I will raise them on the last day.

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Spiritual Israelite

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@Spiritual Israelite @Scott Downey

Is God still Saving souls? = YES
Please don't waste your time asking questions with obvious answers. Thanks.

Where does God Place the souls who He brings to Christ = HE Places them/us in CHRIST
Col 3:4 - For you died, and
your life is hidden with Christ in God.
When Christ
who is our life Appears, then you/us also will appear with Him in glory.

in Christ
all shall be made alive. But each one in his own order: Christ the firstfruits, afterward those who are Christ’s at His coming


CHRIST is the Beginning/Firstfruits of the First Resurrection and HE is the COMPLETION/End = at HIS COMING

CHRIST is the Alpha and Omega = the Beginning and the End
You are twisting the text to fit your doctrine. Paul did not say "CHRIST is the Beginning/Firstfruits of the First Resurrection and HE is the COMPLETION/End = at HIS COMING". Instead, he pointed out how Christ's resurrection itself was the first in order. That's what saying "Christ the firstfruits" in 1 Cor 15:23 means, which you can see by reading 1 Cor 15:20 where Paul calls Christ Himself the firstfruits...of them that slept. Paul then indicates that next in order to be resurrected are those who belong to Christ. You are ignoring that Paul talked about an ORDER of resurrections. That implies more than one resurrection and not just a first resurrection only.
 
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rwb

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Satan is the Chief Fallen Angel = the Arch Angel that was given great power and authority = until he SINNED

‘You were the seal of perfection,
full of wisdom and perfect in beauty.
13You were in Eden,
the garden of God.
Every kind of precious stone adorned you:a
ruby, topaz, and diamond,
beryl, onyx, and jasper,
sapphire,b turquoise, and emerald.
Your mountings and settings were crafted in gold,
prepared on the day of your creation.
14You were anointed as a guardian cherub,
for I had ordained you.
You were on the holy mountain of God;
you walked among the fiery stones.
15From the day you were created
you were blameless in your ways—
until wickedness was found in you.

These attributes were not given to Adam
a.) Adam was only in the Garden =Adam never was on the Mount of GOD
b.) Adam never received in his being/body "every kind of precious stone" "diamond, topaz, gold etc
c.) Adam was created a man in flesh/blood from the dust - whereas lucifer/satan is spirit
d.) Only Lucifer/Satan was created as a Guardian Cherub - never was Adam designated as such
e.) Only Lucifer/Satan walked among the firey stones - Adam would of perished because he is flesh
f.) GOD creation begins without sin = Adam and Lucifer/Satan was created without sin

Since Adam and Lucifer/Satan were created without sin = who sinned FIRST??? = Lucifer, and his name was changed to Satan

This lamentation is being directed to prince/king Tyrus not to Satan. Pride had lifted his heart, and no doubt Tyrus is showing he is controlled by his father the Devil, but the lamentation is directed to Tyrus, a man, not a spirit. The same is true of Isaiah 14 where the prophet is instructed to take up this proverb against the king of Babylon. Neither is this proverb directed to Satan, but is to a man, the king of Babylon.

Ezekiel 28:2 (KJV) Son of man, say unto the prince of Tyrus, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Because thine heart is lifted up, and thou hast said, I am a God, I sit in the seat of God, in the midst of the seas; yet thou art a man, and not God, though thou set thine heart as the heart of God:

Ezekiel 28:9 (KJV)
Wilt thou yet say before him that slayeth thee, I am God? but thou shalt be a man, and no God, in the hand of him that slayeth thee.

Ellicott's Bible Commentary for English Readers
Ezekiel 28


(2) I am a God.—The arraignment of the prince occupies Eze 28:2-5, his consequent doom Eze 28:6-10. The point of the charge is inordinate pride, begotten of great prosperity; this prosperity, being attributed to his own powers instead of to its true source, led him to imagine himself almost more than mortal. Similar instances of what may be called "the insanity of prosperity" may be seen in the case of Sennacherib (2Ki 18:33-35); of the then living monarch of Babylon, Nebuchadnezzar, to whom this prophecy might well serve as a warning (Da 3:15; 4:30; comp. also Da 7:25; 11:36-37); of Pharaoh (Eze 29:3); of Herod (Ac 12:21-23); of the one foretold in 2Th 2:4; to which list might be added the names of some more modern conquerors, and, in their degree, of many who have been eminently successful in other walks of life, and have consequently sacrificed to their own net (Hab 1:16). It is not to be supposed that the king of Tyre, like some Oriental monarchs and later Roman emperors, actually claimed for himself religious homage; but he had that proud sense of elevation and self-sufficiency which is only translated into words in the expressions of the text.

