I ran a cross a funny meme of Charlton Heston saying that (thread title) when parting the Red Sea in the famous movie "The Ten Commandments". Was going to post it but don't want to be potentially hit with a term of service copyright complaint. Anyway, it did get at some of the ironies that I as a Christian Sacramentalist have from the more Zwinglian "Believer's Baptism" position. I'm use to being on the defensive for things that really be the original context of the Bible as far as Covenant and Faith goes.
The post did remind me of some comments from some former online associates on another message board I saved them for posterity. My Favorite.
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A said concerning the Bible showing only adult baptism in overt texts
"The only reason that instances are recorded in the New Testament of followers of Christ speaking to adult converts about being baptized is because, when the whole world is to be evangelized, OF COURSE they would go first to adults! Wouldn't you? You wouldn't expect them to cruise schoolyards trying to convince children, would you???? But when it says that "whole households" were baptized, as the NT says, it means children, too.
In fact, it is ludicrous to assume (which advocates of "believers baptism" often do) either that 1) there were no children in the households of people of that place and time OR that 2) the parents would join a new religion and insist that their own children be excluded from it."
Another good one.
"It's a common idea in our day that baptism is an outward act of obedience; that it's a public declaration of faith. The problem is, that's not what Scriptures say. If you believe it does, I would challenge you to read everything the Bible has to say about baptism.
Baptism is not what we do for God, but rather, what God does for us. It's the grace and work of God, instituted by Christ Himself — that we are truly baptised into the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. This is not on account of the water, but God's promise through the water; the work of the Holy Spirit.
So the burden shouldn't be on the orthodox Church bodies to defend why children should be baptised, but on those who insist that children should not be. For where in Scripture does it say or even allude to that we must deny children God's grace? Isn't the norm in the Bible that people are born and raised up in faith, as opposed to getting to a point where they have to receive a personal experience and then make a decision to follow God? In the OT, it's very clear that all of Israel belonged to God. Likewise, in the NT, we see that whole households are baptised. More explicitly, Christ has instituted the Church to baptise and make disciples of all nations, which includes everyone. The Gospel is for everyone, for Christ says "Let the little children come to me and do not hinder them, for to such belongs the kingdom of heaven."
The post did remind me of some comments from some former online associates on another message board I saved them for posterity. My Favorite.
"
A said concerning the Bible showing only adult baptism in overt texts
"The only reason that instances are recorded in the New Testament of followers of Christ speaking to adult converts about being baptized is because, when the whole world is to be evangelized, OF COURSE they would go first to adults! Wouldn't you? You wouldn't expect them to cruise schoolyards trying to convince children, would you???? But when it says that "whole households" were baptized, as the NT says, it means children, too.
In fact, it is ludicrous to assume (which advocates of "believers baptism" often do) either that 1) there were no children in the households of people of that place and time OR that 2) the parents would join a new religion and insist that their own children be excluded from it."
Another good one.
"It's a common idea in our day that baptism is an outward act of obedience; that it's a public declaration of faith. The problem is, that's not what Scriptures say. If you believe it does, I would challenge you to read everything the Bible has to say about baptism.
Baptism is not what we do for God, but rather, what God does for us. It's the grace and work of God, instituted by Christ Himself — that we are truly baptised into the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. This is not on account of the water, but God's promise through the water; the work of the Holy Spirit.
So the burden shouldn't be on the orthodox Church bodies to defend why children should be baptised, but on those who insist that children should not be. For where in Scripture does it say or even allude to that we must deny children God's grace? Isn't the norm in the Bible that people are born and raised up in faith, as opposed to getting to a point where they have to receive a personal experience and then make a decision to follow God? In the OT, it's very clear that all of Israel belonged to God. Likewise, in the NT, we see that whole households are baptised. More explicitly, Christ has instituted the Church to baptise and make disciples of all nations, which includes everyone. The Gospel is for everyone, for Christ says "Let the little children come to me and do not hinder them, for to such belongs the kingdom of heaven."
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