, “Cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.” That same language in Matthew is judgment language, not merely reward-loss language.

Also, Paul already gave us the reward-loss passage in 1 Corinthians 3. There the man’s work is burned, but “he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire” ~1 Corinthians 3:15. That is not what Matthew 25 says. In 1 Corinthians 3, the work is burned and the man is saved. In Matthew 25, the servant himself is cast out.

So yes, Paul’s warning is serious. I agree with that. But it does not overturn the distinction. Scripture clearly teaches rewards can be lost. It also clearly teaches false servants can be exposed and judged. Matthew 25 fits the second category, not the first.

A true believer may suffer loss of reward. A false servant is cast into outer darkness. Those are not the same thing.

 

[bdavidc]

You and I are almost on the same page.
We both see the difference between grace and works. We also see the difference between gift and reward.
However:
We interpret the parable differently.
Condemnation is never in view here.
Notice:
A. All three men are the lord's servants. The third man is just as much a servant as the first man.
B. Man # 1 and #2 both are rewarded with rulership. The Millenial Kingdom is in view here.
C. The third man is refused entrance into the Kingdom but does not lose his servanthood. He is called a wicked servant but he is still a servant. Once we are Christ's own, we never lose that status.
Just as Paul taught that we must all stand at the JSOC; Paul also feared that he might be "castaway" if he was unfaithful. 1 Cor 9:24-27, 1 Cor 3:8-15. 1 Cor 4:1-5

I agree that once a person is truly Christ’s own, he does not stop belonging to Christ. That is not the issue. The issue is whether Matthew 25 proves the third servant was truly Christ’s own in the saving sense. I do not believe the text says that.

Calling him a servant does not settle the question. In parables, a servant can represent someone under accountability, someone in a place of profession, or someone entrusted with responsibility. It does not automatically mean regenerate. Matthew 24:48 speaks of “that evil servant,” and his end is “with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth” ~Matthew 24:51. So the word servant by itself cannot be made to mean saved.

The ending is the problem for the reward-loss view. Jesus did not say the third servant lost rulership but remained safely inside. He said, “Cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth” ~Matthew 25:30. That same language in Matthew is judgment language. Matthew 22:13 says the man without the wedding garment is bound and cast “into outer darkness; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.” Matthew 8:12 uses the same kind of language for those cast out.

That is not the same as 1 Corinthians 3. Paul says the man’s work is burned, “but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire” ~1 Corinthians 3:15. In 1 Corinthians 3, the work is burned and the man is saved. In Matthew 25, the servant himself is cast out. Those are not the same outcome.

I also agree that 1 Corinthians 9:27 is serious. Paul says he keeps his body under subjection “lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.” But that verse cannot be used to erase the plain ending of Matthew 25. Paul is warning about being disapproved after preaching to others. Matthew 25 is talking about a wicked servant cast into outer darkness.

The statement “he is refused entrance into the kingdom but remains Christ’s own” is the part I cannot find in the text. Jesus does not say that. He calls him wicked and slothful, exposes his false view of his lord, takes what he had from him, and commands him to be cast into outer darkness.

A true believer can lose reward. I fully agree with that. But Matthew 25 is not describing a saved man losing a crown. It is describing a false servant being exposed by his own words, his own unbelief, and his own fruit.

 

[JimKnox]

I agree that once a person is truly Christ’s own, he does not stop belonging to Christ. That is not the issue. The issue is whether Matthew 25 proves the third servant was truly Christ’s own in the saving sense. I do not believe the text says that.

Calling him a servant does not settle the question. In parables, a servant can represent someone under accountability, someone in a place of profession, or someone entrusted with responsibility. It does not automatically mean regenerate. Matthew 24:48 speaks of “that evil servant,” and his end is “with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth” ~Matthew 24:51. So the word servant by itself cannot be made to mean saved.

The ending is the problem for the reward-loss view. Jesus did not say the third servant lost rulership but remained safely inside. He said, “Cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth” ~Matthew 25:30. That same language in Matthew is judgment language. Matthew 22:13 says the man without the wedding garment is bound and cast “into outer darkness; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.” Matthew 8:12 uses the same kind of language for those cast out.

That is not the same as 1 Corinthians 3. Paul says the man’s work is burned, “but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire” ~1 Corinthians 3:15. In 1 Corinthians 3, the work is burned and the man is saved. In Matthew 25, the servant himself is cast out. Those are not the same outcome.

I also agree that 1 Corinthians 9:27 is serious. Paul says he keeps his body under subjection “lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.” But that verse cannot be used to erase the plain ending of Matthew 25. Paul is warning about being disapproved after preaching to others. Matthew 25 is talking about a wicked servant cast into outer darkness.

The statement “he is refused entrance into the kingdom but remains Christ’s own” is the part I cannot find in the text. Jesus does not say that. He calls him wicked and slothful, exposes his false view of his lord, takes what he had from him, and commands him to be cast into outer darkness.

A true believer can lose reward. I fully agree with that. But Matthew 25 is not describing a saved man losing a crown. It is describing a false servant being exposed by his own words, his own unbelief, and his own fruit.

