I will raise them on the last day.

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Davidpt

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This is not something to get into a big debate about since, as you said, it doesn't mention much about them.

While that is true, then assuming Matthew 27:52-53 actually happened at the time, that doesn't mean we are unable to deduce what likely became of them eventually. After all, there is such a thing as using common sense.

For example.

Is it reasonable that they came out of their tombs and appeared to many in the state they were in while in their tombs? No.

Is it reasonable, that if they put on a flesh body, that they then eventually returned to the state they were in before their tombs opened? No.

Is it reasonable that they all just crawled back into their tombs eventually? No.

Is it reasonable that any of them are still walking among us now? No.

What then became of them eventually?

Apparently, they eventually ascended into heaven. But not in a disembodied state, a bodily state. That would have to be the logical conclusion. Or if none of the above, maybe one of the following?

1) Matthew 27:52-53 never actually happened at the time. It was something someone added to the account that was never present in the original manuscripts.

2) Matthew 27:52-53 never actually happened at the time. And that it is prophecy depicting what the resurrection event is going to look like in the future.

Speaking for myself, I do not see 1) nor 2) likely being the case. Therefore, in regards to what likely happened to them eventually, the logical conclusion still appears to be to me--Apparently, they eventually ascended into heaven. But not in a disembodied state, a bodily state.
 

Spiritual Israelite

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"i would like to place an order"

When you go out to eat, a waitress/waiter will come to serve you = you must first place the Order with the Servant
After you place your order = you must wait = 1 Thess 1:10

Isaiah 52:13 - See, My Servant will act wisely; he will be raised and lifted up and highly exalted.
Matt 20:28 - just as the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.”
LOL!

1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. 23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

You are comparing the order of resurrecitions that Paul gives here where he indicates that Christ's was first and "afterward they that are Christ's at his coming" to placing an order at a restaurant? LOL! You have apparently decided that you don't want to be taken seriously.
 

Scott Downey

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Rev 20:5 "But the rest of the dead did not live again"

The rest of the dead are not living with Christ in Heaven, they will also be resurrected, they are the unbelieving and wicked.
They will be resurrected and face condemnation. They actually have no life (eternal life) and are in hell.

All who are in the graves "the dead" will hear His voice and come forth, bodily resurrected, some to glory, some to condemnation.

Acts 24:14-16
New King James Version
14 But this I confess to you, that according to the Way which they call a sect, so I worship the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the Law and in the Prophets. 15 I have hope in God, which they themselves also accept, that there will be a resurrection [a]of the dead, both of the just and the unjust. 16 This being so, I myself always strive to have a conscience without offense toward God and men.

John 5

28 Do not marvel at this; for the hour is coming in which all who are in the graves will hear His voice 29 and come forth—those who have done good, to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil, to the resurrection of condemnation. 30 I can of Myself do nothing. As I hear, I judge; and My judgment is righteous, because I do not seek My own will but the will of the Father who sent Me.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
After the resurrection of all the dead, comes the judgment, that is a consistent message from God.
 
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Hiddenthings

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Ezekiel’s description of the King of Tyre is directed at the one this wicked King was emulating...
He was told......

“Son of man, sing a dirge concerning the king of Tyre, and tell him, ‘This is what the Sovereign Lord Jehovah says:
“You were the model of perfection,
Full of wisdom and perfect in beauty.
13  You were in Eʹden, the garden of God.
You were adorned with every precious stone. . . .
And their settings and mountings were made of gold.
They were prepared on the day you were created.
14  I assigned you as the anointed covering cherub.
You were on the holy mountain of God, and you walked about among fiery stones.
15  You were faultless in your ways from the day you were created
Until unrighteousness was found in you.

16 Because of your abundant trade,
You became filled with violence, and you began to sin.
So I will cast you out as profane from the mountain of God and destroy you,
O covering cherub, away from the stones of fire.
17 Your heart became haughty because of your beauty.
You corrupted your wisdom because of your own glorious splendor.

I will throw you down to the earth.

I will make you a spectacle before kings.“

The King of Tyre was not “created” and he was not in the garden of Eden.

Who was God talking to in Job’s case? Who was “the adversary”?
We’ve discussed this before, Jane. When I asked why your interpretation places your evil angel in a prophecy that applies only to the king of Tyre, you weren’t able to answer.

You’ve seen the correct interpretation, but you seem unwilling to accept that God could use imagery of the Garden, the cherub, and the priestly stones in this way. It appears you are holding onto your view instead of considering the truth revealed in the text.