The seat of God.—This expression is chosen not merely with reference to the great natural beauty and apparently impregnable position of Tyre, but also to the fact that it was called "the holy island," and looked up to by all its colonies as the central sanctuary of their worship. The Temple of Melkarth was said by the priests to have been founded as far back as 2750 B.C., and Arrian speaks of it as the oldest sanctuary in the annals of mankind. (See also Note on Eze 28:6.)

Ezekiel 28:12 (KJV) Son of man, take up a lamentation upon the king of Tyrus, and say unto him, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty.

(13) Every precious stone.—There is some uncertainty in regard to the names of some of these stones (as sardius may be carnelian, and beryl chrysolite), but the general fact is an allusion to the profuse use of precious stones as ornaments of their royal apparel by Oriental monarchs. The stones mentioned are the same with those in the breastplate of the high priest (Ex 39:10), the third row being omitted; this is supplied in the Greek.

Thy pipes.—The word occurs only here, and its most probable sense is females, those who played upon the tambourines. All these things did not need to be collected by the king of Tyre, but were ready prepared to his hand at the moment of his accession to the throne, just as everything was made ready for Adam in Eden.


(14) Thou art the anointed cherub.—The tense is not expressed in the Hebrew, and it is better to supply the same simple past as is used throughout the passage: thou wert. The imagery is taken from the Temple upon Mount Zion: not that the king of Tyre had at this time any special connection with this, but that these terms were natural to the prophet in this ironical description of him. "The cherub that covereth" the mercy-seat is spoken of as anointed, with reference to Ex 30:26; 40:9.

Upon the holy mountain of God.—The prophet still has his mind upon Mount Zion (comp. Isa 11:9; 56:7), but yet the words are ironically spoken of Tyre as a venerated sanctuary, rising up from the sea.

Stones of fire.—An obvious explanation of this expression, given by many writers, is that it refers to the brilliant sparkling jewels on the robes in which the king walked. But if this were the case, the expression would be a strange one, and the connection implies a deeper and a religious meaning. It is better, therefore, to understand the imagery as similar to that in Re 2:1, and to suppose the prophet to have had in mind such a passage as Ex 24:10, where a paved work of sapphire stone appears as beneath the feet of God, while His glory is "like a devouring fire." This would then be one of the ways in which the king of Tyre is ironically represented as assuming to himself God-like attributes.

(15) Till iniquity was found in thee.—This and the following verse renew still more clearly the comparison with Adam. The king was altogether prosperous until his sin became manifest; then, when his heart was corrupted by his prosperity (Eze 28:16), he was cast out for ever, like Adam from his paradise.

(16) Filled the midst of thee.—The language passes very naturally here from the king himself to the state over which be presided, and with which he was identified, immediately recurring, however, to the king personally. He, as polluted, should be cast out of his imagined mountain of God: he, the cherub covering the mercy-seat, forsooth, shall be destroyed: his fancied God-like walking amid the stones of fire shall for ever cease.

If the lamentation/proverb is directed to a fallen angel called Satan, how do you reconcile the contradiction? There is no indication in Scripture that Satan was ever an angel of God.
 
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rwb

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You surely aint trying to say that about the event recorded in mathew twenty and seven .
Oh i truly pray you were not talking about these .
What bodies . the saints that slept , like david and others
WHO AROSE after JESUS RESSURECTION , them old bodies were already corrupted and bones .
THEY were not raised in them old b odies again my friend . I SURE hope it was not these you were speaking about .

