But can you answer the questions?
Got some scripture that supports your answer of "yes"?
Did anyone live to 1,000 years old?
How Do You Observe Your Sabbath
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Did anyone live to 1,000 years old?
But can you answer the questions?
"Was the law enforce?" Yes! As a result of Cains sin he was punished by God;
Gen.4
"[11] And now art thou cursed from the earth, which hath opened her mouth to receive thy brother's blood from thy hand;
[12] When thou tillest the ground, it shall not henceforth yield unto thee her strength; a fugitive and a vagabond shalt thou be in the earth.
The penalty for sin is death, the second death. As the scriptures tell us, God is merciful and does not always require death as a punishment for sin. But there are times when He does kill to be used as an example.
"Was Cain put to death for killing Able?" According to the scriptures, No!
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Any scripture??? I don't like to form a belief on someone's assumption.
So what are the wages of murder according to the Law.
Rom.6
[23] For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
But one must understand WHAT death is being spoken of.
Heb.9
[27] And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:
The death spoken of above is for ALL men reguardless of sin.
But the death spoken of that is the result of sin is the second death. The one that is eternal!
Rev.21
[8] But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
As I said earlier....we will have to wait until judgement to see if God punished Cain according to the law.
Who know's, that may have been Cain's only sin.
Our God IS merciful!!!!
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Let me help you out. Exd 21:12¶He that smiteth a man, so that he die, shall be surely put to death. Was Cain put to death for killing his brother?
When was Exodus written? Does a law go into effect before it is written or after? What laws had been given to Adam and Eve?
I understand what you are saying. No....Cain was NOT put to death at that moment for killing his brother. But that does not mean God was not enforcing His laws.
Again you must understand WHAT death is being spoken of for the wages of sin.
Killing this mortal body is NOT the death God is talking about for committing sin.
If that were the case, God would have put Adam to death for his sins. And the same would go for EVERYBODY!
"For there is not a just man upon earth, that doeth good, and sinneth not."
"For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;"
But as God's word says....
"...The LORD God, merciful and gracious, longsuffering, and abundant in goodness and truth,..."
I thank God He did not put to death this mortal body of mine for not keeping His laws and commandments.
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So you are trying to say just because Cain was not put to death for murdering Able he was not under the law?
Let me ask you....Did Moses sin? Did ALL of those that came after Moses sin? Let's read God's word....
"For there is not a just man upon earth, that doeth good, and sinneth not."
"For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;"
"And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world."
Did God put ALL that sinned to death the moment they sinned? Was not Moses under the law? Were not ALL the phophets under the law? All of them sinned but God did not put them to death for it. As a matter of fact God said they died, "...with a good report..."
God's word says ALL have sinned. And what is sin? Let's read......
1 John 3
[4] Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.
So who has trangressed God's laws?
THE WHOLE WORLD!
How can you break the law and yet not be under the curse of the law. Does not make sense!
And what is the curse of the law? Death....the SECOND DEATH!!! Now let's read who it was that removed the curse of the law for ALL.....
Gal.3
[13] Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:
Now was the "us" just for the nation of Israel? Of course not! It was for EVERYBODY!!! WHY?
Let's read it again......
"For there is not a just man upon earth, that doeth good, and sinneth not."
"For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;"
"And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world."
And how was that curse removed?
Heb.9
[22] And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.
Let me ask you....
Was Adam under the law?
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Dear brothers and sisters, [fn] the longing of my heart and my prayer to God is that the Jewish people might be saved. I know what enthusiasm they have for God, but it is misdirected zeal. For they don't understand God's way of making people right with himself. Instead, they are clinging to their own way of getting right with God by trying to keep the law. They won't go along with God's way. For Christ has accomplished the whole purpose [fn]of the law. All who believe in him are made right with God.
For Moses wrote that the law's way of making a person right with God requires obedience to all of its commands. But the way of getting right with God through faith says, "You don't need to go to heaven" (to find Christ and bring him down to help you). And it says, "You don't need to go to the place of the dead" (to bring Christ back to life again). Salvation that comes from trusting Christ--which is the message we preach--is already within easy reach. In fact, the Scriptures say, "The message is close at hand; it is on your lips and in your heart." For if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For it is by believing in your heart that you are made right with God, and it is by confessing with your mouth that you are saved. Romans 10:1-10
Let's continue will ALL of God's word.....