That is where we are not going to find common ground.
The plain reading of Matt 25 does not identify the 3rd servant as a false professor. In fact, his assessment of his Lord is accurate but because he was moved to inaction by fear rather than moving by faith, THAT is why he was chastened by his Lord. He failed to use faith. "Without faith it is impossible to please God".
You say his assessment of the Lord was false but Scripture does not bear this out.
"The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom". He began well; he is among the believers. He is a servant; a true servant. But he failed to exercise faith like the other two. "Why call ye me Lord, Lord, but do not the things I say?"
I do not think we will find common ground other than that which we have already agreed.
(Off to church. Have a great day).

 

[faithhopecharity]

Bible Gateway passage: Ephesians 2 - 21st Century King James Version

And you hath He quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins, wherein in times past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience. Among these also we all had our manner of living...

www.biblegateway.com

And you hath He quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins,

2 wherein in times past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience.

3 Among these also we all had our manner of living in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.

4 But God, who is rich in mercy, because of His great love wherewith He loved us,

5 even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ (by grace ye are saved),

6 and hath raised us up together and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus,

7 that in the ages to come He might show the exceeding riches of His grace in His kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith, and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God—

9 not by works, lest any man should boast.

10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath beforehand ordained, that we should walk in them.

which is it "not of works" or "works"?

thks

 

[bdavidc]

That is where we are not going to find common ground.
The plain reading of Matt 25 does not identify the 3rd servant as a false professor. In fact, his assessment of his Lord is accurate but because he was moved to inaction by fear rather than moving by faith, THAT is why he was chastened by his Lord. He failed to use faith. "Without faith it is impossible to please God".
You say his assessment of the Lord was false but Scripture does not bear this out.
"The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom". He began well; he is among the believers. He is a servant; a true servant. But he failed to exercise faith like the other two. "Why call ye me Lord, Lord, but do not the things I say?"
I do not think we will find common ground other than that which we have already agreed.
(Off to church. Have a great day).

I agree we may not find common ground on this, but I still do not think the text supports your conclusion. The third servant’s view of his lord is not presented as wisdom. Jesus calls him “wicked and slothful” in Matthew 25:26. That is not the language of a faithful servant who simply lost reward. His fear did not lead to obedience. It led to disobedience, accusation, and hiding what had been entrusted to him.

“The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom” is true, but that kind of fear produces reverence and obedience. This man’s fear produced unbelief and rebellion. Jesus said in John 14:15, “If ye love me, keep my commandments.” This servant did not act in love, faith, or obedience.

The ending still settles the issue for me. Jesus did not say he was chastened and kept inside. He said, “Cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth” ~Matthew 25:30. That is not the same outcome as 1 Corinthians 3:15, where the man’s work is burned, “but he himself shall be saved.”

A true believer can lose reward. I agree with that. But Matthew 25 does not say this man was saved and merely lost reward. The Lord calls him wicked, exposes his unbelief, takes what he had, and casts him into outer darkness.

 

[marks]

But Matthew 25 does not say this man was saved and merely lost reward.

This parable was not given to the Gentile church, it was given to Israel in the Mosaic Covenant dispensation. Trying to match it up with regeneration will lead to erroneous conclusions.

Much love!

 

[JimKnox]

I agree we may not find common ground on this, but I still do not think the text supports your conclusion. The third servant’s view of his lord is not presented as wisdom. Jesus calls him “wicked and slothful” in Matthew 25:26. That is not the language of a faithful servant who simply lost reward. His fear did not lead to obedience. It led to disobedience, accusation, and hiding what had been entrusted to him.

“The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom” is true, but that kind of fear produces reverence and obedience. This man’s fear produced unbelief and rebellion. Jesus said in John 14:15, “If ye love me, keep my commandments.” This servant did not act in love, faith, or obedience.

The ending still settles the issue for me. Jesus did not say he was chastened and kept inside. He said, “Cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth” ~Matthew 25:30. That is not the same outcome as 1 Corinthians 3:15, where the man’s work is burned, “but he himself shall be saved.”

A true believer can lose reward. I agree with that. But Matthew 25 does not say this man was saved and merely lost reward. The Lord calls him wicked, exposes his unbelief, takes what he had, and casts him into outer darkness.

You still haven't addressed 1 Cor. 9 where Paul says he fears being "a castaway".
This mirrors the 3rd servant of Matt 25.
Matt 25 shows us what Paul actually feared: being "cast out".
That 3rd servant is a true but disobedient servant. He is not an unbeliever.
Have a good day brother.

 

[JimKnox]

This parable was not given to the Gentile church, it was given to Israel in the Mosaic Covenant dispensation. Trying to match it up with regeneration will lead to erroneous conclusions.

Much love!

Thanks for the love Mark, but I reject the "pen knife theology" of many dispensationalists.
Especially where they wrongly divide Israel from the Gentiles.
We are not separated from Israel nor are we replacing Israel: we are JOINED INTO Israel. Therefore, we share in the promises by faith in Christ who is THEIR Messiah and OURS.
Romans 9-11.
Good day.