John 3:36- Better to Obey Jesus, or to Believe in Jesus?

[Dan Clarkston]

Most do not understand Grace or think it is a license to sin.

Exactly. It's gotten to the point where most all churches teach one will still go to Heaven no matter what even if a person lives in sin.

Sometimes I ask question s about these people to get them to talking and when they come right out and say "it's not possible for a Christian to ever lose their salvation".... then I tell them something like, "Man, I'm glad we had this talk... I'm gonna go out tonight and get drunker than Cooter Brown"

Then they typically object saying I should not go out and get drunk, and I reply with why not? I'm still going to Heaven anyway, right?

Then if they continue saying I should not get drunk they paint themselves in to a corner so I can say... you can't have it both ways, which is it? And by that time they acknowledge they are clueless and are unable to answer my questions.

I do all this to make the point in their thinking that they are opposing and contradicting themselves and of course they usually get mad and tell me to leave or they leave.

 

[Grailhunter]

Exactly. It's gotten to the point where most all churches teach one will still go to Heaven no matter what even if a person lives in sin.

Sometimes I ask question s about these people to get them to talking and when they come right out and say "it's not possible for a Christian to ever lose their salvation".... then I tell them something like, "Man, I'm glad we had this talk... I'm gonna go out tonight and get drunker than Cooter Brown"

Then they typically object saying I should not go out and get drunk, and I reply with why not? I'm still going to Heaven anyway, right?

Then if they continue saying I should not get drunk they paint themselves in to a corner so I can say... you can't have it both ways, which is it? And by that time they acknowledge they are clueless and are unable to answer my questions.

I do all this to make the point in their thinking that they are opposing and contradicting themselves and of course they usually get mad and tell me to leave or they leave.

The most important ritual in Christianity involved wine. So have one on me.

 

[Dan Clarkston]

The most important ritual in Christianity involved wine. So have one on me.

I'll continue to walk in the New Wine which is infilling of the Holy Spirit.

You feel free to drink the booze, and do what you greasy grace people do in darkness.

 

[Grailhunter]

I'll continue to walk in the New Wine which is infilling of the Holy Spirit.

You feel free to drink the booze, and do what you greasy grace people do in darkness.

The new wine belief is not true.
No such thing as a grape juice press. All winepresses. Set grape juice out in the summer for a couple days and drink it and see what it does to you. Now the history of mixing wine with water is another topic, but no biblical indication that this is what they drank at the Last Supper.

 

[mailmandan]

I'll continue to walk in the New Wine which is infilling of the Holy Spirit.

You feel free to drink the booze, and do what you greasy grace people do in darkness.

Galatians 5:22 - But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness, self-control...

 

[Soyeong]

That is a lie from the pit of hell.

Christ said:
For God so loved the world that whosoever BELIEVETH in Him should not perish but HAVE everlasting life.

No baptism. No works.
Christ alone by faith alone.

In John 3:16-21, it connects our belief in the Son with our obedience, so it does not present belief in the Son as being an alternative to obedience. In Revelation 14:12, those who kept faith in Jesus are the same as those who kept God's commandments. In Luke 10:25:28, Jesus affirmed that the way to inherit eternal life is by obeying the greatest two commandments, so it is contradictory to believe in Jesus instead of what he taught. The many verses that say that the way to have eternal life is by believing the Son along with the many verses that say that the way to have eternal life is by obeying God's commandments again shows that the way to believe in Jesus is by obeying God's commandments.

The God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob has the character traits that the Law of God was given in order to teach us how to embody, so if our goal is to be like Him through embodying His character traits, then we embody what we believe to be true about Him through our works. For example, the way to believe that God is compassionate is by being compassionate (Luke 6:36), the way to believe that God is holy as by being a doer of His instructions for how to be holy as He is holy (1 Peter 1:16), and so forth. This is exactly the same as the way to believe in the Son, who is the radiance of God's glory and the exact likeness of His character (Hebrews 1:3), which he embodied through his works by setting a sinless example for us to follow of how to walk in obedience to the Law of God.

In Psalm 119:29-30, he wanted to put false ways far from him, for God to be gracious to him to him by teaching him to obey His law, and he chose the way of faith by setting it before him, so this has always been the one and only way of salvation by grace alone through faith alone in Christ alone.

 

[GracePeace]

That's perhaps the most convoluted line of thought I think I have ever read.

Prove it.

 

[JimKnox]

Prove it.

I am tired of "proving" it .
I've fought this works vs faith battle for 46 years.
Nobody is going to solve it this side of eternity.
This is what I discovered:
Scripture clearly teaches salvation IN ETERNITY is by faith alone.
Scripture clearly teaches AFTER salvation that a Christian must display works of righteousness empowered by the Holy Spirit for entrance into the Millenial Kingdom of Christ.
Do you see faith only? That is eternal salvation.
Do you see works? That is Millenial Kingdom rewards.
Simple.