[12] For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
Now let's read what is needed to call upon the Lord.....
[13] For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
You just cannot call upon the name of God....something else is needed. Let's read....
[14] How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?
So in order to call one must believe. And how do you believe? By receiving the word. And who gives the word? A preacher! Just ANY preacher? Let's find out....
[15] And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!
So it must be a preacher that has been sent. So let's review:
1. There is NO difference between Jew and Greek; ALL must call upon the name of the Lord.
2. ALL that call shall be saved.
3. You cannot call upon the Lord unless you believe in Him.
4. You can only believe in HIm AFTER you have heard the word of God.
5. You can only hear the word from a preacher.
6. But not just ANY preacher, it MUST be one that was sent by God.
Now let's confirm this with scripture;
[17] So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
Now here is the question.......
What word of God was being preached?
After all.....there was no New Testament!
So what was the word that was preached to both Jews AND Greeks?
Where did they get their instructions? How did Paul know NOT to covet? Did he tell the Greeks it was wrong also?
And also, the other question.....
Was Adam under the law?
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The word that was preached was the scripture: 1 Peter 1: 19-21 [sup]19[/sup]We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts: [sup]20[/sup]Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
[sup]21[/sup]For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.
So there is more sure word of prophecy... The scriptures or the OT was preached in Paul's time. Holy men of God spake as they were moved or instructed by the Holy Ghost.
[sup]21[/sup]For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.
So there is more sure word of prophecy... The scriptures or the OT was preached in Paul's time. Holy men of God spake as they were moved or instructed by the Holy Ghost.
I have read through this thread and there are a lot of talk about the mosaic law and the confusion concerning Paul's letters. The problem is that people don't seem to understand who was the Law giver. If people would understand that Jesus.. The tree of life was the one that gave the Law even before man was upon this earth... Ok, I could see some faces look puzzled by this statement ...so let me explain.
First lets start with the definition of sin..... 1 John 3: [sup]4[/sup]Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.
So since sin is the transgression or breaking of God's law. Lets see who broke God's law first than man.... Ezekiel 28: 12-18
[sup]12[/sup]Son of man, take up a lamentation upon the king of Tyrus, and say unto him, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty.
[sup]13[/sup]Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created.
[sup]14[/sup]Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
[sup]15[/sup]Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.
[sup]16[/sup]By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire.
[sup]17[/sup]Thine heart was lifted up because of thy beauty, thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness: I will cast thee to the ground, I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee.
[sup]18[/sup]Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.
We know here, he is not talking about any man.. Hence the words anointed cherub... The fact that this being was in the garden of Eden.... God said this being sinned he had iniquity found in him. What iniquity? Lets find out... Isaiah 14: 12-15
[sup]12[/sup]How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
[sup]13[/sup]For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
[sup]14[/sup]I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.
[sup]15[/sup]Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.
Satan broke the first commandment. Exodus 20:3
[sup]3[/sup]Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
The word said he was a murder from the beginning....John 8
44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
The Law of God has always existed!!!! Jesus himself said in Matthew 5:[sup]18[/sup]For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
vs 19 is a warning to those teaching otherwise.. [sup]19[/sup]Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Well heaven and earth is still here so the Law of God still stands.
Look what James said; James 2:8-12
[sup]8[/sup]If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well: [sup]9[/sup]But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.
[sup]10[/sup]For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
[sup]11[/sup]For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.
[sup]12[/sup]So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.
For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill; And also said remember the sabbath day!!!
John said in 1 John 2:3-4
[sup]3[/sup]And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. [sup]4[/sup]He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
That's pretty cut and dry!!! Look at Revelations, this is the last book in the bible and the last chapter of this books reads.
Rev 22:[sup]14[/sup]Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
So my thing is this, if the law of God existed before man was created, hence Satan breaking the law, or sinning. Jesus establishing the Sabbath during creation. And Jesus giving the law to Adam, who broke the commandment of having no other God before me. Which brought sin upon man kind. Jesus gave the thou shall not murder, which Cain broke. Jesus gave the dietary or clean and unclean law to Noah read Gen 7:2, This was all done verbally. Then he wrote the laws down, and gave them to Moses. Which also includes the sabbath day. I can't understand how these laws can be called the mosaic laws. These are all the laws of God.
