How Do You Follow Jesus? By Commitment or By Faith?

[JesusIsFaithful]

Comparing the two versions, it reads the same to me. If you want to interpret it to mean different, then have fun. But as you stated,," many believers see this verse as justifying making a commitment to Christ and into following Him or to do good while they suffer; hence it is more about the committed believers in doing good while they suffer rather than being about how well committed He is in keeping our souls while we suffer"...... Is that not what you are doing? Interpreting? You are telling us what you believe the KJV to mean. No different. The only difference is you insist you are correct. You use verses to JUSTIFY your point even though it does not say "The Lord spoke saying the KJV is the true word of God, no exceptions." But like I have been saying this whole time. It is an interpretation. The KJV can be just as misunderstood as any other version.

Comparing the the two versions in seeing the difference is hardly interpreting.

Are you saying it is okay to drop the subject of "the keeping of our souls" of what our faithful Creator is doing a good job of in the NIV because you claim it reads the same as the KJV does?

OR....

Are you saying that 1 Peter 4:19 in both KJV and NIV are supporting the making & keeping of a commitment to Christ & to follow Christ?

If so, then you are reading the false teaching into the KJV and not reading it for what Peter is saying; just like all those modern Bibles are causing tongues speakers to read the NIV reference of Romans 8:26-27 into the KJV in not seeing the difference when there is.

 

[StanJ]

No one has a problem with the KJV until they read something that they do not like and so they go to another Bible that changes the message that better supports their false teaching and false practises.


How can that be true when that is the case below?

1 Peter 4:19 Wherefore let them that suffer according to the will of God commit the keeping of their souls to him in well doing, as unto a faithful Creator. KJV

This verse is totally about Jesus Christ of Whom we can entrust in doing a good job as in "the well doing" in the keeping of our souls while any saint suffers.

The message has been changed in some modern Bibles.

1 Peter 4:19 So then, those who suffer according to God’s will should commit themselves to their faithful Creator and continue to do good. NIV

The subject of Him keeping our souls while we suffer has been dropped. The way it is written, many believers see this verse as justifying making a commitment to Christ and into following Him or to do good while they suffer; hence it is more about the committed believers in doing good while they suffer rather than being about how well committed He is in keeping our souls while we suffer.

Not all modern Bibles will share in that same changed message of the NIV, but you should all know where the idea for the commitment to Christ and the commitment to follow Christ comes from; errant modern Bibles that decline from the testimony of the Son.

So how can that be circular reasoning when comparing the KJV with the NIV, the truth of the actual message has to be the one or the other?

Refusing to accept what qualified scholars say the Greek says, and blindly sticking to ONLY the KJV is blind bias and nothing more. We have no idea what qualifications the 50 so-called scholars of the KJV had in that day, but we do know the PhD's the current group of scholars have, and not one qualified Greek scholar of our day claims the KJV is the ONLY version to use. It's errors are well documented so when faced with a version that is proven to have errors in it's interpretation, then any real student of the Word, will seek help with understanding the Greek, which is the ONLY inspired text we have, NOT the KJV.

Comparing the the two versions in seeing the difference is hardly interpreting.

Are you saying it is okay to drop the subject of "the keeping of our souls" of what our faithful Creator is doing a good job of in the NIV because you claim it reads the same as the KJV does?

OR....

Are you saying that 1 Peter 4:19 in both KJV and NIV are supporting the making & keeping of a commitment to Christ & to follow Christ?

If so, then you are reading the false teaching into the KJV and not reading it for what Peter is saying; just like all those modern Bibles are causing tongues speakers to read the NIV reference of Romans 8:26-27 into the KJV in not seeing the difference when there is.

If you refuse to look at ALL the evidence, then you are only fooling yourself, which I find is the issue with most people who are KJVO. The issue is not the NIV vs the KJV, it is the KJV vs ALL or most modern English translations. Blindly committing to only ONE 400 year old English translation is the height of being brain washed. There are many other non English translations that refute the KJV in some areas, but I'm sure you think God's mother tongue was English and will not accept this fact either.