I agree Amigo! Those resurrected after the resurrection of Jesus were not bodily resurrected yet, that shall not be until the last trumpet sounds, and the dead in Christ shall be physically resurrected immortal & incorruptible not in these mortal bodies of death we are clothed in now. No, after the resurrection of Christ those who had died in faith waiting for the promised Messiah were raised a spiritual body, now living souls with Christ in the heavenly realm.

Sown natural body, raised a spiritual body because there is both a natural body and a spiritual body. 1Cor 15
 

Spiritual Israelite

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You surely aint trying to say that about the event recorded in mathew twenty and seven .
Oh i truly pray you were not talking about these .
What bodies . the saints that slept , like david and others
WHO AROSE after JESUS RESSURECTION , them old bodies were already corrupted and bones .
THEY were not raised in them old b odies again my friend . I SURE hope it was not these you were speaking about .
You said "they were not raised in them old bodies again", so are you saying you think the ones referenced in Matthew 27:52-53 were resurrected with glorified, immortal bodies? If so, how can that be in light of what Paul said here...

1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. 23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

Paul taught that Christ Himself was the first to be resurrected unto bodily immortality and then next in order to be bodily resurreted unto odily immortality are "they that are Christ's at his coming". He did not mention anyone else being resurrected unto bodily immortality at any other time.
 

Douggg

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Regarding your particular belief, though, even if the first resurrection referred to a mass bodily resurrection, that would contradict your particular belief. You believe there will be a mass bodily resurrection that occurs 7 years (or however long) before the time when you think the first resurrection will take place. So, in your view, the mass bodily resurrection that will take place when Christ returns is not the first mass bodily resurrection that will take place, but instead would be the second.
No contradiction. The first resurrection relative to the millennium does not include a rapture.

rapture timing chart b.jpg
 

Aunty Jane

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IMO, numerous Christians misinterpret the wheat and tares parable because they assume the tares represent all the lost in general. Which would include, satanists, unbelieving Jews, atheists, witches, so on and so on. What they are missing is this. Whatever the wheat represents in the parable, the tares in the early stages of it's growth are masquerading as wheat. It is crystal clear to me who the wheat represent in the parable. It even says who they represent in the parable---the good seed are the children of the kingdom.

Obviously, the children of the kingdom equals saved saints. And that it is absurd, take atheists, for example, that they are masquerading as the children of the kingdom at any time. No they are not. Who would be masquerading as children of the kingdom would be others in the body of Christ, who Jesus says to in the end(Matthew 7), I never knew you, depart from me ye workers of iniquity. Matthew 24 and Matthew 25 indentify these as the unprofitable servants of Christ. And that Matthew 25 indentifies the unprofitable servants of Christ as the goats.

Who knows then? Maybe you and I are on the same page here? All I know is, when it comes to other posters on this board, be they Premil or be they Amil, they and I are not even remotely on the same page here. Not even close.

Imagine interpreting the following in Matthew 25 to be involving unbelieving Jews and atheists, for example, to be representing the goats.

Matthew 25:44 Then shall they, unbelieving Jews and atheists, also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?

And that makes sense of the text exactly how? Then imagine someone such as Cain being among the goats---Then shall Cain also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw I thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?

Then imagine interpreting the following in Matthew 7 in the same manner.

Matthew 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, including unbelieving Jews, atheists, and even Cain, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?+

Except no one would interpret that in that manner. Why do they then interpret it in that manner in Matthew 25 per the sheep and goats judgment? It is because they are ignoring or maybe misunderstanding context in Matthew 24 and 25 leading up to the sheep and goats judgment. Clearly, those verses are involving profitable servants of Christ and unprofitable servants of Christ. Therefore, the sheep = profitable servants of Christ. The goats = unprofitable servants of Christ.

Unbelieving Jews, for example, are not unprofitable servants of Christ. They are not professed servants of Christ, period. Nor are atheists, nor was Cain. So on and so on.
Well said....the “weeds” were planted by “the devil” in “the world”....as a counterfeit, to trap those ignorant or uneducated.....and at that time the people were kept in that condition by “the church”.....the people never flourished in that spiritually poisoned environment. And as we know, weeds will grow opportunistically in places where wheat could not. They will thrive in rubbish soil and will choke out any plants of value, as any gardener knows.