“Son of man, sing a dirge concerning the king of Tyre, and tell him, ‘This is what the Sovereign Lord Jehovah says:

Two truths here for you Jane.

1. You are not interested in the Context of this Prophecy or how Israel received it.
2. You are not interested in what the Sovereign Lord Jehovah says.

This is on you alone.

Unlocking Ezekiel 28

Wickstick & I discussed this thoroughly.
 

ewq1938

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It is a significant requirement the the pre mill as they require marriages and babies to be born to replenish the existant 'old' 'original' earth. And the non glorified still in the earthly body saints will procreate.

Amill believes the same thing. In the Amill Mill marriages and babies are born to replenish the existant 'old' 'original' earth. (Amill teaches we are in the Mill now, and have been for a very long time so all the saints living and dying and having babies on this old Earth yet they somehow all that is ok in their belief system but it's wrong if anyone else believes the same thing!)
 
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Scott Downey

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"After the resurrection of all the dead, comes the judgment, that is a consistent message from God."

And as you notice in Rev 20, after the saints reigning with Christ and who are eternally alive in Him, comes the great judgment Day.
The moment when when you believe in Christ you have passed from death into life, and your life is hid with Christ in God.

John 5:24

“Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life.

Their names are written in the Lamb's book of life
 

David in NJ

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Col 3:4 - For you died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God.
When Christ who is our life Appears, then you/us also will appear with Him in glory.

The spirits-souls of Christians go to be with the Lord Jesus and reign with Him in Heaven when they physically die.
(absent from the body, present with the Lord Jesus)

Since they are hidden with Christ in God they have their part in the first resurrection which is Christ's in heaven (seated with Him, raised with Him in heavenly places in Christ Jesus, as Ephesians 2 says, but they are not yet resurrected themselves into glorified bodies are they. Because He lives, we live also.

When Christ appears again, coming on the clouds of Heaven, then they will be resurrected with a glorified body like He has.
But until then they are hidden with Christ and have a place with Him in heaven in His first resurrection.

Rev 20 is actually ongoing now in heaven with Christ

5 But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.
HalelluYAH - You GOT IT Brother EXCEPT for "Rev 20 is actually ongoing now in heaven with Christ"

Being Born-Again = BORN from ABOVE is ongoing now in Heaven where the FATHER Places us in Christ = Eph 2:4-6

Our New Birth Place - Galatians 4:22-26
For it is written that Abraham had two sons: the one by a bondwoman, the other by a freewoman.
But he who was of the bondwoman was born according to the flesh, and he of the freewoman through promise, which things are symbolic. For these are the two covenants: the one from Mount Sinai which gives birth to bondage, which is Hagar— for this Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia, and corresponds to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children—
but the Jerusalem above is free, which is the mother of us all.
LOL!

1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. 23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

You are comparing the order of resurrecitions that Paul gives here where he indicates that Christ's was first and "afterward they that are Christ's at his coming" to placing an order at a restaurant? LOL! You have apparently decided that you don't want to be taken seriously.
Over your head - again!
 

Spiritual Israelite

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While that is true, then assuming Matthew 27:52-53 actually happened at the time, that doesn't mean we are unable to deduce what likely became of them eventually.
I agree. Which is why I gave my view of what happened to them. Because of what Paul wrote in 1 Corinthians 15:22-23 where he gives the order of resurrections unto bodily immortality without mentioning anyone there but Christ and those who belong to Christ at His coming, we can safely deduce that those who were resurrected in Matthew 27:52-53 were not resurrected unto bodily immorality and died again later like Lazarus and others who had previously been resurrected did.

After all, there is such a thing as using common sense.
Ah, yes. That old (supposedly) reliable common sense. You might call it human wisdom. Paul had something to say about that.

1 Corinthians 2:12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God. 13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual. 14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

It seems that Paul did not agree with thinking that we should completely trust in human common sense the way you do. There's a lot of things in scripture which unbelievers think defy common sense because "the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him".

For example.

Is it reasonable that they came out of their tombs and appeared to many in the state they were in while in their tombs? No.
How do you know how long they had been dead? Did Lazarus appear to many in the state he was in while in his tomb? Yes.

Is it reasonable, that if they put on a flesh body, that they then eventually returned to the state they were in before their tombs opened? No.
Why not?

Is it reasonable that they all just crawled back into their tombs eventually? No.
LOL. What a goofy thing to say. If they died later, what does that have to do with them crawling back into their tombs? They would have either been buried in different tombs or the same tombs they were in previously.