 

[JesusIsFaithful]

Refusing to accept what qualified scholars say the Greek says, and blindly sticking to ONLY the KJV is blind bias and nothing more.

Wrong answer from someone claiming to be more Spirit-filled and Spirit led than others. Not saying you are not Spirit-filled, but what you have said does not jive with scripture, brother, and therefore is not of the truth. I know the Holy Spirit in you did not lead you to post that.

1 John 2:19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us. 20 But ye have an unction from the Holy One, and ye know all things. 21 I have not written unto you because ye know not the truth, but because ye know it, and that no lie is of the truth....26 These things have I written unto you concerning them that seduce you. 27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him. 28 And now, little children, abide in him; that, when he shall appear, we may have confidence, and not be ashamed before him at his coming.


No matter what the exchanges are given here, we each have to confirm the word by way of Jesus Christ, relying on Him as our Good Shepherd to guide us through the Holy Spirit in us. He did not say listen to scholarly educated men & you will never go astray. He said "Follow Me" meaning we are to trust Him to help us to follow Him in abiding in Him & His words.

So pointing to scholarly men with educated degrees is not how we are to confirm which Bible is keeping His words because they loved Him & His words and which Bible is not because they do not love Him nor His words to keep them.

John 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him. 24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.

Jesus wasn't saying that to fill the pages. That was a prophetic warning from the Father for us to know that we will need His help by His words to know which Bible was keeping His words and which are not.

Only He can confirm to you as He did for me that the KJV is the one that is keeping His words because they loved Him & His words.

 

[StanJ]

Wrong answer from someone claiming to be more Spirit-filled and Spirit led than others. Not saying you are not Spirit-filled, but what you have said does not jive with scripture, brother, and therefore is not of the truth. I know the Holy Spirit in you did not lead you to post that.

1 John 2:19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us. 20 But ye have an unction from the Holy One, and ye know all things. 21 I have not written unto you because ye know not the truth, but because ye know it, and that no lie is of the truth....26 These things have I written unto you concerning them that seduce you. 27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him. 28 And now, little children, abide in him; that, when he shall appear, we may have confidence, and not be ashamed before him at his coming.


No matter what the exchanges are given here, we each have to confirm the word by way of Jesus Christ, relying on Him as our Good Shepherd to guide us through the Holy Spirit in us. He did not say listen to scholarly educated men & you will never go astray. He said "Follow Me" meaning we are to trust Him to help us to follow Him in abiding in Him & His words.

So pointing to scholarly men with educated degrees is not how we are to confirm which Bible is keeping His words because they loved Him & His words and which Bible is not because they do not love Him nor His words to keep them.

John 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him. 24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.

Jesus wasn't saying that to fill the pages. That was a prophetic warning from the Father for us to know that we will need His help by His words to know which Bible was keeping His words and which are not.

Only He can confirm to you as He did for me that the KJV is the one that is keeping His words because they loved Him & His words.

Spoken like a true KJVO proponent, but FYI, Jesus sent us the Holy Spirit to ascertain His truth. John 14:26. He left so the Holy Spirit could teach us, and as you don't have the Holy Spirit, you can't be taught nor understand that an English translation is NOT the inspired word of God.

 

[JesusIsFaithful]

Spoken like a true KJVO proponent, but FYI, Jesus sent us the Holy Spirit to ascertain His truth. John 14:26. He left so the Holy Spirit could teach us, and as you don't have the Holy Spirit, you can't be taught nor understand that an English translation is NOT the inspired word of God.

Just so you know, I am not saying you are not Spirit-filled, but I am saying you are not led by the Holy Spirit to say that I do not have the Holy Spirit, and neither do I believe that what you had posted earlier was Spirit led either.

See your earlier argument again.