The other thing that was brought to my attention was the fact that sheep and goats were both farmed by Jews as clean animals, but they have very different characteristics.
As one who has had experience with both animals through farm life and as one still living in a rural area, we have goats, and they are a very different breed, even though they utter similar sounds to sheep. They are stubborn and greedy and they have no concept of being in your way and will only yield place with a shove.

Unlike sheep, they are destructive in their environment.....they have stripped the bark off many of the trees which may lead the tree struggling to live.
Both animals were acceptable as food and sacrifice, but they not alike in any way. Personalities of people will likewise separate them.
 

Spiritual Israelite

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I agree Amigo! Those resurrected after the resurrection of Jesus were not bodily resurrected yet,
Not unto bodily immortality, but the text is very clear that they were bodily resurrected.

Matthew 27:52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose, 53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

This very explicitly says that the BODIES of those saints were resurrected. So, I'm not sure how you can claim that they were not bodily resurrected. I believe they died again later just like Lazarus and others who had been bodily resurrected before that. Paul makes it clear that in terms of being resurrected unto bodily immortality, only Jesus has been so far and then the dead who belong to Him will be bodily resurrected at His second coming (1 Corinthians 15:22-23).

that shall not be until the last trumpet sounds, and the dead in Christ shall be physically resurrected immortal & incorruptible not in these mortal bodies of death we are clothed in now. No, after the resurrection of Christ those who had died in faith waiting for the promised Messiah were raised a spiritual body, now living souls with Christ in the heavenly realm.

Sown natural body, raised a spiritual body because there is both a natural body and a spiritual body. 1Cor 15
We've discussed this before, but I'll just say again that when Jesus comes again, the dead in Christ, whose natural bodies are dead, will be bodily resurrected and will be changed to have spiritual bodies that are incorruptible, immortal, glorious and powerful like Jesus's resurrected body. Paul contrasts the natural bodies we have now that are corruptible and mortal with the spiritual bodies we will have when Jesus comes again at the last trumpet which will be incorruptible and immortal.
 

Spiritual Israelite

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Then know and understand something very simple my friend .
HOW can those RESSURECTED IN CHRIST , ever die again .
THEY dont .
THE RESSURECTED IN CHRIST do not die .
Now since adam and eve ate , DEATH came upon all mankind
BUT SIN CE JESUS and HIS RESSURECTION , LIFE has come upon ALL who do beleive and they shall never die .
THEM saints who ressurected , RESSURECTED IN CHRIST . they did not die again .
This might seem hard to understand .
But do know this , NEVER SIP from the ecumenical cup of Fornication , cause that whore cannot deliver from death
and in fact is death leading only to the second death . SO lets n ot sip of that cup my friend .
Now to the trenches my friend , we got more and more within even christendom that are now buying
into the LIE that her cup has led them too .
How does this address what I said in my post? I don't see that it does at all. Are you saying that those who are referenced in Matthew 27:52-53 had immortal bodies? If so, how does that line up with 1 Corinthians 15:22-23? Why did Paul not mention them there if they were resurrected with immortal bodies? Do you think Lazarus and others who were said to be resurrected before that were resurrected with immortal bodies? If so, why were they not mentioned in 1 Corinthians 15:22-23? Scripture says that Jesus was the first to rise from the dead (Acts 26:23). What do you think that means?
 

Spiritual Israelite

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No contradiction. The first resurrection relative to the millennium does not include a rapture.
So, you have decided that the first resurrection refers to the first mass bodily resurrection that does not include a rapture. I can only shake my head. You definitely can't find any scripture which speaks of a first resurrection in that sense anywhere. But, you can find scripture which speaks of a first resurrection in the way I understand the first resurrection.

Acts 26:23 That Christ should suffer, and that he should be the first that should rise from the dead, and should shew light unto the people, and to the Gentiles.

1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. 23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
 

rwb

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YES = CHRIST is the FIRST Resurrection = Beginning and End

CHRIST is the Beginning of the FIRST Resurrection and HE is the END = 1 Cor 15:20-22
For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ all shall be made alive.

