Like for an example somebody asks you if you think that they look fat,.. would it be a sin to tell them no to spare their feelings?
Is Telling A Lie Ever A Good Thing?
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Joshua 2
"3So the king of Jericho sent to Rahab and said, “Bring out the men who came to you and entered your house, for they have come to spy out the whole land.” 4But the woman had taken the two men and hidden them. So she said, “Yes, the men did come to me, but I did not know where they had come from. 5At dusk, when the gate was about to close, the men went out, and I do not know which way they went. Pursue them quickly, and you may catch them!”
Well, Rahab lied...I believe...
And then we have this:
Hebrews 11
"31By faith the prostitute Rahab, because she welcomed the spies in peace, did not perish with those who were disobedient. "
James 2
" 25 In the same way, was not even Rahab the prostitute justified by her actions when she welcomed the spies and sent them off on another route? "
So, it seems like faith is the key word in this account.
"3So the king of Jericho sent to Rahab and said, “Bring out the men who came to you and entered your house, for they have come to spy out the whole land.” 4But the woman had taken the two men and hidden them. So she said, “Yes, the men did come to me, but I did not know where they had come from. 5At dusk, when the gate was about to close, the men went out, and I do not know which way they went. Pursue them quickly, and you may catch them!”
Well, Rahab lied...I believe...
And then we have this:
Hebrews 11
"31By faith the prostitute Rahab, because she welcomed the spies in peace, did not perish with those who were disobedient. "
James 2
" 25 In the same way, was not even Rahab the prostitute justified by her actions when she welcomed the spies and sent them off on another route? "
So, it seems like faith is the key word in this account.
Maybe thinking somebody looks fat is not abiding in truth.
*Who told us people look fat...?
Ziggy
Well-Known Member
Not saying lying is ever a good thing,
But there may be justification for lying in some circumstances, such as protecting another person.
A robber breaks in your house, asks you if anyone else is in the home. You have 2 kids hiding under a bed.
Do you tell the truth?
I think the sin is in the act of trying to deceive another person through treachury.
The Serpent deceived Eve to cause mankind to fall.
Rahab lied to save her family.
Jhn 7:24 Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.
Pro 31:9 Open thy mouth, judge righteously, and plead the cause of the poor and needy.
Sometimes you have to weigh the situation.
Is it for a righteous cause or a means to deceive through malice.
Interesting question
Thank You
Hugs
But there may be justification for lying in some circumstances, such as protecting another person.
A robber breaks in your house, asks you if anyone else is in the home. You have 2 kids hiding under a bed.
Do you tell the truth?
I think the sin is in the act of trying to deceive another person through treachury.
The Serpent deceived Eve to cause mankind to fall.
Rahab lied to save her family.
Jhn 7:24 Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.
Pro 31:9 Open thy mouth, judge righteously, and plead the cause of the poor and needy.
Sometimes you have to weigh the situation.
Is it for a righteous cause or a means to deceive through malice.
Interesting question
Thank You
Hugs
1 Corinthians 9
"21To those without the law I became like one without the law (though I am not outside the law of God but am under the law of Christ), to win those without the law. 22To the weak I became weak, to win the weak. I have become all things to all people so that by all possible means I might save some. 23I do all this for the sake of the gospel, so that I may share in its blessings."
Also, is being chameleonlike...being deceitful?
"21To those without the law I became like one without the law (though I am not outside the law of God but am under the law of Christ), to win those without the law. 22To the weak I became weak, to win the weak. I have become all things to all people so that by all possible means I might save some. 23I do all this for the sake of the gospel, so that I may share in its blessings."
Also, is being chameleonlike...being deceitful?
Who programmed the hypothetical person into thinking that people look fat?
Genesis 3:11
"“Who told you that you were naked?” asked the LORD God. “Have you eaten from the tree of which I commanded you not to eat?”
Ziggy
Well-Known Member
Heb 2:16 For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.
Mar 2:17 When Jesus heard it, he saith unto them, They that are whole have no need of the physician, but they that are sick: I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
Phl 2:5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
Phl 2:6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
Phl 2:7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
Phl 2:8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
again:
Sometimes you have to weigh the situation.