Refusing to accept what qualified scholars say the Greek says, and blindly sticking to ONLY the KJV is blind bias and nothing more..... It's errors are well documented so when faced with a version that is proven to have errors in it's interpretation, then any real student of the Word, will seek help with understanding the Greek, which is the ONLY inspired text we have, NOT the KJV.

Sounds like again you are not endorising the Holy Spirit for understanding His words in discerning the truth on which Bible is keeping His words of those that loved the Bridegroom, but rather leaning on men's intellect in understanding Greek. It is either the one or the other. And as for this quote above for endorsing learning Greek....

Where is that instruction in the Bible? Since converts were of every nation under heaven even from the beginning of Acts 2 at Pentecost, and as the disciples and the apostle Paul were writing these words of the N.T. for those that seek to be His disciples in abding in His words, where is the instruction to foreign converts that if there be any contradictions to their writings in their native language, to learn Greek & Hebrew to know the original understanding of these messages? Nowhere in sight.

Do prayerfully consider that.

 

[UppsalaDragby]

No one has a problem with the KJV until they read something that they do not like and so they go to another Bible that changes the message that better supports their false teaching and false practises.


How can that be true when that is the case below?

1 Peter 4:19 Wherefore let them that suffer according to the will of God commit the keeping of their souls to him in well doing, as unto a faithful Creator. KJV

This verse is totally about Jesus Christ of Whom we can entrust in doing a good job as in "the well doing" in the keeping of our souls while any saint suffers.

The message has been changed in some modern Bibles.

1 Peter 4:19 So then, those who suffer according to God’s will should commit themselves to their faithful Creator and continue to do good. NIV

The subject of Him keeping our souls while we suffer has been dropped. The way it is written, many believers see this verse as justifying making a commitment to Christ and into following Him or to do good while they suffer; hence it is more about the committed believers in doing good while they suffer rather than being about how well committed He is in keeping our souls while we suffer.

Not all modern Bibles will share in that same changed message of the NIV, but you should all know where the idea for the commitment to Christ and the commitment to follow Christ comes from; errant modern Bibles that decline from the testimony of the Son.

So how can that be circular reasoning when comparing the KJV with the NIV, the truth of the actual message has to be the one or the other?

Exactly! And what you are basically saying here is that anything changed from the KJV is incorrect. Why? Because the KJV is correct. You might as well just say that "everyone who does not agree with me is wrong because I am right". Don't be so arrogant!

If you can prove your point then do so, but anything short of that is nothing more than opinion. And opinions don't prove anything.

 

[JesusIsFaithful]

Exactly! And what you are basically saying here is that anything changed from the KJV is incorrect. Why? Because the KJV is correct. You might as well just say that "everyone who does not agree with me is wrong because I am right". Don't be so arrogant!

If you can prove your point then do so, but anything short of that is nothing more than opinion. And opinions don't prove anything.

Hmmm....

Let's try this;

The lost books in the Bible were left out because they were going against the accepted books in the Bible; as in going against scripture.

So

To know if a modern Bible translated the message right, it cannot go against the other truths in that modern Bible? Correct?

But how does one look for it?

If the message changed inb the modern Bible as found in the KJV Bible, then look at that modern Bible in what it is saying so that what has been read as different from the KJV does not go against the other truths in that modern Bible which those other truths would also be found the same in the KJV as unchanged.

Now for the case of 1 Peter 4:19; did not Jesus preached against religious bondages like oaths, promises, & commitments as being of evil in Matthew 5:33-37 by explaining in verse 36 that believers cannot do any work of God in them or for Him by keeping an oath?

But of course, if you use the CEV version... you may have trouble seeing that truth; indeed; by going to Galatians 5:1-5, you would think it is okay to make a promise in the CEV, but most modern Bibles with the KJV would not agree with that.

As it is. the NIV of 1 Peter 4:19 goes against the truth in the NIV of Matthew 5:33-37 & Galatians 5:1-5.