Is it reasonable that any of them are still walking among us now? No.
Finally, you said something that is actually reasonable.

What then became of them eventually?

Apparently, they eventually ascended into heaven. But not in a disembodied state, a bodily state. That would have to be the logical conclusion.
That would be logical if you are ignorant about what the rest of scripture teaches. As you often do, you are interpreting a passage in isolation from the rest of scripture. How does what you're saying here line up with what Paul taught about resurrections unto bodily immortality?

1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. 23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

You talk about common sense. How is it common sense to contradict what Paul taught about the order of bodily resurrections unto bodily immortality? I don't see any reference here to those who were resurrected, as described in Matthew 27:52-53? Do you think Paul somehow would not have been aware of their resurrection or have not been aware of whether they were resurrected unto bodily immortality or not? I'm sure he would have been. Yet, he does not list them anywhere in the order of resurrections unto bodily immortality. Since we can trust that Paul knew what he was talking about, we can safely conclude that no one so far has ever been resurrected unto bodily immortality except for Jesus Christ and the next time anyone will be resurrected unto bodily immortality will be when the dead in Christ are resurrected unto bodily immortality at His second coming.

Or if none of the above, maybe one of the following?

1) Matthew 27:52-53 never actually happened at the time. It was something someone added to the account that was never present in the original manuscripts.
Are you saying that some claim this?

2) Matthew 27:52-53 never actually happened at the time. And that it is prophecy depicting what the resurrection event is going to look like in the future.
There is no indication of that in the text itself.

Matthew 27:50 Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost. 51 And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent; 52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose, 53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

This indicates that the tombs were opened when Jesus died after an earthquake occurred. Apparently, the earthquake is what caused the tombs to open. And then the bodies of the saints in those tombs were resurrected after Christ was resurrected, which obviously was three days later. There is no indication here whatsoever that it's talking about a future event.

Speaking for myself, I do not see 1) nor 2) likely being the case. Therefore, in regards to what likely happened to them eventually, the logical conclusion still appears to be to me--Apparently, they eventually ascended into heaven. But not in a disembodied state, a bodily state.
And how do you reconcile that with 1 Corinthians 15:22-23? Did you even think about what other scirptures teach while coming up with an interpretation of Matthew 27:52-53?
 

David in NJ

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"After the resurrection of all the dead, comes the judgment, that is a consistent message from God."

And as you notice in Rev 20, after the saints reigning with Christ and who are eternally alive in Him, comes the great judgment Day.
The moment when when you believe in Christ you have passed from death into life, and your life is hid with Christ in God.

John 5:24

“Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life.

Their names are written in the Lamb's book of life
Rev 20 does not and cannot be fulfilled until everyone who is to be Saved by God are Placed in Christ.

Matt 24:14 - "and this gospel will be preached in all the world and then the end will come"

Acts 3:19-21 Repent therefore and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, so that times of refreshing may come from the presence of the Lord, and
A - that He may send Jesus Christ, who was preached to you before,
B - whom heaven must receive until the times of restoration of all things,
C - which God has spoken by the mouth of all His holy prophets since the world began.

AFTER all things are restored according to the FATHER, HE then sends the LORD Jesus Christ for the Resurrection of the Saints

That is the only Time and Place whereby Revelation 20:1-6 is fulfilled

JESUS, the Bride and the HOLY SPIRT Say so = Revelation 22:12-17
 
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Spiritual Israelite

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Over your head - again!
LOL. Dream on, buddy. To claim that what Paul said about the order of resurrections in 1 Corinthians 15:22-23 can be compared to making an order of food at a restaurant is one of the most ridiculous interpretations imaginable. Your nonsense is not over my head, it's below the ground.
 

David in NJ

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LOL. Dream on, buddy. To claim that what Paul said about the order of resurrections in 1 Corinthians 15:22-23 can be compared to making an order of food at a restaurant is one of the most ridiculous interpretations imaginable. Your nonsense is not over my head, it's below the ground.
As non-sensical as JESUS comparing tares and wheat

As non-sensical as the many parables JESUS spoke

JESUS says , I came not to be served but to serve = it went right over your head
 

Spiritual Israelite

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Amill believes the same thing. In the Amill Mill marriages and babies are born to replenish the existant 'old' 'original' earth. (Amill teaches we are in the Mill now, and have been for a very long time so all the saints living and dying and having babies on this old Earth yet they somehow all that is ok in their belief system but it's wrong if anyone else believes the same thing!)
Jesus spoke about this age and the age to come in Luke 20:34-36. He said in this age people get married and they die and in the age to come people will no longer get married or die. In the Premil view, the age to come is the thousand years. By saying there will be babies born during a time after this age ends, which it will when Christ returns at the end of the age (Matt 24:3), that blatantly contradicts what Christ said about no more marriage in the age to come. And by saying that there will be death after Jesus comes at the end of the age contradicts Jesus saying that no one will die anymore in the age to come. Amil does not contradict Luke 20:34-36 like Premil does because we agree that there will be no marriage or death in the eternal age to come in the new heavens and new earth.
 
