Is the "free gift" of salvation really free? - Honestly?

[Hillsage]

Is the "free gift" of salvation really free? - Honestly?​

I believe His "free gift" cost me nothing to receive. But it cost Jesus His life, to 'give' it to me.

This is the evangelical bait-and-switch.
Where's the ethics in that? Should people be tricked into the kingdom?

Should people be raped into their earthly families?

Do we lead someone to Christ and then cut them loose? Nope.

Saw it happen all the time. Especially in our last congregation which had an 'evangelist' instead of a 'pastor' for a leader.

They need to be discipled, right?

So we pile on the expectations.
- Daily Bible reading and prayer.
- Regular church attendance and tithing.
- Sharing the Gospel.
- Discipling others.
- Good works.

All good discipling RECOMMENDATIONS....are they not??? But "EXPECTATIONS"????....that's another 'LEGALISTIC' thing.

So much for a free gift.
It's a free gift... it will cost you everything.

The 'free gift' salvation of my born again spirit, cost me nothing. But 'working out' the salvation of my soul is costing me everything. And it is still a goal I have not yet obtained.

When we lead with the "free gift" of eternal life, are we being completely honest?

Or are we only as "completely honest" as the Greek word translated "eternal" is....'completely honest'?

"Here's your free gift; goodbye; see you in heaven."

Thank god that I believe in OSAS....no chance of lost rewards from 'my book of life'.

 

[Gottservant]

This is the evangelical bait-and-switch.
Where's the ethics in that? Should people be tricked into the kingdom?

Do we lead someone to Christ and then cut them loose? Nope.
They need to be discipled, right?

[...]

What sort of "free gift" is that? (extortion)

You are assuming that it is us pointing to the 'free gift' - actually it is the Holy Spirit in us that does that.

Try not make the impression that you have got it together, all the time - that's not what God called us to.

My failing has definitely been that I don't warn new converts about the Devil (I will endeavour to trust the Holy Spirit to do something about that, in future!)

 

[Behold]

working out' the salvation of my soul is costing me everything.

Working out your salvation is not something you do, its something you understand.

You "work out" your discipleship, not your Salvation........, as Jesus has already "worked out your Salvation" on The Cross, 2000 yrs ago.

Understand?

 

[Hillsage]

Working out your salvation is not something you do, its something you understand.

Your opinion. My scriptural opinion;

PHI 2:12 Wherefore, my beloved (BRETHREN), as ye have ALWAYS OBEYED, not as in my presence only, but NOW much more in my absence, work out your own SALVATION with fear and trembling.

Written to BRETHREN who were already born again saved.

You "work out" your discipleship, not your Salvation........, as Jesus has already "worked out your Salvation" on The Cross, 2000 yrs ago.

Understand?

Jesus worked out the salvation of His soul....not His spirit.

HEB 2:18 For since He Himself was tempted in that which He has suffered, He is able to come to the aid of those who are tempted.

He was first man ever born with the holy spirit of Christ in His body of flesh and His spirit didn't need to be born again. Jesus wasn't made like every human ever born after Adam. Jesus was made like His BRETHREN in every respect. And you weren't a BRETHREN of Jesus until after your spirit was born again.

HEB 2:17 Therefore he had to be made like his BRETHREN in every respect, so that he might become a merciful and faithful high priest in the service of God, to make expiation for the sins of the people.

Christ suffered in the flesh against the temptation to sin and we are to do the same thing AFTER WE ARE BORN AGAIN BRETHREN.

1PE 4:1 Since therefore Christ suffered in the flesh, arm yourselves with the same thought, for whoever has suffered in the flesh has ceased from sin,

 

[stevesonthebay]

This is the evangelical bait-and-switch.
Where's the ethics in that? Should people be tricked into the kingdom?

Do we lead someone to Christ and then cut them loose? Nope.
They need to be discipled, right?

So we pile on the expectations.
- Daily Bible reading and prayer.
- Regular church attendance and tithing.
- Sharing the Gospel.
- Discipling others.
- Good works.

So much for a free gift.
It's a free gift... it will cost you everything.

To anyone who may be insulted by this post, consider this...
Jesus said to count the cost, to take up the cross daily and follow.

When we lead with the "free gift" of eternal life, are we being completely honest?
"Here's your free gift; goodbye; see you in heaven."

Or if someone isn't interested in our "free gift",
we warn them that eternal hell fire awaits those who refuse the "free gift".

What sort of "free gift" is that? (extortion)

I think this is treating salvation like a contract rather than a relationship and transformation.

The person is born again of the spirit. So they have renewed their minds and the values of this world are like fools gold.

But more importantly the person saved knows this as they no longer want to please the world but God. Its not a chore or like an obligation to fullfill a contract.

Its something you become by nature and thus living like Gods Kingdom on earth is actually a joy, is real peace in the midst of conflict, its hope and assurance of something greater than the misery that the world offers.

Even though at times we may feel that this is unfair. We usually find that Gods way was exactly what we needed. God knew us better than we knew ourselves.

In fact the foundation of salvation is sacrifice in Christ. By extension it is sacrificing ourselves at Gods alter like Christ. That may mean doing stuff that this world may think is unfair or oppressive.