But you would not find it unless comparing that with the KJV that 1 Peter 4:19 in the NIV is wrong.

How's that for non-circular reasoning?

 

[Born_Again]

Galatians 5:1-5New International Version (NIV)

Freedom in Christ
5 It is for freedom that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery.
2 Mark my words! I, Paul, tell you that if you let yourselves be circumcised, Christ will be of no value to you at all. 3 Again I declare to every man who lets himself be circumcised that he is obligated to obey the whole law. 4 You who are trying to be justified by the law have been alienated from Christ; you have fallen away from grace. 5 For through the Spirit we eagerly await by faith the righteousness for which we hope.


Galatians 5:1-5 Contemporary English Version (CEV)

Christ Gives Freedom
5 Christ has set us free! This means we are really free. Now hold on to your freedom and don’t ever become slaves of the Law again.
2 I, Paul, promise you that Christ won’t do you any good if you get circumcised. 3 If you do, you must obey the whole Law. 4 And if you try to please God by obeying the Law, you have cut yourself off from Christ and his wonderful kindness. 5 But the Spirit makes us sure that God will accept us because of our faith in Christ.


Galatians 5:1-5 King James Version (KJV)

5 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.
2 Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing.
3 For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law.
4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.
5 For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.


"Mark my words"
"Behold,"
"I promise"

It all means the same thing..... And, if it is from Christ, is it not truth? Could you not promise it? If you couldn't promise it, then you essentially are saying it may or may not be true (you know how wishy washy Christ can get). Do you own a Thesaurus?

Sorry, but you lost this one. Once again, I read all three versions to mean the same thing. It's all in knowledge of words and their meanings. You can stop at any time, brother.
1 Peter 4:19 King James Version (KJV)
19 Wherefore let them that suffer according to the will of God commit the keeping of their souls to him in well doing, as unto a faithful Creator.


1 Peter 4:19 New International Version (NIV)
19 So then, those who suffer according to God’s will should commit themselves to their faithful Creator and continue to do good.


1 Peter 4:19 Contemporary English Version (CEV)
19 If you suffer for obeying God, you must have complete faith in your faithful Creator and keep on doing right.

You really should start your responses with "Well, I think" or "In my opinion". Here is why:

You base your responses off of what you think others will think. I don't even think I could call it false doctrine as much as ignorance of human behavior. Those three version all mean the same thing. The wording is different based on when they were written and what vocabulary was most popular at the time. I would suggest going on-line and researching different vernaculars. I'm almost inclined to ask if English is your first language.

Okay, so you don't believe everyone who says they can speak in tongues can. That is legitimate as there is always room to doubt false prophets. But when you are comparing scripture you are misguided. I do not, in any way, shape, or form, feel God is telling you to spread the KJV as the only truth based on actual realistic fact of why different versions of the Bible are created.

 

[StanJ]

It's the same state of mind of those who have been deceived BA....as they deny that the Holy Spirit does the things He does, they are given this religious deception.

 

[UppsalaDragby]

If the message changed inb the modern Bible as found in the KJV Bible, then look at that modern Bible in what it is saying so that what has been read as different from the KJV does not go against the other truths in that modern Bible which those other truths would also be found the same in the KJV as unchanged.

Now for the case of 1 Peter 4:19; did not Jesus preached against religious bondages like oaths, promises, & commitments as being of evil in Matthew 5:33-37 by explaining in verse 36 that believers cannot do any work of God in them or for Him by keeping an oath?

But of course, if you use the CEV version... you may have trouble seeing that truth; indeed; by going to Galatians 5:1-5, you would think it is okay to make a promise in the CEV, but most modern Bibles with the KJV would not agree with that.

As it is. the NIV of 1 Peter 4:19 goes against the truth in the NIV of Matthew 5:33-37 & Galatians 5:1-5.

