John

[Jordan]

(Kriss;52650)
(TallMan;52644)
Vine's Expository dictionary makes the following good point concerning:-"Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God."The word translated "and" is kai in the greeek which means "namely", "even" or "that is to say".This can be seen by looking at other verses where the woed is used:-Behold, thy King cometh unto thee, meek, and sitting upon an ass, and a colt the foal of an ass. (Matt.21:5)Did Jesus straddle an ass and it's foal at the same time?Of course not, he sat on a young ass.of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace. (Joh:1:16)Does Christ's fulness not incluse grace, so we have to receive that in addition?Of course not!to the saints which are at Ephesus, and to the faithful in Christ Jesus (Eph.1:3)Was Paul writing to 2 distinct groups in Ephesus?Those who are saints and thoise who are faithful?Of course not.So, in John 3:5 Jesus is likening the Spirit to water (as he does elsewhere). There are not 2 new births, we are not born again of whater when we get baptised and born again again when we receive the Spirit.There are 2 states of being, you are born natural, without the Spirit of God within, when you receive His Spirit you become spiritual, a new creature.Joh:3:6: That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.v8 further clarifies:-The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.This is clearly referring to the speaking in tongues that was heard with every one when they received the Spirit in Acts - Acts 2:4, 33, 39; 10:44-46.
A denomiational interptation of scripture by one who believes there is more than one baptism not what the Word says sorry Eph 4:5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,There is only one baptism and that is belief and repoentance water is symbolic of the living Waters of Jesus Christ once one has accepted the Lord and repented in his name you are a partaker of this living water.Kriss has it right. There is only one baptism. Water is ok, but it doesn't save like Kriss saids.

 

[TallMan]

I have no idea what the last 2 posts are trying to say to me.If you don't agree with whjat I actually said, please quote the bit you disagree with and say why.

 

[jtartar]

(followerofchrist;50588)
So baptism by water isn't something you have to do. We are baptized in the spirit already. Correct?
followerofchrist, According to the scriptures Water Baptism IS a requirement for salvation. In Noah's day the only way for salvation was to get on the ark. At 1Pet 3:20,21, we are told that Baptism corresponds to being on the ark of Noah's day, Baptism is what is saving people today. Of course baptism is not the only requirement for salvation, Rom 10:9,10. At Matt 28:19,20, when Jesus gave the orders to preach to the whole world, one of the main things Jesus said to do was to Baptize Jesus' disciples in the name of the Father and the SON and the holy spirit.

 

[treeoflife]

(jtartar;53505)
followerofchrist, According to the scriptures Water Baptism IS a requirement for salvation. In Noah's day the only way for salvation was to get on the ark. At 1Pet 3:20,21, we are told that Baptism corresponds to being on the ark of Noah's day, Baptism is what is saving people today. Of course baptism is not the only requirement for salvation, Rom 10:9,10.
Wrong. Water baptism is not required for salvation. I am baptized, but if I wasn't, I would be no less saved. My baptism had nothing to do with fulfilling my works quota to be saved.I was saved when I believed in what was done in Christ, by Christ, and only through Christ's work...
At Matt 28:19,20, when Jesus gave the orders to preach to the whole world, one of the main things Jesus said to do was to Baptize Jesus' disciples in the name of the Father and the SON and the holy spirit.
Jesus also told us to be perfect just as our Father in heaven is perfect, to turn the other cheek (and many other things. Refer to the sermon on the mount). All of which are sound teachings, good teachings, but not works required for salvation.

 

[Jordan]

(treeoflife;53512)
(jtartar;53505)
followerofchrist,According to the scriptures Water Baptism IS a requirement for salvation.In Noah's day the only way for salvation was to get on the ark. At 1Pet 3:20,21, we are told that Baptism corresponds to being on the ark of Noah's day, Baptism is what is saving people today. Of course baptism is not the only requirement for salvation, Rom 10:9,10.
Wrong. Water baptism is not required for salvation. I am baptized, but if I wasn't, I would be no less saved. My baptism had nothing to do with fulfilling my works quota to be saved.I was saved when I believed in what was done in Christ, by Christ, and only through Christ's work...(jtartar;53505)
At Matt 28:19,20, when Jesus gave the orders to preach to the whole world, one of the main things Jesus said to do was to Baptize Jesus' disciples in the name of the Father and the SON and the holy spirit.
Jesus also told us to be perfect just as our Father in heaven is perfect, to turn the other cheek (and many other things. Refer to the sermon on the mount). All of which are sound teachings, good teachings, but not works required for salvation.Yay, I can agree with treeoflife here. No works required for salvation because of these scriptures. (Ephesians 2:8-9, Romans 11:6)Water Baptism of what Christ did at Matthew 3:13-17 was only symbolic for being born of a mother's womb.Water Baptism is made by man. There is One Lord, one faith, one baptism, (Ephesians 4:5) The baptism we need is of the Holy Ghost / Spirit. Only Christ saves.