CHRIST Completes the Resurrection of His Body/the Saints when HE Comes with them = 1 Thess 4:13-18

Romans 6:8
we have been united together in the likeness of His death, we also shall be in the likeness of His resurrection

Example: the Gospel = God is still Saving men & women and Placing them
in CHRIST

For you died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God.
When Christ who is our life appears, then you/we also will appear with Him in glory. - Colossians 3:3

A person is either
in CHRIST or outside of CHRIST = only TWO resurrections = the FIRST is unto Eternal Life

David, I think the confusion comes from viewing being born again with resurrection from the dead. If we stick with the language of the Bible, we find that being born again through the Spirit of Christ is not a resurrection from physical death, it is to be quickened or made spiritually alive in Christ because we were spiritually dead in trespasses and sins, not physically dead that we must be resurrected to physical life again.

It is in this manner we have part in the first resurrection through the resurrection of Christ. From the moment we have been born again, through our spirit we possess eternal life, and this life can never die. Finally when the last trumpet sounds we, as spiritual body of Christ shall return with Christ to be reunited with our changed body of flesh immortal and incorruptible. So yes two resurrections, the physical resurrection of Christ we have part in spiritually and the physical resurrection of ALL who are in the graves resurrected to physical immortal life or resurrected to condemnation.
 
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Douggg

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So, you have decided that the first resurrection refers to the first mass bodily resurrection that does not include a rapture. I can only shake my head. You definitely can't find any scripture which speaks of a first resurrection in that sense anywhere. But, you can find scripture which speaks of a first resurrection in the way I understand the first resurrection.
Revelation 20:5 refers to "the" first resurrection. Not "a" first resurrection.

The resurrection/rapture event is found in 1Thessalonians4:15-18.
 

rwb

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i DO AGREE with this which you said: "I am saying Christ's resurrection alone in and of HIMSELF is the first resurrection."

My posts always declare the Truth = CHRIST is the First Resurrection

CHRIST is the Beginning and the End of the First Resurrection

For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ all shall be made alive = who are the "all in Christ"???

This is absolutely truth! However, when we partake of Christ's resurrection it is not called our resurrection. It is the bodily resurrection of Christ that we have part in when we are born again, not resurrected! The way we have part in the resurrection of Christ is through His Spirit in us quickening or making us spiritually alive even when we were spiritually dead in trespasses and sins. From the moment we have been born again in spirit we have entered the spiritual Kingdom of God forever through the first resurrection that is the resurrection life of Christ alone.
 
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David in NJ

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David, I think the confusion comes from viewing being born again with resurrection from the dead. If we stick with the language of the Bible, we find that being born again through the Spirit of Christ is not a resurrection from physical death, it is to be quickened or made spiritually alive in Christ because we were spiritually dead in trespasses and sins, not physically dead that we must be resurrected to physical life again.

It is in this manner we have part in the first resurrection through the resurrection of Christ. From the moment we have been born again, through our spirit we possess eternal life, and this life can never die. Finally when the last trumpet sounds we, as spiritual body of Christ shall return with Christ to be reunited with our changed body of flesh immortal and incorruptible. So yes two resurrections, the physical resurrection of Christ we have part in spiritually and the physical resurrection of ALL who are in the graves resurrected to physical immortal life or resurrected to condemnation.
HalelluYAH - you GOT IT = 100%


i was going to say "you nailed it" but the Lord did that first for us when HE went to the Cross and nailed our sins to His Body.
 
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rwb

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Revelation 20:5 refers to "the" first resurrection. Not "a" first resurrection.

The resurrection/rapture event is found in 1Thessalonians4:15-18.

No, the first resurrection speaks of the bodily resurrection of Christ alone, who is the first resurrection of the physically dead to never die again.

The resurrection of 1Th 4:15-18 speaks of the physically dead returning with Christ as spiritual body and resurrecting the dead in Christ first, followed by those who are still alive being caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air in our changed physical body of immortal & incorruptible flesh.

