Many claim to be Christians, but what does the Bible say about it?

[Robert Gwin]

Many claim to be Christians, but what does the Bible say about it?
OP ^






AGREE.
Non-FOLLOWERS of Jesus Christ CALLED people WHO were FOLLOWERS of Jesus Christ......CHRIST-IANS.



AGREE... “IF” ... they REMAINED in his word.



AGREE... “IF” ... they OBEYED his TEACHINGS.



DISAGREE...The Teachings OF Jesus Christ is HE IS THE FULFILLMENT of OT LAW.



AGREE...
Jesus FULFILLED the LAW......LOVE ALL.
Jesus FULFILLED the LAW......GAVE HIS BODY FOR ALL.

Jesus’ TEACHING TO ALL....DO AS HE HAS DONE.
* Love the Lord God Above ALL things.
* Love ALL others.
* Give your Body unto DEATH FOR the Lord God.

* Give your Body unto DEATH FOR the Lord God, AND the Lord Gods POWER will ENTER “IN” YOU.
* His POWER “IN” you WILL KEEP YOU FOREVER WITH the Lord God.
* His POWER “IN” you WILL KEEP YOU “Loving the Lord God Above ALL things FOREVER.
* His POWER “IN” you WILL KEEP YOU “Loving the ALL others”.

...( The Converted )... were given an assignment that would continue to the end of this world.

DISAGREE...
Jesus’ TEACHING is ANY TRUE HEARTFUL BELIEVING and CONFESSED and CONVERTED man ... HAS ACCOMPLISHED...
**WORKING the WORKS of God...........BELIEF (John 6:28-29)
**THE SERVICE of God.......HEARTFUL CONFESSION. (Rom 12:1)



AGREE...[/QUOTE]

Can you be more specific in what you disagree with Taken, so I can address those points sir.

 

[Robert Gwin]

So you are working because you are saved and not to be saved?

No Charlie, no one is actually saved. Saved is receiving salvation, which for most of us is yet future. Saved is a misunderstood term for the most part sir.

 

[Robert Gwin]

It's easy to say, "I am a Christian." Is that all it takes to go to heaven? Does going to church regularly ensure your salvation?

The answer to both of your questions is no Bob

 

[Enoch111]

The only proof that a person is a "christian" is to be born again.

And in order to be born again one must believe on the Lord Jesus Christ (John 1:12,13). And in order to accept Him as Lord one must also believe that He is God (1 Tim 3:16).

 

[Charlie24]

No Charlie, no one is actually saved. Saved is receiving salvation, which for most of us is yet future. Saved is a misunderstood term for the most part sir.

It's true that our salvation is not complete until the resurrection as Paul told us in Eph. 1:13-14.

I would agree with you if not for John saying this,

1 John 5:13
"These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God."

We are just as much saved right now as we will ever be! We have that promise.

But we must hold on to our faith for our salvation to be completed. That is a must.

So I can understand why you say that. But the promise of salvation here and now is very much alive.

 

[Robert Gwin]

And in order to be born again one must believe on the Lord Jesus Christ (John 1:12,13). And in order to accept Him as Lord one must also believe that He is God (1 Tim 3:16).

Who did Jesus say God is Enoch?

 

[Robert Gwin]

It's true that our salvation is not complete until the resurrection as Paul told us in Eph. 1:13-14.

I would agree with you if not for John saying this,

1 John 5:13
"These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God."

We are just as much saved right now as we will ever be! We have that promise.

But we must hold on to our faith for our salvation to be completed. That is a must.

So I can understand why you say that. But the promise of salvation here and now is very much alive.

And of course John was not incorrect, but since the Bible does not contradict itself, how might Heb 6:4-6 play in? You seem reasonable with a good grasp of Scriptural meaning. When God anointed them with holy spirit, no one on earth was more saved than them, however, they had to endure to the end as we all do Mat 24:13. The bad thing about them is, if they fall away from the faith, they have sinned against the holy spirit and have no redemption. Interestingly at their resurrection they are referred to as immortal, I don't understand that, but evidently God puts much faith in them.Most Christians will not come to life until the thousand years have ended Charlie Rev 20:5

I think it is imperative to know what believe means as well Charlie, no doubt those in Mat 7:21-23 believed devotionally in Jesus, but they were not saved. Jesus stated the reason they were not in verse 21.