But you would not find it unless comparing that with the KJV that 1 Peter 4:19 in the NIV is wrong.

How's that for non-circular reasoning?

I have no idea what you are talking about here... so you will have to break it down for me.

Jesus warned us about swearing oaths. And your point is that ALL commitments, promises and oaths are therefore evil? Is that what you are trying to say? I don't get it... and I still don't understand why the KJV doesn't contradict what Jesus said, whereas the newer versions, according to you, does.

 

[heretoeternity]

How do you follow Jesus?..by arguing over which version of the Bible is better..hmmmm says a lot about the mentality of some "christians" but

Remember always Salvation is through the Son of God, His grace and commandments and NOT the sungod/satan and his days of sunday,dec 25th and easter, all of which are non Biblical and of pagan origin.

 

[UppsalaDragby]

How do you follow Jesus?..by arguing over which version of the Bible is better..

I don't think anyone here made that claim. This is a forum created for the purpose of discussing faith issues among Christians, and that is what we are doing.

And what does this thread have to do with "sunday"?

If you are going to try to turn this thread into a discussion about the sabbath, then I would suggest you first meet the challenge I gave to you in the threads that deal with that subject. Why haven't you?

 

[Born_Again]

How do you follow Jesus?..by arguing over which version of the Bible is better..hmmmm says a lot about the mentality of some "christians" but

Remember always Salvation is through the Son of God, His grace and commandments and NOT the sungod/satan and his days of sunday,dec 25th and easter, all of which are non Biblical and of pagan origin.

In the interest of making sure other readers of the topic are not mislead, the interpretation has to be addressed when someone may be mis-interpreting scripture. This of course can change the message. I do agree the discussion of the "correct version of the bible" has gotten to be a bit lengthy but it has become the basis of the understanding of the question based on the original posters doctrine.

 

[KingJ]

How do you follow Jesus?

Do you resort to your own power in following Jesus by keeping that commitment or promise to do so?

Or...

Do you follow Jesus by faith in Him as our Good Shepherd and all His promises to us that He will help us to follow Him in laying aside every weight & sin in running that race in living as His disciple for without Him & without faith, we can do nothing?

Or do you think you are following Him by doing both?

I have learned from Him to rely on Him all the time for following Him and so He has set me free from my commitments, promises, and all other yokes of bondages wherein men can boast and rested in His Covenant to me wherein I have more to give glory and thanksgiving for in Jesus Christ's name. FYI

Well Christianity cannot be faked. We either hate what is evil or we don't. We either turn the left cheek or we don't. We either love our enemy, or we don't.

I am always very curious as to what ''''faith''' exactly people refer to. So what faith can we walk by? Faith that God exists? Faith that God has provided all and I must just accept it?

We walk by faith that Jesus defeated sin and we can now have confidence.... that if we hate what is evil Rom 12:9 and want to be His disciple Matt 16:24...we will be saved.

Jesus could not be more crystal clear to us. Matt 16:24 = 1. Deny ourselves, 2. Carry our cross and 3. Follow Him.

1 = We pro-actively submit our will to His. No surfing on Sunday morning! No expensive car if you have not paid your tithe. No holiday to Hawaii if God wants us to help out at an orphanage.
2 = We serve God where we are. We accept our cross and ''dont try find our lives''. If God wants us to work for Him at a mental institution we dig in and forget about preaching to big congregations.
3 = Where we are, we are Christ. We activelty show love, mercy and kindness to all.

So I guess its both with leaning toward commitment. Faith is a confidence. Not something we can really judge ourselves on 1 Cor 11:31. UNLESS we are referring to the first steps of Christianity when we learn to have faith 'in' God. Like what Abraham had. Faith that God is good.

 

[jam]

For me personally, my commitment and promise never work or it don't last. Eventually it brings load of guilt and serve me like a curse.
I walk by faith and depend on His grace. I am think over the verse where it tell us not to swear under heaven and earth.