1 Thessalonians 4:14-17 (KJV) For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

1 Corinthians 15:52-54 (KJV) In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.
 

David in NJ

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Please don't waste your time asking questions with obvious answers. Thanks.


You are twisting the text to fit your doctrine. Paul did not say "CHRIST is the Beginning/Firstfruits of the First Resurrection and HE is the COMPLETION/End = at HIS COMING". Instead, he pointed out how Christ's resurrection itself was the first in order. That's what saying "Christ the firstfruits" in 1 Cor 15:23 means, which you can see by reading 1 Cor 15:20 where Paul calls Christ Himself the firstfruits...of them that slept. Paul then indicates that next in order to be resurrected are those who belong to Christ. You are ignoring that Paul talked about an ORDER of resurrections. That implies more than one resurrection and not just a first resurrection only.
There does not exist in Scripture "the resurrection itself"

the resurrection has NO POWER in/of "itself" to raise anyone from the dead

You are in the same mindset as Martha
John 11:21-24
Martha said to Jesus, “Lord, if You had been here, my brother would not have died. 22But even now I know that God will give You whatever You ask of Him.”

23“Your brother will rise again,” Jesus told her.

24Martha replied, “I know that he will rise again in the resurrection at the last day.”

JESUS reveals to Martha who HE is = John 11:25

JESUS said to Martha; "I am the Resurrection"
 
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Scott Downey

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@Spiritual Israelite @Scott Downey

Is God still Saving souls? = YES

Where does God Place the souls who He brings to Christ = HE Places them/us in CHRIST
Col 3:4 - For you died, and
your life is hidden with Christ in God.
When Christ
who is our life Appears, then you/us also will appear with Him in glory.

in Christ
all shall be made alive. But each one in his own order: Christ the firstfruits, afterward those who are Christ’s at His coming


CHRIST is the Beginning/Firstfruits of the First Resurrection and HE is the COMPLETION/End = at HIS COMING

CHRIST is the Alpha and Omega = the Beginning and the End
Col 3:4 - For you died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God.
When Christ who is our life Appears, then you/us also will appear with Him in glory.

The spirits-souls of Christians go to be with the Lord Jesus and reign with Him in Heaven when they physically die.
(absent from the body, present with the Lord Jesus)

Since they are hidden with Christ in God they have their part in the first resurrection which is Christ's in heaven (seated with Him, raised with Him in heavenly places in Christ Jesus, as Ephesians 2 says, but they are not yet resurrected themselves into glorified bodies are they. Because He lives, we live also with Him where He is, and He is reigning right now in Heaven with all authority given to Him by the Father.

When Christ appears again, coming on the clouds of Heaven, then they will be resurrected with a glorified body like He has.
But until then they are hidden with Christ and have a place with Him in heaven in His first resurrection.

Rev 20 is actually ongoing now in heaven with Christ

5 But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.
 
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David in NJ

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You corrected nothing. You misquoted me.


That is a different context than what I was talking about. How about staying on topic? Do you think you can do that? I was talking about the order of resurrections like what Paul referenced in 1 Corinthians 15:22-23. You do see that he references an order to resurrections, right?

1 Corinthians 15:20 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept. 21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. 22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. 23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

What is the ORDER of resurrections that Paul gave here? He first mentions Christ's resurrection when he said that Christ was risen from the dead and became the firstfruits of them that slept. So, that is the first resurrection in order that Paul referenced. Christ's resurrection itself. That's what he's talking about when he says "Christ the firstfruits" in 1 Cor 15:23. What is the next resurrection in order that Paul referenced? The resurrection of "they that are Christ's at his coming". He indicated that after Christ's resurrection, that is the next resurrection in order. So, what you are claiming is the end of the first resurrection is actually a second resurrection in order, according to Paul. Christ's resurrection itself and only His resurrection, is the first resurrection in order. THAT is my point. Can you see my point, regardless of whether you agree with it or not? I think I'm making my point clear. What I am NOT saying is that Christ is not Himself the resurrection. In a sense, He is the resurrection and the life, because He said so. But, that has nothing to do with the point I'm making.


And I never said there was. You are wasting your time making a strawman argument.