 

[Charlie24]

And of course John was not incorrect, but since the Bible does not contradict itself, how might Heb 6:4-6 play in? You seem reasonable with a good grasp of Scriptural meaning. When God anointed them with holy spirit, no one on earth was more saved than them, however, they had to endure to the end as we all do Mat 24:13. The bad thing about them is, if they fall away from the faith, they have sinned against the holy spirit and have no redemption. Interestingly at their resurrection they are referred to as immortal, I don't understand that, but evidently God puts much faith in them.Most Christians will not come to life until the thousand years have ended Charlie Rev 20:5

I think it is imperative to know what believe means as well Charlie, no doubt those in Mat 7:21-23 believed devotionally in Jesus, but they were not saved. Jesus stated the reason they were not in verse 21.

We all see things differently and that's ok with me as long as we get the salvation right. God didn't demand that we get all doctrine correct, He demands that we get Christ correct. That is worth fighting for, the rest, not so much. I try to stay away from the conflicts if possible.

When that's not possible, I state my case and let it go. It's not worth driving a wedge between others.

In Heb. 6 and 10, Paul is appealing to new Hebrew converts to Christ. He is warning them of the consequences of turning from Christ and going back to temple worship. The entire book of Hebrews is the case for Christ. Paul is comparing the Old Covenant high priest to the New Covenant high priest, Christ.

There can be no doubt some of these Jews were walking away from Christ, therefore abandoning their faith in Christ. Paul is simply telling them what they have done and are doing. What they are doing is blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.

Just as Ezekiel witnessed the Holy Spirit departing from the temple as He was no longer wanted, so was the Spirit departing from those Jews who no longer had faith and have embarrassed the Holy Spirit going back to Law.

 

[quietthinker]

Many claim to be Christians, but what does the Bible say about it?
hmmmm, I wonder what it says about your claim, Robert?

 

[APAK]

Billions of people throughout the earth claim to be Christians. But they do not have all the same beliefs, or standards. so what is a Christian? Does the Bible give us insight on how to identify them?

The actual definition of Christian is a follower of Jesus Christ. The name Christian was first bestowed on Jesus' disciples in Antioch in the first century as they were gaining in numbers Acts 11:26

Jesus stated that his disciples would really be his if they remained in his word Jn 8:31. In other words they would obey his teachings, as time progressed they would continue to obey the laws handed down through the apostles as well as recorded in the Bible Compare Luke 24:27

Jesus told his followers to Love one another as I have loved you. Not only did he give his life for them, but spent time with them, encouraged them, and helped them. True Christians show by their words and actions that they love one another., including their neighbors. Gal 6:10

True Christians were given an assignment that would continue to the end of this world. Jesus came primarily to preach the good news of the Kingdom of God. Luke 4:43 He sent his disciples out to do the same. Luke 9:2 So true Christians bear testimony of all the things he commanded until God is satisfied a witness is given to the entire earth. Mat 28:19,20; 24:14; Acts 1:8 They devote their time, talents, and treasures even going house to house Acts 5:42 sharing the Bible's message of hope and comfort to make disciples of anyone who desires to hear that message.

There is only one proof according to scripture to know whether you are a Christian or not. Do you have the Spirit of the Son dwelling within you with 100 percent certainty? It must be a yes or no and not a maybe.

(Rom 8:1) There is therefore now no condemnation to them that are in Christ Jesus.
(Rom 8:2) For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death.
(Rom 8:4) That the just requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh but after the Spirit.
(Rom 8:5) For they that are after the flesh mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit, the things of the Spirit.
(Rom 8:6) For the mind of the flesh is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
(Rom 8:9) But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone has not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
(Rom 8:10) And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the spirit is life because of righteousness.
(Rom 8:11) But if the Spirit of Him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He that raised up Christ Jesus from the dead shall give life also to your mortal bodies- through His Spirit that dwells in you.
------------------------------------------
(Gal 4:6) And because you are sons, God sent the Spirit of His Son into our hearts, crying, Abba, Father.
------------------------------------------
(Rom 5:5) and hope does not put us to shame, because God's love has been poured into our hearts through the Holy Spirit which has been given to us.
------------------------------------------
(1Pe 1:11) searching what time or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did point to, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ and the glories that would follow them.
---------------------------------------------
(Php 1:19) For I know that this shall result in my salvation, through your prayer and the supply of the Spirit of Jesus Christ,
----------------------------------------------
The Bible speaks of who is a true Christian. Either one has the Spirit of the Son given by the Spirit of God in their heart and know it, or they are don't. They must either know or not and must be sure. It is that simple to know with confidence. It cannot be faked.