Is it for a righteous cause or a means to deceive through malice.
Hugs
Mar 2:17 When Jesus heard it, he saith unto them, They that are whole have no need of the physician, but they that are sick: I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
Phl 2:5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
Phl 2:6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
Phl 2:7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
Phl 2:8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
again:
Sometimes you have to weigh the situation.
Is it for a righteous cause or a means to deceive through malice.
Hugs
Wrangler
Well-Known Member
Of course lying is, at times, a good thing! God of the Bible did it many times! 400 times in the story below, cross referenced in 2 Chronicles 18:21. And he even honored women who lied. See midwives when Moses was born. God blessed them for the lying. See Rahab, especially honored for her lie in protecting the spies. Jesus obviously lied when he talked about rebuilding the temple in 3 days. ("The temple" was mentioned thousands of times in the Bible and always meant Solomon's temple. But this time the audience was supposed to know he was speaking figuratively of a different temple? Ridiculous. Those he lied to were not his friends).
The God of the Bible is a warrior. He knows with certainty that deception is a powerful ally in war. In 2 Kings 19:35, he sends an angel to kill 185,000 warriors. This is easily accomplished through deception, getting each half to think the other half are the enemy. For certain, God is at spiritual war with sin and Satan. When evildoers want the truth to do more evil, it is wise to lie to defeat their nefarious goals with deception to bring glory to God. For instance, Herod killed all boys 2 years and younger in an attempt to stop the prophesied King of the Jews from coming to power. If you and I knew where baby Jesus was lying in the manger and soldiers asked where he was so they could do their duty, it would be my honor to lie to protect our Savior from harm before completing his all-important mission.
My Bible Study leader says it all comes down to this; Do your words actions bring glory to God? Many non-Christians use the truth as a weapon, not a shield. "I was only telling the truth" is a rationalization for maliciously hurting someone. Here, Ephesians 4:29 guides me. When my wife asks if a shirt makes her look fat, I am inclined to say her fat makes her look fat but I ask if she wants grace or truth.
Hope this helps. 21 Right then, a spirit revealed itself to the Eternal and said, “I will do it. I will draw Ahab into battle.”
22 The Eternal One asked, “How do you plan on doing this?”
The spirit answered, “I will become a spirit of deception within the words of his prophets.”
The Eternal spoke again, “I like this idea. You will succeed at drawing him into battle. Proceed quickly.” 23 Therefore, the Eternal has placed a spirit of deception in the mouths of all your prophets, and He has sent destruction upon you. You will lose.
1 Kings 22:21-23 (VOICE)
Yan
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Mankind always telling a lie to cover up something, but Jesus always make a judgement to the pursuer similar to a woman who caught being adultery and all scribes wants to blame Jesus for that (John 8:1-11). This was the same situation when Egyptian wants to kill Moses and Jesus (Exodus 1:15-22; Matthew 2:13-23).
Michael1985
Active Member
IDK,.. tough question. :/
Of course lying is, at times, a good thing! God of the Bible did it many times! 400 times in the story below, cross referenced in 2 Chronicles 18:21. And he even honored women who lied. See midwives when Moses was born. God blessed them for the lying. See Rahab, especially honored for her lie in protecting the spies. Jesus obviously lied when he talked about rebuilding the temple in 3 days. ("The temple" was mentioned thousands of times in the Bible and always meant Solomon's temple. But this time the audience was supposed to know he was speaking figuratively of a different temple? Ridiculous. Those he lied to were not his friends).
The God of the Bible is a warrior. He knows with certainty that deception is a powerful ally in war. In 2 Kings 19:35, he sends an angel to kill 185,000 warriors. This is easily accomplished through deception, getting each half to think the other half are the enemy. For certain, God is at spiritual war with sin and Satan. When evildoers want the truth to do more evil, it is wise to lie to defeat their nefarious goals with deception to bring glory to God. For instance, Herod killed all boys 2 years and younger in an attempt to stop the prophesied King of the Jews from coming to power. If you and I knew where baby Jesus was lying in the manger and soldiers asked where he was so they could do their duty, it would be my honor to lie to protect our Savior from harm before completing his all-important mission.