He referred to an order of resurrections in 1 Corinthians 15:22-23 when he referred to the resurrection of "every man in his own order". What is your understanding of that?


Where did he say that?
"i would like to place an order"

When you go out to eat, a waitress/waiter will come to serve you = you must first place the Order with the Servant
After you place your order = you must wait = 1 Thess 1:10

Isaiah 52:13 - See, My Servant will act wisely; he will be raised and lifted up and highly exalted.
Matt 20:28 - just as the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.”
 

Spiritual Israelite

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There does not exist in Scripture "the resurrection itself"
LOL. I'm simply referring to the resurrection of Christ itself in terms of the act of Him being bodily resurrected from the dead. You can refer to a resurrection itself in terms of the act of being bodily resurrected from the dead. You are playing word games here because that's all you have to offer. You are playing games instead of actually addressing my points, which is typical of you.

the resurrection has NO POWER in/of "itself" to raise anyone from the dead
I didn't say that it does. You are arguing with a strawman instead of addressing my points.

You are in the same mindset as Martha
John 11:21-24
Martha said to Jesus, “Lord, if You had been here, my brother would not have died. 22But even now I know that God will give You whatever You ask of Him.”

23“Your brother will rise again,” Jesus told her.

24Martha replied, “I know that he will rise again in the resurrection at the last day.”

JESUS reveals to Martha who HE is = John 11:25

JESUS said to Martha; "I am the Resurrection"
What does this have to do with the order of resurrections that Paul gave in 1 Corinthians 15:22-23? Yes, Jesus is the resurrection, but the resurrection of the dead in Christ will not be His resurrection, it will be their resurrection, so what is your point here exactly?
 

TribulationSigns

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This is absolutely truth! However, when we partake of Christ's resurrection it is not called our resurrection. It is the bodily resurrection of Christ that we have part in when we are born again, not resurrected! The way we have part in the resurrection of Christ is through His Spirit in us quickening or making us spiritually alive even when we were spiritually dead in trespasses and sins. From the moment we have been born again in spirit we have entered the spiritual Kingdom of God forever through the first resurrection that is the resurrection life of Christ alone.

Amen! This is correct. When we were born again, we experienced the first resurrection in Christ—our spirit was made alive! Spiritually, we are now living forever, even though we remain in this fleshly body. This is why we are reigning with Christ right now on Earth, as kings and priests of His Kingdom, preaching the Gospel.

Philippians 1:22-23
  • "But if I live in the flesh, this is the fruit of my labour: yet what I shall choose I wot not.
  • For I am in a strait betwixt two, having a desire to depart, and to be with Christ; which is far better:"
The Word of God declares that “to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord.” Where is the Lord? Is He in the grave? In “soul sleep” like those who did not partake in the first resurrection (being born again)? In limbo? No! The Lord is in the Kingdom of Heaven, and that is where our soul immediately goes when we depart from our earthly body—to continue reigning with Him.

Many fail to realize that when Christ speaks of someone who has “died,” He is speaking from a heavenly perspective. From the human view, the person has died—but in God’s view, that person lives on! Christ is not saying, “He’s dead now, but will live later.” No—if you die, you are already alive and had been since you were born again!

Let me repeat this truth: on Earth, your fleshly body will die, but your spirit—already alive in Christ—simply transferred instantly to Heaven, continuing to reign with Him. Your spirit simply moves from the body into the presence of the Lord.

This is not the “resurrection,” because that already occurred—the first resurrection—when we were made alive in Christ while still living in the flesh. Selah!

2nd Corinthians 5:6-8
  • "Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord:
  • (For we walk by faith, not by sight:)
  • We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord."
Also note that when Christ returns, any Christians who are still “alive and remain” on the earth will experience a miraculous transformation. In an instant—“in the twinkling of an eye”—their sin-cursed, fleshly bodies will be changed or removed instantly - - in that moment, their “made alive” spirit will be fully revealed in glory before the messengers from heaven coming down to gather them up to meet the Lord in the air, as the world watches, Matthew 24:31. For flesh and blood cannot enter heaven with the Lord.

1Co 15:52
(52) In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
 
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