Doing stuff that conflicts with our flesh desires which we are inclined to want to do. Loving enermies and going without to help others. These are not pleasing to the world.

But we know that from that sacrifice great things come. A paradox to the world. They say that any great lesson in life comes via pain and suffering. The things of God are foolish to the world. The things of the world get stolen, decay and fade away.

 

[XtraPercept]

So we pile on the expectations.
- Daily Bible reading and prayer.
- Regular church attendance and tithing.
- Sharing the Gospel.
- Discipling others.
- Good works.

So much for a free gift.
It's a free gift... it will cost you everything.

If I gave away free cars, what do you think would happen?

It is not catastrophizing to anticipate destruction correllary to the quantity produced and distributed to all who ask.

Do you think the roads would be safe?

Do you think drivers, in general, would improve in their courtesy and patience?

Do you think you would see clean, shiny, and well maintained automobiles all over the world in demonstration of mass appreciation?

Here's the fun part; this has already happened.

I just enjoy reading the owner's manual and try to encourage others to do the same.

When this vehicle is worn out, I am thrilled for what's next.

 

[soberxp]

 

[soberxp]

@St. SteVen
Why is it a sad expression? So, did you understand the meaning of the picture?

 

[St. SteVen]

@St. SteVen
Why is it a sad expression? So, did you understand the meaning of the picture?

A bouquet of flowers is in the trash. Why?
The flowers, planned and purchased to make a positive statement in a relationship were rejected by the recipient.
What was intended to move a relationship forward was jettisoned by a giver who was stood up, or by a recipient that refused them.
This is tragic to me. Heartbreak for the giver.

 

[soberxp]

A bouquet of flowers is in the trash. Why?
The flowers, planned and purchased to make a positive statement in a relationship were rejected by the recipient.
What was intended to move a relationship forward was jettisoned by a giver who was stood up, or by a recipient that refused them.
This is tragic to me. Heartbreak for the giver.

If the one who sent the flowers was God, would God be heartbroken?

 

[St. SteVen]

If the one who sent the flowers was God, would God be heartbroken?

Yes, I suppose so.
But God is omniscient, so He knew they would be rejected.
He has a plan for redemption.

 

[soberxp]

Yes, I suppose so.
But God is omniscient, so He knew they would be rejected.
He has a plan for redemption.

I believe that only by abiding in Jesus Christ can humanity find salvation, and this is not contradictory to universalism.

Because there is only one path to take, and for anyone, regardless of who they are, walking this path does not mean that those who do not walk it in this world cannot be saved. Rather, we are witnesses in this world, testifying to humanity that this is the only path to redemption—unless someone truly desires to perish completely, which I believe goes against human instinct.

Because we cannot fully obey the Word of God, Jesus Christ has obeyed it in our place. However, we need to understand that we are called to obey the Word of God—our minds can be qualified, but our flesh is always unqualified.

Therefore, Jesus Christ is our Savior.
There will not be a second Savior.

 

[St. SteVen]

I believe that only by abiding in Jesus Christ can humanity find salvation, and this is not contradictory to universalism.

Because there is only one path to take, and for anyone, regardless of who they are, walking this path does not mean that those who do not walk it in this world cannot be saved. Rather, we are witnesses in this world, testifying to humanity that this is the only path to redemption—unless someone truly desires to perish completely, which I believe goes against human instinct.

I have a different understanding of salvation than what you have stated here.
It's not about us. Not about abiding in Christ to find it. Not about following a path.
And yes, this is contradictory to universalism.

Because we cannot fully obey the Word of God, Jesus Christ has obeyed it in our place. However, we need to understand that we are called to obey the Word of God—our minds can be qualified, but our flesh is always unqualified.

Therefore, Jesus Christ is our Savior.
There will not be a second Savior.

Agree.

 

[soberxp]

I have a different understanding of salvation than what you have stated here.
It's not about us. Not about abiding in Christ to find it. Not about following a path.
And yes, this is contradictory to universalism.

There is a path, only obey to the word of God.

 

[St. SteVen]

There is a path, only obey to the word of God.

I agree. But that is not salvation.

Salvation is not a destination.

 

[soberxp]

I agree. But that is not salvation.

Salvation is not a destination.

Abraham obeyed God's word; God said to sacrifice his son, and he did just that. This is redemption in itself, and can even be understood apart from Jesus Christ.
So when has God ever given orders to anyone else as Abraham? Or shows himself to anyone?

This is the free Gift.

 

[St. SteVen]

So when has God ever given orders to anyone else as Abraham? Or shows himself to anyone?

You need to pay attention.
God has a plan for your life as well.
And He is always speaking and showing Himself to you.

 

[soberxp]

You need to pay attention.
God has a plan for your life as well.
And He is always speaking and showing Himself to you.

Whatever reason He speaking and showing Himself to me that is for his own will not for me and my will.

His will shows us in the Bible and hiding in the Bible.No one would listen very clearly, only Jesus Christ can hear him.

All my understanding for the Bible that is even if God said to me, "you!Go to hell!"I shall never question him,buy Only obey.