The only law that was crucified to the cross, was the sacrificial law.
First lets start with the definition of sin..... 1 John 3: [sup]4[/sup]Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.
So since sin is the transgression or breaking of God's law. Lets see who broke God's law first than man.... Ezekiel 28: 12-18
[sup]12[/sup]Son of man, take up a lamentation upon the king of Tyrus, and say unto him, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty.
[sup]13[/sup]Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created.
[sup]14[/sup]Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
[sup]15[/sup]Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.
[sup]16[/sup]By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire.
[sup]17[/sup]Thine heart was lifted up because of thy beauty, thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness: I will cast thee to the ground, I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee.
[sup]18[/sup]Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.
We know here, he is not talking about any man.. Hence the words anointed cherub... The fact that this being was in the garden of Eden.... God said this being sinned he had iniquity found in him. What iniquity? Lets find out... Isaiah 14: 12-15
[sup]12[/sup]How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
[sup]13[/sup]For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
[sup]14[/sup]I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.
[sup]15[/sup]Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.
Satan broke the first commandment. Exodus 20:3
[sup]3[/sup]Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
The word said he was a murder from the beginning....John 8
44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
The Law of God has always existed!!!! Jesus himself said in Matthew 5:[sup]18[/sup]For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
vs 19 is a warning to those teaching otherwise.. [sup]19[/sup]Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Well heaven and earth is still here so the Law of God still stands.
Look what James said; James 2:8-12
[sup]8[/sup]If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well: [sup]9[/sup]But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.
[sup]10[/sup]For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
[sup]11[/sup]For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.
[sup]12[/sup]So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.
For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill; And also said remember the sabbath day!!!
John said in 1 John 2:3-4
[sup]3[/sup]And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. [sup]4[/sup]He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
That's pretty cut and dry!!! Look at Revelations, this is the last book in the bible and the last chapter of this books reads.
Rev 22:[sup]14[/sup]Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
So my thing is this, if the law of God existed before man was created, hence Satan breaking the law, or sinning. Jesus establishing the Sabbath during creation. And Jesus giving the law to Adam, who broke the commandment of having no other God before me. Which brought sin upon man kind. Jesus gave the thou shall not murder, which Cain broke. Jesus gave the dietary or clean and unclean law to Noah read Gen 7:2, This was all done verbally. Then he wrote the laws down, and gave them to Moses. Which also includes the sabbath day. I can't understand how these laws can be called the mosaic laws. These are all the laws of God.
The only law that was crucified to the cross, was the sacrificial law.
I see I am not the only one on this forum God has blessed with wisdom and understanding.
"For I am the LORD, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed." OT
"Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever." NT
I know most just do not get this, but the (2) verses above speaks about the SAME person!
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Amen!!!! John 8: [sup]56[/sup]Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad. [sup]57[/sup]Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham?
[sup]58[/sup]Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.
Exodus 3: 14 [sup]14[/sup]And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.
This is the same God, both old and new testament. We have never dealt with the Father. Only with the Word, He is the only one man has dealt with!!!
I stand corrected. Thanks...
He is the one who has enabled us to represent his new covenant. This is a covenant, not of written laws, but of the Spirit. The old way ends in death; in the new way, the Holy Spirit gives life. That old system of law etched in stone led to death, yet it began with such glory that the people of Israel could not bear to look at Moses' face. For his face shone with the glory of God, even though the brightness was already fading away.
Shouldn't we expect far greater glory when the Holy Spirit is giving life? If the old covenant, which brings condemnation, was glorious, how much more glorious is the new covenant, which makes us right with God! In fact, that first glory was not glorious at all compared with the overwhelming glory of the new covenant. So if the old covenant, which has been set aside, was full of glory, then the new covenant, which remains forever, has far greater glory.
Since this new covenant gives us such confidence, we can be very bold. We are not like Moses, who put a veil over his face so the people of Israel would not see the glory fading away. But the people's minds were hardened, and even to this day whenever the old covenant is being read, a veil covers their minds so they cannot understand the truth. And this veil can be removed only by believing in Christ. Yes, even today when they read Moses' writings, their hearts are covered with that veil, and they do not understand. But whenever anyone turns to the Lord, then the veil is taken away.