I have the Spirit of Christ from his Father within me. I live with this Spirit with 100 percent surety, everyday, every moment I'm conscience.

Does anyone else have the Spirit within them, or are they not Christians and just really pretend they are one?

It is the Holy Spirit which animated Jesus or Yahshua of his previous human life, and now moves in our lives today.

 

[Robert Gwin]

We all see things differently and that's ok with me as long as we get the salvation right. God didn't demand that we get all doctrine correct, He demands that we get Christ correct. That is worth fighting for, the rest, not so much. I try to stay away from the conflicts if possible.

When that's not possible, I state my case and let it go. It's not worth driving a wedge between others.

In Heb. 6 and 10, Paul is appealing to new Hebrew converts to Christ. He is warning them of the consequences of turning from Christ and going back to temple worship. The entire book of Hebrews is the case for Christ. Paul is comparing the Old Covenant high priest to the New Covenant high priest, Christ.

There can be no doubt some of these Jews were walking away from Christ, therefore abandoning their faith in Christ. Paul is simply telling them what they have done and are doing. What they are doing is blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.

Just as Ezekiel witnessed the Holy Spirit departing from the temple as He was no longer wanted, so was the Spirit departing from those Jews who no longer had faith and have embarrassed the Holy Spirit going back to Law.

I hope you are correct Charlie, it would be so nice if God accepted all faiths, however that simply is not a teaching of the Bible sir. He identifies the faith beyond any doubt and we are expected to recognize His people and go with them. Jesus sent his disciples to reach all people with the good news of the Kingdom of God, and when God is satisfied He has reached all He will send His forces to remove those who do not know Him, or obey the gospel of Christ Mat 24:14; 2 Thes 1:6-9 That is a promise from God's word, I do not think it to be erroneous, but again I hope you are correct sir.

 

[Robert Gwin]

There is only one proof according to scripture to know whether you are a Christian or not. Do you have the Spirit of the Son dwelling within you with 100 percent certainty? It must be a yes or no and not a maybe.

(Rom 8:1) There is therefore now no condemnation to them that are in Christ Jesus.
(Rom 8:2) For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death.
(Rom 8:4) That the just requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh but after the Spirit.
(Rom 8:5) For they that are after the flesh mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit, the things of the Spirit.
(Rom 8:6) For the mind of the flesh is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
(Rom 8:9) But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone has not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
(Rom 8:10) And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the spirit is life because of righteousness.
(Rom 8:11) But if the Spirit of Him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He that raised up Christ Jesus from the dead shall give life also to your mortal bodies- through His Spirit that dwells in you.
------------------------------------------
(Gal 4:6) And because you are sons, God sent the Spirit of His Son into our hearts, crying, Abba, Father.
------------------------------------------
(Rom 5:5) and hope does not put us to shame, because God's love has been poured into our hearts through the Holy Spirit which has been given to us.
------------------------------------------
(1Pe 1:11) searching what time or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did point to, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ and the glories that would follow them.
---------------------------------------------
(Php 1:19) For I know that this shall result in my salvation, through your prayer and the supply of the Spirit of Jesus Christ,
----------------------------------------------
The Bible speaks of who is a true Christian. Either one has the Spirit of the Son given by the Spirit of God in their heart and know it, or they are don't. They must either know or not and must be sure. It is that simple to know with confidence. It cannot be faked.

I have the Spirit of Christ from his Father within me. I live with this Spirit with 100 percent surety, everyday, every moment I'm conscience.

Does anyone else have the Spirit within them, or are they not Christians and just really pretend they are one?

It is the Holy Spirit which animated Jesus or Yahshua of his previous human life, and now moves in our lives today.

The proof is in the fruits; teachings and conduct are what identifies Jesus' disciples sir. Are you a Christian Apak? Which God do you worship, that is the main identifier.

 

[Charlie24]

I hope you are correct Charlie, it would be so nice if God accepted all faiths, however that simply is not a teaching of the Bible sir. He identifies the faith beyond any doubt and we are expected to recognize His people and go with them. Jesus sent his disciples to reach all people with the good news of the Kingdom of God, and when God is satisfied He has reached all He will send His forces to remove those who do not know Him, or obey the gospel of Christ Mat 24:14; 2 Thes 1:6-9 That is a promise from God's word, I do not think it to be erroneous, but again I hope you are correct sir.