My Bible Study leader says it all comes down to this; Do your words actions bring glory to God? Many non-Christians use the truth as a weapon, not a shield. "I was only telling the truth" is a rationalization for maliciously hurting someone. Here, Ephesians 4:29 guides me. When my wife asks if a shirt makes her look fat, I am inclined to say her fat makes her look fat but I ask if she wants grace or truth.
21 Right then, a spirit revealed itself to the Eternal and said, “I will do it. I will draw Ahab into battle.”
22 The Eternal One asked, “How do you plan on doing this?”
The spirit answered, “I will become a spirit of deception within the words of his prophets.”
The Eternal spoke again, “I like this idea. You will succeed at drawing him into battle. Proceed quickly.” 23 Therefore, the Eternal has placed a spirit of deception in the mouths of all your prophets, and He has sent destruction upon you. You will lose.
1 Kings 22:21-23 (VOICE)
Uhh,.. I'm not sure where you're getting all this from but I stopped reading at the part where you said that Jesus lied because that's a lie right there.
quietthinker
Well-Known Member
if they ask you, tell them what you think....unless you want to qualify as being full of sh.t
Wrangler
Well-Known Member
So, you are OK with God lying but not Jesus lying? Did you ever read in the Bible why Jesus spoke in so many parables, besides to fulfill prophecy? I'll look for the actual verse if you think it will help. However, the point is he deliberately spoke in ways he knew that unbelievers would not understand. What do you call that?
Also, the Gospel of Mark, in particular, emphasizes how Jesus did not want it known who he was. What do you call withholding information, thereby not allowing others to come to an informed decision about a situation?
My original post was to support the obvious truth about lying; some times it is a good thing. Then I used powerful examples of Scripture of how lying is used to bring glory to God. Do you believe it is better to tell soldiers where baby Jesus lies in the manger so they can kill him than lie to protect him so he can complete his all important mission?
First of all parables aren't lies they're just speaking figuratively and second of all Jesus didn't want it know who He was because He was humbling Himself and that's still not lying. The third example is just completely and utterly ridiculous.
Lying is not a sin; rather lying AGAINST someone is a sin.
There are many good reasons to lie such as protecting yourself or someone else, or even to play a friendly trick, test someone or lead to a truth that can't be stated at first.
So ask if there is a victim of your lie. Will you regret lying later? Or will you regret not lying, because it was an occassion which called for it?
Properly discerning good from evil is a tricky business. The heart knows, and attempting to do good will generally result in actually doing it.
So pursue righteousness as a goal. Don't worry so much about specific actions, there are often times when an act that looks like a sin will actually be righteous. Jesus pointed out examples of this like healing on the Sabbath, drinking alcohol and mentioning David eating the bread only priest were allowed to eat.
"Clean the inside of the dish, and the outside of the dish will be clean too". Purify your intentions so that sin has less and less influence. Your actions will be pure if you are, but many evil people try to appear good.
Do not be like the hypocrites.
A lie is fine, but keep in mind the reasons why you are lying. Is it for a worthy end?
There are many good reasons to lie such as protecting yourself or someone else, or even to play a friendly trick, test someone or lead to a truth that can't be stated at first.
So ask if there is a victim of your lie. Will you regret lying later? Or will you regret not lying, because it was an occassion which called for it?
Properly discerning good from evil is a tricky business. The heart knows, and attempting to do good will generally result in actually doing it.
So pursue righteousness as a goal. Don't worry so much about specific actions, there are often times when an act that looks like a sin will actually be righteous. Jesus pointed out examples of this like healing on the Sabbath, drinking alcohol and mentioning David eating the bread only priest were allowed to eat.
"Clean the inside of the dish, and the outside of the dish will be clean too". Purify your intentions so that sin has less and less influence. Your actions will be pure if you are, but many evil people try to appear good.
Do not be like the hypocrites.
A lie is fine, but keep in mind the reasons why you are lying. Is it for a worthy end?