Now, the Lord is the Spirit, and wherever the Spirit of the Lord is, he gives freedom. And all of us have had that veil removed so that we can be mirrors that brightly reflect [fn] the glory of the Lord. And as the Spirit of the Lord works within us, we become more and more like him and reflect his glory even more.
What law was carved into stone and where did it lead?
Shouldn't we expect far greater glory when the Holy Spirit is giving life? If the old covenant, which brings condemnation, was glorious, how much more glorious is the new covenant, which makes us right with God! In fact, that first glory was not glorious at all compared with the overwhelming glory of the new covenant. So if the old covenant, which has been set aside, was full of glory, then the new covenant, which remains forever, has far greater glory.
Since this new covenant gives us such confidence, we can be very bold. We are not like Moses, who put a veil over his face so the people of Israel would not see the glory fading away. But the people's minds were hardened, and even to this day whenever the old covenant is being read, a veil covers their minds so they cannot understand the truth. And this veil can be removed only by believing in Christ. Yes, even today when they read Moses' writings, their hearts are covered with that veil, and they do not understand. But whenever anyone turns to the Lord, then the veil is taken away.
Now, the Lord is the Spirit, and wherever the Spirit of the Lord is, he gives freedom. And all of us have had that veil removed so that we can be mirrors that brightly reflect [fn] the glory of the Lord. And as the Spirit of the Lord works within us, we become more and more like him and reflect his glory even more.
What law was carved into stone and where did it lead?
First things first......we have strayed way away from the lesson of, "How to you observe your Sabbath"
I do have a few lessons on God's law's and also a few on the laws that Paul taught, which I will post in the future.
But for now, if we could, let's try to stay focused on God's sabbath and how HE said it is to be observed.
If you do not believe God has given us rules on how His sabbath is to be observed, then sobeit. That goes against the word of God, but that is your choice!
This lesson is to let those that may not know, that God indeed has rules that are to be obeyed concerning His sabbath. And they are the following;
1. We ARE to rest on the Sabbath. Lev.23:3 "...but the seventh day is the sabbath of rest..."
2. We are NOT to cook on the Sabbath. Ex.16:23,26 "...bake that which ye will bake to day, and seethe that ye will seethe; and that which remaineth over lay up for you to be kept until the morning. Six days ye shall gather it; but on the seventh day, which is the sabbath, in it there shall be none.
3. We are NOT to do any manner of work (If it can be avoided,) on the Sabbath. Lev.23:3 "Six days shall work be done...ye shall do no work therein: it is the sabbath of the LORD in all your dwellings.
4. We ARE to have an Holy Convocation on the Sabbath. Lev.23:3 "...but the seventh day is the sabbath of rest, an holy convocation..."
5. We are NOT to buy or sell on Gods Sabbath, if it can be avoided. Neh.13:15-22 "In those days saw I in Judah some treading wine presses on the sabbath, and bringing in sheaves, and lading asses; as also wine, grapes, and figs, and all manner of burdens, which they brought into Jerusalem on the sabbath day: and I testified against them in the day wherein they sold victuals." "And it came to pass, that when the gates of Jerusalem began to be dark before the sabbath, I commanded that the gates should be shut, and charged that they should not be opened till after the sabbath: and some of my servants set I at the gates, that there should no burden be brought in on the sabbath day."
6. We are NOT to engage in our own pleasures on God‘s Sabbath. Isa.58:13,14 "If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:" "Then shalt thou delight thyself in the Lord; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the Lord hath spoken it."
So there you have it. Six simple Rules God gave us so that we would know how HE wants us to serve Him on HIS sabbath day.
Again....if you do not agree, sobeit. This lesson is not for you. This lesson is for those that, as God word says;
"And the rest of the people, the priests, the Levites, the porters, the singers, the Nethinims, and all they that had separated themselves from the people of the lands unto the law of God, their wives, their sons, and their daughters, every one having knowledge, and having understanding;
They clave to their brethren, their nobles, and entered into a curse, and into an oath, to walk in God's law, which was given by Moses the servant of God, and to observe and do all the commandments of the LORD our Lord, and his judgments and his statutes;"
This lesson is for those that have chosen to separate themselves from those that choose not to keep God's laws, and for those that have knowledge and understanding. To encourage them to continue in God's laws.
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