I said it's ok with me, didn't say it's ok with Him. I just don't want to argue much of this stuff.

I find much of it is accomplishing nothing. The topics of justification and sanctification are worth the fight.

If you get that right, the rest will fall in place.

 

[Charlie24]

I said it's ok with me, didn't say it's ok with Him. I just don't want to argue much of this stuff.

I find much of it is accomplishing nothing. The topics of justification and sanctification are worth the fight.

If you get that right, the rest will fall in place.

Robert, I'm wondering if we have had conversations on another site.

Your pattern of speech sounds very familiar.

Do you remember Charlie24 from another site?

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

What does a Christian look like?

We can't really look at a stranger in a crowd and tell if he is or is not a Christian by their acts of kindness.
The Bible says "By their fruit, you will know them". But it takes times _ to know someone.

Some people are loving and kind who do not believe in Jesus. And many Christians have been accused of many evils.
We have witnessed non- believers being happy and enjoying life and Christians seen as sad and depressed.
In this new life as a new creature in Christ, we start out as infants. We must grow spiritually. The Holy Spirit is there to guide us into all truth and sanctify us. So we change into Christ-like beings eventually, but we are not all mature yet. So we look and behave sometimes not much differently.
Yes, non- believers are lost, have no relationship with God and hence no sense of purpose and meaning other than to live out their years as best they can, enjoy the fruit of their labor, eat, drink and be merry. They share and love too, are productive, law- abiding citizens and often live by Christian principles - unbeknownst to them.
Sometimes this is perplexing to us. Chances are, God is working in their lives, they are written in the Book of Life and Godis orchestrating some future divine appointment to save them. We don't know.

Being a good, a faithful witness for Christ will be fruitful if it is real. Some can be pretending and hiding behind a facade. Jesus accused the Pharisees and scribes as white washed tombs - hypocrites. Outwardly doing things to be seen,, to receive glory from men, but inside they were dead.
We are to spread the Gospel moreso than to spread our Christian pride and accomplishments: "Look at us, we are more loving than the rest". That reminds me of a key scripture, Luke 18:11-14: "The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, ‘God, I thank You that I am not like other men—extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this tax collector. I fast twice a week; I give tithes of all that I possess.’ And the tax collector, standing afar off, would not so much as raise his eyes to heaven, but beat his breast, saying, ‘God, be merciful to me a sinner!’ I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other; for everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted.”

Christians sometimes hide their fears, anger, guilt, shame, and sin, pretending to live super-spiritual, holy lives because we are fed and promised that we are to have life in the full. But that doesn't mean we won experience those things.
We are to be salt and light, but sometimes we are not, which is why the Bible continuosly reminds us how to live. If our inner change automatically transformed our outer behavior into pure love, the world would see it, there would be no questioning the difference between us and them.
Goodness, morality and actions are important but it really isn't about us, it is about Christ we need to focus on d spread the good news about.
That actually brings up another topic. I won't elaborate on it but just state that if we focus too much on ourselves, we will not be happy, live life in the full and can get depressed.
Someone said that "S I N" is when you remove "S" and "N", you are left with "I".
( I, me, mine ... ) "Look at me what I have done" or as a group, "Look what we do ..."

The most distinguishing difference between Christians and non-Christians is our faith in Christ. And that is a gift.

Theology matters, being salt and light matters, brotherly love matters, but they are not more important than Jesus Christ. We spread the gospel not how good we are. We don't put ourselves on a pedestal and look down on others. We are to be humble Christians.

And btw, a Christian is saved NOW, we have entered into eternal life when we believe in Christ. We are "in Christ" spiritually, have died with Him and have been spiritually born again. We have been made new creatures.

Here are some scriptures that confirm this fundamental doctrine:

Romans 6:4
Romans 6:23
Romans 10:10
1 John 5:12
Ephesians 2:5
John 11:25
Galatians 3:27
2 Corinthians 5:7
John 5:24

 

[Robert Gwin]

I said it's ok with me, didn't say it's ok with Him. I just don't want to argue much of this stuff.

I find much of it is accomplishing nothing. The topics of justification and sanctification are worth the fight.

If you get that right, the rest will fall in place.

There is a reason why God gave us His word Charlie. Learning about Him should be the most important thing in our lives. Mat 6:33; 7:21