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Spiritual Israelite

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As non-sensical as JESUS comparing tares and wheat

As non-sensical as the many parables JESUS spoke

JESUS says , I came not to be served but to serve = it went right over your head
Are you saying that you think Paul was telling a parable in 1 Corinthians 15:20-23 rather than giving a literal order of resurrections while talking about the literal bodily resurrection of Christ and the literal bodily resurrection of those who belong to Christ at His second coming?
 

Hiddenthings

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The souls and spirits of believers are with Jesus in paradise now. Jesus told the thief on the cross that he would be with Him that day in paradise.

Luke 23:43 And Jesus said to him, “Assuredly, I say to you, today you will be with Me in Paradise.”
Their next waking moment will be like what.... 1 Corinthians 15:52
 

David in NJ

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Rev 20:5 "But the rest of the dead did not live again"

The rest of the dead are not living with Christ in Heaven, they will also be resurrected, they are the unbelieving and wicked.
They will be resurrected and face condemnation. They actually have no life (eternal life) and are in hell.

All who are in the graves "the dead" will hear His voice and come forth, bodily resurrected, some to glory, some to condemnation.

Acts 24:14-16
New King James Version
14 But this I confess to you, that according to the Way which they call a sect, so I worship the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the Law and in the Prophets. 15 I have hope in God, which they themselves also accept, that there will be a resurrection [a]of the dead, both of the just and the unjust. 16 This being so, I myself always strive to have a conscience without offense toward God and men.

John 5

28 Do not marvel at this; for the hour is coming in which all who are in the graves will hear His voice 29 and come forth—those who have done good, to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil, to the resurrection of condemnation. 30 I can of Myself do nothing. As I hear, I judge; and My judgment is righteous, because I do not seek My own will but the will of the Father who sent Me.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
After the resurrection of all the dead, comes the judgment, that is a consistent message from God.
The Two resurrections are separated by 1,000 Years

When Christ said all those who are in the Graves will hear His Voice = absolutely, and then HE separates the TWO resurrections
FIRST Resurrection is unto Eternal Life
The second resurrection is unto eternal death = the Second Death

there will be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and the unjust = two separate groups
 

David in NJ

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Are you saying that you think Paul was telling a parable in 1 Corinthians 15:20-23 rather than giving a literal order of resurrections while talking about the literal bodily resurrection of Christ and the literal bodily resurrection of those who belong to Christ at His second coming?
lol

why even say such a thing?
 

TribulationSigns

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More on Revelation 5:10:

Revelation 5:10

  • "And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth."
Answer:

And indeed the saints "DID" reign as Kings On Earth. All of them, even as we do today. The statement is already true, not "will be true in the future." We have already been made Kings and Priests unto God, and are already living and reigning on earth. And have been since the cross instituted the millennial reign of Christ's kingdom on earth. When Christ said my Kingdom is not of this world, He wasn't kidding, He was expounding on the scriptures.

Revelation 1:5-6
  • "And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,
  • And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen."
Hath made!! Not "will make." We ALREADY reign with Him on Earth as Kings and Priests in the Kingdom as we preach the Gospel to the world!

Revelation 1:9
  • "I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ."
Not will, but Christ already has a Kingdom, and has already made us reign as Kings and Priests in this Kingdom of God, right here on earth.

1st Peter 2:9
  • "But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:"
In the Greek, Royal Priesthood is the exact same as Kingdom of Priests. In fact, this verse is directly related to the Exodus 19:6, Kingdom of Priests passage. The Kingdom Of God on earth has already been established!

Luke 17:20-21
  • "And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:
  • Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you."
Looking for an observable or physical Kingdom of Christ on earth is futile, even as Christ so plainly illustrated! His Kingdom Does Not come in such a manner so that it can be physically observed by man, because it is a Spiritual Kingdom which is WITHIN YOU...where you are "MADE ALIVE" in Christ! You has made king and priest in His Kingdom when you were born again! An invisible kingdom more powerful and glorious than any Kingdom that could be observed on earth, ever could be!
 
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